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 Nurse's Future [message #742409]
Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40 Go to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 13156
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



"This team needs an enema!"
#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireBuchberger #FireHowsonAgain #FireChiarelli #FireMcLellan #FireBobbyNicks and...SIGH...#FireTheGretzkys

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #742410 is a reply to message #742409 ]
Fri, 06 September 2019 09:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 16306
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



If Nurse has another good season, I think they would move Klef before Nurse. Nurse is too popular in the room and with the org. And he is going to convince Hall to come back too, as per Garfield.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #742413 is a reply to message #742410 ]
Fri, 06 September 2019 10:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 13156
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:50

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



If Nurse has another good season, I think they would move Klef before Nurse. Nurse is too popular in the room and with the org. And he is going to convince Hall to come back too, as per Garfield.


It would not surprise me, but it would be foolish.

Klefbom, after this season, will have 3 more years at $4.167MM. Even if Nurse were to score an extra 5 points a season (and I don't expect him to), paying him $2.5 to $3.0MM more than Klefbom and locking in long-term is likely a mistake. You can add a pretty decent depth player for that kind of money. Even if you thought Nurse was better than Klefbom (which I think hard to see any evidence for), Klefbom + $2.5MM (assuming the team spends that) vs Nurse is a clear win for 77+.

And while Nurse is more physical, I don't think he is any better as a defensive defenceman. There's some warts in his game. It will be interesting to see how it goes this year with Tippett's plan to start with Nurse/Larsson as a defensive shutdown pair. I don't see either of them as a particularly strong puck-mover, although Nurse does skate the puck well.

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see the Oilers sign Nurse for $7MM and trade away Klefbom instead, because that's the kind of thing the Oilers do, but it's hard to see how that wouldn't be a mistake.



"This team needs an enema!"
#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireBuchberger #FireHowsonAgain #FireChiarelli #FireMcLellan #FireBobbyNicks and...SIGH...#FireTheGretzkys

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #742414 is a reply to message #742413 ]
Fri, 06 September 2019 11:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 16306
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 10:41

Kr55 wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:50

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



If Nurse has another good season, I think they would move Klef before Nurse. Nurse is too popular in the room and with the org. And he is going to convince Hall to come back too, as per Garfield.


It would not surprise me, but it would be foolish.

Klefbom, after this season, will have 3 more years at $4.167MM. Even if Nurse were to score an extra 5 points a season (and I don't expect him to), paying him $2.5 to $3.0MM more than Klefbom and locking in long-term is likely a mistake. You can add a pretty decent depth player for that kind of money. Even if you thought Nurse was better than Klefbom (which I think hard to see any evidence for), Klefbom + $2.5MM (assuming the team spends that) vs Nurse is a clear win for 77+.

And while Nurse is more physical, I don't think he is any better as a defensive defenceman. There's some warts in his game. It will be interesting to see how it goes this year with Tippett's plan to start with Nurse/Larsson as a defensive shutdown pair. I don't see either of them as a particularly strong puck-mover, although Nurse does skate the puck well.

Honestly, it wouldn't surprise me at all to see the Oilers sign Nurse for $7MM and trade away Klefbom instead, because that's the kind of thing the Oilers do, but it's hard to see how that wouldn't be a mistake.


I don't think they trade Klef right away if they extend Nurse. Maybe in his last season where Klef may be looking at 7+ on an extension to stay an Oiler. Lucky we signed Klef before he really did much in the NHL, one of Chia's few moves that worked out. We can keep both for at least another year, and find ways to get lefties playing on the right side, which I think Broberg has said he's done.

That said, the Nurse/Larsson combo, based on historical stats, does have potential to drive down Nurses's next contract price :)



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 sRe: Nurse's Future [message #742446 is a reply to message #742409 ]
Fri, 06 September 2019 21:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner is currently online mightyreasoner
Messages: 3058
Registered: October 2005
Location: Edmonton

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Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



I think I'd try to keep Nurse AND Klefbom for as long as I can. With Seattle expansion, the team is likely to lose one of Bear or Jones, and Klefbom's health is a MAJOR concern for me. It's a long fall from Klefbom on your first pairing to Russell on your first pairing. It's less of a fall from Klefbom to Nurse (still a fall).

Plus, Nurse has shown an ability to put up points.

$7M isn't a reach for Nurse, not now. That's pretty close to where the market has shifted for similar defensemen, and we may even see that rise depending on what happens with Werenski, Provorov, and McEvoy in the coming weeks. The Oilers probably shouldn't have bridged him, but they painted themselves into a corner and it will cost them a little more now; they won't have the pre-inflation discount they could have.

If the idea is to win sooner rather than later (and if should be given where you are with McDavid) I think you keep the guys in their prime (Klefbom, Nurse, possibly Larsson), work in Bouchard in the next few seasons, and try to keep the third pairing open for some of the younger guys, giving them sheltered roles (Broberg, Lagesson, etc). The last thing you want is all sorts of rookies figuring things out and continuing to tank the McDavid deal. They need to win before McDavid decides he's had enough here.

Sign Nurse. If Broberg or some of the others develop as they hope, Nurse will still be a moveable asset 3 years down the road. There's no rush, and it isn't likely to be an overpay of any sort if/when the time does come to move him.



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 Re: sRe: Nurse's Future [message #742451 is a reply to message #742446 ]
Sat, 07 September 2019 09:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
Messages: 1971
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Location: Edmonton

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mightyreasoner wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 21:20

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



I think I'd try to keep Nurse AND Klefbom for as long as I can. With Seattle expansion, the team is likely to lose one of Bear or Jones, and Klefbom's health is a MAJOR concern for me. It's a long fall from Klefbom on your first pairing to Russell on your first pairing. It's less of a fall from Klefbom to Nurse (still a fall).

Plus, Nurse has shown an ability to put up points.

$7M isn't a reach for Nurse, not now. That's pretty close to where the market has shifted for similar defensemen, and we may even see that rise depending on what happens with Werenski, Provorov, and McEvoy in the coming weeks. The Oilers probably shouldn't have bridged him, but they painted themselves into a corner and it will cost them a little more now; they won't have the pre-inflation discount they could have.

If the idea is to win sooner rather than later (and if should be given where you are with McDavid) I think you keep the guys in their prime (Klefbom, Nurse, possibly Larsson), work in Bouchard in the next few seasons, and try to keep the third pairing open for some of the younger guys, giving them sheltered roles (Broberg, Lagesson, etc). The last thing you want is all sorts of rookies figuring things out and continuing to tank the McDavid deal. They need to win before McDavid decides he's had enough here.

Sign Nurse. If Broberg or some of the others develop as they hope, Nurse will still be a moveable asset 3 years down the road. There's no rush, and it isn't likely to be an overpay of any sort if/when the time does come to move him.

Oilers who aren’t named McDavid should be signing below market value based on the lack of team success. RFA ones anyways.



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: sRe: Nurse's Future [message #742452 is a reply to message #742451 ]
Sat, 07 September 2019 10:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 16306
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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CrudeRemarks wrote on Sat, 07 September 2019 09:09

mightyreasoner wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 21:20

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.



I think I'd try to keep Nurse AND Klefbom for as long as I can. With Seattle expansion, the team is likely to lose one of Bear or Jones, and Klefbom's health is a MAJOR concern for me. It's a long fall from Klefbom on your first pairing to Russell on your first pairing. It's less of a fall from Klefbom to Nurse (still a fall).

Plus, Nurse has shown an ability to put up points.

$7M isn't a reach for Nurse, not now. That's pretty close to where the market has shifted for similar defensemen, and we may even see that rise depending on what happens with Werenski, Provorov, and McEvoy in the coming weeks. The Oilers probably shouldn't have bridged him, but they painted themselves into a corner and it will cost them a little more now; they won't have the pre-inflation discount they could have.

If the idea is to win sooner rather than later (and if should be given where you are with McDavid) I think you keep the guys in their prime (Klefbom, Nurse, possibly Larsson), work in Bouchard in the next few seasons, and try to keep the third pairing open for some of the younger guys, giving them sheltered roles (Broberg, Lagesson, etc). The last thing you want is all sorts of rookies figuring things out and continuing to tank the McDavid deal. They need to win before McDavid decides he's had enough here.

Sign Nurse. If Broberg or some of the others develop as they hope, Nurse will still be a moveable asset 3 years down the road. There's no rush, and it isn't likely to be an overpay of any sort if/when the time does come to move him.

Oilers who aren’t named McDavid should be signing below market value based on the lack of team success. RFA ones anyways.


THey probably would, but it would be on deals walking them to UFA. 5Mx2 for Nurse?



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #751981 is a reply to message #742409 ]
Sun, 19 January 2020 17:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Location: Edmonton

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Nurse is tied for 19th in the NHL for EV points among D in the league. Probably would be far and away our top points D if he got Klef's PP time.

Wonder what he's gonna end up getting from us...



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #752000 is a reply to message #742409 ]
Mon, 20 January 2020 10:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
Messages: 5369
Registered: January 2016

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Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.


If you look at the list, who is replacing Nurse or Klef in the next 3 years, even 5?
Russell will be gone.
Jones I think can take over Russell's spot in the 3rd pairing and be full time next year. I think he will need at least a couple of seasons being a full time before he can even be considered as a top 4. I am not sure he gets there ever.
Lagesson I don't think it more than a 3rd pairing guy.
Samorukov probably needs 1-2 yrs in the minors, then a couple years in the NHL. He's probably 4 years away minimum.
Broberg will be at least 4 years away. 1 -2 yrs in the minors, some NHL time in the bottom pairing.

I look at the contracts. After this year, Klef has 3 more years. So he will be basically 30 when his contract is up. Hopefully at that time, one of the younger guys is ready for top 4 full time. So they could sign Nurse to a 5-6 yr deal and have what they have right now. The Oilers have a higher 20's guy leading the way who's in his prime, they have another lower close to mid 20's guy coming into their own, then young guys coming up behind. I do not think they are in a position to be trading away Nurse or Klef anytime soon.

I also do not see how Nurse's camp can come at the Oilers and think they are worth more than Morrissey. Those 2 play similar type of minutes, have similar roles, play on special teams but aren't #1 PP guys and will put up similar points.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #752003 is a reply to message #752000 ]
Mon, 20 January 2020 11:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 20 January 2020 10:28

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.


If you look at the list, who is replacing Nurse or Klef in the next 3 years, even 5?
Russell will be gone.
Jones I think can take over Russell's spot in the 3rd pairing and be full time next year. I think he will need at least a couple of seasons being a full time before he can even be considered as a top 4. I am not sure he gets there ever.
Lagesson I don't think it more than a 3rd pairing guy.
Samorukov probably needs 1-2 yrs in the minors, then a couple years in the NHL. He's probably 4 years away minimum.
Broberg will be at least 4 years away. 1 -2 yrs in the minors, some NHL time in the bottom pairing.

I look at the contracts. After this year, Klef has 3 more years. So he will be basically 30 when his contract is up. Hopefully at that time, one of the younger guys is ready for top 4 full time. So they could sign Nurse to a 5-6 yr deal and have what they have right now. The Oilers have a higher 20's guy leading the way who's in his prime, they have another lower close to mid 20's guy coming into their own, then young guys coming up behind. I do not think they are in a position to be trading away Nurse or Klef anytime soon.

I also do not see how Nurse's camp can come at the Oilers and think they are worth more than Morrissey. Those 2 play similar type of minutes, have similar roles, play on special teams but aren't #1 PP guys and will put up similar points.


Worth noting - you're responding to a post from September.

Nurse has had another strong season this year. It'll be interesting to see what that means from a financial point of view. The organization HAS to be negotiate hard on these. The team does not have the cap space to afford not to.

The ammunition is there - Connor McDavid took a discount to be here...so you should too.

The left side X factor is really Philip Broberg. Is he something real or not? While I hope he develops well, I don't have a lot of hope that Samorukov will do well with the Oilers - he's getting under-utilized in his first pro season, and there's so much competition in that defence cohort, it's going to be tough for him - and since Broberg isn't just a first round pick, but also a reach at #8 - the Oilers are going to be incentivized to give him every opportunity to move quickly up the ranks when he comes over. That's going to be at the expense of Samorukov (and Lagesson & Jones to an extent too). On top of that, the Oilers basically never do well by Russian players.

Nurse and Klefbom look like they're dialed in to that 1-2 position at LD for the foreseeable future, but I think both would still not be untouchables for me in the right deal.



"This team needs an enema!"
#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireBuchberger #FireHowsonAgain #FireChiarelli #FireMcLellan #FireBobbyNicks and...SIGH...#FireTheGretzkys

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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #752008 is a reply to message #752003 ]
Mon, 20 January 2020 12:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
Messages: 5369
Registered: January 2016

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Adam wrote on Mon, 20 January 2020 11:09

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 20 January 2020 10:28

Adam wrote on Fri, 06 September 2019 09:40

I'm curious what the team does with Nurse. I know that the prevailing wisdom is that he's a core piece, but here's the left side depth chart for the Oilers right now:

Klefbom
Nurse
Russell
Jones
Lagesson
Samurokov
Broberg
Manning
Lowe

That's four youngsters pushing up, all who look to have a decent chance to be NHLers. I don't want to make a move too early like the Oilers usually do - see Gilbert, Petry, etc. - but if you're looking at almost $7MM a season for Nurse, and a couple of those guys have cracked the roster, with a couple more on the horizon? How long do you really want to commit to #25? Especially when Klefbom is better and cheaper, so Nurse is really the second pairing guy. If you think any of those guys are likely better than Nurse in the next 2-3 years, then you can't commit to him long-term at those dollars and his money is maybe better off spent fixing the forwards - or re-signing Nugent-Hopkins to an extension.


If you look at the list, who is replacing Nurse or Klef in the next 3 years, even 5?
Russell will be gone.
Jones I think can take over Russell's spot in the 3rd pairing and be full time next year. I think he will need at least a couple of seasons being a full time before he can even be considered as a top 4. I am not sure he gets there ever.
Lagesson I don't think it more than a 3rd pairing guy.
Samorukov probably needs 1-2 yrs in the minors, then a couple years in the NHL. He's probably 4 years away minimum.
Broberg will be at least 4 years away. 1 -2 yrs in the minors, some NHL time in the bottom pairing.

I look at the contracts. After this year, Klef has 3 more years. So he will be basically 30 when his contract is up. Hopefully at that time, one of the younger guys is ready for top 4 full time. So they could sign Nurse to a 5-6 yr deal and have what they have right now. The Oilers have a higher 20's guy leading the way who's in his prime, they have another lower close to mid 20's guy coming into their own, then young guys coming up behind. I do not think they are in a position to be trading away Nurse or Klef anytime soon.

I also do not see how Nurse's camp can come at the Oilers and think they are worth more than Morrissey. Those 2 play similar type of minutes, have similar roles, play on special teams but aren't #1 PP guys and will put up similar points.


Worth noting - you're responding to a post from September.

Nurse has had another strong season this year. It'll be interesting to see what that means from a financial point of view. The organization HAS to be negotiate hard on these. The team does not have the cap space to afford not to.

The ammunition is there - Connor McDavid took a discount to be here...so you should too.

The left side X factor is really Philip Broberg. Is he something real or not? While I hope he develops well, I don't have a lot of hope that Samorukov will do well with the Oilers - he's getting under-utilized in his first pro season, and there's so much competition in that defence cohort, it's going to be tough for him - and since Broberg isn't just a first round pick, but also a reach at #8 - the Oilers are going to be incentivized to give him every opportunity to move quickly up the ranks when he comes over. That's going to be at the expense of Samorukov (and Lagesson & Jones to an extent too). On top of that, the Oilers basically never do well by Russian players.

Nurse and Klefbom look like they're dialed in to that 1-2 position at LD for the foreseeable future, but I think both would still not be untouchables for me in the right deal.

Great. What has changed in 4 months? Unless I missed a move, the same guys are here and I don't think the order has changed. If anything, it's solidified where guys are at meaning no guy has just jumped up out of no where to look closer than they were in September.

With the injury to Benning, that gave Jones the chance to come up. Jones has been decent, I wouldn't call him outstanding but overall good enough. If the injury doesn't happen, he's probably not here. When Benning comes back and provided he's close to up to speed, while I am not a Russell lover, I would play Russell over Jones for now and because he's right handed, I play Benning over Jones. So he's not full time yet. I expect Jones to be full time next year in the 3rd pairing and probably needs a couple of seasons in the 3rd pairing before he might be ready to move up if it ever happens.

Everything else still applies in my opinion for time lines. I supposed if a team just knocks your socks off with a trade you just can't pass up then you look at it but whether it's September or right now, the Oilers in my opinion are at least 3 years from being able to move a guy like Klef or Nurse. All bets are off if Nurse goes stupid and his contract demands are just out to lunch but I just don't know how thanks to Morrissey. I don't know how Nurses agent or Nurse for that matter can go to the Oilers and have any kind of credibility and demand much more than Morrissey. Maybe there is a tiny case for a few hundred K more, not sure what that case is but that would be it. Just too many numbers in all categories say they are very, very similar and should be paid accordingly.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753453 is a reply to message #752008 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753454 is a reply to message #753453 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753455 is a reply to message #753454 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 13:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.

Nurse is not elite. He's good. a 2020 equivalent of the Larsson or Kelfbom contracts is what he should get.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753461 is a reply to message #753454 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753464 is a reply to message #753461 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 13:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it

If that is your position and Crude seems to believe that as well, then you are most definitely going to be upset with the contract because I don't think there is a chance in hell he signs for 5 mill. It wouldn't matter if he is on the Oilers or any other team in the NHL. Morrissey signed for 6.25 mill. There's the market for today's dollars. Those 2 play the same style of game which is more of the defensive style with not a lot of PP time but on time on the PK. They play similar minutes and put up similar points. I don't think I heard a single person, not even people in here bashing the Morrissey contract. How can anyone justify him taking over 1 mill less than Morrissey. They are almost the same player.

Using Klefbom's contract I don't think even qualifies. When he signed it, he was going into his last year of his entry level deal. He signed his deal Sept 19, 2015. Before that, he'd played 77 games in the NHL. They took a risk and it paid off big time. When Nurse signs his next contract, he has 331 games right now and he will have over 360 games played. You aren't getting a top 4 damn with that much time put in for 5 mill. The time to do that was 2 yrs ago before they signed his bridge.

You guys need to be realistic here.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753470 is a reply to message #753464 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 14:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it

If that is your position and Crude seems to believe that as well, then you are most definitely going to be upset with the contract because I don't think there is a chance in hell he signs for 5 mill. It wouldn't matter if he is on the Oilers or any other team in the NHL. Morrissey signed for 6.25 mill. There's the market for today's dollars. Those 2 play the same style of game which is more of the defensive style with not a lot of PP time but on time on the PK. They play similar minutes and put up similar points. I don't think I heard a single person, not even people in here bashing the Morrissey contract. How can anyone justify him taking over 1 mill less than Morrissey. They are almost the same player.

Using Klefbom's contract I don't think even qualifies. When he signed it, he was going into his last year of his entry level deal. He signed his deal Sept 19, 2015. Before that, he'd played 77 games in the NHL. They took a risk and it paid off big time. When Nurse signs his next contract, he has 331 games right now and he will have over 360 games played. You aren't getting a top 4 damn with that much time put in for 5 mill. The time to do that was 2 yrs ago before they signed his bridge.

You guys need to be realistic here.


I think you actually need to read the post before replying. Do I think he’ll sign for $5M/yr? No. Is that what I believe he’s actually worth for what he brings to the table? Yes. Jets overpaid Morrissey which re-set the market much the Oilers did with Draisaitl



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753471 is a reply to message #753470 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 14:58

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it

If that is your position and Crude seems to believe that as well, then you are most definitely going to be upset with the contract because I don't think there is a chance in hell he signs for 5 mill. It wouldn't matter if he is on the Oilers or any other team in the NHL. Morrissey signed for 6.25 mill. There's the market for today's dollars. Those 2 play the same style of game which is more of the defensive style with not a lot of PP time but on time on the PK. They play similar minutes and put up similar points. I don't think I heard a single person, not even people in here bashing the Morrissey contract. How can anyone justify him taking over 1 mill less than Morrissey. They are almost the same player.

Using Klefbom's contract I don't think even qualifies. When he signed it, he was going into his last year of his entry level deal. He signed his deal Sept 19, 2015. Before that, he'd played 77 games in the NHL. They took a risk and it paid off big time. When Nurse signs his next contract, he has 331 games right now and he will have over 360 games played. You aren't getting a top 4 damn with that much time put in for 5 mill. The time to do that was 2 yrs ago before they signed his bridge.

You guys need to be realistic here.


I think you actually need to read the post before replying. Do I think he’ll sign for $5M/yr? No. Is that what I believe he’s actually worth for what he brings to the table? Yes. Jets overpaid Morrissey which re-set the market much the Oilers did with Draisaitl

I read your post and think you are out to lunch if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill and the fact you think Morrissey is an overpay, in my mind solidifies that. 6.25 mill a year for 8 yrs for a 24 yr old, 23+min, good skating, puck moving, play both special teams, 30+ pt dman. The guy isn't even at his peak yet. You are literally buying ALL of his prime years. I take that contract all day long and laugh when it looks better and better as the years go by. If you want to argue Nurse is only worth 6 mill, I can buy that. But 5?? rofl



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753473 is a reply to message #753464 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm  is currently offline Oscargasm
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 14:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it

If that is your position and Crude seems to believe that as well, then you are most definitely going to be upset with the contract because I don't think there is a chance in hell he signs for 5 mill. It wouldn't matter if he is on the Oilers or any other team in the NHL. Morrissey signed for 6.25 mill. There's the market for today's dollars. Those 2 play the same style of game which is more of the defensive style with not a lot of PP time but on time on the PK. They play similar minutes and put up similar points. I don't think I heard a single person, not even people in here bashing the Morrissey contract. How can anyone justify him taking over 1 mill less than Morrissey. They are almost the same player.

Using Klefbom's contract I don't think even qualifies. When he signed it, he was going into his last year of his entry level deal. He signed his deal Sept 19, 2015. Before that, he'd played 77 games in the NHL. They took a risk and it paid off big time. When Nurse signs his next contract, he has 331 games right now and he will have over 360 games played. You aren't getting a top 4 damn with that much time put in for 5 mill. The time to do that was 2 yrs ago before they signed his bridge.

You guys need to be realistic here.


To start, I like Darnell, I hope he develops even more of a mean streak and is an Oiler for a long time yet. But he’s 25. He’s not going to do MUCH more growing. Yeah okay, he’s still relatively young but let’s be realistic here, I think we know what we have in Darnell already.

I get bargaining but Darnell sees himself as John Carlson, who resigned for 8M just last season? Cmon. Darnell needs to be realistic. I think this fanbase is pretty realistic when it comes to Darnell’s next contract and the cap hit it represents.

You hear it, read it, everywhere, comparisons to Morrissey. Winnipeg extends Morrissey for 6.25M and doesn’t have room to keep Tyler Myers, who goes to YVR for 6M and has arguably been a large part of the Canucks season which sees them sitting atop the division. Where is Winnipeg? They’ve fallen behind the Blackhawks (okay, tied in points but you get my point [I hope?]).

Now, I’m not comparing Bear to Myers, but you resign and overpay Nurse (on a franchise where overpayments became the norm) you aren’t going to be able to resign the rest of your supporting cast including a guy like Bear, Doc’s d partner.

You don’t pay second pair, non top pp unit defensemen 8M. You don’t pay them 7M. Yes, Klef’s contract is a super bargain. But you can’t offset a value with an overpay.

5.5 AAV is what I’m hoping this comes out to be. Though I won’t be surprised when it’s over 6.

[Updated on: Tue, 04 February 2020 15:18]


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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753474 is a reply to message #753473 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 15:15

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 14:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 13:32

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:55

Gator21 wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 12:51

https://oilersnation.com/2020/02/04/darnell-nurse-is-apparen tly-seeking-8-million-annually-on-his-next-contract/

Haha see ya Darnell! Honestly I even think the $6.25M/yr that Morrisey is getting on a long term deal would be generous given what Nurse brings to the table. Break down his points and how many are just secondary assists from passing the puck up to McDavid or Draisaitl and watching magic happen. To me he isn't worth more than $5M/yr

I don't think you are being realistic if you think Nurse is worth 5 mill. What's the difference between Morrissey and Nurse? Morrissey is probably a bit better defensively but Nurse is more physical, a better skater and tougher. Points, wise, they put up pretty similar numbers.


RealisticallyI think that's what he's worth although I agree he"ll likely get more. I'd be somewhat ok with the same deal as Morrisey but any more than thatwould be terrible for the team and the Oilers can't afford to keep handing out charity and overpaying on deals just cuz they like the guy. Nurse is under team control for 2 more seasons, Holland needs to draw a line in the sand on this one and stcik to it

If that is your position and Crude seems to believe that as well, then you are most definitely going to be upset with the contract because I don't think there is a chance in hell he signs for 5 mill. It wouldn't matter if he is on the Oilers or any other team in the NHL. Morrissey signed for 6.25 mill. There's the market for today's dollars. Those 2 play the same style of game which is more of the defensive style with not a lot of PP time but on time on the PK. They play similar minutes and put up similar points. I don't think I heard a single person, not even people in here bashing the Morrissey contract. How can anyone justify him taking over 1 mill less than Morrissey. They are almost the same player.

Using Klefbom's contract I don't think even qualifies. When he signed it, he was going into his last year of his entry level deal. He signed his deal Sept 19, 2015. Before that, he'd played 77 games in the NHL. They took a risk and it paid off big time. When Nurse signs his next contract, he has 331 games right now and he will have over 360 games played. You aren't getting a top 4 damn with that much time put in for 5 mill. The time to do that was 2 yrs ago before they signed his bridge.

You guys need to be realistic here.


To start, I like Darnell, I hope he develops even more of a mean streak and is an Oiler for a long time yet. But he’s 25. He’s not going to do MUCH more growing. Yeah okay, he’s still relatively young but let’s be realistic here, I think we know what we have in Darnell already.

I get bargaining but Darnell sees himself as John Carlson, who resigned for 8M just last season? Cmon. Darnell needs to be realistic. I think this fanbase is pretty realistic when it comes to Darnell’s next contract and the cap hit it represents.

You hear it, read it, everywhere, comparisons to Morrissey. Winnipeg extends Morrissey for 6.25M and doesn’t have room to keep Tyler Myers, who goes to YVR for 6M and has arguably been a large part of the Canucks season which sees them sitting atop the division. Where is Winnipeg? They’ve fallen behind the Blackhawks (okay, tied in points but you get my point [I hope?]).

Now, I’m not comparing Bear to Myers, but you resign and overpay Nurse (on a franchise where overpayments became the norm) you aren’t going to be able to resign the rest of your supporting cast including a guy like Bear, Doc’s d partner.

You don’t pay second pair, non top pp unit defensemen 8M. You don’t pay them 7M. Yes, Klef’s contract is a super bargain. But you can’t offset a value with an overpay.

5.5 AAV is what I’m hoping this comes out to be. Though I won’t be surprised when it’s over 6.

If you are trying to get something, when you go into a negotiation for anything, do you start things off with your low offer? Hell no. You start high. Even McDavid, I doubt he started at 12.5, he probably started higher knowing he had a limit he'd go too.

I'd be very surprised if he didn't get around what Morrissey got.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753477 is a reply to message #753474 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 16:21


If you are trying to get something, when you go into a negotiation for anything, do you start things off with your low offer? Hell no. You start high. Even McDavid, I doubt he started at 12.5, he probably started higher knowing he had a limit he'd go too.

I'd be very surprised if he didn't get around what Morrissey got.


I’m part of the negotiating committee for my companies union. I’ve been in many a negotiation in my professional career. Absolutely you start high. But you don’t start at an astronomic number. Guarantee his camp says we want 8 while the Oilers say we want Darnell in at 5. That’s where you get holdouts. That’s where you get bad blood.

If this report came out saying Nurse is looking for 7M I’d respect it as normal negotiating. As it is, with his camp saying 8... I laugh and say come back after the concussion symptoms have passed.

Disclosure: I’ve experienced several concussions in my life and deal with symptoms to this day. I can make a concussion joke.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753480 is a reply to message #753477 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 15:31

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 16:21


If you are trying to get something, when you go into a negotiation for anything, do you start things off with your low offer? Hell no. You start high. Even McDavid, I doubt he started at 12.5, he probably started higher knowing he had a limit he'd go too.

I'd be very surprised if he didn't get around what Morrissey got.


I’m part of the negotiating committee for my companies union. I’ve been in many a negotiation in my professional career. Absolutely you start high. But you don’t start at an astronomic number. Guarantee his camp says we want 8 while the Oilers say we want Darnell in at 5. That’s where you get holdouts. That’s where you get bad blood.

If this report came out saying Nurse is looking for 7M I’d respect it as normal negotiating. As it is, with his camp saying 8... I laugh and say come back after the concussion symptoms have passed.

Disclosure: I’ve experienced several concussions in my life and deal with symptoms to this day. I can make a concussion joke.

The source of the 8 mill ask is Matheson. He's 70. If Nurse thinks he's legit worth 8, as much as I like him, adios Darnell.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753485 is a reply to message #753480 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 16:40

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 15:31

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 16:21


If you are trying to get something, when you go into a negotiation for anything, do you start things off with your low offer? Hell no. You start high. Even McDavid, I doubt he started at 12.5, he probably started higher knowing he had a limit he'd go too.

I'd be very surprised if he didn't get around what Morrissey got.


I’m part of the negotiating committee for my companies union. I’ve been in many a negotiation in my professional career. Absolutely you start high. But you don’t start at an astronomic number. Guarantee his camp says we want 8 while the Oilers say we want Darnell in at 5. That’s where you get holdouts. That’s where you get bad blood.

If this report came out saying Nurse is looking for 7M I’d respect it as normal negotiating. As it is, with his camp saying 8... I laugh and say come back after the concussion symptoms have passed.

Disclosure: I’ve experienced several concussions in my life and deal with symptoms to this day. I can make a concussion joke.

The source of the 8 mill ask is Matheson. He's 70. If Nurse thinks he's legit worth 8, as much as I like him, adios Darnell.



I just don’t get the Trouba comparison his camp allegedly makes.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753494 is a reply to message #753485 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 17:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 15:56



I just don’t get the Trouba comparison his camp allegedly makes.


Not sure why. Nurse is virtually matching Trouba's output without the PP time. Both are 25. Both will be 1 year from UFA when their contracts are up (Trouba last year, Nurse this year). Nurse is bigger, nastier, and from what little indicators we have, better defensively.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753497 is a reply to message #753494 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 18:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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NetBOG wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 18:27

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 15:56



I just don’t get the Trouba comparison his camp allegedly makes.


Not sure why. Nurse is virtually matching Trouba's output without the PP time. Both are 25. Both will be 1 year from UFA when their contracts are up (Trouba last year, Nurse this year). Nurse is bigger, nastier, and from what little indicators we have, better defensively.


I get what you’re saying, but I still don’t see it.

Just on simple stats let’s compare three players...yes, I’m aware that there’s a magnitude of things to be looked for a players value.

PlayerA:
GP G A P +/-
459 49 153 202 28

PlayerB:
GP G A P +/-
331 28 82 110 -7

PlayerC:
GP G A P +/-
274 23 79 102 24

You can probably guess who’s who by reading this thread. One player comes in at an 8M AAV, one player a 6.25M AAV and one is TBD.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753481 is a reply to message #753477 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 14:31


I’m part of the negotiating committee for my companies union. I’ve been in many a negotiation in my professional career. Absolutely you start high. But you don’t start at an astronomic number. Guarantee his camp says we want 8 while the Oilers say we want Darnell in at 5. That’s where you get holdouts. That’s where you get bad blood.

If this report came out saying Nurse is looking for 7M I’d respect it as normal negotiating. As it is, with his camp saying 8... I laugh and say come back after the concussion symptoms have passed.

Disclosure: I’ve experienced several concussions in my life and deal with symptoms to this day. I can make a concussion joke.


To be fair, you've never negotiated with the Oilers (probably), where you ask for max dollars, term and a no movement clause and, more often than not, you get it.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753484 is a reply to message #753481 ]
Tue, 04 February 2020 15:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Goose wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 16:42

Oscargasm wrote on Tue, 04 February 2020 14:31


I’m part of the negotiating committee for my companies union. I’ve been in many a negotiation in my professional career. Absolutely you start high. But you don’t start at an astronomic number. Guarantee his camp says we want 8 while the Oilers say we want Darnell in at 5. That’s where you get holdouts. That’s where you get bad blood.

If this report came out saying Nurse is looking for 7M I’d respect it as normal negotiating. As it is, with his camp saying 8... I laugh and say come back after the concussion symptoms have passed.

Disclosure: I’ve experienced several concussions in my life and deal with symptoms to this day. I can make a concussion joke.


To be fair, you've never negotiated with the Oilers (probably), where you ask for max dollars, term and a no movement clause and, more often than not, you get it.


Does it count trying to get a Rexall beer at a discount after I was about 6 deep back in 2013?



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753570 is a reply to message #753484 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 08:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I'm calling a 5 year deal at $6.65 Million AAV per year & gets signed in late August. I think Holland has some young guys that he probably feels can step in for 2-4 weeks if negotiations run into October, so he holds pretty firm.


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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753577 is a reply to message #753570 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 09:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Jakey wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 08:34

I'm calling a 5 year deal at $6.65 Million AAV per year & gets signed in late August. I think Holland has some young guys that he probably feels can step in for 2-4 weeks if negotiations run into October, so he holds pretty firm.


I'll put my money on 7Mx8. And you just have to play Nurse's puck skills slowly ramp up over the years.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753578 is a reply to message #753577 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753587 is a reply to message #753578 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753599 is a reply to message #753587 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 12:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)


Guys are going to have to start taking discounts if they want to be part of this group and keep it together long term. That said, I don't fault anyone, especially in the prime of their career, trying to get the most money that they can, which will ultimately set them and their family up for life. Do what's best for you I say!

I think a 2 year deal for Nurse makes some sense in the short term, and maybe we can take a run at a cup in that span, but I don't see how the Oilers would be able to keep him beyond that with the young D coming up behind him.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753600 is a reply to message #753599 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 12:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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jds308 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 12:30

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)


Elliotte Friedman on the pending Nurse deal.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/31-thoughts-dustin-byfug lien-winnipeg-jets-contract/

"6. I don’t think Darnell Nurse is going to be signing for $8 million per season. There’s what you ask for, and what you’re actually looking for. Nurse wants to be an Oiler, which supersedes everything else. It could happen now on a short-term deal, or it could be punted to the summer, when there’s a clearer cap picture for the future. But there’s optimism that something will get done."


The Oilers should have the buyouts off the books in a couple of years, and hopefully Holland doesn't have to buy out anyone else. Also, the cap should rise if the US TV deal goes through and is a whopper.






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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753607 is a reply to message #753600 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 13:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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GabbyDugan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 11:56


The Oilers should have the buyouts off the books in a couple of years, and hopefully Holland doesn't have to buy out anyone else. Also, the cap should rise if the US TV deal goes through and is a whopper.





This seems like a terrible reason to overpay Nurse on a long-term deal.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753614 is a reply to message #753587 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 13:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)


Nurse is a guy I'd be willing to go with a shorter contract on, especially if the Oilers are set against trading any of the defence prospects. Eventually he's going to get pushed from behind, and if the team locks in to a really long deal with him, that could hurt our ability to be flexible.

Honestly, 7 and 8 year deals should really only be used for the very top players on your team. Everyone below that should be kept on shorter deals to give the team more flexibility. Yes, you'll lose some guys to free agency every so often, but if you're a contender they're more likely to sign extensions and stay. I'm not worried about offending people who aren't superstars by not treating them like superstars.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753616 is a reply to message #753614 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 14:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 13:57

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)


Nurse is a guy I'd be willing to go with a shorter contract on, especially if the Oilers are set against trading any of the defence prospects. Eventually he's going to get pushed from behind, and if the team locks in to a really long deal with him, that could hurt our ability to be flexible.

Honestly, 7 and 8 year deals should really only be used for the very top players on your team. Everyone below that should be kept on shorter deals to give the team more flexibility. Yes, you'll lose some guys to free agency every so often, but if you're a contender they're more likely to sign extensions and stay. I'm not worried about offending people who aren't superstars by not treating them like superstars.

I actually agree with you on the longer term deals. Unless the guy is willing to take a BIG discount for the security of a long term deal, I wouldn't be handing out max term deals to anyone unless they are the elite guy on your team.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753615 is a reply to message #753587 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 14:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)

Why would you have to trade him if he signs a 2 year deal?

I am a fan of Nurse, I think he is very valuable to this team but that value comes at a price. I don't see how he can make anymore than Morrissey on a long term deal which I have stated. The Oilers can't afford to be giving out huge overpays on long term deals. If you can get him for Morrissey money on a long term deal, I think that is fair. The cap is going to go up. The comparison to Klefbom as a tiny bit of merit but at the same time, when Klefbom signed he had way, way less experience and wasn't even close to being established AND the cap was significantly lower than it is now. He signed his deal in 2015. I think it's a pipe dream of some who think 5 mill is fair on a long term deal. That is a 900k raise from when Klefbom signed 5 years ago. That's not realistic.

I think Nurse feels like he has more offense to give which is where his 8 mill starting point comes from. Personally I don't see it. I am sure he looks at the 41 he put up last year as a starting point and he will build off that. If he was a 50 pt guy every year, then sure, he probably deserves a contract close to 8.
He's not. He's a 30-35 pt guy. He's on pace for 35 pts this year. With Klefbom doing what he does which is 30-40. Then you factor in Bear who's a bit more offensive so chances are he will up his points a bit next year. Then you factor in Bouchard is coming who's purely offensive, the offensive opportunities for Nurse are not going to get any better. So if you sign him to a 2 yr deal and with all the younger, more offensive guys coming up which cements his role as more of a defensive shut down guy. He is on pace for 35 pts this year. With a defensive shut down guy role cemented in and even less offensive opportunity as he probably won't get any PP time, if he puts up another 30-35 pts next year, you have a history.

So you go to him after next season in the last year of his deal. The cap has gone up a bunch with the new TV deal for the States in place. You have the new expansion team there. You have cleared some bad money off the books. You should have a guys like Bouchard and Bear being your main right shot guys, McDavid and Leon, his 2 best buddies on the team will be cooking along. His team should be good, then you go to him and lock him up long term as the shut down guy he is and pay him accordingly.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753617 is a reply to message #753615 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 14:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:01

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)

Why would you have to trade him if he signs a 2 year deal?

I am a fan of Nurse, I think he is very valuable to this team but that value comes at a price. I don't see how he can make anymore than Morrissey on a long term deal which I have stated. The Oilers can't afford to be giving out huge overpays on long term deals. If you can get him for Morrissey money on a long term deal, I think that is fair. The cap is going to go up. The comparison to Klefbom as a tiny bit of merit but at the same time, when Klefbom signed he had way, way less experience and wasn't even close to being established AND the cap was significantly lower than it is now. He signed his deal in 2015. I think it's a pipe dream of some who think 5 mill is fair on a long term deal. That is a 900k raise from when Klefbom signed 5 years ago. That's not realistic.

I think Nurse feels like he has more offense to give which is where his 8 mill starting point comes from. Personally I don't see it. I am sure he looks at the 41 he put up last year as a starting point and he will build off that. If he was a 50 pt guy every year, then sure, he probably deserves a contract close to 8.
He's not. He's a 30-35 pt guy. He's on pace for 35 pts this year. With Klefbom doing what he does which is 30-40. Then you factor in Bear who's a bit more offensive so chances are he will up his points a bit next year. Then you factor in Bouchard is coming who's purely offensive, the offensive opportunities for Nurse are not going to get any better. So if you sign him to a 2 yr deal and with all the younger, more offensive guys coming up which cements his role as more of a defensive shut down guy. He is on pace for 35 pts this year. With a defensive shut down guy role cemented in and even less offensive opportunity as he probably won't get any PP time, if he puts up another 30-35 pts next year, you have a history.

So you go to him after next season in the last year of his deal. The cap has gone up a bunch with the new TV deal for the States in place. You have the new expansion team there. You have cleared some bad money off the books. You should have a guys like Bouchard and Bear being your main right shot guys, McDavid and Leon, his 2 best buddies on the team will be cooking along. His team should be good, then you go to him and lock him up long term as the shut down guy he is and pay him accordingly.


I think he is likely done in Edmonton if both sides think a 2 year deal is OK. If he is hoping for more offensive numbers, that would mean he needs PP time, and I think the PP time is close to belonging to Bouchard. It's not gonna work out that well for Nurse. Then he starts thinking he needs to go to another team before he can get what he thinks he deserves.

My thought on Nurse has always been that the org wants him long term, so the idea he could be moved never seemed realistic. If that's not the case, I'm totally open to moving him for some forward help. I'm not that impressed still with his passing game, and the guy still loses focus a lot defensively. Great skater for sure, and he is able to get involved well enough during McDavid ice time to get decent ES point production, but I don't feel there is that much in his game that is irreplaceable. He is very heavily dependent on his D partner for puck moving. Thank goodness for Bear.



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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753620 is a reply to message #753617 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 14:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:08

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:01

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)

Why would you have to trade him if he signs a 2 year deal?

I am a fan of Nurse, I think he is very valuable to this team but that value comes at a price. I don't see how he can make anymore than Morrissey on a long term deal which I have stated. The Oilers can't afford to be giving out huge overpays on long term deals. If you can get him for Morrissey money on a long term deal, I think that is fair. The cap is going to go up. The comparison to Klefbom as a tiny bit of merit but at the same time, when Klefbom signed he had way, way less experience and wasn't even close to being established AND the cap was significantly lower than it is now. He signed his deal in 2015. I think it's a pipe dream of some who think 5 mill is fair on a long term deal. That is a 900k raise from when Klefbom signed 5 years ago. That's not realistic.

I think Nurse feels like he has more offense to give which is where his 8 mill starting point comes from. Personally I don't see it. I am sure he looks at the 41 he put up last year as a starting point and he will build off that. If he was a 50 pt guy every year, then sure, he probably deserves a contract close to 8.
He's not. He's a 30-35 pt guy. He's on pace for 35 pts this year. With Klefbom doing what he does which is 30-40. Then you factor in Bear who's a bit more offensive so chances are he will up his points a bit next year. Then you factor in Bouchard is coming who's purely offensive, the offensive opportunities for Nurse are not going to get any better. So if you sign him to a 2 yr deal and with all the younger, more offensive guys coming up which cements his role as more of a defensive shut down guy. He is on pace for 35 pts this year. With a defensive shut down guy role cemented in and even less offensive opportunity as he probably won't get any PP time, if he puts up another 30-35 pts next year, you have a history.

So you go to him after next season in the last year of his deal. The cap has gone up a bunch with the new TV deal for the States in place. You have the new expansion team there. You have cleared some bad money off the books. You should have a guys like Bouchard and Bear being your main right shot guys, McDavid and Leon, his 2 best buddies on the team will be cooking along. His team should be good, then you go to him and lock him up long term as the shut down guy he is and pay him accordingly.


I think he is likely done in Edmonton if both sides think a 2 year deal is OK. If he is hoping for more offensive numbers, that would mean he needs PP time, and I think the PP time is close to belonging to Bouchard. It's not gonna work out that well for Nurse. Then he starts thinking he needs to go to another team before he can get what he thinks he deserves.

My thought on Nurse has always been that the org wants him long term, so the idea he could be moved never seemed realistic. If that's not the case, I'm totally open to moving him for some forward help. I'm not that impressed still with his passing game, and the guy still loses focus a lot defensively. Great skater for sure, and he is able to get involved well enough during McDavid ice time to get decent ES point production, but I don't feel there is that much in his game that is irreplaceable. He is very heavily dependent on his D partner for puck moving. Thank goodness for Bear.

The teams that are going to overpay for a guy like Nurse in money and even opportunity are probably lousy teams.

So if the Oilers are a good team which they should be. They are a contender which they should be. They have Leon and McDavid dominating which they will be. Nurse will be a key member on the team both in the room and on the ice. You think he's going to leave his best buddies to go for the money right when they should be cooking with gas?

He's already made over 9 mill in career earnings. Let's say he signs a 2 yr deal at around 5 mill. So there is another 10 mill.
Then in 2 years, when he is 27 and still has 4-5 real good years left. You dangle 4-5 yrs at around 6 mill per in front of him, he's going to leave his buddies for a few mill more?

I suppose it could happen but if I am loving who I play with, my team is good and will be good for years to come and I have something like 40-50 mill in career earnings, I wouldn't leave. If it was his last contract then maybe. But he will be early 30's and unless he gets hurt, he will have another contract after.

And if he does decide to leave all his buddies in 2 years. You'd still have Klef who in 2 years will be 29 and should still be good. Plus you'd have Bear and Bouchard and probably one of or all Samorukov, Broberg and maybe Jones on your team and by that time ready for prime time. So at that point, you draw your line in the sand and if he says no, you trade him because you have cover.

[Updated on: Wed, 05 February 2020 14:24]


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 Re: Nurse's Future [message #753621 is a reply to message #753620 ]
Wed, 05 February 2020 14:26 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:20

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:08

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 14:01

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 10:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 05 February 2020 09:15

Rishaug talking this morning that the Oilers are supposedly talking maybe a short term, less money deal with Nurse. If that is the case, maybe they have their number that they won't budge off of for a long term deal. I said it a few times, I don't know how the Nurse camp can expect more than Morrissey. There is just too many similarities between both players to justify anymore.

A short term deal while not ideal because it would take Nurse to UFA but it would save them some money and in 2 years, the cap is supposed to go up a lot and the Oilers would have a lot of their buyout money gone. Plus you'd have a long body of work for Nurse. If Nurse is what he is right now in a couple of seasons which is a pretty solid, big minute, top 4 dman who can do a little bit of everything but scores around 30-35 pts, you know what he is. I am sure Nurse wants more because he is guarding against him becoming a 50 pt guy which I don't see.


Saw MacKenzie suggest 2 years at something under 6M. Yikes. If we sign that, I think you seriously need to consider trading him very soon.

That would really surprise me. Always figured Nurse was loved to death by the org and it would come down from on high to get him signed long term. Maybe not. Or maybe full autonomy is actually a thing? :)

Why would you have to trade him if he signs a 2 year deal?

I am a fan of Nurse, I think he is very valuable to this team but that value comes at a price. I don't see how he can make anymore than Morrissey on a long term deal which I have stated. The Oilers can't afford to be giving out huge overpays on long term deals. If you can get him for Morrissey money on a long term deal, I think that is fair. The cap is going to go up. The comparison to Klefbom as a tiny bit of merit but at the same time, when Klefbom signed he had way, way less experience and wasn't even close to being established AND the cap was significantly lower than it is now. He signed his deal in 2015. I think it's a pipe dream of some who think 5 mill is fair on a long term deal. That is a 900k raise from when Klefbom signed 5 years ago. That's not realistic.

I think Nurse feels like he has more offense to give which is where his 8 mill starting point comes from. Personally I don't see it. I am sure he looks at the 41 he put up last year as a starting point and he will build off that. If he was a 50 pt guy every year, then sure, he probably deserves a contract close to 8.
He's not. He's a 30-35 pt guy. He's on pace for 35 pts this year. With Klefbom doing what he does which is 30-40. Then you factor in Bear who's a bit more offensive so chances are he will up his points a bit next year. Then you factor in Bouchard is coming who's purely offensive, the offensive opportunities for Nurse are not going to get any better. So if you sign him to a 2 yr deal and with all the younger, more offensive guys coming up which cements his role as more of a defensive shut down guy. He is on pace for 35 pts this year. With a defensive shut down guy role cemented in and even less offensive opportunity as he probably won't get any PP time, if he puts up another 30-35 pts next year, you have a history.

So you go to him after next season in the last year of his deal. The cap has gone up a bunch with the new TV deal for the States in place. You have the new expansion team there. You have cleared some bad money off the books. You should have a guys like Bouchard and Bear being your main right shot guys, McDavid and Leon, his 2 best buddies on the team will be cooking along. His team should be good, then you go to him and lock him up long term as the shut down guy he is and pay him accordingly.


I think he is likely done in Edmonton if both sides think a 2 year deal is OK. If he is hoping for more offensive numbers, that would mean he needs PP time, and I think the PP time is close to belonging to Bouchard. It's not gonna work out that well for Nurse. Then he starts thinking he needs to go to another team before he can get what he thinks he deserves.

My thought on Nurse has always been that the org wants him long term, so the idea he could be moved never seemed realistic. If that's not the case, I'm totally open to moving him for some forward help. I'm not that impressed still with his passing game, and the guy still loses focus a lot defensively. Great skater for sure, and he is able to get involved well enough during McDavid ice time to get decent ES point production, but I don't feel there is that much in his game that is irreplaceable. He is very heavily dependent on his D partner for puck moving. Thank goodness for Bear.

The teams that are going to overpay for a guy like Nurse in money and even opportunity are probably lousy teams.

So if the Oilers are a good team which they should be. They are a contender which they should be. They have Leon and McDavid dominating which they will be. Nurse will be a key member on the team both in the room and on the ice. You think he's going to leave his best buddies to go for the money right when they should be cooking with gas?

He's already made over 9 mill in career earnings. Let's say he signs a 2 yr deal at around 5 mill. So there is another 10 mill.
Then in 2 years, when he is 27 and still has 4-5 real good years left. You dangle 4-5 yrs at around 6 mill per in front of him, he's going to leave his buddies for a few mill more?

I suppose it could happen but if I am loving who I play with, my team is good and will be good for years to come and I have something like 40-50 mill in career earnings, I wouldn't leave. If it was his last contract then maybe. But he will be early 30's and unless he gets hurt, he will have another contract after.


If he's playing hardball now and demanding something like 8M long term (maybe his actual goal is something like 7.25M, still too high), I think that answers the question about his approach. Why would he not just sign 6M long term now if he would be willing to do 5mx2 now and 6M in 2 years?

I think after a 5Mx2 deal, he's back at 8M again at least. If he felt he was robbed of PP opportunity over those 2 years which suppressed his point totals he feels he was capable of, it makes the negotiation even harder leading up to him being a UFA. Not sure if the buddies thing is strong enough for the vast majority of players to be OK taking significantly less than you think you're worth. He'll still get to hang with all those guys in the summer and post-career.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


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- #2, April 2015

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