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 Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694557]
Wed, 10 May 2017 23:23 Go to next message
mad90  is currently offline mad90
Messages: 78
Registered: July 2007
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

No Cups

I know the Oilers just got nocked out and some people are still stinging but I am super excited for next year! So it got me thinking about what changes are going to be made, I have little doubt the Oilers will move on from Pouliot(AHL, buyout) Eberle (Trade). RNH could be moved in the right situation (Right handed centre?), and do the Oilers resign Russell?

Caggiula - McDavid - Maroon
Lucic - Draisaitl - ??????
??????? - RNH? - Puljujarvi
Slepshev - Letestu - Kassian

Klefbom - Larrson
Sekera - Benning
Nurse - ??????

Talbot
Brossoit?

There are some interesting UFA's out there. I feel the Oilers are going to be more conservative in terms of the UFA's signings, I could see them in on Williams, Stafford, Gionta for RW for the right price max 1 or 2 yr deals. On defence depends if you trade Eberle for something on the right side, would need to move $ for $. A lot of these moves will be based on how much Draisaitl gets.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694562 is a reply to message #694557 ]
Wed, 10 May 2017 23:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vsove  is currently offline vsove
Messages: 963
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




No Mo' Lowe

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694564 is a reply to message #694562 ]
Wed, 10 May 2017 23:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
Messages: 5164
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

5 Cups

vsove wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 22:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




He was, his lack of speed really started to be apparent, he lost a tonne of weight last summer, it helped, maybe this summer he gets in better shape, trains with Leon, gets faster.



McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks, K. Russell = $3.1 M

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694566 is a reply to message #694564 ]
Wed, 10 May 2017 23:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mad90  is currently offline mad90
Messages: 78
Registered: July 2007
Location: Edmonton, Alberta

No Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 23:32

vsove wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 22:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




He was, his lack of speed really started to be apparent, he lost a tonne of weight last summer, it helped, maybe this summer he gets in better shape, trains with Leon, gets faster.



Yup and its a contract bargain and he is coming into a contract year. I feel Maroon will have a big year again, but if you want to maximize your assets and get a larger need this would be a time to trade him.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694575 is a reply to message #694566 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 00:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ryanc182  is currently offline ryanc182
Messages: 155
Registered: July 2008
Location: Red Deer

No Cups

Still not sure we can absorb the cap hit, but I'd love to see Oshie on McDavids RW. Eberle's top end production but a more complete player.

Anyone else see the score thinking we'd be in on Kovalchuk? Personally I hope not unless it's a short term deal? ( Is this even possible with a player leaving voluntary retirement on a previous long term contract?"



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694591 is a reply to message #694575 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 08:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skoobz  is currently offline Skoobz
Messages: 2211
Registered: January 2006
Location: McDavidisneyland

2 Cups

Can't see Oshie coming to a Canadian team, but I'd love to see him as an Eberle-replacement.


"[It was] really cool to throw on the Oilers gear, the gear that I want to play the rest of my life wearing. It was pretty cool to put it on. With all the history, it was a lot of fun." - Connor McDavid, July 1, 2015

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694594 is a reply to message #694562 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

vsove wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 23:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




You thought Maroon was bad? He had 8 pts in 13 games and was a +2. Was he a dominant force every game? NO but he was alright. He had 27 goals with McDavid, you don't dump him.




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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694600 is a reply to message #694594 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vsove  is currently offline vsove
Messages: 963
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:02

vsove wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 23:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




You thought Maroon was bad? He had 8 pts in 13 games and was a +2. Was he a dominant force every game? NO but he was alright. He had 27 goals with McDavid, you don't dump him.




I don't think he was bad, necessarily, but he wasn't playing up to his regular standards. He seemed to be snakebitten, kept whiffing on wide-open chances and took a lot of dumb penalties throughout.

To answer my own question, I think you bring him back, but with the understanding that he's likely not the long-term answer on that line. That said, I don't know who's out there that you'd really want to replace him - McDavid needs a finisher, but he drives the play enough on that line that what you really need is someone who can take his feeds and put them in the net.

Not a lot of options out there, unfortunately.

RW is the more pressing concern. If Puljujarvi can take the next step at some point during the season, he's gotta be a lock for one of your top two. Our D needs another RHD - I don't dislike Russell, but I'm not sure if he's our long term solution.

Gryba should not see the NHL ice in an Oilers uniform again.

For forwards, I actually like the idea of trying RNH as a winger. If your top two lines look like

Maroon - McDavid - Pulju (maybe, eventually)
Lucic - Drai - Nuge
Caggiula - ??? - ???
Slepyshev- Letestu - Kassian

The problem, of course, is that suddenly you don't have a 3rd line center.

I don't think that looks terrible, and the third RW spot shouldn't be impossible to fill.

As for the first line, I think you give a 1-year contract to someone to fill that 1st RW spot until Pulju is ready, don't rush him in.

Defense is a little trickier. I thought that Nurse/Larsson pairing looked really good in Game 6, but I don't know if you can justify moving Klef down (and then Sekera further down), because that looks like:

Nurse - Larsson
Klefbom - Russell (or replacement)
Sekera - Benning

So instead, I think oyu stick with:

Klefbom-Larsson
Sekera - ???
Nurse - Benning

I think 82 games together would help that Nurse-Benning pair solidify their game a lot, so pretty much stick with the same D pairings, but replace Russell with a trade, since there's not much in UFA.

And Gryba never ever sees the ice again.

Eberle is likely gone. I don't think that's necessarily a good idea, but he's become the whipping boy du-jour, and a change of scenery would be good for him and for us. I liked Desharnais but I don't know how much he figures into our plans (or how much he should).

[Updated on: Thu, 11 May 2017 09:49]


No Mo' Lowe

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694619 is a reply to message #694600 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
WizardofOil  is currently offline WizardofOil
Messages: 69
Registered: June 2007
Location: Sherwood Park

No Cups

vsove wrote on Fri, 12 May 2017 00:32


And Gryba never ever sees the ice again.

Eberle is likely gone. I don't think that's necessarily a good idea, but he's become the whipping boy-du-jour, and a change of scenery would be good for him and for us.



I think Gryba did a great job of 7th d. Without him this year, our depth would have much worse. I am not against him being 7th d and getting inserted when we need a big body against bigger teams. I'm not sure we can find a better option for the price.

Eberle leaves for one reason and that is to give Eberle's money to Draisailt. He is in for a big raise and the Oilers will need to find the bills. Hopefully, Puljujarvi is ready to play on an entry level to save some money and replace Eberle.



"I'm one of those guys that if you don't want to play here, don't screw around, get the hell out." - Pat Quinn

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694617 is a reply to message #694562 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
WizardofOil  is currently offline WizardofOil
Messages: 69
Registered: June 2007
Location: Sherwood Park

No Cups

vsove wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 14:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




I am pretty sure he was playing with bruised or cracked ribs during the playoffs. It happened during one of the last two Vancouver games at the end of the season. That will slow anyone down. You definitely bring Maroon back, he brings energy, a big body, and an attractive contract. The goals were just a bonus!



"I'm one of those guys that if you don't want to play here, don't screw around, get the hell out." - Pat Quinn

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694618 is a reply to message #694617 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vsove  is currently offline vsove
Messages: 963
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

WizardofOil wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:03

vsove wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 14:29

Do you bring back Maroon, though? I feel like he's been incredibly underwhelming all playoffs.




I am pretty sure he was playing with bruised or cracked ribs during the playoffs. It happened during one of the last two Vancouver games at the end of the season. That will slow anyone down. You definitely bring Maroon back, he brings energy, a big body, and an attractive contract. The goals were just a bonus!


Yeah, for some reason I thought this was his last year on that contract.

For 1.5 million, bring him back. Next year, he can score the goal that knocks his former team out of the playoffs, all while they pay part of his salary.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694625 is a reply to message #694562 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 19:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
HamBlaster  is currently offline HamBlaster
Messages: 1126
Registered: June 2007

1 Cup

I would bring Maroon back. He has good chemistry with McD and with Drai, and he can be had for a pretty reasonable price. He's never going to drive offense himself, however he's a solid complementary piece. He also has size and can lean on guys. I'd take Maroon every day over Coke machines that have no skill (Clifford or King) or really small guys that can be pushed off the puck (Ebs).


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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694627 is a reply to message #694625 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 19:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike  is currently offline Mike
Messages: 4673
Registered: August 2005
Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

4 Cups

Would love to see RNH as McDavid's RW. He has a great shot when he wants to use it. We can't have a former 1st overall making $6M as a 3C putting up 20-30 points. But $6M for a RW1? If it were to work, it could be found money.

Finding a decent 3C for about half the price shouldn't be that difficult.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694628 is a reply to message #694627 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 21:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jds308  is currently offline jds308
Messages: 1382
Registered: September 2007
Location: Summerland

1 Cup

Mike wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 18:57

Would love to see RNH as McDavid's RW. He has a great shot when he wants to use it. We can't have a former 1st overall making $6M as a 3C putting up 20-30 points. But $6M for a RW1? If it were to work, it could be found money.

Finding a decent 3C for about half the price shouldn't be that difficult.


Not sure about Nuge on RW, but what about LW? Then find another RW version of Maroon? ie. Big, tough, decent skater, on a cheapish deal that can park his rear in front of the goalie and forecheck like hell, and recover pucks in the corners? Maybe we already have him in Kassian? I dunno. But my point is, I like the idea of a Nuge/McDavid line as long as the other winger can provide some size and preferably a right shot.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694629 is a reply to message #694628 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 04:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ziltoid  is currently offline ziltoid
Messages: 184
Registered: January 2011

No Cups

jds308 wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 21:55

Mike wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 18:57

Would love to see RNH as McDavid's RW. He has a great shot when he wants to use it. We can't have a former 1st overall making $6M as a 3C putting up 20-30 points. But $6M for a RW1? If it were to work, it could be found money.

Finding a decent 3C for about half the price shouldn't be that difficult.


Not sure about Nuge on RW, but what about LW? Then find another RW version of Maroon? ie. Big, tough, decent skater, on a cheapish deal that can park his rear in front of the goalie and forecheck like hell, and recover pucks in the corners? Maybe we already have him in Kassian? I dunno. But my point is, I like the idea of a Nuge/McDavid line as long as the other winger can provide some size and preferably a right shot.


With McDavid's passing you want a person on that line to be on their off wing. I agree with Mike, putting Nuge on the 1RW spot and finding a 3C is the best option as Draisaitl can be the driver on the 2nd line. It also takes some of the defense responsibility away from McDavid; having Nuge will allow McDavid to cheat for offense more often, which will push the opposition D back, which will help with zone exits as they are less willing to try and stand up on the blue line (seriously, how often have we struggled to exit the zone over the last decade).



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694638 is a reply to message #694562 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 13:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle  is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
Messages: 249
Registered: April 2012

No Cups

He makes like 1.5 million dollars. How do you even question that? He had a point in all but one game in second round I believe. Please, be real.


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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694639 is a reply to message #694638 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 13:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
vsove  is currently offline vsove
Messages: 963
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

clutchlikeeberle wrote on Fri, 12 May 2017 13:29

He makes like 1.5 million dollars. How do you even question that? He had a point in all but one game in second round I believe. Please, be real.


As mentioned (twice, in fact), for some reason I thought he was at the end of his current contract.

At 1.5 million, you absolutely bring him back. But you have to assume he'll be looking for a big raise if he keeps up his current production, and I think we need to acknowledge that he might not be in the long-term plans.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694596 is a reply to message #694557 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

mad90 wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 23:23

I know the Oilers just got nocked out and some people are still stinging but I am super excited for next year! So it got me thinking about what changes are going to be made, I have little doubt the Oilers will move on from Pouliot(AHL, buyout) Eberle (Trade). RNH could be moved in the right situation (Right handed centre?), and do the Oilers resign Russell?

Caggiula - McDavid - Maroon
Lucic - Draisaitl - ??????
??????? - RNH? - Puljujarvi
Slepshev - Letestu - Kassian

Klefbom - Larrson
Sekera - Benning
Nurse - ??????

Talbot
Brossoit?

There are some interesting UFA's out there. I feel the Oilers are going to be more conservative in terms of the UFA's signings, I could see them in on Williams, Stafford, Gionta for RW for the right price max 1 or 2 yr deals. On defence depends if you trade Eberle for something on the right side, would need to move $ for $. A lot of these moves will be based on how much Draisaitl gets.

I am not totally against your lines. I see Eberle as a must to being gone. I also see Slep maybe moving up. I see Pouliot gone.

However, I do wonder about RNH. I think it's pretty clear that Leon needs to be the #2 center so the Oilers have that 2 headed monster. So that automatically drops Nuge to the 3rd line. In my opinion, a good 3rd line center needs to put up 12-15 goals, 30-40 pts. So Nuge is capable of that. BUT a 3rd line center also needs to be very good defensively and good on faceoffs. I wouldn't call Nuge very good defensively, I would call him passable and his faceoffs aren't good. He has the odd good game but was a a 43.8% faceoff guy on the seasons and was 44.8% on the series. Flat out not good enough. Plus at 6 mill, he makes WAY too much to be in a 3rd line role.

When it comes to trading Nuge. I know some people will say "Don't trade him when his value is low". Fair point. However, the Oilers can probably hold on to him for next season cap wise. After nest season, they will have both Leon's AND McDavid's contract counting. So they will most likely need the cap relief. So if you have Nuge as your 3rd line center going into next season, putting up 3rd line numbers THEN you have the pressure of needing cap relief, I don't see how Nuge's value will go up. I believe his value might be as high as it gets going into this season.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694598 is a reply to message #694596 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
Messages: 543
Registered: November 2007
Location: Leduc

No Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:10

mad90 wrote on Wed, 10 May 2017 23:23

I know the Oilers just got nocked out and some people are still stinging but I am super excited for next year! So it got me thinking about what changes are going to be made, I have little doubt the Oilers will move on from Pouliot(AHL, buyout) Eberle (Trade). RNH could be moved in the right situation (Right handed centre?), and do the Oilers resign Russell?

Caggiula - McDavid - Maroon
Lucic - Draisaitl - ??????
??????? - RNH? - Puljujarvi
Slepshev - Letestu - Kassian

Klefbom - Larrson
Sekera - Benning
Nurse - ??????

Talbot
Brossoit?

There are some interesting UFA's out there. I feel the Oilers are going to be more conservative in terms of the UFA's signings, I could see them in on Williams, Stafford, Gionta for RW for the right price max 1 or 2 yr deals. On defence depends if you trade Eberle for something on the right side, would need to move $ for $. A lot of these moves will be based on how much Draisaitl gets.

I am not totally against your lines. I see Eberle as a must to being gone. I also see Slep maybe moving up. I see Pouliot gone.

However, I do wonder about RNH. I think it's pretty clear that Leon needs to be the #2 center so the Oilers have that 2 headed monster. So that automatically drops Nuge to the 3rd line. In my opinion, a good 3rd line center needs to put up 12-15 goals, 30-40 pts. So Nuge is capable of that. BUT a 3rd line center also needs to be very good defensively and good on faceoffs. I wouldn't call Nuge very good defensively, I would call him passable and his faceoffs aren't good. He has the odd good game but was a a 43.8% faceoff guy on the seasons and was 44.8% on the series. Flat out not good enough. Plus at 6 mill, he makes WAY too much to be in a 3rd line role.

When it comes to trading Nuge. I know some people will say "Don't trade him when his value is low". Fair point. However, the Oilers can probably hold on to him for next season cap wise. After nest season, they will have both Leon's AND McDavid's contract counting. So they will most likely need the cap relief. So if you have Nuge as your 3rd line center going into next season, putting up 3rd line numbers THEN you have the pressure of needing cap relief, I don't see how Nuge's value will go up. I believe his value might be as high as it gets going into this season.


That is exactly bang on for Nuge's value. He won't get enough top 6 play time, so his points will be limited like this year. He will be pegged as a 3rd line center with a little upside offensively in the NHL. To try and trade a really good 3rd line center with a $6 million cap hit will be horrendous. Do it now while a team might think he is just snake bitten and needs a change of scenary.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694601 is a reply to message #694598 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

Here is a scenario that I think would be awesome if it happened but don't know as lots of cards would have to fall.

In the expansion draft, the Ducks will have some hard decisions. They have a bunch of guys with No Moves. They have some really, really good young dmen. Lindholm, Manson, Fowler, Vatanen. Bieksa has a no move. I would think the Ducks will want protect at least Lindholm, Fowler, Manson. Plus with all the no moves, a guy like Silverberg will probably be available. I have to think that if Silverberg is available, he will get picked by Vegas. He's a good player on a cheapish deal.

Now I think we can all agree that the way to build a team is have a good goalie, have good defense and strength down the middle. With the guys available in the expansion draft, Vegas will have a lousy team and probably real weak at center. They just signed Shipachyov to a 2 year, 9 mill deal. He's a 30 yr old Russian who's NEVER played a single NHL game. That to me says Vegas already know they will be weak down the middle and especially weak for offensive centers. So they took a flyer on a guy and paid a lot to get him. I don't think cap space will be a problem for Vegas and even though deep down they know they will be lousy for awhile, they will want to try to be competitive.

If Vegas gets Silverberg, if I am the Oilers, I try to trade Nuge for Silverberg straight up. Here is why. Nuge is 24. I think he needs to work on some things and I think he needs to get stronger. He's a good skater and if he does what I said, I think he can have a bounce back year and he's young enough that he hasn't peaked. I don't think Nuge is a 3rd line center. He makes too much and his game isn't suited for that. If Nuge is playing top 6 mins, scoring over 20 goals, high 50's in points, then his 6 mill isn't that bad. But on the Oilers however, he won't get top 6 time. So if you are Vegas, you have to think he would be appealing. Getting a 24 yr old center with lots of experience who immediately slides into your top 6 makes you better and he would be WAY better than I assume anything that will be exposed. He's signed for several more years. Plus the money isn't an issue for Vegas. For many other teams, what Nuge makes is an issue. For the Oilers, they would be getting a good skating, right winger, right shot, who's experienced, can one time the puck, has a good 2 way game, has OK size, signed to 3.75 mill for a few more seasons and you could instantly slide seamlessly into your top 6, maybe even on McDavid's line. He's what the Oilers could really use, plus you get cap relief.

This is a trade that would need the cards to fall into place but would benefit both teams. I don't think for a second the Oilers could in the offseason trade the Ducks NUge for Silverberg. The Ducks wouldn't want Nuge and couldn't afford him.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694609 is a reply to message #694601 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 11:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
Messages: 543
Registered: November 2007
Location: Leduc

No Cups

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:51

Here is a scenario that I think would be awesome if it happened but don't know as lots of cards would have to fall.

In the expansion draft, the Ducks will have some hard decisions. They have a bunch of guys with No Moves. They have some really, really good young dmen. Lindholm, Manson, Fowler, Vatanen. Bieksa has a no move. I would think the Ducks will want protect at least Lindholm, Fowler, Manson. Plus with all the no moves, a guy like Silverberg will probably be available. I have to think that if Silverberg is available, he will get picked by Vegas. He's a good player on a cheapish deal.

Now I think we can all agree that the way to build a team is have a good goalie, have good defense and strength down the middle. With the guys available in the expansion draft, Vegas will have a lousy team and probably real weak at center. They just signed Shipachyov to a 2 year, 9 mill deal. He's a 30 yr old Russian who's NEVER played a single NHL game. That to me says Vegas already know they will be weak down the middle and especially weak for offensive centers. So they took a flyer on a guy and paid a lot to get him. I don't think cap space will be a problem for Vegas and even though deep down they know they will be lousy for awhile, they will want to try to be competitive.

If Vegas gets Silverberg, if I am the Oilers, I try to trade Nuge for Silverberg straight up. Here is why. Nuge is 24. I think he needs to work on some things and I think he needs to get stronger. He's a good skater and if he does what I said, I think he can have a bounce back year and he's young enough that he hasn't peaked. I don't think Nuge is a 3rd line center. He makes too much and his game isn't suited for that. If Nuge is playing top 6 mins, scoring over 20 goals, high 50's in points, then his 6 mill isn't that bad. But on the Oilers however, he won't get top 6 time. So if you are Vegas, you have to think he would be appealing. Getting a 24 yr old center with lots of experience who immediately slides into your top 6 makes you better and he would be WAY better than I assume anything that will be exposed. He's signed for several more years. Plus the money isn't an issue for Vegas. For many other teams, what Nuge makes is an issue. For the Oilers, they would be getting a good skating, right winger, right shot, who's experienced, can one time the puck, has a good 2 way game, has OK size, signed to 3.75 mill for a few more seasons and you could instantly slide seamlessly into your top 6, maybe even on McDavid's line. He's what the Oilers could really use, plus you get cap relief.

This is a trade that would need the cards to fall into place but would benefit both teams. I don't think for a second the Oilers could in the offseason trade the Ducks Nuge for Silverberg. The Ducks wouldn't want Nuge and couldn't afford him.



This would be a solid move IMO. There was some pundits talking about teams like the Ducks who are in a bad situation for expansion adding some picks into a deal so that Vegas takes a lesser player than a guy like a Silverberg. Anaheim was thought to asking Vegas to take a guy like Theodore, add in a 2-3rd rd pick instead of taking Silverberg/Montour.
You are correct though....The Ducks are in a terrible spot for the expansion draft. I think they will trade a guy like Vatanen to a team like the Yotes who have no expansion issues and can take on a guy like this and still protect him easily in the draft.

If they can't find a trade before the draft & they protect 4 Dmen, they will have 2 very good Dmen & 1 very good forward available for Vegas to choose from. They are going to have to make a big time trade for one of their Dmen and add picks to Vegas to select who they want to lose.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694603 is a reply to message #694598 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 09:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
Messages: 543
Registered: November 2007
Location: Leduc

No Cups

Here is my lineup for next season & an explanation on how some trade's would work out to get these players.

Maroon McDavid Caggiula
Lucic Draisaitl R. Strome (from NYI)
Slepyshev Boyle Kassian
Kulemin Letestu Pakarinen
Extra - ?

Klefbom Larrson
Sekera J. Faulk (from Car)
Nurse Reinhart
Extra - ?

Talbot
Brossoit

1st move - Pouliot gets picked up in the expansion draft & we dump $4 million in cap space.

2nd move - after expansion draft we trade Eberle to NYI for R. Strome & Kulemin. We get back a 2nd line RW ($2.5 cap hit) & take Kulemin back because the NYI need to dump some salary to take on Eberle's cap hit. Kulemin is no gem, but his cap is $4.87 for ONLY 1 Year, so we eat that contract to dump 2 years of Eberle's contract. Kulemin has a bit of a history that he can step into a top 6 role when injuries occur & he is big, can skate ok & likes to play physical. Strome seems to not be in the plan much. Weight & Capulano didn't give him many minutes besides 2nd unit PP time. Maybe a change in culture can help him out? This deal works cause Snow wants a winger for Tavares to entice him to sign his extension & thinks Eberle could be a value pick up cause he had an off year. Snow is trying to keep his job & thinks Eberle had an off year.

3rd move - after expansion trade Nuge & Khaira to Carolina for Justin Faulk. I don't want to trade Nuge, but we can't pay a 3rd line center $6 million for 3 more years, math doesn't work with 2 big contracts coming in for Drai & Connor. Carolina thinks Nuge can be an effective 2nd line center (they are desperate for top 6 center) & just had an off year & Khaira tips the scale for them to pull the trigger to let a RH powerplay Dman go out the door with a great contract.

4th move - sign Boyle as UFA to 2 year deal at $2.25 million a year). he becomes our 3rd line center.

I would leave Puljujarvi in the minors unless he pushes big time. That way we make him fight for his ice & we have a great option if injuries occur. Reinhart gets the #6 spot and is an ok #6 IMO.

The Eberle contract is an albatross and will be very difficult to move without taking on some garbage contract back. If no one wants him, maybe Vegas takes him for a depth dman and a 3rd line center that they picked up in the expansion draft? either way he's gotta go. If you keep Nuge play him on the wing with Drai.

We save $5.375 million in cap space with all of these moves. Drai's contract will eat that up in a hurry.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694606 is a reply to message #694603 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 11:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

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Jakey wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:59

Here is my lineup for next season & an explanation on how some trade's would work out to get these players.

Maroon McDavid Caggiula
Lucic Draisaitl R. Strome (from NYI)
Slepyshev Boyle Kassian
Kulemin Letestu Pakarinen
Extra - ?

Klefbom Larrson
Sekera J. Faulk (from Car)
Nurse Reinhart
Extra - ?

Talbot
Brossoit

1st move - Pouliot gets picked up in the expansion draft & we dump $4 million in cap space.

2nd move - after expansion draft we trade Eberle to NYI for R. Strome & Kulemin. We get back a 2nd line RW ($2.5 cap hit) & take Kulemin back because the NYI need to dump some salary to take on Eberle's cap hit. Kulemin is no gem, but his cap is $4.87 for ONLY 1 Year, so we eat that contract to dump 2 years of Eberle's contract. Kulemin has a bit of a history that he can step into a top 6 role when injuries occur & he is big, can skate ok & likes to play physical. Strome seems to not be in the plan much. Weight & Capulano didn't give him many minutes besides 2nd unit PP time. Maybe a change in culture can help him out? This deal works cause Snow wants a winger for Tavares to entice him to sign his extension & thinks Eberle could be a value pick up cause he had an off year. Snow is trying to keep his job & thinks Eberle had an off year.

3rd move - after expansion trade Nuge & Khaira to Carolina for Justin Faulk. I don't want to trade Nuge, but we can't pay a 3rd line center $6 million for 3 more years, math doesn't work with 2 big contracts coming in for Drai & Connor. Carolina thinks Nuge can be an effective 2nd line center (they are desperate for top 6 center) & just had an off year & Khaira tips the scale for them to pull the trigger to let a RH powerplay Dman go out the door with a great contract.

4th move - sign Boyle as UFA to 2 year deal at $2.25 million a year). he becomes our 3rd line center.

I would leave Puljujarvi in the minors unless he pushes big time. That way we make him fight for his ice & we have a great option if injuries occur. Reinhart gets the #6 spot and is an ok #6 IMO.

The Eberle contract is an albatross and will be very difficult to move without taking on some garbage contract back. If no one wants him, maybe Vegas takes him for a depth dman and a 3rd line center that they picked up in the expansion draft? either way he's gotta go. If you keep Nuge play him on the wing with Drai.

We save $5.375 million in cap space with all of these moves. Drai's contract will eat that up in a hurry.

I don't mind your ideas. The only thing I wonder is I am not sure Vegas goes after Pouliot. I would love if they did but not sure. I think they would actually be more interested in Reinhart. Building up your back end is crucial. I think Reinhart finally took a step in his development where he is close to being an NHLer. Given his age, I could see them going after him. Plus with them realistically being not in a position to even be remotely good. They could slow play him and let him over develop if they want and he's be cheap. So I could see a scenario where the Oilers might have to buy out Pouliot or swallow hard and keep him.

Plus you forgot Benning. He's a lock to be in the top 6 next year and he's a right shot.

But interesting idea on Faulk. I was a fan last year. With Benning, I don't think it's as dire to get that right shot PP guy but if you could land him, awesome and Faulk is signed for less than 5 mill and he is still young. Having your entire top 4 signed for under 6 mill, with 3 out of 4 less than 5 mill would be outstanding.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694607 is a reply to message #694606 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 11:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
Messages: 543
Registered: November 2007
Location: Leduc

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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 11:07

Jakey wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:59

Here is my lineup for next season & an explanation on how some trade's would work out to get these players.

Maroon McDavid Caggiula
Lucic Draisaitl R. Strome (from NYI)
Slepyshev Boyle Kassian
Kulemin Letestu Pakarinen
Extra - ?

Klefbom Larrson
Sekera J. Faulk (from Car)
Nurse Reinhart
Extra - ?

Talbot
Brossoit

1st move - Pouliot gets picked up in the expansion draft & we dump $4 million in cap space.

2nd move - after expansion draft we trade Eberle to NYI for R. Strome & Kulemin. We get back a 2nd line RW ($2.5 cap hit) & take Kulemin back because the NYI need to dump some salary to take on Eberle's cap hit. Kulemin is no gem, but his cap is $4.87 for ONLY 1 Year, so we eat that contract to dump 2 years of Eberle's contract. Kulemin has a bit of a history that he can step into a top 6 role when injuries occur & he is big, can skate ok & likes to play physical. Strome seems to not be in the plan much. Weight & Capulano didn't give him many minutes besides 2nd unit PP time. Maybe a change in culture can help him out? This deal works cause Snow wants a winger for Tavares to entice him to sign his extension & thinks Eberle could be a value pick up cause he had an off year. Snow is trying to keep his job & thinks Eberle had an off year.

3rd move - after expansion trade Nuge & Khaira to Carolina for Justin Faulk. I don't want to trade Nuge, but we can't pay a 3rd line center $6 million for 3 more years, math doesn't work with 2 big contracts coming in for Drai & Connor. Carolina thinks Nuge can be an effective 2nd line center (they are desperate for top 6 center) & just had an off year & Khaira tips the scale for them to pull the trigger to let a RH powerplay Dman go out the door with a great contract.

4th move - sign Boyle as UFA to 2 year deal at $2.25 million a year). he becomes our 3rd line center.

I would leave Puljujarvi in the minors unless he pushes big time. That way we make him fight for his ice & we have a great option if injuries occur. Reinhart gets the #6 spot and is an ok #6 IMO.

The Eberle contract is an albatross and will be very difficult to move without taking on some garbage contract back. If no one wants him, maybe Vegas takes him for a depth dman and a 3rd line center that they picked up in the expansion draft? either way he's gotta go. If you keep Nuge play him on the wing with Drai.

We save $5.375 million in cap space with all of these moves. Drai's contract will eat that up in a hurry.

I don't mind your ideas. The only thing I wonder is I am not sure Vegas goes after Pouliot. I would love if they did but not sure. I think they would actually be more interested in Reinhart. Building up your back end is crucial. I think Reinhart finally took a step in his development where he is close to being an NHLer. Given his age, I could see them going after him. Plus with them realistically being not in a position to even be remotely good. They could slow play him and let him over develop if they want and he's be cheap. So I could see a scenario where the Oilers might have to buy out Pouliot or swallow hard and keep him.

Plus you forgot Benning. He's a lock to be in the top 6 next year and he's a right shot.

But interesting idea on Faulk. I was a fan last year. With Benning, I don't think it's as dire to get that right shot PP guy but if you could land him, awesome and Faulk is signed for less than 5 mill and he is still young. Having your entire top 4 signed for under 6 mill, with 3 out of 4 less than 5 mill would be outstanding.


Ya I forgot Benning, duh on me. Put him in for Reinhart and then Reinhart can be the extra guy.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694610 is a reply to message #694603 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 12:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NZ Oiler Fan  is currently offline NZ Oiler Fan
Messages: 1532
Registered: October 2006
Location: Rocky Mountain House, AB

1 Cup

Jakey wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:59

Here is my lineup for next season & an explanation on how some trade's would work out to get these players.

Maroon McDavid Caggiula
Lucic Draisaitl R. Strome (from NYI)
Slepyshev Boyle Kassian
Kulemin Letestu Pakarinen
Extra - ?

Klefbom Larrson
Sekera J. Faulk (from Car)
Nurse Reinhart
Extra - ?

Talbot
Brossoit

1st move - Pouliot gets picked up in the expansion draft & we dump $4 million in cap space.

2nd move - after expansion draft we trade Eberle to NYI for R. Strome & Kulemin. We get back a 2nd line RW ($2.5 cap hit) & take Kulemin back because the NYI need to dump some salary to take on Eberle's cap hit. Kulemin is no gem, but his cap is $4.87 for ONLY 1 Year, so we eat that contract to dump 2 years of Eberle's contract. Kulemin has a bit of a history that he can step into a top 6 role when injuries occur & he is big, can skate ok & likes to play physical. Strome seems to not be in the plan much. Weight & Capulano didn't give him many minutes besides 2nd unit PP time. Maybe a change in culture can help him out? This deal works cause Snow wants a winger for Tavares to entice him to sign his extension & thinks Eberle could be a value pick up cause he had an off year. Snow is trying to keep his job & thinks Eberle had an off year.

3rd move - after expansion trade Nuge & Khaira to Carolina for Justin Faulk. I don't want to trade Nuge, but we can't pay a 3rd line center $6 million for 3 more years, math doesn't work with 2 big contracts coming in for Drai & Connor. Carolina thinks Nuge can be an effective 2nd line center (they are desperate for top 6 center) & just had an off year & Khaira tips the scale for them to pull the trigger to let a RH powerplay Dman go out the door with a great contract.

4th move - sign Boyle as UFA to 2 year deal at $2.25 million a year). he becomes our 3rd line center.

I would leave Puljujarvi in the minors unless he pushes big time. That way we make him fight for his ice & we have a great option if injuries occur. Reinhart gets the #6 spot and is an ok #6 IMO.

The Eberle contract is an albatross and will be very difficult to move without taking on some garbage contract back. If no one wants him, maybe Vegas takes him for a depth dman and a 3rd line center that they picked up in the expansion draft? either way he's gotta go. If you keep Nuge play him on the wing with Drai.

We save $5.375 million in cap space with all of these moves. Drai's contract will eat that up in a hurry.


Love Justin Faulk, but I think it'd cost a hell of a lot more than Nuge and a 4th line spare part to get him, and that's assuming that for some bizarre reason Carolina would even entertain the thought of moving him.
It took Hall to get Larsson, and I'd rate Faulk as a better overall defenceman than Larsson...



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694612 is a reply to message #694610 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 12:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

NZ Oiler Fan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 12:05

Jakey wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 09:59

Here is my lineup for next season & an explanation on how some trade's would work out to get these players.

Maroon McDavid Caggiula
Lucic Draisaitl R. Strome (from NYI)
Slepyshev Boyle Kassian
Kulemin Letestu Pakarinen
Extra - ?

Klefbom Larrson
Sekera J. Faulk (from Car)
Nurse Reinhart
Extra - ?

Talbot
Brossoit

1st move - Pouliot gets picked up in the expansion draft & we dump $4 million in cap space.

2nd move - after expansion draft we trade Eberle to NYI for R. Strome & Kulemin. We get back a 2nd line RW ($2.5 cap hit) & take Kulemin back because the NYI need to dump some salary to take on Eberle's cap hit. Kulemin is no gem, but his cap is $4.87 for ONLY 1 Year, so we eat that contract to dump 2 years of Eberle's contract. Kulemin has a bit of a history that he can step into a top 6 role when injuries occur & he is big, can skate ok & likes to play physical. Strome seems to not be in the plan much. Weight & Capulano didn't give him many minutes besides 2nd unit PP time. Maybe a change in culture can help him out? This deal works cause Snow wants a winger for Tavares to entice him to sign his extension & thinks Eberle could be a value pick up cause he had an off year. Snow is trying to keep his job & thinks Eberle had an off year.

3rd move - after expansion trade Nuge & Khaira to Carolina for Justin Faulk. I don't want to trade Nuge, but we can't pay a 3rd line center $6 million for 3 more years, math doesn't work with 2 big contracts coming in for Drai & Connor. Carolina thinks Nuge can be an effective 2nd line center (they are desperate for top 6 center) & just had an off year & Khaira tips the scale for them to pull the trigger to let a RH powerplay Dman go out the door with a great contract.

4th move - sign Boyle as UFA to 2 year deal at $2.25 million a year). he becomes our 3rd line center.

I would leave Puljujarvi in the minors unless he pushes big time. That way we make him fight for his ice & we have a great option if injuries occur. Reinhart gets the #6 spot and is an ok #6 IMO.

The Eberle contract is an albatross and will be very difficult to move without taking on some garbage contract back. If no one wants him, maybe Vegas takes him for a depth dman and a 3rd line center that they picked up in the expansion draft? either way he's gotta go. If you keep Nuge play him on the wing with Drai.

We save $5.375 million in cap space with all of these moves. Drai's contract will eat that up in a hurry.


Love Justin Faulk, but I think it'd cost a hell of a lot more than Nuge and a 4th line spare part to get him, and that's assuming that for some bizarre reason Carolina would even entertain the thought of moving him.
It took Hall to get Larsson, and I'd rate Faulk as a better overall defenceman than Larsson...

You may be right about Faulk. However, he didn't have that great of a year. He was a brutal -18. The Hurricanes are loaded on defense with more guys coming. But they are weak at forward and especially at center. So its all about the needs of the team and what it will take to get a player you think can help you.

The Oilers desperately needed help on defense and especially on the right side at the end of last season. They had a surplus of offensive forwards. They paid a high price to get Larsson but it only cost them one player that they could afford to lose with no other assets. I think it paid off. For the Canes. I think they need forward help. I don't think Faulk straight up gets you a high end forward. So if you can get a pretty good forward and it just costs you one asset, it might be worth it.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694620 is a reply to message #694612 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

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I am just listening to Gregor and Strudwick talk about Eberle. Strudwck is of the opinion that the team needs to talk to Eberle and tell him he needs to get stronger, put one some muscle weight and work on his skating. Then give him a chance next season. I am all for giving people chances. But at the same time. Eberle will be 27 yrs old this Monday. He has 7 NHL seasons under his belt. He's played over 500 NHL games. I have to assume that given his size, he's probably been told every year that he needs to continue to get bigger and stronger. Given that he was never the best skater to begin with and how the league just gets faster and faster, I have to assume working on his skating is nothing new to him.

So the questions I would have are:
#1 Assuming Eberle takes being a pro seriously, wouldn't he already know this and have been working on it for the past 7 seasons?
#2 At 27 yrs old, I believe most athletes are usually at their peak physically and skill wise. So I would think that Eberle is about as good as he is going to get. So what are the odds he suddenly has this hidden, untapped gear?

I just have a hard time believing that when McLellan has his end of season meeting and if he mentions to Eberle "Ebs, we'd like you to get stronger, put on some muscle weight and start working with our skating coach way more." That it would be a shock to Eberle. I just have to assume he's been told that since his first year in the NHL and I don't think he will suddenly go "Oh, OK, I didn't realize everyone was actually being serious all those years until now. I'm going to do it now." Like has he not been taking his training serious before now?



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694622 is a reply to message #694620 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ragnarok73  is currently offline Ragnarok73
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:19

I am just listening to Gregor and Strudwick talk about Eberle. Strudwck is of the opinion that the team needs to talk to Eberle and tell him he needs to get stronger, put one some muscle weight and work on his skating. Then give him a chance next season. I am all for giving people chances. But at the same time. Eberle will be 27 yrs old this Monday. He has 7 NHL seasons under his belt. He's played over 500 NHL games. I have to assume that given his size, he's probably been told every year that he needs to continue to get bigger and stronger. Given that he was never the best skater to begin with and how the league just gets faster and faster, I have to assume working on his skating is nothing new to him.

So the questions I would have are:
#1 Assuming Eberle takes being a pro seriously, wouldn't he already know this and have been working on it for the past 7 seasons?
#2 At 27 yrs old, I believe most athletes are usually at their peak physically and skill wise. So I would think that Eberle is about as good as he is going to get. So what are the odds he suddenly has this hidden, untapped gear?

I just have a hard time believing that when McLellan has his end of season meeting and if he mentions to Eberle "Ebs, we'd like you to get stronger, put on some muscle weight and start working with our skating coach way more." That it would be a shock to Eberle. I just have to assume he's been told that since his first year in the NHL and I don't think he will suddenly go "Oh, OK, I didn't realize everyone was actually being serious all those years until now. I'm going to do it now." Like has he not been taking his training serious before now?

I don't think TMac and Chia are talking about how much Ebs has to improve at this point so much as they're talking about how much he needs to go. The problem is getting some sucker to take him and his cap hit for next year. Since this is highly unlikely, the Oil will likely have to retain salary to get anyone even remotely interested in him. At least Ference and his dead money should also be gone, and hopefully Poo can get picked by the Golden Knights in their draft.



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"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694624 is a reply to message #694622 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
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Ragnarok73 wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:28

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:19

I am just listening to Gregor and Strudwick talk about Eberle. Strudwck is of the opinion that the team needs to talk to Eberle and tell him he needs to get stronger, put one some muscle weight and work on his skating. Then give him a chance next season. I am all for giving people chances. But at the same time. Eberle will be 27 yrs old this Monday. He has 7 NHL seasons under his belt. He's played over 500 NHL games. I have to assume that given his size, he's probably been told every year that he needs to continue to get bigger and stronger. Given that he was never the best skater to begin with and how the league just gets faster and faster, I have to assume working on his skating is nothing new to him.

So the questions I would have are:
#1 Assuming Eberle takes being a pro seriously, wouldn't he already know this and have been working on it for the past 7 seasons?
#2 At 27 yrs old, I believe most athletes are usually at their peak physically and skill wise. So I would think that Eberle is about as good as he is going to get. So what are the odds he suddenly has this hidden, untapped gear?

I just have a hard time believing that when McLellan has his end of season meeting and if he mentions to Eberle "Ebs, we'd like you to get stronger, put on some muscle weight and start working with our skating coach way more." That it would be a shock to Eberle. I just have to assume he's been told that since his first year in the NHL and I don't think he will suddenly go "Oh, OK, I didn't realize everyone was actually being serious all those years until now. I'm going to do it now." Like has he not been taking his training serious before now?

I don't think TMac and Chia are talking about how much Ebs has to improve at this point so much as they're talking about how much he needs to go. The problem is getting some sucker to take him and his cap hit for next year. Since this is highly unlikely, the Oil will likely have to retain salary to get anyone even remotely interested in him. At least Ference and his dead money should also be gone, and hopefully Poo can get picked by the Golden Knights in their draft.

I agree with you. I just don't understand where Strudwick is coming from. Could Eberle score a few more goals next year? Sure he could. With a little better luck, he could score 25 goals. It still doesn't change the fact he's an extremely one dimensional player who makes 6 mill which is probably at least 1 mill more than he should.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694623 is a reply to message #694620 ]
Thu, 11 May 2017 16:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently online Kr55
Messages: 10749
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:19

I am just listening to Gregor and Strudwick talk about Eberle. Strudwck is of the opinion that the team needs to talk to Eberle and tell him he needs to get stronger, put one some muscle weight and work on his skating. Then give him a chance next season. I am all for giving people chances. But at the same time. Eberle will be 27 yrs old this Monday. He has 7 NHL seasons under his belt. He's played over 500 NHL games. I have to assume that given his size, he's probably been told every year that he needs to continue to get bigger and stronger. Given that he was never the best skater to begin with and how the league just gets faster and faster, I have to assume working on his skating is nothing new to him.

So the questions I would have are:
#1 Assuming Eberle takes being a pro seriously, wouldn't he already know this and have been working on it for the past 7 seasons?
#2 At 27 yrs old, I believe most athletes are usually at their peak physically and skill wise. So I would think that Eberle is about as good as he is going to get. So what are the odds he suddenly has this hidden, untapped gear?

I just have a hard time believing that when McLellan has his end of season meeting and if he mentions to Eberle "Ebs, we'd like you to get stronger, put on some muscle weight and start working with our skating coach way more." That it would be a shock to Eberle. I just have to assume he's been told that since his first year in the NHL and I don't think he will suddenly go "Oh, OK, I didn't realize everyone was actually being serious all those years until now. I'm going to do it now." Like has he not been taking his training serious before now?


Nuge and Ebs should both be throwing money at Gary Roberts right now to get into his camp. Or some program on that level. And Nuge needs to throw money at Adam Oates to personally work with him on faceoffs. These guys should be very aware of what kept them from being successful in these playoffs, and if they ever don't want to feel as bad as they do right now again, they will work their butts off this summer.

And I don't mean just for the Oilers either. Just in general, for any team they may end up on. They have to know now how important the summer work is if they want to be successful in April/May/June. Never want to hear again how Nuge trained with his brother all summer or garbage like that (http://www.anhstrengthperformance.com/about).

[Updated on: Thu, 11 May 2017 18:36]


"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694631 is a reply to message #694623 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 08:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:40

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 11 May 2017 16:19

I am just listening to Gregor and Strudwick talk about Eberle. Strudwck is of the opinion that the team needs to talk to Eberle and tell him he needs to get stronger, put one some muscle weight and work on his skating. Then give him a chance next season. I am all for giving people chances. But at the same time. Eberle will be 27 yrs old this Monday. He has 7 NHL seasons under his belt. He's played over 500 NHL games. I have to assume that given his size, he's probably been told every year that he needs to continue to get bigger and stronger. Given that he was never the best skater to begin with and how the league just gets faster and faster, I have to assume working on his skating is nothing new to him.

So the questions I would have are:
#1 Assuming Eberle takes being a pro seriously, wouldn't he already know this and have been working on it for the past 7 seasons?
#2 At 27 yrs old, I believe most athletes are usually at their peak physically and skill wise. So I would think that Eberle is about as good as he is going to get. So what are the odds he suddenly has this hidden, untapped gear?

I just have a hard time believing that when McLellan has his end of season meeting and if he mentions to Eberle "Ebs, we'd like you to get stronger, put on some muscle weight and start working with our skating coach way more." That it would be a shock to Eberle. I just have to assume he's been told that since his first year in the NHL and I don't think he will suddenly go "Oh, OK, I didn't realize everyone was actually being serious all those years until now. I'm going to do it now." Like has he not been taking his training serious before now?


Nuge and Ebs should both be throwing money at Gary Roberts right now to get into his camp. Or some program on that level. And Nuge needs to throw money at Adam Oates to personally work with him on faceoffs. These guys should be very aware of what kept them from being successful in these playoffs, and if they ever don't want to feel as bad as they do right now again, they will work their butts off this summer.

And I don't mean just for the Oilers either. Just in general, for any team they may end up on. They have to know now how important the summer work is if they want to be successful in April/May/June. Never want to hear again how Nuge trained with his brother all summer or garbage like that (http://www.anhstrengthperformance.com/about).

I 100% agree. In my opinion, those 2 have not done what was needed to improve much. How long is your average practice? 45 mins? That's when they actually get to practice which isn't a lot because they are so busy traveling and you need to give these guys rest so they can properly recover after games. So there physically isn't a ton of time to actually do skill development in practice if at all. These guys need to do stuff on their own time and in the offseason.

Can anyone actually say that Nuge is vastly improved much? He's a little bigger, a little stronger and more aware but he had 52 pts in his rookie year, his career high is 56. NO it's not the bloody coaches fault. All the stats people say faceoffs don't matter much. Well they freaking mattered in the Ducks series as it allowed the Ducks to get whatever match up they wanted at will. McLellan tried to shield McDavid from Kesler but the Ducks were typically winning over 60% of the draws every night so all they had to do was draw the puck back an in 6 seconds, Kesler is out there again. Here is Nuge's stats. https://www.nhl.com/player/ryan-nugent-hopkins-8476454 He was 37.5% in his rookie year. Well he had zero experience and was 174 lbs. Then he went up to 41%, 42.4, 45.6, then dropped to 44.8 and 43.8 this past season. If you are busting your butt in the offseason and trying to improve on your skills how can you barely improve in faceoffs after 6 seasons? It's a skill centers have to do. He's been a center for his entire career. Where is the improvement?

Eberle. According to an article I found at the time he was drafted, Eberle at 18 was 5'10, 174. http://bleacherreport.com/articles/31696-nhl-draft-edmonton- oilers-take-jordan-eberle-22nd-overall
The soon to be 27 yr old Eberle is listed at 5'11, 184. When you are a small player, I am sure he was told when he was drafted that the first thing he needed to do was to get bigger and stronger. I bet every year after that he was told to get bigger and stronger. So from his draft year until Monday when he is 27, that's 9 years, he's gained a grand total of 10 lbs. Apparently from his draft year, he grew an inch. So there is probably a pound. I have to assume that as a high end junior player he was in decent shape and training already. So you telling me in 9 years of training you only gained 10 lbs? Does Eberle look much bigger or stronger today than he did in his first year or 2? No. If you remember how skinnish McDavid looked his first year and compare him this season. You can see that he looks thicker and you can see he's stronger because he wins more puck battles. That's in 1 offseason and I am pretty sure he goes to that Gary Roberts camp.

So If I am Nuge, I stop worrying about all my freaking race horses and fire whoever my trainer, skills coach or whatever person you work out with right now. Eberle should be the same. Then like you said, if I am Nuge and Eberle, I am signing up with Oates TODAY. To learn how to be better. He trains not just slugs, he trains superstars. Then either sign up with Gary Roberts or whoever is considered the best offseason conditioning coach/trainer and I work my bag off to put some muscle on that frame so maybe once in awhile I can win a puck battle and not get pushed off the puck so easily.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694632 is a reply to message #694623 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 08:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mazankowski  is currently offline mazankowski
Messages: 514
Registered: June 2006
Location: Kelowna BC

No Cups

I have 3 big issues facing us going into the offseason.

1) We had better have a good contingency plan to get a RH 2nd pairing offensive D man if we do not re-sign KR. If we have Benning move up the lineup next year, we won't take the next step. I don't think Benning is a bad player, he's just raw and developing still. To throw him into that spot, with those minutes, as a sophomore player is a lot for any player. Can Eberle net you a someone with a terrible contract, be exposed to Vegas or someone who just had a down year? Maybe.

2) We need a better fit for the PP to take Letestu's spot. He had an unreal year, but you cannot tell me that there's not someone out there that can do it better. Letestu (if he's not claimed by Vegas) is a solid 4th line C, and Penalty Killer. But he should not be getting more than 12 minutes a night. Perhaps the fit comes from a replacement 3rd line right handed centreman, or a right handed winger. Think of a guy like Patrick Sharp, Ales Hemsky, or Justin Williams flanking that PP on the left side bottom funnel.

3) A Right Handed centre who is good on the dot. If the series against Anaheim proved anything, it was that faceoffs ARE important. I don't care what any pundit tells you, and that the difference between a 45% and 55% draw team is 1 or 2 faceoffs a game, it's timely draws which are important (PP, PK, and the end of game). Ideally, this person would be able to facilitate a PP as well. Could a guy like Mike Fisher up and leave Nashville? Unlikely, but that's the kind of guy we need.

My ideal lineup:

Maroon - McDavid - Puljujarvi/RNH
Lucic - Draisaitl - Sharp
Caggiula - Fisher -Slepyshev
Khaira - Letestu - Kassian

Klefbom - Larrson
Sekera - Russell/Spurgeon/Myers
Nurse - Benning

Talbot
Brossoit



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694635 is a reply to message #694632 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 11:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

One thing I struggle with when it comes to the Eberle talk and especially when it comes to guys that are a bit against it like the radio people. When they talk about Eberle, the immediately say "If you are going to trade him, you have to bring in someone who will equal his 25-30 goals." Well he only scored 20. Could Eberle maybe score 25 goals next year? Sure he could. But as a GM do you seriously make all your decisions based completely on hope?

I would think that the prudent thing to do is if you are trading Eberle, you bring in a guy that can at least replace what Eberle scored this season. If he scores more, bonus. But you can't count on Eberle scoring 25+ goals based on what he did this past season or the playoffs.

The same goes for Nuge. I think the Oilers need an upgrade at 3rd line center. They need a reliable guy that can go out and actually match up against some of the bigger centers in the league especially the West and do a more consistent job than Nuge does. They also need a guy who is consistently decent at winning faceoffs especially in the defensive zone. Could Nuge come in next season and be a fantastic shut down center, winning 55+% of his draws all year and get Selke consideration. Anything is possible. But as the GM do you base your roster decisions on the less than likely chance he does that or do you make a move and bring in someone who you know will be an upgrade?

The Oilers for years when they sucked made all kinds of bets on the "If's and maybes". They bet that Yak would be a Ovie light. He night not be in the league this year. They bet that Gagner would be a right shooting, high scoring top 6 center. Until this season, he was barely a bottom 6 forward and spent tons of time on the wing. So if they are serious about taking the next step and going after the cup which they should be given where they are at now. I would prefer to go after more sure bets than cross your fingers.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694637 is a reply to message #694635 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 12:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Prince Albert 1  is currently offline Prince Albert 1
Messages: 574
Registered: February 2006
Location: Prince Albert,Sk

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Pitlick was on pace to replace Eberles 20 goals. How would his speed/physicality have looked in a fast, physical series against the Ducks?

If he could ever stay healthy could be a candidate to take on 2nd/3rd line RW duties.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694645 is a reply to message #694635 ]
Fri, 12 May 2017 17:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
Messages: 1474
Registered: October 2006
Location: Vancouver

1 Cup

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 12 May 2017 10:47

One thing I struggle with when it comes to the Eberle talk and especially when it comes to guys that are a bit against it like the radio people. When they talk about Eberle, the immediately say "If you are going to trade him, you have to bring in someone who will equal his 25-30 goals." Well he only scored 20. Could Eberle maybe score 25 goals next year? Sure he could. But as a GM do you seriously make all your decisions based completely on hope?


I'm honestly not trying to be a knob here, and I don't want to argue whether the Oilers should keep Eberle - again I've resigned myself to it's virtual inevitability regardless of how opposed to it I am. But since you asked and since I am someone on the other side of the Eberle argument, I'll try and explain the thought process a little bit (at least for myself).

I don't know specifically who or what comment you're referring to, but my guess is they're basing it off of more than 1 season. The three years before that Eberle scored 28, 24 and 25 goals. So saying 30 goals is a stretch considering he's only done it once, but 22-27 is probably reasonable, no? Especially when you consider how bad of a shooting % year that Eberle had, and we know that shooting % fluctuates somewhat wildly.

Here are Crosby's last 4 years goal totals, shots and shooting%:

13/14 - 36 goals/259 shots/13.9%
14/15 - 28 goals/237 shots/11.8%
15/16 - 36 goals/248 shots/14.5%
16/17 - 44 goals/255 shots/17.3%

We can see the somewhat volatile nature of shooting % and how much it influences goal totals. In the year Crosby had the highest shooting % he had his highest goal total and vice versa.

So, hypothetically, if the Pens had decided to trade Crosby after the 14/15 season, should they have just gone out and looked for someone that they assumed could score 28 goals? That would have been a bad move. And before all your heads explode, I'm not suggesting that Eberle=Crosby. This volatility around shooting% and it's relationship to goals is pretty consistent for all players. In 2010/11 Ovechkin had his worst shooting % year (8.7%) and his fewest goals ever 32. In subsequent years his shooting % went back up (around 13%) and he was back to scoring 50+.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694665 is a reply to message #694645 ]
Sun, 14 May 2017 17:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

Goose wrote on Fri, 12 May 2017 17:11

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 12 May 2017 10:47

One thing I struggle with when it comes to the Eberle talk and especially when it comes to guys that are a bit against it like the radio people. When they talk about Eberle, the immediately say "If you are going to trade him, you have to bring in someone who will equal his 25-30 goals." Well he only scored 20. Could Eberle maybe score 25 goals next year? Sure he could. But as a GM do you seriously make all your decisions based completely on hope?


I'm honestly not trying to be a knob here, and I don't want to argue whether the Oilers should keep Eberle - again I've resigned myself to it's virtual inevitability regardless of how opposed to it I am. But since you asked and since I am someone on the other side of the Eberle argument, I'll try and explain the thought process a little bit (at least for myself).

I don't know specifically who or what comment you're referring to, but my guess is they're basing it off of more than 1 season. The three years before that Eberle scored 28, 24 and 25 goals. So saying 30 goals is a stretch considering he's only done it once, but 22-27 is probably reasonable, no? Especially when you consider how bad of a shooting % year that Eberle had, and we know that shooting % fluctuates somewhat wildly.

Here are Crosby's last 4 years goal totals, shots and shooting%:

13/14 - 36 goals/259 shots/13.9%
14/15 - 28 goals/237 shots/11.8%
15/16 - 36 goals/248 shots/14.5%
16/17 - 44 goals/255 shots/17.3%

We can see the somewhat volatile nature of shooting % and how much it influences goal totals. In the year Crosby had the highest shooting % he had his highest goal total and vice versa.

So, hypothetically, if the Pens had decided to trade Crosby after the 14/15 season, should they have just gone out and looked for someone that they assumed could score 28 goals? That would have been a bad move. And before all your heads explode, I'm not suggesting that Eberle=Crosby. This volatility around shooting% and it's relationship to goals is pretty consistent for all players. In 2010/11 Ovechkin had his worst shooting % year (8.7%) and his fewest goals ever 32. In subsequent years his shooting % went back up (around 13%) and he was back to scoring 50+.

Eberle this past season showed he was unable to play with McDavid. He isn't fast enough. He doesn't one time the puck well, doesn't have a good shot and he doesn't shoot fast enough. Instead of taking the insane feeds from McDavid and firing it, Eberle likes to screw around with puck to much. So there is no chemistry there.

He goes and plays with his long time center and somehow can't find chemistry with a guy that he's played with and has success with for 6 years. Eberle is being paid 6 mill. He doesn't do anything else but produce points. That isn't me taking a shot at him, that's just what he is. Has always been that, will always be that. IN order to justify making 6 mill, he's being paid to be a 30 goal, 65-70 pts play. He hasn't scored 30 goals or 70 or more points since before he signed this deal. He's morphed into a 25 goal, 60 pt guy in a decent year. So he's overpaid but probably at least 1 mill.

At 27 yrs old, Eberle is at his peak. There is no hidden development or talent. He's as good as he is going to get. He's never been the fastest skater and in a league that has gotten faster, he hasn't kept up. He's not the biggest guy, he's small. He hasn't kept up with getting stronger. As I pointed out earlier. In 9 years, he put on 10 lbs from his draft weight. If he is working and bulking up like he should be, he should be in the mid 190's. He's not.

So he's already making too much money because he's being paid to be a 30+ goal, 70+ pt guy which he hasn't done since before he signed the contract and probably won't ever do. He's already falling behind in skating and he's still not strong enough. Could he score 25 goals next year? Maybe. You say his shooting percentage is down so sure. But are his numbers down only because he just had an off year OR are they because everyone else knows what he does, he hasn't changed his game and now everyone is faster than him and his lack of strength and diminishing quickness is making it hard for him to get to the spots anymore. That is what concerns me.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694666 is a reply to message #694665 ]
Sun, 14 May 2017 17:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Babaganoosh  is currently offline Babaganoosh
Messages: 1317
Registered: January 2009
Location: Medicine Hat,AB

1 Cup

As Goose pointed out in another thread Eberle and Draisatl had a almost identical points/60min while playing with McDavid so when are you going to stop pushing the fallacy that Eberle can't play with McDavid.


" If you have anything good to say, say it off!"

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694667 is a reply to message #694666 ]
Sun, 14 May 2017 17:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
Messages: 1474
Registered: October 2006
Location: Vancouver

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Babaganoosh wrote on Sun, 14 May 2017 16:36

As Goose pointed out in another thread Eberle and Draisatl had a almost identical points/60min while playing with McDavid so when are you going to stop pushing the fallacy that Eberle can't play with McDavid.


And Eberle's scoring rates in 15/16 with McDavid were much higher than Draisaitl's in 16/17.

Smaller sample for sure, but I don't think we can just pretend they didn't happen.



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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694668 is a reply to message #694667 ]
Sun, 14 May 2017 17:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently online Kr55
Messages: 10749
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Goose wrote on Sun, 14 May 2017 17:43

Babaganoosh wrote on Sun, 14 May 2017 16:36

As Goose pointed out in another thread Eberle and Draisatl had a almost identical points/60min while playing with McDavid so when are you going to stop pushing the fallacy that Eberle can't play with McDavid.


And Eberle's scoring rates in 15/16 with McDavid were much higher than Draisaitl's in 16/17.

Smaller sample for sure, but I don't think we can just pretend they didn't happen.


Think the requirements of McDavid's wingers evolved with how much the league started to let teams get away with checking McDavid. Ebs and McDavid were magic last season. Lots of points off the rush, quite a bit early this season as well. Sadly, as this season went on McDavid seemed to go from being groped and grabbed for 20% of his ice time to 70%, and cycle play and his linemates being able to carry the puck and fight off defenders started to become a must for his offense. McLellan's decisions for who to play with McDavid as the season went on tell the rest of the story.

Think going forward, the basic requirements for McDavid's wingers will be guys that are fast, at least average strength, willing to battle along the boards all night long, and ideally can 1-time shots. Hurry up Pulju!!!

[Updated on: Sun, 14 May 2017 18:03]


"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Starting Lineups for 2017-2018 Season [message #694673 is a reply to message #694666 ]
Mon, 15 May 2017 08:35 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
RDOilerfan is currently online RDOilerfan
Messages: 1930
Registered: January 2016

1 Cup

Babaganoosh wrote on Sun, 14 May 2017 17:36

As Goose pointed out in another thread Eberle and Draisatl had a almost identical points/60min while playing with McDavid so when are you going to stop pushing the fallacy that Eberle can't play with McDavid.


OK great but that still doesn't change the fact that he's being paid 6 mill and being paid as if he is a consistent 30+ goal, 70 pt guy. He was given that contract right after he had 34 goals, 76 pts. He's never gotten close since. So even if he does bounce back and scores 25 goals and pushes 60 pts, which is where he settled into before this season, he's still way overpaid because he doesn't do enough other things to justify that 6 mill. When Eberle doesn't score he doesn't do anything else. That's not intended as a knock that's just his style of play. He's been like that his entire career.

I believe Eberle is currently the Oilers Hornqvist. He's a smallish winger who puts up 20+ goals and 50+ pts every year. Production wise, that's just fine. http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/player-bio/patric-hornqvist Those are Hornqvist numbers, pretty consistent. I was surprised at how many hits he gets, especially the last 2 seasons which Eberle doesn't do. Hornqvist is a slightly more grittier, more responsible Eberle. BUT Hornqvist makes 4.25 mill. Eberle isn't 1.75 mill better than Hornqvist. If the Pens have proven anything, it's that when you have 2 elite centers, you don't have to break the bank on wingers to have good lines. If Eberle was making 4.5 mill and he puts up his 25 goal, close to 60 pts, similar to a hornqvist, then you live with the flaws in his game because his contract isn't bad. Even if he made 5 mill, you may grumble a bit but you probably live with it.

To put it into perspective. If the Oilers had Eberle at Hornqvist money, that 6 mill he currently makes would pay for him and be damn close to covering Kassian's new deal. If you don't like Hornqvist, a person can rattle off tons of guys scoring similar numbers to Eberle who make in the 4's or less. So while I like Eberle, if you can get rid of him and his 6 mill, I believe you have to get rid of him because I think you can replace Eberle's production with someone for way less. Eberle's usual production being mid 20's in goals, 55+ pts. I don't see Eberle moving forward scoring more than that.



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