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 Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687280]
Tue, 21 February 2017 09:29 Go to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 18175
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers /case-for-the-defence-oilers-are-knee-deep-in-blue-liners

Quote:

• A face-off man because they’re worst in the league at 47.2 per cent and if they play Anaheim in the first playoff round, the Ducks with Ryan Kesler and Antoine Vermette are No. 1 and would eat them up.

• A veteran backup goalie because Cam Talbot can’t play every single night and he’s more indispensable than captain Connor McDavid.

• Maybe an older unrestricted free agent right-winger with some offensive pop.

What he doesn’t need is more defencemen, unlike most teams.


SIGH. I really like Matheson as a guy I read religiously growing up, but I do think he's in serious decline now, and I kind of hope he hangs them up soon.

I think all three of his items on the wish list are good to have for the Oilers, but really, there's nothing that would better help the Oilers chances of advancing in the playoffs more than a powerplay quarterback defenceman. We don't need another 5/6/7 defenceman who brings no offence, but if we had someone who could put up some reliable minutes and add pop to the man advantage, it could provide a big lift to the team. The powerplay has gone in spurts all year, but you wonder what it could be with the right gun on the point and McDavid on the half-wall.

If that means the Oilers need to send a defenceman the other way in a deal, or if it means that we have NHL-calibre defencemen sitting for our stretch drive and the playoffs? I'm pretty okay with that. Benning had a good game against Chicago, but he's still a rookie. If I have a choice between him or Shattenkirk in the lineup? It's a pretty easy one for me.

I'd love for the team to have a real back-up goalie, but I wanted one a long time before now. Honestly, it's becoming less important because if the team is in a race, they'll ride Talbot hard anyhow. Once they're in the playoffs, there is almost no chance the back-up plays unless Talbot gets hurt - and if that happens, it's unlikely any back-up option is going to adequately replace him. I think all we can hope for is that the Oilers clinch as soon as possible and then that the team is able to give him some rest down the stretch.

A face-off guy and a right winger? Those are nice to haves. The right wing isn't that important if McLellan can find a way to get the guys he has contributing. The center? Sounds like a Jerrod Smithson trade he's calling for. Kesler and Vermette are going to best most team's centermen, but that won't be where a series with the Ducks is won or lost.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687293 is a reply to message #687280 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 12:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne  is currently offline PlusOne
Messages: 3362
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Adam wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 10:29

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers /case-for-the-defence-oilers-are-knee-deep-in-blue-liners

Quote:

• A face-off man because they’re worst in the league at 47.2 per cent and if they play Anaheim in the first playoff round, the Ducks with Ryan Kesler and Antoine Vermette are No. 1 and would eat them up.

• A veteran backup goalie because Cam Talbot can’t play every single night and he’s more indispensable than captain Connor McDavid.

• Maybe an older unrestricted free agent right-winger with some offensive pop.

What he doesn’t need is more defencemen, unlike most teams.


SIGH. I really like Matheson as a guy I read religiously growing up, but I do think he's in serious decline now, and I kind of hope he hangs them up soon.

I think all three of his items on the wish list are good to have for the Oilers, but really, there's nothing that would better help the Oilers chances of advancing in the playoffs more than a powerplay quarterback defenceman. We don't need another 5/6/7 defenceman who brings no offence, but if we had someone who could put up some reliable minutes and add pop to the man advantage, it could provide a big lift to the team. The powerplay has gone in spurts all year, but you wonder what it could be with the right gun on the point and McDavid on the half-wall.

If that means the Oilers need to send a defenceman the other way in a deal, or if it means that we have NHL-calibre defencemen sitting for our stretch drive and the playoffs? I'm pretty okay with that. Benning had a good game against Chicago, but he's still a rookie. If I have a choice between him or Shattenkirk in the lineup? It's a pretty easy one for me.

I'd love for the team to have a real back-up goalie, but I wanted one a long time before now. Honestly, it's becoming less important because if the team is in a race, they'll ride Talbot hard anyhow. Once they're in the playoffs, there is almost no chance the back-up plays unless Talbot gets hurt - and if that happens, it's unlikely any back-up option is going to adequately replace him. I think all we can hope for is that the Oilers clinch as soon as possible and then that the team is able to give him some rest down the stretch.

A face-off guy and a right winger? Those are nice to haves. The right wing isn't that important if McLellan can find a way to get the guys he has contributing. The center? Sounds like a Jerrod Smithson trade he's calling for. Kesler and Vermette are going to best most team's centermen, but that won't be where a series with the Ducks is won or lost.


I agree with your thoughts here but as always, will chime in on the face off thing. This is a drum I am going to bang until the MSM stops spouting about the importance of that percentage.
Situationally it CAN be important but big picture there is very little if any correlation between FO% and winning.

Even if Chia believes that TEAM face off percentage is a priority how does he fix that? these are our FO numbers;
McDavid; 43.9
RNH; 44.2
Drai; 49.2
Letestu; 51.7
Lander; 56

They arent replacing any of the worst three face off guys with a better face off player without a drop off in almost every other aspect.

Clearly the team values SITUATIONAL face offs which explains Letestu on the PP.

The top ten FO teams in the league with overall place in the point standings are;
ANA 9
COL 30
BOS 11
DET 20
CAR 28
MIN 2
VAN 25
PHIL 18
OTT 11
LA 22

The worst ten with their place in the point standings;
EDM 8
NYR 7
PIT 3
WIN 21
FLA 14
SJ 6
CLB 4
CHI 5
TB 24
AZ 29

Both lists are all over the map.

If our 4th line C was 41% on the dot and we could pick a better one up to play 5 mins a night, only taking important draws then sure get one CHEAP but the way this team is built combined with the fact that FO's JUST ARENT THAT IMPORTANT as a stat doesnt mean that this a low priority for me, it isnt even on my list of things to improve right now.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687297 is a reply to message #687293 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 12:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
Messages: 3499
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Location: Edmonton

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PlusOne wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 12:10

Adam wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 10:29

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers /case-for-the-defence-oilers-are-knee-deep-in-blue-liners

Quote:

• A face-off man because they’re worst in the league at 47.2 per cent and if they play Anaheim in the first playoff round, the Ducks with Ryan Kesler and Antoine Vermette are No. 1 and would eat them up.

• A veteran backup goalie because Cam Talbot can’t play every single night and he’s more indispensable than captain Connor McDavid.

• Maybe an older unrestricted free agent right-winger with some offensive pop.

What he doesn’t need is more defencemen, unlike most teams.


SIGH. I really like Matheson as a guy I read religiously growing up, but I do think he's in serious decline now, and I kind of hope he hangs them up soon.

I think all three of his items on the wish list are good to have for the Oilers, but really, there's nothing that would better help the Oilers chances of advancing in the playoffs more than a powerplay quarterback defenceman. We don't need another 5/6/7 defenceman who brings no offence, but if we had someone who could put up some reliable minutes and add pop to the man advantage, it could provide a big lift to the team. The powerplay has gone in spurts all year, but you wonder what it could be with the right gun on the point and McDavid on the half-wall.

If that means the Oilers need to send a defenceman the other way in a deal, or if it means that we have NHL-calibre defencemen sitting for our stretch drive and the playoffs? I'm pretty okay with that. Benning had a good game against Chicago, but he's still a rookie. If I have a choice between him or Shattenkirk in the lineup? It's a pretty easy one for me.

I'd love for the team to have a real back-up goalie, but I wanted one a long time before now. Honestly, it's becoming less important because if the team is in a race, they'll ride Talbot hard anyhow. Once they're in the playoffs, there is almost no chance the back-up plays unless Talbot gets hurt - and if that happens, it's unlikely any back-up option is going to adequately replace him. I think all we can hope for is that the Oilers clinch as soon as possible and then that the team is able to give him some rest down the stretch.

A face-off guy and a right winger? Those are nice to haves. The right wing isn't that important if McLellan can find a way to get the guys he has contributing. The center? Sounds like a Jerrod Smithson trade he's calling for. Kesler and Vermette are going to best most team's centermen, but that won't be where a series with the Ducks is won or lost.


I agree with your thoughts here but as always, will chime in on the face off thing. This is a drum I am going to bang until the MSM stops spouting about the importance of that percentage.
Situationally it CAN be important but big picture there is very little if any correlation between FO% and winning.

Even if Chia believes that TEAM face off percentage is a priority how does he fix that? these are our FO numbers;
McDavid; 43.9
RNH; 44.2
Drai; 49.2
Letestu; 51.7
Lander; 56

They arent replacing any of the worst three face off guys with a better face off player without a drop off in almost every other aspect.

Clearly the team values SITUATIONAL face offs which explains Letestu on the PP.

The top ten FO teams in the league with overall place in the point standings are;
ANA 9
COL 30
BOS 11
DET 20
CAR 28
MIN 2
VAN 25
PHIL 18
OTT 11
LA 22

The worst ten with their place in the point standings;
EDM 8
NYR 7
PIT 3
WIN 21
FLA 14
SJ 6
CLB 4
CHI 5
TB 24
AZ 29

Both lists are all over the map.

If our 4th line C was 41% on the dot and we could pick a better one up to play 5 mins a night, only taking important draws then sure get one CHEAP but the way this team is built combined with the fact that FO's JUST ARENT THAT IMPORTANT as a stat doesnt mean that this a low priority for me, it isnt even on my list of things to improve right now.


I wonder if Letestu isn't on the PP based on production. He's been good, and I'm as surprised as anyone.

I'd still rather have a guy who wins face offs as opposed to not, especially late in the game. But your point is solid... who are you taking out? I guess you could move Draisaitl back to the wing and bring in someone like Boyle, but does that make you better? It likely does if the 3C option is then Caggiula, but more likely it makes the team one-like threat again. I'd rather them add a second line RW I think if they are looking to add a forward.





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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687303 is a reply to message #687297 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 12:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne  is currently offline PlusOne
Messages: 3362
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Location: Regina, Sask

3 Cups

mightyreasoner wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 13:21



I wonder if Letestu isn't on the PP based on production. He's been good, and I'm as surprised as anyone.

I'd still rather have a guy who wins face offs as opposed to not, especially late in the game. But your point is solid... who are you taking out? I guess you could move Draisaitl back to the wing and bring in someone like Boyle, but does that make you better? It likely does if the 3C option is then Caggiula, but more likely it makes the team one-like threat again. I'd rather them add a second line RW I think if they are looking to add a forward.





Agreed on Letestu but I would call him adequate but not good on the PP. He has 8 points. No sure what his total PP time is but that makes him the 5th best forward.
Given his ability on the draw (yes, the PP is one place I think starting with possesion is important he is the right fit there)

I think they should try RNH at RW and see what happens. It might be a little late but it narrows your focus in the trade market

If they rolled out;
Maroon - McD - Eberle
Lucic - Leon - *new RW/RNH
Drake - *New C/RNH - Kassian
Henricks/Letestu/Jujar/Iiro/etc *basically the leftovers

You have a decent linup assuming some production from Ebs/RNH comes at some point

**ETA
Just realized I "forgot" Pouliot. Perhaps I didnt really forget him.....

[Updated on: Tue, 21 February 2017 12:55]


Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on


CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687319 is a reply to message #687297 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 16:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jds308  is currently offline jds308
Messages: 1290
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Location: Summerland

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mightyreasoner wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 11:21

PlusOne wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 12:10

Adam wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 10:29

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers /case-for-the-defence-oilers-are-knee-deep-in-blue-liners

Quote:

• A face-off man because they’re worst in the league at 47.2 per cent and if they play Anaheim in the first playoff round, the Ducks with Ryan Kesler and Antoine Vermette are No. 1 and would eat them up.

• A veteran backup goalie because Cam Talbot can’t play every single night and he’s more indispensable than captain Connor McDavid.

• Maybe an older unrestricted free agent right-winger with some offensive pop.

What he doesn’t need is more defencemen, unlike most teams.


SIGH. I really like Matheson as a guy I read religiously growing up, but I do think he's in serious decline now, and I kind of hope he hangs them up soon.

I think all three of his items on the wish list are good to have for the Oilers, but really, there's nothing that would better help the Oilers chances of advancing in the playoffs more than a powerplay quarterback defenceman. We don't need another 5/6/7 defenceman who brings no offence, but if we had someone who could put up some reliable minutes and add pop to the man advantage, it could provide a big lift to the team. The powerplay has gone in spurts all year, but you wonder what it could be with the right gun on the point and McDavid on the half-wall.

If that means the Oilers need to send a defenceman the other way in a deal, or if it means that we have NHL-calibre defencemen sitting for our stretch drive and the playoffs? I'm pretty okay with that. Benning had a good game against Chicago, but he's still a rookie. If I have a choice between him or Shattenkirk in the lineup? It's a pretty easy one for me.

I'd love for the team to have a real back-up goalie, but I wanted one a long time before now. Honestly, it's becoming less important because if the team is in a race, they'll ride Talbot hard anyhow. Once they're in the playoffs, there is almost no chance the back-up plays unless Talbot gets hurt - and if that happens, it's unlikely any back-up option is going to adequately replace him. I think all we can hope for is that the Oilers clinch as soon as possible and then that the team is able to give him some rest down the stretch.

A face-off guy and a right winger? Those are nice to haves. The right wing isn't that important if McLellan can find a way to get the guys he has contributing. The center? Sounds like a Jerrod Smithson trade he's calling for. Kesler and Vermette are going to best most team's centermen, but that won't be where a series with the Ducks is won or lost.


I agree with your thoughts here but as always, will chime in on the face off thing. This is a drum I am going to bang until the MSM stops spouting about the importance of that percentage.
Situationally it CAN be important but big picture there is very little if any correlation between FO% and winning.

Even if Chia believes that TEAM face off percentage is a priority how does he fix that? these are our FO numbers;
McDavid; 43.9
RNH; 44.2
Drai; 49.2
Letestu; 51.7
Lander; 56

They arent replacing any of the worst three face off guys with a better face off player without a drop off in almost every other aspect.

Clearly the team values SITUATIONAL face offs which explains Letestu on the PP.

The top ten FO teams in the league with overall place in the point standings are;
ANA 9
COL 30
BOS 11
DET 20
CAR 28
MIN 2
VAN 25
PHIL 18
OTT 11
LA 22

The worst ten with their place in the point standings;
EDM 8
NYR 7
PIT 3
WIN 21
FLA 14
SJ 6
CLB 4
CHI 5
TB 24
AZ 29

Both lists are all over the map.

If our 4th line C was 41% on the dot and we could pick a better one up to play 5 mins a night, only taking important draws then sure get one CHEAP but the way this team is built combined with the fact that FO's JUST ARENT THAT IMPORTANT as a stat doesnt mean that this a low priority for me, it isnt even on my list of things to improve right now.


I wonder if Letestu isn't on the PP based on production. He's been good, and I'm as surprised as anyone.

I'd still rather have a guy who wins face offs as opposed to not, especially late in the game. But your point is solid... who are you taking out? I guess you could move Draisaitl back to the wing and bring in someone like Boyle, but does that make you better? It likely does if the 3C option is then Caggiula, but more likely it makes the team one-like threat again. I'd rather them add a second line RW I think if they are looking to add a forward.





Even on McDavid's wing Leon was taking most of the faceoffs. Leon as #2 C means McDavid takes more draws, one of the few weak areas of his game.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687312 is a reply to message #687293 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 14:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jerekybeef  is currently offline jerekybeef
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Location: Kamloops

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Agreed on the FO%.

Ultimately, you want to have the top team in every regard/stat. Winning face offs is important for puck control unless you have the best forecheck and take away %. It's a situational need. Yes of course everyone wants to win face offs. Its like the shootout, everyone wants to win but teams aren't putting goalies in the shootout off the bench because they're great in that context.

Speaking of which, I remember a game against Dallas, that MacT pulled Conklin for Morrison in the shootout. Conklin was so pissed about that he smashed his helmet off the ground and it rebounded up and he caught it. Memories...

It was Dallas not Arizona

[Updated on: Tue, 21 February 2017 14:31]


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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687316 is a reply to message #687312 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 15:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 18175
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Location: Edmonton, AB

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jerekybeef wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 14:29

Agreed on the FO%.

Ultimately, you want to have the top team in every regard/stat. Winning face offs is important for puck control unless you have the best forecheck and take away %. It's a situational need. Yes of course everyone wants to win face offs. Its like the shootout, everyone wants to win but teams aren't putting goalies in the shootout off the bench because they're great in that context.

Speaking of which, I remember a game against Dallas, that MacT pulled Conklin for Morrison in the shootout. Conklin was so pissed about that he smashed his helmet off the ground and it rebounded up and he caught it. Memories...

It was Dallas not Arizona


And as bad as Conklin was at the shootout, the tactic wasn't a good one for MacTavish. Turns out that a cold goalie facing a breakaway competition isn't a recipe for success. They lit up Morrison with two goals on two shots. It was also the last time he wore an Oilers jersey. He was waived that week and claimed by Ottawa.

I think Morrison gets credit for the loss on the stats too...which is bizarre in a game where he didn't play a second of icetime.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687317 is a reply to message #687316 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 15:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:22

jerekybeef wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 14:29

Agreed on the FO%.

Ultimately, you want to have the top team in every regard/stat. Winning face offs is important for puck control unless you have the best forecheck and take away %. It's a situational need. Yes of course everyone wants to win face offs. Its like the shootout, everyone wants to win but teams aren't putting goalies in the shootout off the bench because they're great in that context.

Speaking of which, I remember a game against Dallas, that MacT pulled Conklin for Morrison in the shootout. Conklin was so pissed about that he smashed his helmet off the ground and it rebounded up and he caught it. Memories...

It was Dallas not Arizona


And as bad as Conklin was at the shootout, the tactic wasn't a good one for MacTavish. Turns out that a cold goalie facing a breakaway competition isn't a recipe for success. They lit up Morrison with two goals on two shots. It was also the last time he wore an Oilers jersey. He was waived that week and claimed by Ottawa.

I think Morrison gets credit for the loss on the stats too...which is bizarre in a game where he didn't play a second of icetime.


MacT was so ahead of his time. Coaching like all players are just a collection of numerical ratings with certain strengths and weaknesses unaffected by outside influences or situations. Can really see why he believed in the power of Eakins.



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- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687318 is a reply to message #687280 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

[Updated on: Tue, 21 February 2017 16:24]


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687321 is a reply to message #687318 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 16:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jds308  is currently offline jds308
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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 14:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions.


I'm really coming around to this way of thinking as well. I don't think this is the year for Chia to blow his brains out and go for it. I think it's fair to say that the Oilers are exceeding most peoples expectations this year, and look like they're destined for the playoffs. It's still hard to wrap my mind around that, but I'm truly almost there!

There's a few key points that I think stop Chia from really going for it.

1: Expansion draft. Yes I know that a rental won't really affect this, but the player you really want may cost you someone that does have an impact on it. Overall this looming draft is just going to make it challenging to make deals this year imo, especially when it comes to anyone with term that will have to be protected.

2: Flat cap. You certainly don't want to take on any extra salary for next year without knowing what the cap is going to look like. Also, any extra cap now will affect the end of year bonuses which in turn will hamper your cap next year depending on where it ends up. Bottom line, too much uncertainty to take any cap risks right now.

3: McDavid/Leon contracts. Let's just say Chia goes and adds Shattenkirk a faceoff specialist and a RW sniper tomorrow. Forget the fact that it likely cost a Shat ton to get done, what if the moves actually put the team deep into the playoffs? Now you get to head into the off season with Leon needing a new deal, and McDavid extension talk opening up with both players coming off deep playoff runs. Ouch to the cap! Better off to stay the course, get some playoff experience and negotiate these same deals that are still going to cost a lot, but maybe not as much as they would have. Go for it next year when those contracts are already signed.

4: 2nd round pick to Boston. Isn't this the last year we can send our compensation pick to Boston for the Chia signing? Stupid rule yes, but also reality. So, maybe this year you hang onto your 1st and 3rds (I think we have 2?) since you know you're going to be short a 2nd. These picks would likely have to be in play in the deadline deals in order to minimize gutting your roster and prospect pool. Not to mention the expansion draft will probably put a premium on draft picks this year.

I think Chia stays the course. I could see a small move happening, back-up goalie or maybe a depth forward. Nothing that's going to make or break the teams playoff drive. I would like to see a back-up just to give Talbot some rest down the stretch, but like others have mentioned Talbot is playing every playoff game unless he's hurt in which case we're likely done anyway.

My expectations have already been exceeded for this year. Playoffs are a bonus, and I'm so stoked. Next year is the year my friends.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687342 is a reply to message #687318 ]
Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently online CrusaderPi
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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687346 is a reply to message #687342 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 00:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.

There's an expansion draft.

And for once, we have a gm who isn't telegraphing to the entire freaking planet what he intends to do.
Re-lax.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687348 is a reply to message #687346 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 02:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Ales Cooper wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 00:18

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.

There's an expansion draft.

And for once, we have a gm who isn't telegraphing to the entire freaking planet what he intends to do.
Re-lax.


I think he makes an excellent point. The Oilers are keeping most of their best players no matter what. We're going to lose some depth piece, but you lose players every year, and there's lots of time pre-expansion draft to move pieces to optimize return if there's someone valuable you stand to lose.

If the reason Chiarelli doesn't want to make a move is the expansion draft, then that's a problem. If there's a better player we lose, it's because we got someone more valuable than him who bumped him out of a protected spot...that's a good problem to have. Ideally, you have the depth on your team that everyone they could pick seems like a big loss.




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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687371 is a reply to message #687348 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 13:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 01:02

Ales Cooper wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 00:18

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.

There's an expansion draft.

And for once, we have a gm who isn't telegraphing to the entire freaking planet what he intends to do.
Re-lax.


I think he makes an excellent point. The Oilers are keeping most of their best players no matter what. We're going to lose some depth piece, but you lose players every year, and there's lots of time pre-expansion draft to move pieces to optimize return if there's someone valuable you stand to lose.

If the reason Chiarelli doesn't want to make a move is the expansion draft, then that's a problem. If there's a better player we lose, it's because we got someone more valuable than him who bumped him out of a protected spot...that's a good problem to have. Ideally, you have the depth on your team that everyone they could pick seems like a big loss.




I can't speak for others, but my worry would be trading someone like say Nurse for a rental. Nurse is Vegas exempt so he would have HUGE value to a team acquiring him, especially if they're ridding themselves of a player that would need protection, or a UFA. For example, would you trade Nurse for Shatenkirk given the current circumstances? I wouldn't. Would St Louis, I think they would. I'm not saying Chia would do a deal like that, but those are the deals I would steer clear of.

I'm also not big on trading our 1st round pick this year so there's not a lot left over to trade. Maybe you move Davidson or Hendricks or some fringe guys or career AHL'ers. I doubt Pouliot or Fayne will be going anywhere, so I don't see much happening of any significance and I think that's ok.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687377 is a reply to message #687371 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 14:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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jds308 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 13:32

Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 01:02

Ales Cooper wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 00:18

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.

There's an expansion draft.

And for once, we have a gm who isn't telegraphing to the entire freaking planet what he intends to do.
Re-lax.


I think he makes an excellent point. The Oilers are keeping most of their best players no matter what. We're going to lose some depth piece, but you lose players every year, and there's lots of time pre-expansion draft to move pieces to optimize return if there's someone valuable you stand to lose.

If the reason Chiarelli doesn't want to make a move is the expansion draft, then that's a problem. If there's a better player we lose, it's because we got someone more valuable than him who bumped him out of a protected spot...that's a good problem to have. Ideally, you have the depth on your team that everyone they could pick seems like a big loss.




I can't speak for others, but my worry would be trading someone like say Nurse for a rental. Nurse is Vegas exempt so he would have HUGE value to a team acquiring him, especially if they're ridding themselves of a player that would need protection, or a UFA. For example, would you trade Nurse for Shatenkirk given the current circumstances? I wouldn't. Would St Louis, I think they would. I'm not saying Chia would do a deal like that, but those are the deals I would steer clear of.

I'm also not big on trading our 1st round pick this year so there's not a lot left over to trade. Maybe you move Davidson or Hendricks or some fringe guys or career AHL'ers. I doubt Pouliot or Fayne will be going anywhere, so I don't see much happening of any significance and I think that's ok.


I don't think anyone would trade Nurse for a rental. If you're trading Nurse, it's for someone who brings some different element - likely a similar aged defenceman who brings more offence, even if that means a little less nasty. Preferably a right-shooter too.

That's not the kind of asset you give up for a guy who may only play 20 games with the team.

As for what we can trade, there's a few options. We have a lot of prospects who could potentially go, from the low level (Musil/Simpson) type options to the mid-level (Reinhart/Slepyshev) to the upper mid-level (Jones/Bear). I wouldn't give up Puljujarvi for almost anything.

We could trade 2018 picks. For the right player, I'd consider the first and/or third from this year. Or you could trade a guy like Russell to a team for a pick (just show them the super-secret report that shows he's one of the best puck-movers in the league!), then turn around and use that pick in another deal.

I'd be okay even giving up one of those two defencemen in the right deal, because there's no telling whether they'll make the jump and when that might happen. Our best window to win is the next 2-3 years, so if you can bring a guy that can help push us deep in the playoffs this year, it could be a big factor in future success, and I think if someone who's only seen Edmonton as a visitor is here for a playoff run, they're going to think long and hard about staying. The team has huge upside, McDavid is soon to be the best player in the game, and the playoffs will be crazy here as long-suffering fans finally get to let loose. It's going to be loud. If there's even two rounds in this building, I think there will be a huge appetite to come back for more - even for a guy like Shattenkirk who's apparently got ties to the east.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687372 is a reply to message #687342 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 13:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.


Is Maroon our 13th player? That's probably who is gone if we lock into the 8 skaters option. I would think Chia really likes Maroon and doesn't want to lost him for nothing. This team isn't ready to go all in on, we have Nuge and Ebs and could say Lucic too not playing near their ability. There is not that much to gain IMO by trying to make a trade deadline splash to add a long term solution on D. There aren't nearly as many options right now as there could be in the off-season too. I just don't see the benefit of trying to rush things. Would just be probably overpaying for one of the very limited options out there and guaranteeing that we lose a good player in the expansion draft.

Hopefully we can add a decent bottom 6C so Nuge can get some pressure taken off him. And it will be nice for the kids to finally get a taste of the playoffs to make them hungry for it again next year with what should be a more complete team.

[Updated on: Wed, 22 February 2017 13:42]


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- Lowe, 2013

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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687378 is a reply to message #687372 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 14:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 13:35

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.


Is Maroon our 13th player? That's probably who is gone if we lock into the 8 skaters option. I would think Chia really likes Maroon and doesn't want to lost him for nothing. This team isn't ready to go all in on, we have Nuge and Ebs and could say Lucic too not playing near their ability. There is not that much to gain IMO by trying to make a trade deadline splash to add a long term solution on D. There aren't nearly as many options right now as there could be in the off-season too. I just don't see the benefit of trying to rush things. Would just be probably overpaying for one of the very limited options out there and guaranteeing that we lose a good player in the expansion draft.

Hopefully we can add a decent bottom 6C so Nuge can get some pressure taken off him. And it will be nice for the kids to finally get a taste of the playoffs to make them hungry for it again next year with what should be a more complete team.


8 skaters, a goalie, McDavid, Nurse - he's maybe only #11 or #12, but still, it's mid-roster turnover. Good teams survive losing a few good players from the middle of their roster. I think that's an awful lot less of a blow than Chicago having to part with Byfuglien, Ladd and Bolland after their first Cup.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687380 is a reply to message #687378 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 14:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:18

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 13:35

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 21:11

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 15:48

Seriously, curse the expansion draft. I bet Chia would be pushing hard for an offensive RHD if it wasn't going to lock him into the 8 skater option for the expansion draft.

I think small improvements are all we're getting this year. Not sure I like the idea of a 1st round pick or a good piece being lost this year for a rental player. Don't think this is the year to be going all in like that. Need to add long term solutions or cheap small additions. I would love for the OIlers to get a guy like Boyle so that Nuge can be moved to the wing, or, if needed Drai back to McDavid's wing if we need a push for a goal.

Good lord, if chiarelli is managing scared because he might lose the 13th player on this team he's not the right person for the job.


Is Maroon our 13th player? That's probably who is gone if we lock into the 8 skaters option. I would think Chia really likes Maroon and doesn't want to lost him for nothing. This team isn't ready to go all in on, we have Nuge and Ebs and could say Lucic too not playing near their ability. There is not that much to gain IMO by trying to make a trade deadline splash to add a long term solution on D. There aren't nearly as many options right now as there could be in the off-season too. I just don't see the benefit of trying to rush things. Would just be probably overpaying for one of the very limited options out there and guaranteeing that we lose a good player in the expansion draft.

Hopefully we can add a decent bottom 6C so Nuge can get some pressure taken off him. And it will be nice for the kids to finally get a taste of the playoffs to make them hungry for it again next year with what should be a more complete team.


8 skaters, a goalie, McDavid, Nurse - he's maybe only #11 or #12, but still, it's mid-roster turnover. Good teams survive losing a few good players from the middle of their roster. I think that's an awful lot less of a blow than Chicago having to part with Byfuglien, Ladd and Bolland after their first Cup.


He's more useful than Ebs and Nuge this year. I put him as the guy to go though because the Oilers would be afraid of the optics of losing Ebs or Nuge for nothing.

Still, I don't see the need for it. I don't see overpaying for a RHD right now making much difference for the playoff run. I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.

[Updated on: Wed, 22 February 2017 14:29]


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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687382 is a reply to message #687380 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 14:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:25


He's more useful than Ebs and Nuge this year. I put him as the guy to go though because the Oilers would be afraid of the optics of losing Ebs or Nuge for nothing.

Still, I don't see the need for it. I don't see overpaying for a RHD right now making much difference for the playoff run. I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.


It's pretty debateable to say he's been more valuable. There's just different expectations on them. He's definitely more value for the dollars he's being paid, but more valuable? Eberle has 5 more points, despite an extremely low shooting percentage to his career average.

Nugent-Hopkins has one point less, despite playing virtually no time with McDavid. He also plays a more important position.

Maroon is 28 and is having his best season ever. His last point made this the first time he's ever hit 30 points in a season, and he's got an excellent shot at getting to 40 this year. He should finish with 25+ goals. But is it sustainable? Or has he caught lightning in a bottle? And how much credit do you give to McDavid. Certainly, Maroon hasn't been the same player on other lines.

I think the way fans view Eberle and Nugent-Hopkins this year is typically Edmontonian. Short sighted based on what have you done most recently, focussing on the negative highlights more than anything they do wrong. I think both have had disappointing seasons, but there are those (not you) who've suggested that they're basically done and in decline now, and that's ridiculous. You go to games and hear people talking about how completely useless those players are. Here, you're either a star and we love you, or you basically are garbage and we wish we could trade you for pocket lint (unless you're a gritty fourth liner who provides no offence but really really tries hard...then you're loved for all time).

If you had to put money on one of Eberle or Maroon scoring 40+ points in each of the next 2-3 seasons, who would you bet on? Who'd you make the bet on with Nugent-Hopkins vs Maroon?

I really like Patrick Maroon. I think he's a great fit, and if I'm Chiarelli and faced with exposing him, I'm offering up some good incentives to Las Vegas to get them to pass on him (and probably reminding them that his scoring metrics away from McDavid are an awful lot worse). But I don't think that he's irreplaceable, and I don't think he's more important than those two you mention.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687385 is a reply to message #687382 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 15:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:46

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:25


He's more useful than Ebs and Nuge this year. I put him as the guy to go though because the Oilers would be afraid of the optics of losing Ebs or Nuge for nothing.

Still, I don't see the need for it. I don't see overpaying for a RHD right now making much difference for the playoff run. I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.


It's pretty debateable to say he's been more valuable. There's just different expectations on them. He's definitely more value for the dollars he's being paid, but more valuable? Eberle has 5 more points, despite an extremely low shooting percentage to his career average.

Nugent-Hopkins has one point less, despite playing virtually no time with McDavid. He also plays a more important position.

Maroon is 28 and is having his best season ever. His last point made this the first time he's ever hit 30 points in a season, and he's got an excellent shot at getting to 40 this year. He should finish with 25+ goals. But is it sustainable? Or has he caught lightning in a bottle? And how much credit do you give to McDavid. Certainly, Maroon hasn't been the same player on other lines.

I think the way fans view Eberle and Nugent-Hopkins this year is typically Edmontonian. Short sighted based on what have you done most recently, focussing on the negative highlights more than anything they do wrong. I think both have had disappointing seasons, but there are those (not you) who've suggested that they're basically done and in decline now, and that's ridiculous. You go to games and hear people talking about how completely useless those players are. Here, you're either a star and we love you, or you basically are garbage and we wish we could trade you for pocket lint (unless you're a gritty fourth liner who provides no offence but really really tries hard...then you're loved for all time).

If you had to put money on one of Eberle or Maroon scoring 40+ points in each of the next 2-3 seasons, who would you bet on? Who'd you make the bet on with Nugent-Hopkins vs Maroon?

I really like Patrick Maroon. I think he's a great fit, and if I'm Chiarelli and faced with exposing him, I'm offering up some good incentives to Las Vegas to get them to pass on him (and probably reminding them that his scoring metrics away from McDavid are an awful lot worse). But I don't think that he's irreplaceable, and I don't think he's more important than those two you mention.


I'm finding with this team right now, with McLellan's coaching, that any chemistry players have together needs to be treated like gold. No chemistry usually means no production these days with the Oilers. Maroon and McDavid together has worked really well. I bet it could be even better if Maroon was put in the 1st PP unit, but we have to keep pumping those Lucic tires. I think we're actually missing out on that Maroon/McDavid combo being better because of that very annoying PP choice. That chemistry is the main reason I think Maroon is more valuable to the team right now than Ebs or Nuge.

I think Ebs will have a bounce back season next year. I probably take this a dozen times, but I think his problem is confidence, and it may be rooting from him messing up his shot with some bad shoot coaching last off-season. Not sure if that shooting % is going to be going up much the rest of this year. He's gonna have to get in close around the net and slam some garbage in if he wants goals. I'm probably overstating that Maroon is more valuable than Ebs long term. Just more valuable right now, assuming Ebs is going to bounce back next year.

Nuge, sigh...I've been pumping that boys tires for years. Many rants about how he's gonna take his game to another level and be a driver now that he's not deferring to Hall all the time. Never saw this coming. He's losing his C battle damn near every night. Even Brandon Sutter can dominate a top C now and then. Nuge, his game is just holding on for dear life, missing every 2nd or 3rd assignment in his zone, some perimeter shots, clean losses on almost all important faceoffs, dumping pucks in and not coming close to getting the puck back. If McLellan is never going to try him on wing, I'm not sure what to do with him anymore. I think his role as a 3C that can't handle top players could be easily replaced at this point with someone that could do a better job of it. But, we would never expose him in an expansion draft.

[Updated on: Wed, 22 February 2017 15:23]


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- Lowe, 2013

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- MacT, 2015

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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687439 is a reply to message #687385 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 13:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:11

Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:46

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:25


He's more useful than Ebs and Nuge this year. I put him as the guy to go though because the Oilers would be afraid of the optics of losing Ebs or Nuge for nothing.

Still, I don't see the need for it. I don't see overpaying for a RHD right now making much difference for the playoff run. I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.


It's pretty debateable to say he's been more valuable. There's just different expectations on them. He's definitely more value for the dollars he's being paid, but more valuable? Eberle has 5 more points, despite an extremely low shooting percentage to his career average.

Nugent-Hopkins has one point less, despite playing virtually no time with McDavid. He also plays a more important position.

Maroon is 28 and is having his best season ever. His last point made this the first time he's ever hit 30 points in a season, and he's got an excellent shot at getting to 40 this year. He should finish with 25+ goals. But is it sustainable? Or has he caught lightning in a bottle? And how much credit do you give to McDavid. Certainly, Maroon hasn't been the same player on other lines.

I think the way fans view Eberle and Nugent-Hopkins this year is typically Edmontonian. Short sighted based on what have you done most recently, focussing on the negative highlights more than anything they do wrong. I think both have had disappointing seasons, but there are those (not you) who've suggested that they're basically done and in decline now, and that's ridiculous. You go to games and hear people talking about how completely useless those players are. Here, you're either a star and we love you, or you basically are garbage and we wish we could trade you for pocket lint (unless you're a gritty fourth liner who provides no offence but really really tries hard...then you're loved for all time).

If you had to put money on one of Eberle or Maroon scoring 40+ points in each of the next 2-3 seasons, who would you bet on? Who'd you make the bet on with Nugent-Hopkins vs Maroon?

I really like Patrick Maroon. I think he's a great fit, and if I'm Chiarelli and faced with exposing him, I'm offering up some good incentives to Las Vegas to get them to pass on him (and probably reminding them that his scoring metrics away from McDavid are an awful lot worse). But I don't think that he's irreplaceable, and I don't think he's more important than those two you mention.


I'm finding with this team right now, with McLellan's coaching, that any chemistry players have together needs to be treated like gold. No chemistry usually means no production these days with the Oilers. Maroon and McDavid together has worked really well. I bet it could be even better if Maroon was put in the 1st PP unit, but we have to keep pumping those Lucic tires. I think we're actually missing out on that Maroon/McDavid combo being better because of that very annoying PP choice. That chemistry is the main reason I think Maroon is more valuable to the team right now than Ebs or Nuge.

I think Ebs will have a bounce back season next year. I probably take this a dozen times, but I think his problem is confidence, and it may be rooting from him messing up his shot with some bad shoot coaching last off-season. Not sure if that shooting % is going to be going up much the rest of this year. He's gonna have to get in close around the net and slam some garbage in if he wants goals. I'm probably overstating that Maroon is more valuable than Ebs long term. Just more valuable right now, assuming Ebs is going to bounce back next year.

Nuge, sigh...I've been pumping that boys tires for years. Many rants about how he's gonna take his game to another level and be a driver now that he's not deferring to Hall all the time. Never saw this coming. He's losing his C battle damn near every night. Even Brandon Sutter can dominate a top C now and then. Nuge, his game is just holding on for dear life, missing every 2nd or 3rd assignment in his zone, some perimeter shots, clean losses on almost all important faceoffs, dumping pucks in and not coming close to getting the puck back. If McLellan is never going to try him on wing, I'm not sure what to do with him anymore. I think his role as a 3C that can't handle top players could be easily replaced at this point with someone that could do a better job of it. But, we would never expose him in an expansion draft.


Hmmm.... Just thinking out loud here. What if you did leave Nuge exposed? He would be a lock to be picked no? That would be an instant 6M off the books. In a lot of ways that in itself is more valuable than any trade we would find for Nuge right now where we're likely either overpaying for someone or eating some of the Nuge dollars. Not saying I would do it, just saying.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687440 is a reply to message #687439 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 13:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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jds308 wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 13:08

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:11

Adam wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:46

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 14:25


He's more useful than Ebs and Nuge this year. I put him as the guy to go though because the Oilers would be afraid of the optics of losing Ebs or Nuge for nothing.

Still, I don't see the need for it. I don't see overpaying for a RHD right now making much difference for the playoff run. I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.


It's pretty debateable to say he's been more valuable. There's just different expectations on them. He's definitely more value for the dollars he's being paid, but more valuable? Eberle has 5 more points, despite an extremely low shooting percentage to his career average.

Nugent-Hopkins has one point less, despite playing virtually no time with McDavid. He also plays a more important position.

Maroon is 28 and is having his best season ever. His last point made this the first time he's ever hit 30 points in a season, and he's got an excellent shot at getting to 40 this year. He should finish with 25+ goals. But is it sustainable? Or has he caught lightning in a bottle? And how much credit do you give to McDavid. Certainly, Maroon hasn't been the same player on other lines.

I think the way fans view Eberle and Nugent-Hopkins this year is typically Edmontonian. Short sighted based on what have you done most recently, focussing on the negative highlights more than anything they do wrong. I think both have had disappointing seasons, but there are those (not you) who've suggested that they're basically done and in decline now, and that's ridiculous. You go to games and hear people talking about how completely useless those players are. Here, you're either a star and we love you, or you basically are garbage and we wish we could trade you for pocket lint (unless you're a gritty fourth liner who provides no offence but really really tries hard...then you're loved for all time).

If you had to put money on one of Eberle or Maroon scoring 40+ points in each of the next 2-3 seasons, who would you bet on? Who'd you make the bet on with Nugent-Hopkins vs Maroon?

I really like Patrick Maroon. I think he's a great fit, and if I'm Chiarelli and faced with exposing him, I'm offering up some good incentives to Las Vegas to get them to pass on him (and probably reminding them that his scoring metrics away from McDavid are an awful lot worse). But I don't think that he's irreplaceable, and I don't think he's more important than those two you mention.


I'm finding with this team right now, with McLellan's coaching, that any chemistry players have together needs to be treated like gold. No chemistry usually means no production these days with the Oilers. Maroon and McDavid together has worked really well. I bet it could be even better if Maroon was put in the 1st PP unit, but we have to keep pumping those Lucic tires. I think we're actually missing out on that Maroon/McDavid combo being better because of that very annoying PP choice. That chemistry is the main reason I think Maroon is more valuable to the team right now than Ebs or Nuge.

I think Ebs will have a bounce back season next year. I probably take this a dozen times, but I think his problem is confidence, and it may be rooting from him messing up his shot with some bad shoot coaching last off-season. Not sure if that shooting % is going to be going up much the rest of this year. He's gonna have to get in close around the net and slam some garbage in if he wants goals. I'm probably overstating that Maroon is more valuable than Ebs long term. Just more valuable right now, assuming Ebs is going to bounce back next year.

Nuge, sigh...I've been pumping that boys tires for years. Many rants about how he's gonna take his game to another level and be a driver now that he's not deferring to Hall all the time. Never saw this coming. He's losing his C battle damn near every night. Even Brandon Sutter can dominate a top C now and then. Nuge, his game is just holding on for dear life, missing every 2nd or 3rd assignment in his zone, some perimeter shots, clean losses on almost all important faceoffs, dumping pucks in and not coming close to getting the puck back. If McLellan is never going to try him on wing, I'm not sure what to do with him anymore. I think his role as a 3C that can't handle top players could be easily replaced at this point with someone that could do a better job of it. But, we would never expose him in an expansion draft.


Hmmm.... Just thinking out loud here. What if you did leave Nuge exposed? He would be a lock to be picked no? That would be an instant 6M off the books. In a lot of ways that in itself is more valuable than any trade we would find for Nuge right now where we're likely either overpaying for someone or eating some of the Nuge dollars. Not saying I would do it, just saying.

Does Vegas have to get to a cap floor? It would be interesting to see if Sekera or Lucic didn't have an NMC and weren't protected. I'm sure some team will roll the dice on some useful, but probably too expensive talent.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687383 is a reply to message #687380 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 14:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 13:25

I see this playoff run more about seeing who has it in them to hit another level. Chances are there are going to be some guys that just fold like a cheap suit, and it will be good info to figure out how to put the final touches on this team.


This will be eye opening for sure. I always wanted to see Sam Gagner in a playoff series, I just felt like he was the type of player that would ramp up when it counts. I see Eberle as potentially similar, he could find that next gear. Lucic is a guy we will be glad to have around, as he's one of the few on the team with any significant playoff experience and he wears a letter. I think we'll see a different Lucic come April. The key will be secondary scoring. We know teams are going to do all they can to shut down McDavid. Nuge, Eberle, Leon, Lucic, and others are going to have to pick it up offensively.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687381 is a reply to message #687372 ]
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 13:35

Is Maroon our 13th player? That's probably who is gone if we lock into the 8 skaters option. I would think Chia really likes Maroon and doesn't want to lost him for nothing. This team isn't ready to go all in on, we have Nuge and Ebs and could say Lucic too not playing near their ability. There is not that much to gain IMO by trying to make a trade deadline splash to add a long term solution on D. There aren't nearly as many options right now as there could be in the off-season too. I just don't see the benefit of trying to rush things. Would just be probably overpaying for one of the very limited options out there and guaranteeing that we lose a good player in the expansion draft.



I'm not sure if Maroon is a lock to be claimed. Certainly he is an attractive option, but he is also one year away from UFA. The odds of him re-signing in Las Vegas don't seem super high... so if you are building a expansion franchise, do you want a one-year rental or would you rather get someone like Reinhart or Davidson or Kassian or Khaira or Brossoit?

It's too bad we have to protect Lucic though.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687395 is a reply to message #687280 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 18:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Tue, 21 February 2017 09:29

http://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers /case-for-the-defence-oilers-are-knee-deep-in-blue-liners

Quote:

• A face-off man because they’re worst in the league at 47.2 per cent and if they play Anaheim in the first playoff round, the Ducks with Ryan Kesler and Antoine Vermette are No. 1 and would eat them up.

• A veteran backup goalie because Cam Talbot can’t play every single night and he’s more indispensable than captain Connor McDavid.

• Maybe an older unrestricted free agent right-winger with some offensive pop.

What he doesn’t need is more defencemen, unlike most teams.


SIGH. I really like Matheson as a guy I read religiously growing up, but I do think he's in serious decline now, and I kind of hope he hangs them up soon.

I think all three of his items on the wish list are good to have for the Oilers, but really, there's nothing that would better help the Oilers chances of advancing in the playoffs more than a powerplay quarterback defenceman. We don't need another 5/6/7 defenceman who brings no offence, but if we had someone who could put up some reliable minutes and add pop to the man advantage, it could provide a big lift to the team. The powerplay has gone in spurts all year, but you wonder what it could be with the right gun on the point and McDavid on the half-wall.

If that means the Oilers need to send a defenceman the other way in a deal, or if it means that we have NHL-calibre defencemen sitting for our stretch drive and the playoffs? I'm pretty okay with that. Benning had a good game against Chicago, but he's still a rookie. If I have a choice between him or Shattenkirk in the lineup? It's a pretty easy one for me.

I'd love for the team to have a real back-up goalie, but I wanted one a long time before now. Honestly, it's becoming less important because if the team is in a race, they'll ride Talbot hard anyhow. Once they're in the playoffs, there is almost no chance the back-up plays unless Talbot gets hurt - and if that happens, it's unlikely any back-up option is going to adequately replace him. I think all we can hope for is that the Oilers clinch as soon as possible and then that the team is able to give him some rest down the stretch.

A face-off guy and a right winger? Those are nice to haves. The right wing isn't that important if McLellan can find a way to get the guys he has contributing. The center? Sounds like a Jerrod Smithson trade he's calling for. Kesler and Vermette are going to best most team's centermen, but that won't be where a series with the Ducks is won or lost.


Yeah, what I'd like to see on the back end is some capable size that can stop a cycle in its tracks and take more ownership of the crease area. I think that's where Sekera, Benning, Davidson, and especially Russell fall down. Larsson is not bad, Gryba is good if he can get there, and Klef could be waaay more assertive. Plus, a threat from the point....Klef seems to be the only guy on the back end on the PP that doesn't just wobble wristers in. I don't think the D still missing on the back end will be available at the deadline, though.

I guess at RW, would depend on what's available. A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good, I would not mind seeing the ability to move RNH to McDavid's wing from time to time, as well as Drai. Not sure why that hasn't been tried.

I have a feeling though, that not much gets done at the deadline this year. It'll be interesting to see how the looming expansion draft affects what happens at the trade deadline.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687397 is a reply to message #687395 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687410 is a reply to message #687397 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 19:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20

K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?


For me, it becomes a need only if they intend on playing Draisaitl or Nugent Hopkins on the wing. Caggiula doesn't do it for me as the 3C. Neither does Letestu - he's a good fourth line centre. Khaira should be moving in and out of the lineup with Caggiula, Hendricks, Slepyshev.

If they intend on playing Draisaitl on the second line and Nuge on the third, it become obvious that they need at least one more right winger. If they are moving Drai or Nuge to try and cover that area of weakness... at that point I would suggest that 3C is a concern.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687414 is a reply to message #687410 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 19:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 20:29

PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20

K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?


For me, it becomes a need only if they intend on playing Draisaitl or Nugent Hopkins on the wing. Caggiula doesn't do it for me as the 3C. Neither does Letestu - he's a good fourth line centre. Khaira should be moving in and out of the lineup with Caggiula, Hendricks, Slepyshev.

If they intend on playing Draisaitl on the second line and Nuge on the third, it become obvious that they need at least one more right winger. If they are moving Drai or Nuge to try and cover that area of weakness... at that point I would suggest that 3C is a concern.


I can see that angle but I would think it is easier to find a RW than a decent 2 way, bottom 6, C that is better than all of Caggiula, Letestu and Lander at a price that doesnt open up another hole?

We have 4 or NHL caliber centerman, 5 if you count Lander. and our best ones on faceoffs are in the bottom 6 already.
Even if I move away from my point that FO % doesnt matter, There is almost no way we can improve on face offs as a team by replacing the guys we are talking about...



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687426 is a reply to message #687414 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 20:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:52

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 20:29

PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20

K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?


For me, it becomes a need only if they intend on playing Draisaitl or Nugent Hopkins on the wing. Caggiula doesn't do it for me as the 3C. Neither does Letestu - he's a good fourth line centre. Khaira should be moving in and out of the lineup with Caggiula, Hendricks, Slepyshev.

If they intend on playing Draisaitl on the second line and Nuge on the third, it become obvious that they need at least one more right winger. If they are moving Drai or Nuge to try and cover that area of weakness... at that point I would suggest that 3C is a concern.


I can see that angle but I would think it is easier to find a RW than a decent 2 way, bottom 6, C that is better than all of Caggiula, Letestu and Lander at a price that doesnt open up another hole?

We have 4 or NHL caliber centerman, 5 if you count Lander. and our best ones on faceoffs are in the bottom 6 already.
Even if I move away from my point that FO % doesnt matter, There is almost no way we can improve on face offs as a team by replacing the guys we are talking about...



Yeah, I agree with you. I actually think there are more available RWers hitting the market this year than any other position too. The cost should be less; the payoff should be more.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687431 is a reply to message #687414 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 21:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:52

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 20:29

PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20

K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?


For me, it becomes a need only if they intend on playing Draisaitl or Nugent Hopkins on the wing. Caggiula doesn't do it for me as the 3C. Neither does Letestu - he's a good fourth line centre. Khaira should be moving in and out of the lineup with Caggiula, Hendricks, Slepyshev.

If they intend on playing Draisaitl on the second line and Nuge on the third, it become obvious that they need at least one more right winger. If they are moving Drai or Nuge to try and cover that area of weakness... at that point I would suggest that 3C is a concern.


I can see that angle but I would think it is easier to find a RW than a decent 2 way, bottom 6, C that is better than all of Caggiula, Letestu and Lander at a price that doesnt open up another hole?

We have 4 or NHL caliber centerman, 5 if you count Lander. and our best ones on faceoffs are in the bottom 6 already.
Even if I move away from my point that FO % doesnt matter, There is almost no way we can improve on face offs as a team by replacing the guys we are talking about...



Well its one or the other. If they want Drai and Nuge strictly at center, then they're light on wing. If the want one of the 2 on wing, then you have a hole at center. Do they have a 3rd line center if one of their centers is playing wing? I don't think so.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687430 is a reply to message #687397 ]
Wed, 22 February 2017 21:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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PlusOne wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 18:20

K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 22 February 2017 19:03



A bottom 6 center good on draws would be good,




I have asked this question, in some shape or form, of every person that identifies the bottom 6 center who is good on draws as a need.

Why is that a need? Of all the places we could look for an improvement why do you identify that as one that should be on the Oilers wish list?


I think I answered that in my comment, but why wouldn't it be a need if they want Drai or RNH in a wing role, and I think RNH might be eventually destined for wing....then they're short a decent center, no?



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687437 is a reply to message #687430 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 11:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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It boggles the mind how there is a segment of people who think faceoffs aren't important. In the era of hockey where it's all about possession and moving the puck. When you lose the faceoff, you lose possession. So you are in chase mode. If you are in your zone and you lose the draw, there is a good chance the other team gets a scoring chance. At the very least the line on the ice spends the majority of their shift trying to get the puck back.

On the pp when you win the draw you have the puck and there is a good chance you control the puck In the offensive zone for a long stretch of time given you have the extra man. As soon as you lose the draw you basically lose at least 15-20 seconds due to the other team shooting it out and th offensive team has to get it and bring it back.

Being poor at faceoffs is why I believe Nuge has been struggling for years now. He's 6 yrs in and he still sucks at faceoffs. Nuge plays tough minutes but when he is doing that since he can't win a draw he is constantly chasing the puck. Pretty tough to score when you constantly have to try to go and get the puck every shift.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687458 is a reply to message #687437 ]
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 12:02

It boggles the mind how there is a segment of people who think faceoffs aren't important. In the era of hockey where it's all about possession and moving the puck. When you lose the faceoff, you lose possession. So you are in chase mode. If you are in your zone and you lose the draw, there is a good chance the other team gets a scoring chance. At the very least the line on the ice spends the majority of their shift trying to get the puck back.

On the pp when you win the draw you have the puck and there is a good chance you control the puck In the offensive zone for a long stretch of time given you have the extra man. As soon as you lose the draw you basically lose at least 15-20 seconds due to the other team shooting it out and th offensive team has to get it and bring it back.

Being poor at faceoffs is why I believe Nuge has been struggling for years now. He's 6 yrs in and he still sucks at faceoffs. Nuge plays tough minutes but when he is doing that since he can't win a draw he is constantly chasing the puck. Pretty tough to score when you constantly have to try to go and get the puck every shift.


Although you didnt mention me specifically I have been quote vocal about how focusing on FO percentage is not that important I will address your post.

Some of your points about where face offs are important are valid. For those of us that dont see finding a good face off guy as a priority here is a point form version of our side of things;
When it comes to the NHL as a whole
- in 5 on 5 hockey there is almost zero correlation between FO% and scoring chances
- there is no correlation between team FO% and winning percentage

As it pertains to the Oilers;
-As I mentioned your points about special teams are valid. The Oilers have those guys that can win them.
- They cant replace the bad faceoff players with a player that is an equal or better hockey player AND better at faceoffs.
- their best players are bad at faceoffs and vice versa. How would you fix the problem?

Because you mention RNH;
- I actually dont think he is as terrible as some people seem to think he is overall. Someone else mentioned it somewhere but Oiler fans paint a player with one brush. Maroon and RNH are perfect examples of this. Maroon is cheap, acquired for nothing and has 30 points playing a lot iwth McDavid. RNH was a first overall, has a big contract and has 30 points playing on whatever line and with whatever linemates are left over. Maroon is a hero and RNH should be traded for a fourth line face off specialist.
But this is about FO's. IMO losing faceoffs has VERY little to do with RNH's issues. He has possession of the puck a lot, he just seems to be making worse decisions with it as he gets older instead of better. He also is playing much higher given his defensive responsibilities this year.

As far as your opening line about it boggling your mind. That is almost the exact same wording that the panel on TSN used when they were discussing the deadline and how they couldnt figure out why teams were still paying top trade dollar for bottom 6 faceoff specialists.
I havent heard a single person who gets paid for their hockey opinions claim that faceoff % means anything at all in years.
It is about as relevant as plus minues.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687442 is a reply to message #687430 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 13:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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There must be a reason why Nuge has never spent time on the wing. It can't because of his face off prowess. He hasn't exactly been a selke candidate lately so it can't be because of his exceptional defensive play. The only thing I can think of is he's a left shot and we're loaded on the LW. Leon has the slick backhand, not mention size that perhaps outweighs the fat that he's a left shot. Still, why not stick Nuge on the wing next to Leon, or McDavid for a couple games. What's the worst that will happen? He doesn't light it up? Gotta find a way to get this kid going or we'll end up with another Sam Gagner.


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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687444 is a reply to message #687442 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 14:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mazankowski  is currently offline mazankowski
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Registered: June 2006
Location: Kelowna BC

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I don't know how far fetched this is, but TSN reported this:

http://www.tsn.ca/hurricanes-depth-on-defence-drawing-intere st-1.673683

I don't see the Ducks ever helping us in a trade. But the important note is that the Canes have a wealth of young defencemen and would be willing to move one if they were to receive help up front. Looking at them down the middle, they have Rask, Teravainen, and Staal. However, right wing is thin with Lindholm being their best option.

Could an Eberle plus for Faulk be an option? It's difficult with Eberle going into the final two years of his deal while Faulk has 3 more years, but the price point on the cap is similar, and perhaps you include a conditional first rounder if Eberle doesn't sign back with the Canes?

A deal such as this is likely a draft day type deal, but would solidify our top 4 D and with Pool Party likely ready next season, it may make Eberle even more dispensable.

To Car: Eberle, Oesterle/Simpson/ Musil, a Conditional 2019/20/21 1st Rounder

To Edm: Faulk



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687445 is a reply to message #687444 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 15:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
Messages: 3499
Registered: October 2005
Location: Edmonton

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mazankowski wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:40

I don't know how far fetched this is, but TSN reported this:

http://www.tsn.ca/hurricanes-depth-on-defence-drawing-intere st-1.673683

I don't see the Ducks ever helping us in a trade. But the important note is that the Canes have a wealth of young defencemen and would be willing to move one if they were to receive help up front. Looking at them down the middle, they have Rask, Teravainen, and Staal. However, right wing is thin with Lindholm being their best option.

Could an Eberle plus for Faulk be an option? It's difficult with Eberle going into the final two years of his deal while Faulk has 3 more years, but the price point on the cap is similar, and perhaps you include a conditional first rounder if Eberle doesn't sign back with the Canes?

A deal such as this is likely a draft day type deal, but would solidify our top 4 D and with Pool Party likely ready next season, it may make Eberle even more dispensable.

To Car: Eberle, Oesterle/Simpson/ Musil, a Conditional 2019/20/21 1st Rounder

To Edm: Faulk


I like Faulk an awful lot, and I'm not sure one or both of Eberle and Nugent Hopkins aren't moved due to cap concerns. But I can't help but feel like RW is our weakest position - by far.

Puljujarvi - to date has only proven he can't produce at the NHL-level. He's doing well in the AHL and likely starts here next year, but it's a dangerous gamble to pencil him into your Top-6.

Draisaitl - I like him at centre because there's precious few people creating offence outside of the first line besides Draisaitl.

Pitlick - a UFA, at best a third liner.

Kassian - solid fourth liner.

Slepyshev - a bit of an NHL/AHL tweener, unlikely to be more than a third liner.

Pakarinen - fourth liner, 13th forward

We've got lots of fourth line guys, but only question marks for third liners, and no clear Top-2 RWers outside of Eberle. There's likely some available this summer, but you are really really making that right side weak if you move Eberle out. Despite his rough season.

I believe the Oilers would feel less of an impact from Nugent-Hopkins being moved than from Eberl being moved.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687446 is a reply to message #687445 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 15:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mazankowski  is currently offline mazankowski
Messages: 406
Registered: June 2006
Location: Kelowna BC

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mightyreasoner wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:23

mazankowski wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:40

I don't know how far fetched this is, but TSN reported this:

http://www.tsn.ca/hurricanes-depth-on-defence-drawing-intere st-1.673683

I don't see the Ducks ever helping us in a trade. But the important note is that the Canes have a wealth of young defencemen and would be willing to move one if they were to receive help up front. Looking at them down the middle, they have Rask, Teravainen, and Staal. However, right wing is thin with Lindholm being their best option.

Could an Eberle plus for Faulk be an option? It's difficult with Eberle going into the final two years of his deal while Faulk has 3 more years, but the price point on the cap is similar, and perhaps you include a conditional first rounder if Eberle doesn't sign back with the Canes?

A deal such as this is likely a draft day type deal, but would solidify our top 4 D and with Pool Party likely ready next season, it may make Eberle even more dispensable.

To Car: Eberle, Oesterle/Simpson/ Musil, a Conditional 2019/20/21 1st Rounder

To Edm: Faulk


I like Faulk an awful lot, and I'm not sure one or both of Eberle and Nugent Hopkins aren't moved due to cap concerns. But I can't help but feel like RW is our weakest position - by far.

Puljujarvi - to date has only proven he can't produce at the NHL-level. He's doing well in the AHL and likely starts here next year, but it's a dangerous gamble to pencil him into your Top-6.

Draisaitl - I like him at centre because there's precious few people creating offence outside of the first line besides Draisaitl.

Pitlick - a UFA, at best a third liner.

Kassian - solid fourth liner.

Slepyshev - a bit of an NHL/AHL tweener, unlikely to be more than a third liner.

Pakarinen - fourth liner, 13th forward

We've got lots of fourth line guys, but only question marks for third liners, and no clear Top-2 RWers outside of Eberle. There's likely some available this summer, but you are really really making that right side weak if you move Eberle out. Despite his rough season.

I believe the Oilers would feel less of an impact from Nugent-Hopkins being moved than from Eberl being moved.



I definitely agree with you there Mighty; and I guess the hope is that you can replenish the RW through free agency or perhaps a trade. The RW on McDavid's line has been a carousel to say the least, and I think you can slot anyone there; however Leon has been the best option thus far. But I agree with your assessment that he will be better served becoming the 2nd line C at some point, but perhaps it's when we eventually deal RNH.

Giving Oshie big money and term would be a gamble but he would definitely be a better option than Eberle at the same price point if you can get him for that, while being self aware that the big pay raises will be coming for McDavid, Leon, and Maroon. Maybe a stop gap Vrbata signing makes sense?

I guess what I'm saying is that right handed D man is far more difficult (and important) to find than a top 6 RW.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687449 is a reply to message #687446 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 15:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
McDavid97  is currently offline McDavid97
Messages: 1282
Registered: July 2007

1 Cup

mazankowski wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 15:36

mightyreasoner wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:23

mazankowski wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:40

I don't know how far fetched this is, but TSN reported this:

http://www.tsn.ca/hurricanes-depth-on-defence-drawing-intere st-1.673683

I don't see the Ducks ever helping us in a trade. But the important note is that the Canes have a wealth of young defencemen and would be willing to move one if they were to receive help up front. Looking at them down the middle, they have Rask, Teravainen, and Staal. However, right wing is thin with Lindholm being their best option.

Could an Eberle plus for Faulk be an option? It's difficult with Eberle going into the final two years of his deal while Faulk has 3 more years, but the price point on the cap is similar, and perhaps you include a conditional first rounder if Eberle doesn't sign back with the Canes?

A deal such as this is likely a draft day type deal, but would solidify our top 4 D and with Pool Party likely ready next season, it may make Eberle even more dispensable.

To Car: Eberle, Oesterle/Simpson/ Musil, a Conditional 2019/20/21 1st Rounder

To Edm: Faulk


I like Faulk an awful lot, and I'm not sure one or both of Eberle and Nugent Hopkins aren't moved due to cap concerns. But I can't help but feel like RW is our weakest position - by far.

Puljujarvi - to date has only proven he can't produce at the NHL-level. He's doing well in the AHL and likely starts here next year, but it's a dangerous gamble to pencil him into your Top-6.

Draisaitl - I like him at centre because there's precious few people creating offence outside of the first line besides Draisaitl.

Pitlick - a UFA, at best a third liner.

Kassian - solid fourth liner.

Slepyshev - a bit of an NHL/AHL tweener, unlikely to be more than a third liner.

Pakarinen - fourth liner, 13th forward

We've got lots of fourth line guys, but only question marks for third liners, and no clear Top-2 RWers outside of Eberle. There's likely some available this summer, but you are really really making that right side weak if you move Eberle out. Despite his rough season.

I believe the Oilers would feel less of an impact from Nugent-Hopkins being moved than from Eberl being moved.



I definitely agree with you there Mighty; and I guess the hope is that you can replenish the RW through free agency or perhaps a trade. The RW on McDavid's line has been a carousel to say the least, and I think you can slot anyone there; however Leon has been the best option thus far. But I agree with your assessment that he will be better served becoming the 2nd line C at some point, but perhaps it's when we eventually deal RNH.

Giving Oshie big money and term would be a gamble but he would definitely be a better option than Eberle at the same price point if you can get him for that, while being self aware that the big pay raises will be coming for McDavid, Leon, and Maroon. Maybe a stop gap Vrbata signing makes sense?

I guess what I'm saying is that right handed D man is far more difficult (and important) to find than a top 6 RW.


I don't see them trading Faulk for Eberle.

Does anyone have a list of the top 10 UFA Right wings for this summer? Since cap geek is down and nhlnumbers isn't great to get that list hoping someone can find one.



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687451 is a reply to message #687449 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 16:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
MJ  is currently offline MJ
Messages: 2359
Registered: November 1997
Location: Victoria

2 Cups

McDavid97 wrote on Thu, 23 February 2017 14:59

Does anyone have a list of the top 10 UFA Right wings for this summer? Since cap geek is down and nhlnumbers isn't great to get that list hoping someone can find one.


Here's a list:
http://www.spotrac.com/nhl/free-agents/right-wing/ufa/

Slim pickings...



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 Re: Oilers Shopping List According to Matheson [message #687453 is a reply to message #687451 ]
Thu, 23 February 2017 16:24 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
McDavid97  is currently offline McDavid97
Messages: 1282
Registered: July 2007

1 Cup

Thanks MJ


Top 20 Right Wing UFA that played 1 game this year

Alexander Radulov
Jaromir Jagr
Jarome Iginla
Shane Doan
Alexandre Burrows
Brian Gionta
T.J. Oshie
Ales Hemsky
Patrik Berglund
Justin Williams
Radim Vrbata
Tommy Wingels
Jiri Hudler
Matt Hendricks
Ryan Garbutt
Chris Neil
Pierre-Alexandre Parenteau
Chris Thorburn
Patrick Eaves
Ryan White

Those RW's that are under 35 years old

Alexander Radulov
T.J. Oshie
Ales Hemsky
Patrik Berglund
Tommy Wingels
Jiri Hudler
Ryan Garbutt
Pierre-Alexandre Parenteau
Chris Thorburn
Patrick Eaves
Ryan White


So looking at that list, we look at Oshie, Berglund, maybe PAP?



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