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 Speculation » The Seattle expansion.Pages (7): [ «  <  1  2  3  4  5  6  7  >  »]
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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788630 is a reply to message #788624 ]
Mon, 05 July 2021 17:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jds308  is currently offline jds308
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 15:21

OilPeg wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 13:18

Mike wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 12:08

So I have to assume the answer is "yes", but if you have to ask the question...

Now that RNH has been signed and we need to go 7-3-1 with really only 5 forwards of note to protect, will someone on Holland's staff have put together a list of the 29 other teams' likely protected lists and see if there are some low hanging fruit somewhere? Either a trade of one of our exposed Dmen for a forward, or just try to get a top 6 guy for cheap? Or even some decent bottom 6 guys worth protecting?

I am hoping the Oilers are making calls to teams that need Dmen and offering up a guy like Jones or Laggesson for a forward. I see those 2 as somewhat interchangeable. Jones skates a little better and passed the puck better but is a weak defender, plays small, is slight, not physical at all and easy to play against. Where as Laggesson is bigger, much better defender, a bit more physical, harder to play against but isn't as good of a skater and passer. I see both as a 3rd pairing guy now and into the future.

So pick 1, trade the other for a forward. If the Oilers have Bear, Bouchard and Nurse who's puck moving is decent now in my opinion, I think you can get away with no Jones if he gets you a better player. Especially since both Broberg and potentially Samorukov are close.

I absolutely think they should be trying to poach another team's forward ranks as they definitely have protection spots open up front. But, if they trade one of Jones or Lagesson, they're likely losing the other to Seattle, so you definitely have to keep that in mind when thinking about making a trade like that. Snapping up a forward like Kunin, Appleton, McCann, Bellows, whoever it may be, using a draft pick might be a better option.

Unless you're exposing Klefbom, then you protect the other and lose Khaira I guess.

Klefbom is 100% getting exposed. either he's done for because of the shoulder or they are spinning the narrative (late) as hard as they can. Here's my 7-3-1:
McDavid
Draisaitl
Nugent-Hopkins
Puljujärvi
Kailer Yamamoto
Tyler Benson.
Cooper Marody

Darnell Nurse
Ethan Bear
Caleb Jones

Stuart Skinner


I'll swap Marody for Archibald if the coach prefers. fact is there isn't a 7th forward worth protecting and I'd be hard in the trade market to give up a defensive asset for one.



I agree on those 3 D, assuming Larsson isn't signed prior to expansion. If the rumours out there are true about Chicago being after Jones to help to acquire his brother, who's to say Seattle isn't thinking the same and they could potentially grab Caleb for nothing.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788656 is a reply to message #788624 ]
Tue, 06 July 2021 11:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:21

OilPeg wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 13:18

Mike wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 12:08

So I have to assume the answer is "yes", but if you have to ask the question...

Now that RNH has been signed and we need to go 7-3-1 with really only 5 forwards of note to protect, will someone on Holland's staff have put together a list of the 29 other teams' likely protected lists and see if there are some low hanging fruit somewhere? Either a trade of one of our exposed Dmen for a forward, or just try to get a top 6 guy for cheap? Or even some decent bottom 6 guys worth protecting?

I am hoping the Oilers are making calls to teams that need Dmen and offering up a guy like Jones or Laggesson for a forward. I see those 2 as somewhat interchangeable. Jones skates a little better and passed the puck better but is a weak defender, plays small, is slight, not physical at all and easy to play against. Where as Laggesson is bigger, much better defender, a bit more physical, harder to play against but isn't as good of a skater and passer. I see both as a 3rd pairing guy now and into the future.

So pick 1, trade the other for a forward. If the Oilers have Bear, Bouchard and Nurse who's puck moving is decent now in my opinion, I think you can get away with no Jones if he gets you a better player. Especially since both Broberg and potentially Samorukov are close.

I absolutely think they should be trying to poach another team's forward ranks as they definitely have protection spots open up front. But, if they trade one of Jones or Lagesson, they're likely losing the other to Seattle, so you definitely have to keep that in mind when thinking about making a trade like that. Snapping up a forward like Kunin, Appleton, McCann, Bellows, whoever it may be, using a draft pick might be a better option.

Unless you're exposing Klefbom, then you protect the other and lose Khaira I guess.

Klefbom is 100% getting exposed. either he's done for because of the shoulder or they are spinning the narrative (late) as hard as they can. Here's my 7-3-1:
McDavid
Draisaitl
Nugent-Hopkins
Puljujärvi
Kailer Yamamoto
Tyler Benson.
Cooper Marody

Darnell Nurse
Ethan Bear
Caleb Jones

Stuart Skinner


I'll swap Marody for Archibald if the coach prefers. fact is there isn't a 7th forward worth protecting and I'd be hard in the trade market to give up a defensive asset for one.




Marody is not getting protected over Archibald. It will be a miracle if Marody is even in the organization at the start of the regular season.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788686 is a reply to message #788656 ]
Tue, 06 July 2021 13:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
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Jakey wrote on Tue, 06 July 2021 11:03

CrudeRemarks wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:21

OilPeg wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 13:18

Mike wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 12:08

So I have to assume the answer is "yes", but if you have to ask the question...

Now that RNH has been signed and we need to go 7-3-1 with really only 5 forwards of note to protect, will someone on Holland's staff have put together a list of the 29 other teams' likely protected lists and see if there are some low hanging fruit somewhere? Either a trade of one of our exposed Dmen for a forward, or just try to get a top 6 guy for cheap? Or even some decent bottom 6 guys worth protecting?

I am hoping the Oilers are making calls to teams that need Dmen and offering up a guy like Jones or Laggesson for a forward. I see those 2 as somewhat interchangeable. Jones skates a little better and passed the puck better but is a weak defender, plays small, is slight, not physical at all and easy to play against. Where as Laggesson is bigger, much better defender, a bit more physical, harder to play against but isn't as good of a skater and passer. I see both as a 3rd pairing guy now and into the future.

So pick 1, trade the other for a forward. If the Oilers have Bear, Bouchard and Nurse who's puck moving is decent now in my opinion, I think you can get away with no Jones if he gets you a better player. Especially since both Broberg and potentially Samorukov are close.

I absolutely think they should be trying to poach another team's forward ranks as they definitely have protection spots open up front. But, if they trade one of Jones or Lagesson, they're likely losing the other to Seattle, so you definitely have to keep that in mind when thinking about making a trade like that. Snapping up a forward like Kunin, Appleton, McCann, Bellows, whoever it may be, using a draft pick might be a better option.

Unless you're exposing Klefbom, then you protect the other and lose Khaira I guess.

Klefbom is 100% getting exposed. either he's done for because of the shoulder or they are spinning the narrative (late) as hard as they can. Here's my 7-3-1:
McDavid
Draisaitl
Nugent-Hopkins
Puljujärvi
Kailer Yamamoto
Tyler Benson.
Cooper Marody

Darnell Nurse
Ethan Bear
Caleb Jones

Stuart Skinner


I'll swap Marody for Archibald if the coach prefers. fact is there isn't a 7th forward worth protecting and I'd be hard in the trade market to give up a defensive asset for one.




Marody is not getting protected over Archibald. It will be a miracle if Marody is even in the organization at the start of the regular season.

Do you agree with the premise that Archibald isn't really worth protecting either though? Oilers should move a D prospect for a forward that deserves protection. Or maybe a forward AND a D prospect.



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788717 is a reply to message #788686 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

[Updated on: Wed, 07 July 2021 09:46]


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788727 is a reply to message #788717 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
Messages: 3836
Registered: November 2010
Location: Edmonton

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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788729 is a reply to message #788727 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm is currently online Oscargasm
Messages: 8513
Registered: May 2009
Location: YEG

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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.


If he can be dealt for a piece that helps in the here and now (the next 1-3 years, not the actual now being the offseason [hahah]) then I fully support a trade of Benson. Though, he could very well be the 3LW this team has lacked. Could.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788733 is a reply to message #788729 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 11:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
Messages: 3836
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Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:58

CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.


If he can be dealt for a piece that helps in the here and now (the next 1-3 years, not the actual now being the offseason [hahah]) then I fully support a trade of Benson. Though, he could very well be the 3LW this team has lacked. Could.

As a trade piece absolutely. I just don't want to lose another draft pick for nothing:

chiarelli and mclellan = 2 picks gone.
Marino = gone
AA = 2 picks gone
lucic = pick gone
we can mention mike green here too I suppose.
Kulikov might make that list if he doesn't re-sign.


People talk about trade trees and how a single transaction benefits teams for a long time. Oilers trade trees are usually straight lines. It affects your ability to develop talent internally.



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788734 is a reply to message #788733 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 11:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm is currently online Oscargasm
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Location: YEG

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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 11:24

Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:58

CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.


If he can be dealt for a piece that helps in the here and now (the next 1-3 years, not the actual now being the offseason [hahah]) then I fully support a trade of Benson. Though, he could very well be the 3LW this team has lacked. Could.

As a trade piece absolutely. I just don't want to lose another draft pick for nothing:

chiarelli and mclellan = 2 picks gone.
Marino = gone
AA = 2 picks gone
lucic = pick gone
we can mention mike green here too I suppose.
Kulikov might make that list if he doesn't re-sign.


People talk about trade trees and how a single transaction benefits teams for a long time. Oilers trade trees are usually straight lines. It affects your ability to develop talent internally.


That’s exactly it, and why I said for help in the here and now. If he’s moved to bring in Keith, I’ll be a happy fan.

Marino, we get to see what comes of that with Pit’s 6th rounder we hold this year. Kulikov won’t be resigned unless they don’t land Keith and subsequently get shut down by Oleksiak(who is staying in Dallas). Man, F the league for the TMac, Chia and lucic picks.



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Category 3 - Considerably Musty
Category 4 - Severely Musty
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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788745 is a reply to message #788734 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 15:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 17835
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Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 11:41

CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 11:24

Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:58

CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.


If he can be dealt for a piece that helps in the here and now (the next 1-3 years, not the actual now being the offseason [hahah]) then I fully support a trade of Benson. Though, he could very well be the 3LW this team has lacked. Could.

As a trade piece absolutely. I just don't want to lose another draft pick for nothing:

chiarelli and mclellan = 2 picks gone.
Marino = gone
AA = 2 picks gone
lucic = pick gone
we can mention mike green here too I suppose.
Kulikov might make that list if he doesn't re-sign.


People talk about trade trees and how a single transaction benefits teams for a long time. Oilers trade trees are usually straight lines. It affects your ability to develop talent internally.


That’s exactly it, and why I said for help in the here and now. If he’s moved to bring in Keith, I’ll be a happy fan.

Marino, we get to see what comes of that with Pit’s 6th rounder we hold this year. Kulikov won’t be resigned unless they don’t land Keith and subsequently get shut down by Oleksiak(who is staying in Dallas). Man, F the league for the TMac, Chia and lucic picks.


We do have a bad habit of frittering these guys away. We don't make decisions as to whether they can be NHL players and then we don't deal them while they have value.

I'm okay with a trade involving Benson, although I would not want that to be for an over-the-hill, over-priced defenceman who's going to eat up way too much cap space, while not adding to the team other than in a bunch of meaningless "intangibles".

I think there's still a segment of the fanbase here who thinks they're getting a different player than they really are here. 2021 Duncan Keith is not the same guy as he was five years ago. He was not just not a good defenceman for the Blackhawks last year, he was still a bad defenceman when playing in a 2nd pairing role, with plenty of time with the 'Hawks best forwards and a bias towards offensive zone starts.

If we're playing him with the second pairing, you'd assume that he is not getting a lot of time with McDavid, that he's not getting the offensive zone starts and that he's playing with the weak depth of the Oilers...so there isn't a lot of security blanket there. We would be relying on him making a complete reversal of his trend - a trend that has the Blackhawks thinking that he's a guy they're okay with getting rid of. It should be asked why they're okay losing all those wonderful intangibles if they're so important. They have a young team with a lot of young defenceman and they don't feel they need him (and are in fact looking at significant upgrades).

This is a guy with a buy-out proof contract, at over three times the cap hit that he's worth. The bizarre focus on actual dollars from the Edmonton media just shows that they've been asked to help form a smokescreen. What fan actually cares about the bargain Katz is getting compared to cap hit?

The only way a Keith deal makes any sense is if the Oilers are being paid to take him on - so 'Hawks retain a lot of salary and take some additional bad contract back. Giving them a prospect for their troubles is idiotic, because we have the position of strength. They want out from that deal, and Keith will only go a very few places due to his NMC. He can force them to protect him in the expansion draft.

So if they want to deal him, make a deal that's Koskinen and Russell for Keith, with a chunk of Keith's salary retained. We get a bunch of cap savings this year with a bit of a penalty next year being stuck with an overpriced 7th defenceman. They'd lose cap space this year and be saddled with a couple deadweights, but they'd have significantly more cap space available a year from now. They could buy out Koskinen or Russell or convince Seattle or someone else to take them away.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788736 is a reply to message #788733 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 11:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 11:24

Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:58

CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.


If he can be dealt for a piece that helps in the here and now (the next 1-3 years, not the actual now being the offseason [hahah]) then I fully support a trade of Benson. Though, he could very well be the 3LW this team has lacked. Could.

As a trade piece absolutely. I just don't want to lose another draft pick for nothing:

chiarelli and mclellan = 2 picks gone.
Marino = gone
AA = 2 picks gone
lucic = pick gone
we can mention mike green here too I suppose.
Kulikov might make that list if he doesn't re-sign.


People talk about trade trees and how a single transaction benefits teams for a long time. Oilers trade trees are usually straight lines. It affects your ability to develop talent internally.

Hat tip to the scouts for recognizing Marino could be a player so they took him but he made the choice that as an American he did not want to play in Canada. So what's the solution to that because he's not the only guy who's been drafted by a Canadian team only to have to dump him for nothing because he won't play. I believe part of the reason the Flames included Adam Fox in a trade is he indicated he wouldn't sign. He just won the Norris. So what's the solution to that? Either don't draft an American or expect that a Canadian team will lose American guys for nothing. You can ask the kid if he would come to Canada if drafted but of course he's going to say yes when you interview him.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788731 is a reply to message #788727 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 11:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 10:54

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 07 July 2021 09:41

I see lots of Benson love so I am curious where he would even fit on the Oilers.

Based on everything I could find online about him, he's a smart offensive player who is more of a set up guy than goal scorer. I looked up his stats and even in junior he didn't score a lot of goals. His highest goals were his 17-18 season where had 27 in 58 games and that was his last junior eligible season. So he's going up against kids he's 2 or 3 yrs older than. That isn't a lot of goals in junior.

He's not small but he's not exactly big. He's definitely not physical. I don't think his shot is that great and considering he doesn't score a lot of goals, I am guessing it isn't a strength. One of the areas he has to work on is the defensive side which is pretty common for offensive guys. I think his defense is a bit better, at least in the AHL. Skating wise, I know that is one of his biggest knocks so I am sure he has worked on it so I am guessing at best, he's an average skater.

I do not think he would be good in the top 6 as they have 2 premium set up guys in McD and Leon. They need guys that can finish, go to the net, dig out pucks, bring some speed and I feel a little size on the wings and that isn't him. He's not a go to the net guy to screen or clean up the garbage and his skating will hold him back. If he is in the top 6 this season, then I see that as fail by the GM to address a hole.

For the bottom 6. In my opinion, your bottom 6 needs lots of guys that can skate, get in on the forecheck, some of them have to hit someone, size would be nice but they don't all have to be huge as long as they bring it, they need to bring up the energy and the bulk if not all of the PK needs to come from the bottom 6. So I am not seeing much if any of the requirements that a bottom 6 guy should have in Benson. He's not even a center. I see Benson as a guy who not very good team has in their top 6 and that team is always looking to replace him. Then when he gets bumped down, he might struggle for a full time spot.

I think he is another Kahun that is slightly bigger but a little slower and might shoot even less who will find himself healthy scratched a lot and who you are always looking for a better option.

for the record, Benson was, and always will be, the wrong pick at that spot in that draft. But he has offensive upside and the chance to progress/develop. Our bottom six (or 8) doesn't score, AND gets scored on all the time. He's worth holding onto to see if he's a better fit than some of the current placeholders.

I agree with you there about the bottom 6 needing to score more. I just seem him as a square peg for a round hole. They need more scoring but all the things he doesn't do, are what bottom 6 guys need to do along with scoring and I don't think he had the boots to be a top 6 guy.

So I think a trade is a good idea for a different type of play. If he ended up being the expansion pick, I would call that a win for the Oilers as I don't see how he plays on the Oilers. If they want to have his style of player in the bottom 6, might as well resign Kahun. At least in Kahun he had multiple season where he as produced some in the NHL and can play a bit, Benson has zero history to say be can even play or not.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788748 is a reply to message #788686 ]
Wed, 07 July 2021 15:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 06 July 2021 13:26

Jakey wrote on Tue, 06 July 2021 11:03

CrudeRemarks wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:21

OilPeg wrote on Mon, 05 July 2021 16:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 13:18

Mike wrote on Thu, 01 July 2021 12:08

So I have to assume the answer is "yes", but if you have to ask the question...

Now that RNH has been signed and we need to go 7-3-1 with really only 5 forwards of note to protect, will someone on Holland's staff have put together a list of the 29 other teams' likely protected lists and see if there are some low hanging fruit somewhere? Either a trade of one of our exposed Dmen for a forward, or just try to get a top 6 guy for cheap? Or even some decent bottom 6 guys worth protecting?

I am hoping the Oilers are making calls to teams that need Dmen and offering up a guy like Jones or Laggesson for a forward. I see those 2 as somewhat interchangeable. Jones skates a little better and passed the puck better but is a weak defender, plays small, is slight, not physical at all and easy to play against. Where as Laggesson is bigger, much better defender, a bit more physical, harder to play against but isn't as good of a skater and passer. I see both as a 3rd pairing guy now and into the future.

So pick 1, trade the other for a forward. If the Oilers have Bear, Bouchard and Nurse who's puck moving is decent now in my opinion, I think you can get away with no Jones if he gets you a better player. Especially since both Broberg and potentially Samorukov are close.

I absolutely think they should be trying to poach another team's forward ranks as they definitely have protection spots open up front. But, if they trade one of Jones or Lagesson, they're likely losing the other to Seattle, so you definitely have to keep that in mind when thinking about making a trade like that. Snapping up a forward like Kunin, Appleton, McCann, Bellows, whoever it may be, using a draft pick might be a better option.

Unless you're exposing Klefbom, then you protect the other and lose Khaira I guess.

Klefbom is 100% getting exposed. either he's done for because of the shoulder or they are spinning the narrative (late) as hard as they can. Here's my 7-3-1:
McDavid
Draisaitl
Nugent-Hopkins
Puljujärvi
Kailer Yamamoto
Tyler Benson.
Cooper Marody

Darnell Nurse
Ethan Bear
Caleb Jones

Stuart Skinner


I'll swap Marody for Archibald if the coach prefers. fact is there isn't a 7th forward worth protecting and I'd be hard in the trade market to give up a defensive asset for one.




Marody is not getting protected over Archibald. It will be a miracle if Marody is even in the organization at the start of the regular season.

Do you agree with the premise that Archibald isn't really worth protecting either though? Oilers should move a D prospect for a forward that deserves protection. Or maybe a forward AND a D prospect.



This I agree with, but sadly I do not think the Oilers will make such a move. I am non-believer that they know how to move around assets until it has been proven otherwise.

I see Benson having value. Marody...not so much. For the record, I wanted Benson in the draft. I saw him play a few times in the WHL and he looked unreal and had some scout love before he had some injuries. He was not a soft player then and I think he still has some sandpaper to his game. I would love to see Benson get an extended look with the Oilers next season.

[Updated on: Wed, 07 July 2021 15:38]


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788984 is a reply to message #777776 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788986 is a reply to message #788984 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.



"[It was] really cool to throw on the Oilers gear, the gear that I want to play the rest of my life wearing. It was pretty cool to put it on. With all the history, it was a lot of fun." - Connor McDavid, July 1, 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #788992 is a reply to message #788986 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireLowe #FireChiarelli #FireBobbyNicks #FireKeithGretzky #FireKenHolland #FireTippett

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789045 is a reply to message #788992 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789046 is a reply to message #789045 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 20:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.



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-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789056 is a reply to message #789046 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 22:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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What if Holland's master plan has Keith waiving his NTC and going unprotected! Seattle wouldn't take a boat anchor contract like that would they?

New list:

McDavid
Draisaitl
Nuge
Puljujärvi
Benson
Yams
idk... Shore?

Bear
Lagesson
Nurse

Skinner

We don't lose a d prospect and all it cost us was a D prospect and a conditional pick!



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789060 is a reply to message #789056 ]
Mon, 12 July 2021 23:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 22:53

What if Holland's master plan has Keith waiving his NTC and going unprotected! Seattle wouldn't take a boat anchor contract like that would they?

New list:

McDavid
Draisaitl
Nuge
Puljujärvi
Benson
Yams
idk... Shore?

Bear
Lagesson
Nurse

Skinner

We don't lose a d prospect and all it cost us was a D prospect and a conditional pick!


https://media1.tenor.com/images/7ae760e946c60bb64e33d0da132c0202/tenor.gif?itemid=4642309



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789068 is a reply to message #789046 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smyth260  is currently offline smyth260
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Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?



Clean house or bust

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789073 is a reply to message #789068 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.

[Updated on: Tue, 13 July 2021 08:12]


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789076 is a reply to message #789073 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 09:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.


The only reason the Keith deal isn't that relevant is that it was signed over a decade ago when he was a really different player.

I do think there's some problems for the Oilers out of all this. Holland has demonstrated that the Oilers probably aren't a place to come if you want to win - they're a joke. And he's shown that he's a pushover when it comes to negotiation...so if you're an agent, come in high. He'll be thrown by that approach, and then give you more than he should.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireLowe #FireChiarelli #FireBobbyNicks #FireKeithGretzky #FireKenHolland #FireTippett

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789103 is a reply to message #789076 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 11:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
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Adam wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 09:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.


The only reason the Keith deal isn't that relevant is that it was signed over a decade ago when he was a really different player.

I do think there's some problems for the Oilers out of all this. Holland has demonstrated that the Oilers probably aren't a place to come if you want to win - they're a joke. And he's shown that he's a pushover when it comes to negotiation...so if you're an agent, come in high. He'll be thrown by that approach, and then give you more than he should.

I'm starting to think there should be some sort of interview process before you hire a general manager...



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789108 is a reply to message #789103 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 11:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently online CrusaderPi
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 11:32

Adam wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 09:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.


The only reason the Keith deal isn't that relevant is that it was signed over a decade ago when he was a really different player.

I do think there's some problems for the Oilers out of all this. Holland has demonstrated that the Oilers probably aren't a place to come if you want to win - they're a joke. And he's shown that he's a pushover when it comes to negotiation...so if you're an agent, come in high. He'll be thrown by that approach, and then give you more than he should.

I'm starting to think there should be some sort of interview process before you hire a general manager...

His resume, which includes Stanley Cups, is an interview.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789109 is a reply to message #789108 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 11:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
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CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 11:38

CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 11:32

Adam wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 09:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.


The only reason the Keith deal isn't that relevant is that it was signed over a decade ago when he was a really different player.

I do think there's some problems for the Oilers out of all this. Holland has demonstrated that the Oilers probably aren't a place to come if you want to win - they're a joke. And he's shown that he's a pushover when it comes to negotiation...so if you're an agent, come in high. He'll be thrown by that approach, and then give you more than he should.

I'm starting to think there should be some sort of interview process before you hire a general manager...

His resume, which includes Stanley Cups, is an interview.

All I'm saying is Pat Maroon is close to retirement and knows the Oilers well.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789110 is a reply to message #789103 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 11:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 11:32


I'm starting to think there should be some sort of interview process before you hire a general manager...


Why do that when you can just ask all your rivals who THEY think you should hire?

I wonder if one of the people who suggested they should hire Ken Holland was one Stan Bowman...



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789112 is a reply to message #789103 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 11:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 11:32

Adam wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 09:01

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 08:10

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 02:24

Kr55 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 19:10

inverno76 wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 20:09

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:40

Skoobz wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:31

Adam wrote on Mon, 12 July 2021 14:25

Good news folks! We won't be losing Caleb Jones in the expansion draft!!!

Now, are the Oilers smart enough to protect guys like Benson? Or do we burn spots on Archibald, Kassian or Khaira instead.


I actually think there’s a good chance Kass is Seattle’s Oiler.


My guess is that the Oilers protect all the depth guys now, and Benson gets snapped up by the Kraken.


I’m guessing Benson and Archibald get protected, but I have very little faith. Kassian and Turris could easily be Holland’s choices. Tipp loves Turris…….


Sounded like the Larsson talks were completely up in the air now. Man of man, if we end up signing him before the draft...

...don't want to think about it.

Hope Holland is just being coy and hiding that there is a handshake deal that he can't comment on. But, who the heck knows with that guy anymore.


Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?

The players and agents are all about past resumes. They go to UFA and they expect to get paid for what they just did, not what they are going to do. The resume of what Keith did in the past is easily twice as good as Larsson's. So I don't think it does anything for Larsson.

Players in my opinion are all about what other guys did so maybe it helps him sign even more. He could look at it and be like my potential partner used to be potentially Jones who wasn't very good. NOW my partner is Keith which is great.


The only reason the Keith deal isn't that relevant is that it was signed over a decade ago when he was a really different player.

I do think there's some problems for the Oilers out of all this. Holland has demonstrated that the Oilers probably aren't a place to come if you want to win - they're a joke. And he's shown that he's a pushover when it comes to negotiation...so if you're an agent, come in high. He'll be thrown by that approach, and then give you more than he should.

I'm starting to think there should be some sort of interview process before you hire a general manager...


We took it a step further. A new revolution in hiring. You get the guy you're hiring to teach you what their job and your job actual entails and what's expected. POHO Bobby called up Holland to ask him what a POHO and GM were supposed to do. The lessons were so good Bobby hired him for his own job and GM.

[Updated on: Tue, 13 July 2021 11:42]


"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789087 is a reply to message #789068 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 10:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently online Skookum Jim
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smyth260 wrote on Tue, 13 July 2021 01:24

Have to think Larsson's agent just got a lot more firepower to get his client a raise.

If the Oilers are willing to pay a 38 year old Duncan Keith 5+ million, why shouldn't they pay Larsson in that range? 5 less points over the last year, younger, better analytics.

Do we have any toes left with which to shoot ourselves in the foot?


With respect to Larsson's expectations, that's $5.5M in cap space, Keith is only getting paid $3.6M over 2 years, Avg $1.8M.
Not sure what Larsson's market value is, less than $4M hopefully..

[Updated on: Tue, 13 July 2021 10:16]


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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789165 is a reply to message #777776 ]
Tue, 13 July 2021 17:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Pierre LeBrun @PierreVLeBrun

There's a growing sense that the Predators might leave Matt Duchene unprotected in the expansion draft. Has five more years on his deal at an $8M AAV.
@TSNHockey
@TheAthletic



Posterchild for guys that mail it in after they get a pay day (Nashville are experts on finding those guys). Doubt Seattle takes him.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789209 is a reply to message #777776 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 11:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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CapFriendly @CapFriendly

There were only two players to waive their No Move Clauses (NMC) in the Vegas Expansion Draft:

1. Marc-André Fleury
2. Toby Enström

So far three players have waived their NMC for the Seattle Expansion Draft:

1. Milan Lucic
2. Jeff Skinner
3. Erik Johnson



Some real gems for Seattle.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789212 is a reply to message #789209 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 12:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks  is currently offline CrudeRemarks
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 11:33

CapFriendly @CapFriendly

There were only two players to waive their No Move Clauses (NMC) in the Vegas Expansion Draft:

1. Marc-André Fleury
2. Toby Enström

So far three players have waived their NMC for the Seattle Expansion Draft:

1. Milan Lucic
2. Jeff Skinner
3. Erik Johnson



Some real gems for Seattle.

Who would ever take Lucic? Seattle would have to fire their analytics department first or they'd all walkout the moment the name was anounced.



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789213 is a reply to message #777776 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789215 is a reply to message #789213 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 12:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 15:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


I would say you're crazy, but after this latest debacle, nothing would surprise me anymore.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789217 is a reply to message #789213 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 13:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


If its for DeBrusk or better, then I'm okay with moving Bear. If its to Seattle for them to take Neal in the draft, then I would be scared.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789219 is a reply to message #789217 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 13:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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bigred75 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 13:02

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


If its for DeBrusk or better, then I'm okay with moving Bear. If its to Seattle for them to take Neal in the draft, then I would be scared.

debrusk played like a 3rd liner last season. We already have a bottom six guy that gets paid that much in Kassian.

Wouldn't shock me given the last name, but does anyone else feel like the train is going off the rails pretty quickly this offseason?



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789230 is a reply to message #789213 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 13:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


Ahhh...the next 24 hours in Oilers town could be interesting.

Makes total sense. Holland's told Tippett that he really wants to see Bouchard in the lineup next year. Tippett is uncomfortable with having two defencemen under the age of 27 in the same lineup, so Holland gets to work trading all the guys with potential.

You would have hoped that Jeff Petry's play this year (and the last 2-3 before that for that matter) would have been a great cautionary tale for the Oilers on the dangers of giving up on good young defencemen too early, but then again, if you can get Jake DeBrusk...

Business Operations leader Kevin Lowe should really be kiboshing this. Bear's jersey is one of the best selling of any player on any Canadian team. I don't think DeBrusk jerseys will move so swiftly off the shelf...



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789259 is a reply to message #789230 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 15:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently online Dragon_Matt
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we could always trade for Keegan Lowe again. He's that solid veteran leadership we need. He's been ripened properly in the AHL taking a leadership role in the past 4 seasons (even being the Captain for 2018-2020), three with the Oilers affiliate and last season with the San Diego Gulls.


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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789262 is a reply to message #789230 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 16:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm is currently online Oscargasm
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Adam wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 13:47

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


Ahhh...the next 24 hours in Oilers town could be interesting.

Makes total sense. Holland's told Tippett that he really wants to see Bouchard in the lineup next year. Tippett is uncomfortable with having two defencemen under the age of 27 in the same lineup, so Holland gets to work trading all the guys with potential.

You would have hoped that Jeff Petry's play this year (and the last 2-3 before that for that matter) would have been a great cautionary tale for the Oilers on the dangers of giving up on good young defencemen too early, but then again, if you can get Jake DeBrusk...

Business Operations leader Kevin Lowe should really be kiboshing this. Bear's jersey is one of the best selling of any player on any Canadian team. I don't think DeBrusk jerseys will move so swiftly off the shelf...


What if, now just throw the matches and chunk of wood topped with a gas soaked rag aside.. what if Boston is unable to get Hall to resign and, like a good GM, want to try to get something for their departing asset. If Bear and a conditional can get you Debrusk and the rights to Taylor hall (conditional based on him resigning), do you do it then? You’d be bringing in your 1LW and 3LW for the cost of Bear and whatever conditional asset decided upon and then bring Barrie back for your 1RD spot where let’s be honest he and Nurse paired together was a positive for the Oilers.

Or is this something just ToO oUtSiDe ThE bOx FoR hOlLaNd? Or how do you have that cap room when you couldn’t get Chicago to retain a Dunkin’ donut on Keith?

Now, let’s be realistic here. Trading Bear would upset a big chunk of Oil Country. No matter the return. Especially with their recent announcement of the first ever all-Indigenous hockey camp. I personally don’t see Bear moved. If that means anything.



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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789267 is a reply to message #789262 ]
Wed, 14 July 2021 17:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Oscargasm wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 16:30

Adam wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 13:47

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 14 July 2021 12:41

Saw mention Bob was playing with the idea of a Bear trade on Oilers now.

I have a bad feeling we're about to sign Larsson, and now that we have to protect Keith, we're going to be trading Bear for a forward.


Ahhh...the next 24 hours in Oilers town could be interesting.

Makes total sense. Holland's told Tippett that he really wants to see Bouchard in the lineup next year. Tippett is uncomfortable with having two defencemen under the age of 27 in the same lineup, so Holland gets to work trading all the guys with potential.

You would have hoped that Jeff Petry's play this year (and the last 2-3 before that for that matter) would have been a great cautionary tale for the Oilers on the dangers of giving up on good young defencemen too early, but then again, if you can get Jake DeBrusk...

Business Operations leader Kevin Lowe should really be kiboshing this. Bear's jersey is one of the best selling of any player on any Canadian team. I don't think DeBrusk jerseys will move so swiftly off the shelf...


What if, now just throw the matches and chunk of wood topped with a gas soaked rag aside.. what if Boston is unable to get Hall to resign and, like a good GM, want to try to get something for their departing asset. If Bear and a conditional can get you Debrusk and the rights to Taylor hall (conditional based on him resigning), do you do it then? You’d be bringing in your 1LW and 3LW for the cost of Bear and whatever conditional asset decided upon and then bring Barrie back for your 1RD spot where let’s be honest he and Nurse paired together was a positive for the Oilers.

Or is this something just ToO oUtSiDe ThE bOx FoR hOlLaNd? Or how do you have that cap room when you couldn’t get Chicago to retain a Dunkin’ donut on Keith?

Now, let’s be realistic here. Trading Bear would upset a big chunk of Oil Country. No matter the return. Especially with their recent announcement of the first ever all-Indigenous hockey camp. I personally don’t see Bear moved. If that means anything.


I would basically never pay for the early rights to renegotiate with a player. It's too risky. You lose an actual asset for a chance that you can convince the guy you're overpaying him enough to make it not worth testing the market. You throw in that third year at the same value for Nikitin, because you can only have so many of that price point defenceman and he definitely needs to be one of them for the next three years.

Pull together a good pitch, and have your best players reach out and talk to the guy and try to convince him he should come here. Don't spend assets frivolously...if anything that should convince him not to sell, because clearly management are all morons...



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789357 is a reply to message #777776 ]
Fri, 16 July 2021 13:28 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Stauffer and Spector saying Oilers will protect McDavid, Draisaitl, RNH, Puljujarvi, Yamamoto, Kassian, Archibald, Nurse, Keith, Bear, and Skinner.


Bye Benson? WHat a waste of development and never bothered to give him a shot if that's what we do. Protecting Kassian is idiotic.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: The Seattle expansion. [message #789360 is a reply to message #789357 ]
Fri, 16 July 2021 13:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently online CrusaderPi
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Kr55 wrote on Fri, 16 July 2021 13:28

Stauffer and Spector saying Oilers will protect McDavid, Draisaitl, RNH, Puljujarvi, Yamamoto, Kassian, Archibald, Nurse, Keith, Bear, and Skinner.


Bye Benson? WHat a waste of development and never bothered to give him a shot if that's what we do. Protecting Kassian is idiotic.

Oilers gotta Oiler.



East of the Rockies and west of the rest.

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