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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809716 is a reply to message #808855 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 13:45

Oscargasm
Messages: 6623
Registered: May 2009
Location: YEG

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Text dump;
Progress on Kane contract extension today

Nothing ‘official’ discussed but Campbell’s agent has hinted at his interest in coming to Edmonton

Smoke on Giroux, but could be a backup to Kane plan. Keep an eye on Richard Rakell as well.

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more.

Forgot to add, some progress on a deal including the 29th overall made today. Meeting with Kane’s camp again tomorrow. Keith’s camp as well. Expect the Kdominos to fall shortly, The Ks; Keith, Kulak and Kane.

[Updated on: Mon, 04 July 2022 13:49]

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809717 is a reply to message #809716 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

nullterm
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

Illegitimi non carborundum.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809718 is a reply to message #809717 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 13:56

Kr55
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Registered: May 2002
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nullterm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

What happened to the talk of the trade/buyout/resign lower move with Keith? Hope that still happens if he doesn't retire. Sucks to give up even more assets for him, but we need that cap space!

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809719 is a reply to message #809718 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:00

CrusaderPi
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Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:56

nullterm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

What happened to the talk of the trade/buyout/resign lower move with Keith? Hope that still happens if he doesn't retire. Sucks to give up even more assets for him, but we need that cap space!

Why would Keith want to give up a million and a half dollars? For vague promises of future employment? Do we think he doesn't walk into an Okanagan-only scouting job with the Blackhawks two second after retiring?

The time to move past Keith was last summer when the Blackhawks called Holland. That ship has sailed and we're stuck at port holding a very expensive bag.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809721 is a reply to message #809719 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:07

Kr55
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CrusaderPi wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:00

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:56

nullterm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

What happened to the talk of the trade/buyout/resign lower move with Keith? Hope that still happens if he doesn't retire. Sucks to give up even more assets for him, but we need that cap space!

Why would Keith want to give up a million and a half dollars? For vague promises of future employment? Do we think he doesn't walk into an Okanagan-only scouting job with the Blackhawks two second after retiring?

The time to move past Keith was last summer when the Blackhawks called Holland. That ship has sailed and we're stuck at port holding a very expensive bag.

Doesn't he make more money? He gets the buyout money, then if he signs again for say 1.5M he gets his same salary on top of that. For the Oilers, we save 4M of cap space.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809724 is a reply to message #809721 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:11

Oscargasm
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Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:07

CrusaderPi wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:00

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:56

nullterm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

What happened to the talk of the trade/buyout/resign lower move with Keith? Hope that still happens if he doesn't retire. Sucks to give up even more assets for him, but we need that cap space!

Why would Keith want to give up a million and a half dollars? For vague promises of future employment? Do we think he doesn't walk into an Okanagan-only scouting job with the Blackhawks two second after retiring?

The time to move past Keith was last summer when the Blackhawks called Holland. That ship has sailed and we're stuck at port holding a very expensive bag.

Doesn't he make more money? He gets the buyout money, then if he signs again for say 1.5M he gets his same salary on top of that. For the Oilers, we save 4M of cap space.

But we get over 4M of space moving out Barrie to which provides Bouchard more responsibility to inflate his contract due next summer

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809726 is a reply to message #809724 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:17

Kr55
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:11

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:07

CrusaderPi wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:00

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:56

nullterm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 12:45

Signs pointing to Keith returning which has stoked Barrie talks more. .

As much as I've been a fan of Keith's work in the past, we need to move past him. And giving up Barrie to keep Keith is boneheaded. I know Barrier will never reach Keith's potential, but he's younger and a valuable PP asset with our forward corps.

What happened to the talk of the trade/buyout/resign lower move with Keith? Hope that still happens if he doesn't retire. Sucks to give up even more assets for him, but we need that cap space!

Why would Keith want to give up a million and a half dollars? For vague promises of future employment? Do we think he doesn't walk into an Okanagan-only scouting job with the Blackhawks two second after retiring?

The time to move past Keith was last summer when the Blackhawks called Holland. That ship has sailed and we're stuck at port holding a very expensive bag.

Doesn't he make more money? He gets the buyout money, then if he signs again for say 1.5M he gets his same salary on top of that. For the Oilers, we save 4M of cap space.

But we get over 4M of space moving out Barrie to which provides Bouchard more responsibility to inflate his contract due next summer

Should do both. It's up to Keith is he stays, clearly. So, if you can turn his 5.5M into 1.5M cap hit, do it. We need to be all in this coming season.

Ideally, you can get assets for Barrie that you can turn into the incentive for Arizona or another team to do the buyout of Keith for us.

Turning Barrie + Keith into Keith + 8M cap space would be a massive

[Updated on: Mon, 04 July 2022 14:19]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809727 is a reply to message #809726 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

RDOilerfan
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I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809730 is a reply to message #809727 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 14:55

Oscargasm
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RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

Those Canada day festivities in Kelowna are top notch. His real offseason regimen isn’t slated to start till July 5. So they’re giving him a handful of days to see if he still had the ambition and drive after a few days of really hitting the rubber.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809731 is a reply to message #809730 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 15:00

Goose
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

Those Canada day festivities in Kelowna are top notch. His real offseason regimen isn’t slated to start till July 5. So they’re giving him a handful of days to see if he still had the ambition and drive after a few days of really hitting the rubber.

If Keith is actually planning on retiring, the Oilers should be able to trade him back to the Blackhawks where they can "send him to the minors" and have him sit at his house in the Okanagan, and save themselves the cap recapture penalty.

Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
18/19: 232 GF / 274 GA (-42)
19/20 (82 game pace): 257 GF / 254 GA (+3) in 64 games
2021 (82 game pace):269 GF / 235 GA (+34) after 38 games

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809732 is a reply to message #809731 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 15:08

Kr55
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Goose wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 15:00

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

Those Canada day festivities in Kelowna are top notch. His real offseason regimen isn’t slated to start till July 5. So they’re giving him a handful of days to see if he still had the ambition and drive after a few days of really hitting the rubber.

If Keith is actually planning on retiring, the Oilers should be able to trade him back to the Blackhawks where they can "send him to the minors" and have him sit at his house in the Okanagan, and save themselves the cap recapture penalty.

Sure Chicago will take that 5.5M off our hands. For a 2nd and 1st if we make it to the finals thanks to the cap space.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809737 is a reply to message #809731 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 16:38

Adam
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Goose wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 15:00

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 13:55

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

Those Canada day festivities in Kelowna are top notch. His real offseason regimen isn’t slated to start till July 5. So they’re giving him a handful of days to see if he still had the ambition and drive after a few days of really hitting the rubber.

If Keith is actually planning on retiring, the Oilers should be able to trade him back to the Blackhawks where they can "send him to the minors" and have him sit at his house in the Okanagan, and save themselves the cap recapture penalty.

I don't think the 'Hawks give a damn. They're talking about trading DeBrincat, and basically tearing it all down for a rebuild. Kane & Toews may not be thrilled about it, so maybe they get exited too - but I don't think the Blackhawks are too upset if Keith retires and they don't have as much cap room this year.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809746 is a reply to message #809731 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 20:37

K.McC#24
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I just can't see Keith doing something that frigs Chicago, like flat out retiring. Your scenario might be plausible.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809738 is a reply to message #809730 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 16:39

Adam
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:55

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

Those Canada day festivities in Kelowna are top notch. His real offseason regimen isn’t slated to start till July 5. So they’re giving him a handful of days to see if he still had the ambition and drive after a few days of really hitting the rubber.

He's sitting in a dark room with magnets on his skin waiting for the mystic powers to tell him what to do.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireLowe ~~#FireChiarelli~~ #FireBobbyNicks #FireKeithGretzky #FireKenHolland ~~#FireTippett~~

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809734 is a reply to message #809727 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 15:52

CrudeRemarks
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RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 14:22

I have to think that Keith is considering retiring more than people thought. Unless he was seriously hurt, with the offseason being shorter this year, the Oilers have been done playing for almost a month now. I would assume if you are coming back, the offseason training needs to start real quick.

A more likely scenario is Keith doesn’t consider anybody else’s needs or timelines. He’s enjoying his off-season with his kid and he’ll eventually get around to telling OEG his plans.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809740 is a reply to message #808855 ]	Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Oscargasm
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Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809750 is a reply to message #809740 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

RDOilerfan
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809756 is a reply to message #809750 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

inverno76
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809767 is a reply to message #809756 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

RDOilerfan
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inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809769 is a reply to message #809767 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 10:39

inverno76
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

Kassian's position would still need to be filled, so it's not a true salary in, salary out proposal you have formulated.

I would be selling narrative of 'what if' you get stuck with the whole cap and Kane is allowed to walk as a UFA. I would be selling Kassian as a great locker room guy, and an elite on-ice deterrent who can play on the top line when needed. I would selling the fact that Edmonton would still be eating one year of Kane at full dollar value in his final year.

Kassian is a moveable asset, and the Sharks could buy him out at any time to get more cap space if they wanted out of it. Holland has a nice hand here. He better not fold.

[Updated on: Tue, 05 July 2022 10:49]

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809777 is a reply to message #809769 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 11:10

RDOilerfan
Messages: 5205
Registered: January 2016

5 Cups

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:39

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

Kassian's position would still need to be filled, so it's not a true salary in, salary out proposal you have formulated.

I would be selling narrative of 'what if' you get stuck with the whole cap and Kane is allowed to walk as a UFA. I would be selling Kassian as a great locker room guy, and an elite on-ice deterrent who can play on the top line when needed. I would selling the fact that Edmonton would still be eating one year of Kane at full dollar value in his final year.

Kassian is a moveable asset, and the Sharks could buy him out at any time to get more cap space if they wanted out of it. Holland has a nice hand here. He better not fold.

I am not trying to pick a fight with you and I get we are in an Oilers fan site so we all want every situation to work out decisively in the Oilers favor but how in the world do you see Kassian as a moveable asset? He's a 4th line player with some injury concerns making more than 3 times what he should be making. Who's dying to add that to their team? I am not saying you can't trade Kassian but to do it, the Oilers will probably have to add a decent asset with him to get a team to take on his contract.

Plus 4th line players that don't play special teams like Kassian, should be making between league minimum and 1 mill. He's not on your PP or PK, he doesn't score a lot and all he really does sadly now is occasionally bring some physicality and once in a blue moon fight someone. With the way the league has gone, you can probably get away with him not playing every night now. So if they are just looking for a part time guy that hits a little, the Oilers could probably just slide Malone into his spot. Malone skates OK, doesn't bring a ton of offense, has some size, will hit and forecheck a little and the bonus is he can play a little center, so he might win you a draw and maybe slide into a bit of PK from time to time if your main guys are tired or hurt. He only makes 762500.

So if you could get rid of Kassian and his 3.2 plus pay 762500 for Kassian's replacement, you are getting Kane for 4.5 mill. For a guy that will probably score you 25 goal min with trying hard, to ride shot gun for McD. All day long YES.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809781 is a reply to message #809777 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 11:49

inverno76
Messages: 2448
Registered: September 2005
Location: Prince Albert, Saskatchew...

2 Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 11:10

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:39

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

Kassian's position would still need to be filled, so it's not a true salary in, salary out proposal you have formulated.

I would be selling narrative of 'what if' you get stuck with the whole cap and Kane is allowed to walk as a UFA. I would be selling Kassian as a great locker room guy, and an elite on-ice deterrent who can play on the top line when needed. I would selling the fact that Edmonton would still be eating one year of Kane at full dollar value in his final year.

Kassian is a moveable asset, and the Sharks could buy him out at any time to get more cap space if they wanted out of it. Holland has a nice hand here. He better not fold.

I am not trying to pick a fight with you and I get we are in an Oilers fan site so we all want every situation to work out decisively in the Oilers favor but how in the world do you see Kassian as a moveable asset? He's a 4th line player with some injury concerns making more than 3 times what he should be making. Who's dying to add that to their team? I am not saying you can't trade Kassian but to do it, the Oilers will probably have to add a decent asset with him to get a team to take on his contract.

Plus 4th line players that don't play special teams like Kassian, should be making between league minimum and 1 mill. He's not on your PP or PK, he doesn't score a lot and all he really does sadly now is occasionally bring some physicality and once in a blue moon fight someone. With the way the league has gone, you can probably get away with him not playing every night now. So if they are just looking for a part time guy that hits a little, the Oilers could probably just slide Malone into his spot. Malone skates OK, doesn't bring a ton of offense, has some size, will hit and forecheck a little and the bonus is he can play a little center, so he might win you a draw and maybe slide into a bit of PK from time to time if your main guys are tired or hurt. He only makes 762500.

So if you could get rid of Kassian and his 3.2 plus pay 762500 for Kassian's replacement, you are getting Kane for 4.5 mill. For a guy that will probably score you 25 goal min with trying hard, to ride shot gun for McD. All day long YES.

I am just creating a discussion. Not fighting.

McDonaugh and Johnson were just moved for no return. Both are better players, but their salaries were substantially higher and carried term. They would have been unmovable in Edmonton.

Kassian's replacement will be at league min? You could sell me on Holloway, but he was already penciled in for a spot and will start out at 925k. Gagner's names has resurfaced for a third time, but he's a 13th forward and not a replacement player. Who will fill Kass's roster spot at that price point?

Kassian to San Jose makes sense, but you need to do Mike Grier dirty and push for more.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809795 is a reply to message #809777 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:00

CrudeRemarks
Messages: 2231
Registered: November 2010
Location: Edmonton

2 Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 11:10

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:39

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

Kassian's position would still need to be filled, so it's not a true salary in, salary out proposal you have formulated.

I would be selling narrative of 'what if' you get stuck with the whole cap and Kane is allowed to walk as a UFA. I would be selling Kassian as a great locker room guy, and an elite on-ice deterrent who can play on the top line when needed. I would selling the fact that Edmonton would still be eating one year of Kane at full dollar value in his final year.

Kassian is a moveable asset, and the Sharks could buy him out at any time to get more cap space if they wanted out of it. Holland has a nice hand here. He better not fold.

I am not trying to pick a fight with you and I get we are in an Oilers fan site so we all want every situation to work out decisively in the Oilers favor but how in the world do you see Kassian as a moveable asset? He's a 4th line player with some injury concerns making more than 3 times what he should be making. Who's dying to add that to their team? I am not saying you can't trade Kassian but to do it, the Oilers will probably have to add a decent asset with him to get a team to take on his contract.

Plus 4th line players that don't play special teams like Kassian, should be making between league minimum and 1 mill. He's not on your PP or PK, he doesn't score a lot and all he really does sadly now is occasionally bring some physicality and once in a blue moon fight someone. With the way the league has gone, you can probably get away with him not playing every night now. So if they are just looking for a part time guy that hits a little, the Oilers could probably just slide Malone into his spot. Malone skates OK, doesn't bring a ton of offense, has some size, will hit and forecheck a little and the bonus is he can play a little center, so he might win you a draw and maybe slide into a bit of PK from time to time if your main guys are tired or hurt. He only makes 762500.

So if you could get rid of Kassian and his 3.2 plus pay 762500 for Kassian's replacement, you are getting Kane for 4.5 mill. For a guy that will probably score you 25 goal min with trying hard, to ride shot gun for McD. All day long YES.

That’s a terrrible sales pitch. Kassian is a fast skating player with hands and grit. He’s proven he can score when elevated and hold his own defensively in a bottom six role. He’ll fight anyone and opposing players hear footsteps when he’s on the ice.

Do up a nice highlight package and hit Send

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809770 is a reply to message #809767 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 10:40

CrusaderPi
Messages: 13039
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

From a risk management point of view, the Sharks might be willing. I think there's some likelihood that they'll be on the hook for half to two-thirds of Kane's previous contract. So right now let's say San Jose's starting point is losing 3.5 million in cap space and salary for zero return. Getting a proven NHL player back, paying less salary, and getting that grievance off the books are all positives.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809771 is a reply to message #809770 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 10:42

Kr55
Messages: 17117
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:40

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

From a risk management point of view, the Sharks might be willing. I think there's some likelihood that they'll be on the hook for half to two-thirds of Kane's previous contract. So right now let's say San Jose's starting point is losing 3.5 million in cap space and salary for zero return. Getting a proven NHL player back, paying less salary, and getting that grievance off the books are all positives.

I'm scared now. Grier's first move could be a hard squeeze on Holland.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809773 is a reply to message #809771 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 10:56

Dragon_Matt
Messages: 684
Registered: January 2009
Location: edmonton

No Cups

well you can't expect Holland to do the swap 1 for 1. That wouldn't be fair. we should really retain some of Kassian... and throw in a 2nd.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809892 is a reply to message #809770 ]	Wed, 06 July 2022 19:31

Rutuu
Messages: 123
Registered: March 2011
Location: Brisbane

No Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:40

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

From a risk management point of view, the Sharks might be willing. I think there's some likelihood that they'll be on the hook for half to two-thirds of Kane's previous contract. So right now let's say San Jose's starting point is losing 3.5 million in cap space and salary for zero return. Getting a proven NHL player back, paying less salary, and getting that grievance off the books are all positives.

Agree that the above is one of the likely outcomes. It is also in the Sharks interest to offer Kane to other teams with similar retention terms. No one wanted that smoke last year, and the Oiler's benefited. It is presumptuous to assume that the Oiler's will benefit from the same lack of buyers a second time after Kane led the playoffs in scoring.

LA and WSH are both rumoured to be showing interest in Kane.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809894 is a reply to message #809892 ]	Wed, 06 July 2022 19:33

Oscargasm
Messages: 6623
Registered: May 2009
Location: YEG

6 Cups

Rutuu wrote on Wed, 06 July 2022 19:31

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:40

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 10:31

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 09:47

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 08:12

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 04 July 2022 18:16

Kevin Weekes backing up the big dawg;
**Keep an eye on 👁** Evander Kane and @EdmontonOilers were a great match for each other, @cmcdavid97 played a big role in him choosing there, and they clicked on their line. EDM is logical choice for him to re-sign,if both sides can make it work. @espn @NHL #HockeyTwitter

Coupled with Stauffer’s tweet and putting it with what Odie has been saying, it should come as no surprise.

Also, obviously nothing announced yet.. and some things changing by the minute this week but possibility of deal with Sharks after Grier announced as GM tomorrow, with Kassian part of package going to San Jose for Kane.

I have wondered about Kassian to the Sharks a lot. I am not a lawyer what I have to think there will be a settlement if they sit around waiting for the Arb to do his thing. I don't see how each side would proceed unless they felt they had a real good case. Kane wants his money. The Sharks want him gone and would like to have none of his money but probably deep down know they will be on the hook for some. These NHL deals seem to be really hard to get out of unless the player agrees. So could it be as simple as trading the Sharks Kassian with some other asset for Kane's contract. Kane gets his full money. The Sharks while overpaid get a player that's an NHLer rather than dead cap space.

I think the Sharks still would have to eat a chunk of that contract, or that's what I am selling to San Jose. We will take the headache and Kane will settle, but you eat 30% of that salary. Otherwise, there is a very good chance Kane get's a sizeable settlement and the Sharks only get a cap penalty.

Holland needs to exploit this leverage. Not very confident he will, but I am truly hopeful.

Well would trading Kassian and his 3.2 mill not be the same as the Sharks eating some of the contract?

Kassian is an NHL 4th liner probably making 3 times what he should at 3.2 mill for the next 2 more years. So he has next to zero value and is someone the Oilers and probably every fan want to get rid of. Kane makes 7 mill for the next 3 seasons.

Regardless of how the Sharks feel about Kane, he's still a really good top 6 player who's signed. So he has some value. If you swap Kassian and his 3.2 for Kane and his 7. You are getting Kane for 3.8 mill for the next 2 years. So the Sharks would basically be eating 45% of his contract by taking Kassian.

So in your eyes to be fair, you want the Sharks to take Kassian AND retain more money?

From a risk management point of view, the Sharks might be willing. I think there's some likelihood that they'll be on the hook for half to two-thirds of Kane's previous contract. So right now let's say San Jose's starting point is losing 3.5 million in cap space and salary for zero return. Getting a proven NHL player back, paying less salary, and getting that grievance off the books are all positives.

Agree that the above is one of the likely outcomes. It is also in the Sharks interest to offer Kane to other teams with similar retention terms. No one wanted that smoke last year, and the Oiler's benefited. It is presumptuous to assume that the Oiler's will benefit from the same lack of buyers a second time after Kane lead the playoffs in scoring.

LA and WSH are both rumoured to be showing interest in Kane.

Kane and Tom Wilson on the same team would be intense.

Kane with the kings, no thanks.

His camp is adamant they can get big money for long term. Unless Oilers can fashion a trade with the grieving sharks, he won’t be coming back to Edmonton. A vast difference a few days can make.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809796 is a reply to message #808855 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:02

Oscargasm
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Lots of talk about Keith being done…

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809798 is a reply to message #809796 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:07

Kr55
Messages: 17117
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

https://c.tenor.com/wbQFA2NwbZgAAAAC/dear-lord.gif

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- MacT, 2015

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809799 is a reply to message #809796 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:16

inverno76
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Registered: September 2005
Location: Prince Albert, Saskatchew...

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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Kenny has him at Joey's right now wooing him for one more year.

Imagine the leadership we could buy with 5.5M savings?

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809803 is a reply to message #809796 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Skookum Jim
Messages: 7484
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809804 is a reply to message #809803 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:43

inverno76
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Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

Bettman comes from out of the shadows and threatens to sanction the Oilers. We lose all of draft picks and assume San Jose's Kane debt, but Evander becomes a UFA.

Oilers are not allowed to have good things to happen to them.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809805 is a reply to message #809804 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 14:49

Kr55
Messages: 17117
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

Bettman comes from out of the shadows and threatens to sanction the Oilers. We lose all of draft picks and assume San Jose's Kane debt, but Evander becomes a UFA.

Oilers are not allowed to have good things to happen to them.

I would bet on a loose interpretation of the rules where Chicago is awarded 3.4M the cap credit for Keith's 1 season with the Oilers.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809809 is a reply to message #809805 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 15:05

inverno76
Messages: 2448
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Location: Prince Albert, Saskatchew...

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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:49

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

Bettman comes from out of the shadows and threatens to sanction the Oilers. We lose all of draft picks and assume San Jose's Kane debt, but Evander becomes a UFA.

Oilers are not allowed to have good things to happen to them.

I would bet on a loose interpretation of the rules where Chicago is awarded 3.4M the cap credit for Keith's 1 season with the Oilers.

We got a call against Calgary that I would have bet my left pinky on going against us. Maybe the wind is shifting, but I still see Lucy holding onto that damn football.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809810 is a reply to message #809805 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 15:07

CrusaderPi
Messages: 13039
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:49

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

Bettman comes from out of the shadows and threatens to sanction the Oilers. We lose all of draft picks and assume San Jose's Kane debt, but Evander becomes a UFA.

Oilers are not allowed to have good things to happen to them.

I would bet on a loose interpretation of the rules where Chicago is awarded 3.4M the cap credit for Keith's 1 season with the Oilers.

...that they'll be able to defer for a few years so it's useful when they're making a run again.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809837 is a reply to message #809803 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 21:06

Adam
Messages: 12700
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

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Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

For the hundred billionth time - Chicago doesn't care if they lose cap room next year. They have $20MM in cap space, are looking to move DeBrincat and they're a year from the end of Kane and Toews' contracts. They aren't planning to be competitive, so a cap hit of $3MM? Doesn't really bother them. They spend the year selling and look to draft high and hopefully rebound in a couple years, long after the Keith cap hit is a distant memory.

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809840 is a reply to message #809837 ]	Tue, 05 July 2022 23:29

Skookum Jim
Messages: 7484
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

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Adam wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 20:06

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

For the hundred billionth time - Chicago doesn't care if they lose cap room next year. They have $20MM in cap space, are looking to move DeBrincat and they're a year from the end of Kane and Toews' contracts. They aren't planning to be competitive, so a cap hit of $3MM? Doesn't really bother them. They spend the year selling and look to draft high and hopefully rebound in a couple years, long after the Keith cap hit is a distant memory.

According to Puckpedia its more than $3M.. its $5,538,462 in 22-23, and $1,938,456 in 23-24

Even if they decide not to compete next year, and tank, it'll still hurt them, the $5.5M cap hit will reduce trade opportunities to take on cap for assets.

According to past NHL precedence, Edmonton would get $3,438,462 cap relief.. but we know the NHL doesn't like it when the Oilers try to get in to play their game.. so not going to happen.

From Puckpedia
https://puckpedia.com/salary-cap/answers/duncan-keith-potent ial-recapture

Quote:

Duncan Keith Potential Recapture
If Keith retires after the upcoming season, what are the repercussions?

Answer
Jul 13, 2021
If Keith were to retire after this 21-22 season (with 1 season remaining), it would trigger a recapture cap hit for Chicago and Edmonton. The recapture is the difference between the cap hit and the compensation for all the years the player played on a team. For Keith, if he retired after 21-22, the recapture would be:

-Chicago recapture charge of $7,476,918. The charge would be allocated as $5,538,462 (Keith's original cap Hit) in 22-23, and the remaining $1,938,456 in 23-24

-Edmonton recapture benefit of $3,438,462 in 22-23; this is a negative cap hit (cap savings)

[Updated on: Tue, 05 July 2022 23:31]

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Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809841 is a reply to message #809840 ]	Wed, 06 July 2022 00:21

Adam
Messages: 12700
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

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Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 23:29

Adam wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 20:06

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 14:35

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 05 July 2022 13:02

Lots of talk about Keith being done…

Chicago.. craps pants

For the hundred billionth time - Chicago doesn't care if they lose cap room next year. They have $20MM in cap space, are looking to move DeBrincat and they're a year from the end of Kane and Toews' contracts. They aren't planning to be competitive, so a cap hit of $3MM? Doesn't really bother them. They spend the year selling and look to draft high and hopefully rebound in a couple years, long after the Keith cap hit is a distant memory.

According to Puckpedia its more than $3M.. its $5,538,462 in 22-23, and $1,938,456 in 23-24

Even if they decide not to compete next year, and tank, it'll still hurt them, the $5.5M cap hit will reduce trade opportunities to take on cap for assets.

According to past NHL precedence, Edmonton would get $3,438,462 cap relief.. but we know the NHL doesn't like it when the Oilers try to get in to play their game.. so not going to happen.

From Puckpedia
https://puckpedia.com/salary-cap/answers/duncan-keith-potent ial-recapture

Quote:

Duncan Keith Potential Recapture
If Keith retires after the upcoming season, what are the repercussions?

Answer
Jul 13, 2021
If Keith were to retire after this 21-22 season (with 1 season remaining), it would trigger a recapture cap hit for Chicago and Edmonton. The recapture is the difference between the cap hit and the compensation for all the years the player played on a team. For Keith, if he retired after 21-22, the recapture would be:

-Chicago recapture charge of $7,476,918. The charge would be allocated as $5,538,462 (Keith's original cap Hit) in 22-23, and the remaining $1,938,456 in 23-24

-Edmonton recapture benefit of $3,438,462 in 22-23; this is a negative cap hit (cap savings)

You're correct, I forgot that the $3ish million for the Oilers isn't the same number as the Hawks get hit with.

The point still stands. The 'Hawks don't need to cap space, and aren't likely to be anywhere close to the cap this year. They'll be in danger of being below the cap floor if they deal Toews and Kane during the season too. This penalty is probably more of a blessing than a curse to them, and they're definitely not going to lose sleep if Keith retires.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireLowe ~~#FireChiarelli~~ #FireBobbyNicks #FireKeithGretzky #FireKenHolland ~~#FireTippett~~

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809842 is a reply to message #808855 ]	Wed, 06 July 2022 07:43

Oscargasm
Messages: 6623
Registered: May 2009
Location: YEG

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Cap space?

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Re: Both Smith and Keith considering retirement [message #809843 is a reply to message #809842 ]	Wed, 06 July 2022 08:03

RDOilerfan
Messages: 5205
Registered: January 2016

5 Cups

Just my opinion but if Keith was coming back, we would have heard by now. The longer it drags on, the more it feels like he's going to retire, it's just hard to say it. I saw on insta, Leon is already working out so I can't see Keith who's supposedly a fitness freak, hanging out by the pool forgetting to let Kenny know he's coming back. If Keith is coming back, the Oilers know already I feel.

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