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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712319 is a reply to message #712316 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 09:35

Kr55
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Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:32

Goose wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:23

PlusOne wrote on Wed, 21 March 2018 23:16

As I mentioned in my reply to RDOF; having a bunch of picks doesnt mean they should be expendable without a good trade. It doesn't excuse this trade if in fact Marody plans to go back to school and he will be a FA roughly 16 months from now.

The team needs every piece of tradeable ammo it has, they can't go wasting them.

I have low odds that either that third round pick or this player will ever contribute to the Oilers improving anytime in the next 5 years so in the end it isn't a big deal.

I am just tired of what I see as bad asset management.

Ya, I hear what you're saying in that he could potentially be a free agent in a little over a year, but I think the chance that the Oilers aren't able to sign him is pretty low. Justin Schultz is the last guy I can think of that didn't sign with the team that held his rights, and he had a lot more leverage than Marody does. I just don't think there's going to be a bunch of teams starting a bidding war over this kid. Especially since given the Oilers forward depth, if he continues to improve, he'll be pretty high up the Oilers depth chart by the time he finishes his NCAA career.

That's not accurate. There's guys every year who go this route. Matthew Benning was a Bruins pick who waited out his time and became a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was a Predators pick. There are only a few like Schultz and DeKeyser who get a huge amount of attention, but this is an annual occurrence. If you play out your career at university, then you can become UFA and pick your spot.

NJ just got their best offensive D, Will Butcher, this way too, a Colorado draft pick. I can't see how it wouldn't be super attractive to any remotely good college player to just go UFA. Colorado got Kerfoot too, who NJ drafted. Little dose of hope, Kerfoot's college stats look a lot like Marody's :)

[Updated on: Thu, 22 March 2018 09:40]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
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"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712320 is a reply to message #712316 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 09:37

PlusOne
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Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:32

Goose wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:23

PlusOne wrote on Wed, 21 March 2018 23:16

As I mentioned in my reply to RDOF; having a bunch of picks doesnt mean they should be expendable without a good trade. It doesn't excuse this trade if in fact Marody plans to go back to school and he will be a FA roughly 16 months from now.

The team needs every piece of tradeable ammo it has, they can't go wasting them.

I have low odds that either that third round pick or this player will ever contribute to the Oilers improving anytime in the next 5 years so in the end it isn't a big deal.

I am just tired of what I see as bad asset management.

Ya, I hear what you're saying in that he could potentially be a free agent in a little over a year, but I think the chance that the Oilers aren't able to sign him is pretty low. Justin Schultz is the last guy I can think of that didn't sign with the team that held his rights, and he had a lot more leverage than Marody does. I just don't think there's going to be a bunch of teams starting a bidding war over this kid. Especially since given the Oilers forward depth, if he continues to improve, he'll be pretty high up the Oilers depth chart by the time he finishes his NCAA career.

That's not accurate. There's guys every year who go this route. Matthew Benning was a Bruins pick who waited out his time and became a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was a Predators pick. There are only a few like Schultz and DeKeyser who get a huge amount of attention, but this is an annual occurrence. If you play out your career at university, then you can become UFA and pick your spot.

Vesey is the perfect example that I was about to comment on.
Drafted by Preds
told them he wasnt signing there
Traded to Buff for a 3rd IIRC
Signed in NY as an FA when he didnt want to sign with the Sabres as well.

As with Marody I knew nothing of Vesey before the above saga but he seems to have come out with a much better college resume than Marody.
2 time Hobey Baker finalist, lost to Eichel as a Junior, won in his senior season as one of the major ones.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712322 is a reply to message #712318 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 09:42

PlusOne
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PoolParty wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:35

The amount of circle jerking this forum does astounds me. Our GM traded away the chance to draft a player that has a 16-23% chance of playing 100 games for the Oilers. In return he got a Hobey Baker Finalist which happens to have a 25% (since 2000) chance of playing 100+ games in the NHL. Seems like decent asset management to me.

Seems like the lot of people here think a 3rd round pick is gonna get you a 1D or 1st line winger when you add it to a package of garbage. SMH.

More hyperbole.

All "circle jerking" aside. I think the lengthy discussions on moves such as this are a bi-product of the tire fire of a season that we are almost done with.

My end opinion of this trade is a shoulder shrug but that is more based on my confidence right now than anything.
I have no faith that the team would use that third round pick as a swing in a trade or to draft a decent prospect.
I also have little faith that that the Oilers can sign, develop and have a useful player in Marody.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712324 is a reply to message #712316 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 09:54

Goose
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Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 08:32

That's not accurate. There's guys every year who go this route. Matthew Benning was a Bruins pick who waited out his time and became a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was a Predators pick. There are only a few like Schultz and DeKeyser who get a huge amount of attention, but this is an annual occurrence. If you play out your career at university, then you can become UFA and pick your spot.

I stand corrected. I don't have numbers in front of me, but I'd be willing to bet that the vast majority of NCAA players end up signing with the team that drafted them (or owns their rights). There's a risk for sure, especially if Marody has another season where he improves next year. But that's balanced against the fact that they get a guy that's showing good signs, and is 3 years older (and hopefully further along), than anyone they draft in the 3rd round.

I don't hate this move, but I completely agree with ziltoid's point that my preference would have been to use the pick as part of a package to get someone that's actually NHL ready at the draft (and not Griffin Reinhart 'ready').

Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
18/19: 232 GF / 274 GA (-42)
19/20 (82 game pace): 257 GF / 254 GA (+3) in 64 games
2021 (82 game pace):269 GF / 235 GA (+34) after 38 games

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712327 is a reply to message #712317 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 10:27

RDOilerfan
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PlusOne wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:34

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 08:35

Look I get you dislike the management but do you seriously think they make the trade without knowing they can sign him?

Honestly yes, yes I do think they would do that.
I am not saying they don't have a chance to sign him but I doubt they know it as a fact.

When anyone here doesnt like a move you instantly make an accusation that we are anti management regardless of the move. Then you try to cast as much sunshine as you can onto whatever deal or move has been made. You seem to be projecting some anger towards anyone who comments on a move by management as if I am calling for a fire bombing of the head office.

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 08:35

I don't for a second think this organization is doing these things just to piss the fans off because they think it's funny. I don't think they are closing their eyes and throwing a dart at the board and say "Let's try him'.

I didn't say that at all. I dont think PC is making moves out of spite or to leave the team in as bad as a place as possible as some middle finger.

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 08:35

Thanks to past management and thinking that guys like Moroz, Musil and a list of others could play, the Oilers have diddly squat in the system right now that are even decent AHLers let alone guys looking to push for NHL spots. Slowly they are building that and it looks like they have some dmen coming but at forward, they have NOTHING. That is why in my opinion they go out and sign these AHlers like Callahan, Malone, Ferlin, Downing who are decent AHLers because they need someone to play on their AHL team and they need someone who in an emergency they can call up. Other than Malone, who else can the Oilers call up to play forward? I'd say no one and Malone is a 13th NHL forward at best. I think based on the last couple of drafts, some talent will be turning pro at forward next year and the year after and hopefully a few of them will develop into players in a few years who will be viable call up options. So when they sign Marody (I believe they will) they will have a 21-22 yr old guy who apparently has some skill and based on the scouting reports has a chance to be a decent bottom 6 guy in the NHL. Whether that happens, we shall see but given his age, he should be closer to being that vs a guy they draft next year who's 4 yrs away. So maybe in the near future, instead of calling up a 28 yr old 13th forward in Malone, they can call up this guy to fill a role. Regardless, trading a 3rd round pick on a potential close to making it guy when you have 3 picks in the same round, isn't going to kill them. This team needs to improve NOW not 5 years from now.

I honestly do hope you are 100% right and I do think that is what PC is hoping for too. I have admitted I am a bit jaded and lacking anymore hope that one of his deals pan out given very few have.

One question for you. If the above is likely, if he is pretty likely so sign, has been improving and likely ready to step in to any kind of NHL role sooner than later why would the Flyers give him up for a 3rd?

To respond to you saying I throw as much sunshine on everything. I have lost count how many times I have said that I get why people are upset with how things have gone. IT has sucked and I am pissed off too. I get that you have very little faith in the management right now. They don't deserve your faith. It might shock you but I am skeptical about the moves they make given their current track record. But I don't live my life where if someone makes a mistake, I write them off forever as being keeping useless. So when they make a move, I like to see what happens first rather than jump right too the conclusion it sucks. I can't see into the future so I don't know that. I won't go into detail on my reasons why I don't automatically think it is a bad move. I have done that to death. All I will say is they had 3 -3rd rounders so giving up 1 3rd round pick for the potential of a guy actually stepping into their system next year I don't deem as being a terrible thing. I am not ready to completely applaud the move but I am at least prepared to wait and see before I grab another pitch fork. What I find frustrating is because I actually like to see moves play out first before I decide they suck or not, I am deemed a Chia lover.

When it comes to the Flyers giving up on him. I have no clue. They drafted him in 2015, maybe the guys that wanted him are gone now. Maybe it was a shift in organization philosophy. Maybe the coach doesn't see a fit. Maybe they have too much of similar players. According to this link. https://www.prosportstransactions.com/hockey/DraftTrades/Fut ure/Flyers.htm
If the Flyers resign Mrazek, they have to give up their 3rd rounder in 2019 to the Wings. That would mean they don't have a 3rd rounder so they wanted one and this was the cost to get one. It's been said, teams value draft picks so maybe the amount of teams willing to give on up for him was limited. Given who they have in goal before Mrazek, there is a chance they do it. Maybe the player has looked at the team and told them he won't sign with them for whatever reason.

[Updated on: Thu, 22 March 2018 10:32]

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712328 is a reply to message #712327 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 10:33

PlusOne
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 10:27

When it comes to the Flyers giving up on him. I have no clue. They drafted him in 2015, maybe the guys that wanted him are gone now. Maybe it was a shift in organization philosophy. Maybe the coach doesn't see a fit. Maybe they have too much of similar players. According to this link. https://www.prosportstransactions.com/hockey/DraftTrades/Fut ure/Flyers.htm
If the Flyers resign Mrazek, they have to give up their 3rd rounder in 2019 to the Wings. That would mean they don't have a 3rd rounder. Given who they have in goal before Mrazek, there is a chance they do it. Maybe the player has looked at the team and told them he won't sign with them for whatever reason.

I took out the rest of your quote as you this convo is quickly slipping back into the BS that I am sure annoys most around here so I will move on from that.

To the above. Valid points on the Flyers reasons for moving him.
I hope this works out and Marody contributes to the team sooner than later.

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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712330 is a reply to message #712327 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 10:36

CrudeRemarks
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For me the concern is at the end of last season you had a 27 goal scorer on a favourable contract in Maroon. And instead of trading him last offseason, when his value was the highest it probably will ever be, Chiarelli held on to him, made the disastrous Eberle deal, and then only got the 3rd round pick at the deadline. Now that pick is a college player who may become a free agent and go somewhere else. Maroon trade is constantly listed as one of the Chiarelli wins. if the end result is nobody instead of a 27 goal scorer that's bad asset management.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712336 is a reply to message #712330 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 11:13

RDOilerfan
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 10:36

For me the concern is at the end of last season you had a 27 goal scorer on a favourable contract in Maroon. And instead of trading him last offseason, when his value was the highest it probably will ever be, Chiarelli held on to him, made the disastrous Eberle deal, and then only got the 3rd round pick at the deadline. Now that pick is a college player who may become a free agent and go somewhere else. Maroon trade is constantly listed as one of the Chiarelli wins. if the end result is nobody instead of a 27 goal scorer that's bad asset management.

In fairness, which NHL team EVER trades a guy coming off a a good season? If they did, fans would go completely bonkers.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712337 is a reply to message #712336 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 11:19

CrudeRemarks
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Our team clearly isn't concerned about fans objecting to trades. The idea that you never ever sell high on a player sounds like bad business to me. But I do agree that Chiarelli doesn't.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712340 is a reply to message #712337 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 11:30

RDOilerfan
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:19

Our team clearly isn't concerned about fans objecting to trades. The idea that you never ever sell high on a player sounds like bad business to me. But I do agree that Chiarelli doesn't.

That isn't the point. If a player is having a great season, no team is going to dump him. That just isn't the Oilers, that's all teams. The Flames are going to miss the playoffs, there is clearly something wrong with the mix. Other than Gaudreau and Monahan, maybe Tkachuk, there isn't a ton of scoring depth. Gaudreau is going to score close to 90 pts this year. So is value will be sky high. So if the Flames don't trade him, does that make the GM stupid?

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712341 is a reply to message #712340 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 11:57

ziltoid
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:30

CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:19

Our team clearly isn't concerned about fans objecting to trades. The idea that you never ever sell high on a player sounds like bad business to me. But I do agree that Chiarelli doesn't.

That isn't the point. If a player is having a great season, no team is going to dump him. That just isn't the Oilers, that's all teams. The Flames are going to miss the playoffs, there is clearly something wrong with the mix. Other than Gaudreau and Monahan, maybe Tkachuk, there isn't a ton of scoring depth. Gaudreau is going to score close to 90 pts this year. So is value will be sky high. So if the Flames don't trade him, does that make the GM stupid?

Gaudreau isn't 1 year away for being UFA on a team that just signed 12.5MM and 8.5MM deals with with 2 more promising players coming off ELCs next year. Maroon was always going to get moved this year (unless he signed a sweetheart deal in the offseason, which he didn't), so why hang on to him and risk his value declining when you can move him when his value is at an all-time high?

Most often teams won't move a player after a good season, but there are absolutely circumstances when it is appropriate to do so, and although I don't have time to comb through trade histories, I am sure it has, and will continue to, happen.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712342 is a reply to message #712340 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:03

CrudeRemarks
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Sorry are you saying that teams never trade good players? PK Subban, Taylor Hall, Seth Jones, Ryan Johansen, Filip Forsberg, Ryan O'Reilly. All those guys weren't good players anymore when they were traded?

Teams trade a good player if they have a surplus at that position to address an area of weakness.

Specific to your Calgary situation, no the Flames shouldn't trade anyone and should continue to just miss the playoffs because it's the only thing that brings me joy anymore.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712343 is a reply to message #712340 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:17

Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:30

CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:19

Our team clearly isn't concerned about fans objecting to trades. The idea that you never ever sell high on a player sounds like bad business to me. But I do agree that Chiarelli doesn't.

That isn't the point. If a player is having a great season, no team is going to dump him. That just isn't the Oilers, that's all teams. The Flames are going to miss the playoffs, there is clearly something wrong with the mix. Other than Gaudreau and Monahan, maybe Tkachuk, there isn't a ton of scoring depth. Gaudreau is going to score close to 90 pts this year. So is value will be sky high. So if the Flames don't trade him, does that make the GM stupid?

There are lots of times when guys having great seasons are dealt. Tampa Bay got Ben Bishop for Cory Conacher when Conacher was scorching hot. The Hossa/Heatley deal came with both players doing well. There are LOTS of examples out there if you care to look. GMs should not be concerned about the fan reactions when making trades. They should make trades that improve their team - and selling when a guy is peaking is one way to do that...especially if you think other people overvalue him given a hot season.

Your argument of Gaudreau isn't relevant here. You shouldn't trade ALL your players who've had a good year. You should assess your needs and what you have and what other people are willing to pay for what you have. At the point where they're paying more than what you think they should, then you consider a deal - although it still can't be done in a bubble. You have to examine what you have and what you need and how it will impact your team. No one ever said the job of a GM was easy.

If you want a good example of this, look at Sam Gagner. His second last season was the lockout-shortened year. He was almost a point a game player and MacTavish talked about him as part of the core (even though he was heading in to an arbitration case). The Oilers were chock full of smaller, young forwards, and Gagner almost certainly had real value after his year under Krueger.

The Oilers inked him to a deal and avoided arbitration, promising the player in the media that he wouldn't be traded ahead of his NMC kicking in.

Then he had a terrible season. His face was destroyed by Kassian in training camp, he rushed back from injury, he had Dallas Eakins as his soul-destroying coach and he slumped to his worst ever season.

The Oilers THEN traded him to Tampa Bay for a guy who was going to get bought out anyhow in Teddy Purcell.

While I realize we have the benefit of hindsight now, when SHOULD have the Oilers traded Sam Gagner? (For the record, I was advocating trading him after that lockout season).

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712344 is a reply to message #712342 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:18

RDOilerfan
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 12:03

Sorry are you saying that teams never trade good players? PK Subban, Taylor Hall, Seth Jones, Ryan Johansen, Filip Forsberg, Ryan O'Reilly. All those guys weren't good players anymore when they were traded?

Teams trade a good player if they have a surplus at that position to address an area of weakness.

Specific to your Calgary situation, no the Flames shouldn't trade anyone and should continue to just miss the playoffs because it's the only thing that brings me joy anymore.

No, I am saying that teams NEVER trade guys at their peak.

Subban was having an OK year for Montreal but he wasn't as good as he was before he signed his big deal. There were all kinds of rumors that he was a problem in the room, they needed a culture change and he was the odd man out. If Subban was lighting it up the season he was traded and deemed as a core guy, not a chance in hell he would have been traded.

Johansen was having a down year in Columbus the year he was traded. From early on when they drafted him, they had issues with him and issues signing contracts with him. The organization and player didn't get along. Columbus needed a Dman. Jones was a young dman, he was no better than 3rd on their depth chart, probably 4th because they had Josi, Weber, Ellie, Ekholm all on their team.

Filip Forsberg was not even in the NHL, I don't even think he was in North America yet.. All he was, was a prospect at the time and Washington traded him for Erat to load up for a playoff run.

O'Reilly was another guy that had problems with the organization early on with signing contracts. He was up for a new deal. They didn't want to pay him as much as he wanted, so they dumped him for a boat load of players, picks and prospects, most of which did not work out.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712345 is a reply to message #712344 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:22

CrudeRemarks
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 12:18

CrudeRemarks wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 12:03

Sorry are you saying that teams never trade good players? PK Subban, Taylor Hall, Seth Jones, Ryan Johansen, Filip Forsberg, Ryan O'Reilly. All those guys weren't good players anymore when they were traded?

Teams trade a good player if they have a surplus at that position to address an area of weakness.

Specific to your Calgary situation, no the Flames shouldn't trade anyone and should continue to just miss the playoffs because it's the only thing that brings me joy anymore.

No, I am saying that teams NEVER trade guys at their peak.

Subban was having an OK year for Montreal but he wasn't as good as he was before he signed his big deal. There were all kinds of rumors that he was a problem in the room, they needed a culture change and he was the odd man out. If Subban was lighting it up the season he was traded and deemed as a core guy, not a chance in hell he would have been traded.

Johansen was having a down year in Columbus the year he was traded. From early on when they drafted him, they had issues with him and issues signing contracts with him. The organization and player didn't get along. Columbus needed a Dman. Jones was a young dman, he was no better than 3rd on their depth chart, probably 4th because they had Josi, Weber, Ellie, Ekholm all on their team.

Filip Forsberg was not even in the NHL, I don't even think he was in North America yet.. All he was, was a prospect at the time and Washington traded him for Erat to load up for a playoff run.

O'Reilly was another guy that had problems with the organization early on with signing contracts. He was up for a new deal. They didn't want to pay him as much as he wanted, so they dumped him for a boat load of players, picks and prospects, most of which did not work out.

Got it... Problem in the room, okay year, culture change, contract issues, too deep, only a top prospect. Well I guess maroon only fits the contract issues one. and maybe the "too deep" one if we understand Chiarelli's view of the team after the playoffs. Nevermind this is the best possible return. Hope he signs here.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712346 is a reply to message #712324 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:23

Adam
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Goose wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 09:54

Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 08:32

That's not accurate. There's guys every year who go this route. Matthew Benning was a Bruins pick who waited out his time and became a free agent. Jimmy Vesey was a Predators pick. There are only a few like Schultz and DeKeyser who get a huge amount of attention, but this is an annual occurrence. If you play out your career at university, then you can become UFA and pick your spot.

I stand corrected. I don't have numbers in front of me, but I'd be willing to bet that the vast majority of NCAA players end up signing with the team that drafted them (or owns their rights). There's a risk for sure, especially if Marody has another season where he improves next year. But that's balanced against the fact that they get a guy that's showing good signs, and is 3 years older (and hopefully further along), than anyone they draft in the 3rd round.

I don't hate this move, but I completely agree with ziltoid's point that my preference would have been to use the pick as part of a package to get someone that's actually NHL ready at the draft (and not Griffin Reinhart 'ready').

My concern is that typically, teams don't trade good prospects for picks at the point where they should be signing their first pro contract unless they have a sense that the player isn't going to sign with them. For some reason, the Flyers are willing to move a Hobey Baker finalist for a lottery ticket. I'd suggest that signals an impasse on that end and they've decided they're better off trading the pick than hoping they can talk him in to a contract.

Now, it could be like Riley Nash, where he didn't want to sign with Edmonton, but did with Carolina who we dealt his rights too...or he could be like Vesey, who didn't care that he got traded and still waited to call his own shot.

I think a lot depends on whether the player is going pro or not. If he's playing out next year in the NCAA, this is a huge risk to me. It means we'll have a short opportunity next spring to get him inked or he goes UFA. If he wants to be pro this year and start making money, then maybe he will like our depth chart better than Philly's and it's all good. we will see....

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712347 is a reply to message #712343 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:30

CrudeRemarks
Messages: 1698
Registered: November 2010
Location: Edmonton

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If you go back and look, i think you'll find that Heatley, Bishop, Conacher etc were all cancers in the dressing room and having contract issues. You only trade players at their lowest value. how else do you get a good shot at a lottery pick?

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712348 is a reply to message #712346 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:34

Goose
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Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:23

My concern is that typically, teams don't trade good prospects for picks at the point where they should be signing their first pro contract unless they have a sense that the player isn't going to sign with them. For some reason, the Flyers are willing to move a Hobey Baker finalist for a lottery ticket. I'd suggest that signals an impasse on that end and they've decided they're better off trading the pick than hoping they can talk him in to a contract.

Technically, he's a Hobey Baker nominee, but there's like 75 of them. He didn't make the top 10 -Finalist cut. icon_wink

icon_wink

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712349 is a reply to message #712327 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 12:46

Oscargasm
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 10:27

I am deemed a Chia lover.

I assume you mean chia seeds? Do you find yourself feeling bloated, or has it aided in digestion and improved bowel movements?

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712350 is a reply to message #712348 ]	Thu, 22 March 2018 13:01

CrusaderPi
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Goose wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 12:34

Adam wrote on Thu, 22 March 2018 11:23

My concern is that typically, teams don't trade good prospects for picks at the point where they should be signing their first pro contract unless they have a sense that the player isn't going to sign with them. For some reason, the Flyers are willing to move a Hobey Baker finalist for a lottery ticket. I'd suggest that signals an impasse on that end and they've decided they're better off trading the pick than hoping they can talk him in to a contract.

Technically, he's a Hobey Baker nominee, but there's like 75 of them. He didn't make the top 10 -Finalist cut. icon_wink

icon_wink

Holy crap, there are like 75 nominees. How does that work? Does every team get to nominate an entire line?

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712548 is a reply to message #712247 ]	Tue, 27 March 2018 01:25

NetBOG
Messages: 2894
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Ok, I'm trying to figure this out.

In this article in the Edmonton Sun, Jim Matheson says that Marody could just quit school right now, the Oilers would then have a 30 day window to sign him but if that window lapses, he would become UFA.

http://edmontonsun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers/coo per-marody-ahead-of-other-edmonton-oilers-prospects

I would tend to believe Jim, he's been doing this forever and he's in the HHOF, however, I don't think he's right on this one.

He seems to believe that just because Marody played in the USHL, he can leave early, but I think that rule only applies to player who plays their first college eligible year outside of college.

I believe this is the rule applies to Marody.

Article 8.6 (c)
(iii) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive rights of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class.

Which means the Oilers would still retain his rights until next summer.

Again, I'm just a shmuck who thinks he can read legalese, so I might be wrong.

Matheson also states that Keith Gretzky was the one scouting Marody. He also states the Oilers pretty much wouldn't have done this trade without a virtual guarantee of being able to sign him.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712562 is a reply to message #712548 ]	Tue, 27 March 2018 08:22

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

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NetBOG wrote on Tue, 27 March 2018 01:25

Ok, I'm trying to figure this out.

In this article in the Edmonton Sun, Jim Matheson says that Marody could just quit school right now, the Oilers would then have a 30 day window to sign him but if that window lapses, he would become UFA.

http://edmontonsun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers/coo per-marody-ahead-of-other-edmonton-oilers-prospects

I would tend to believe Jim, he's been doing this forever and he's in the HHOF, however, I don't think he's right on this one.

He seems to believe that just because Marody played in the USHL, he can leave early, but I think that rule only applies to player who plays their first college eligible year outside of college.

I believe this is the rule applies to Marody.

Article 8.6 (c)
(iii) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive rights of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class.

Which means the Oilers would still retain his rights until next summer.

Again, I'm just a shmuck who thinks he can read legalese, so I might be wrong.

Matheson also states that Keith Gretzky was the one scouting Marody. He also states the Oilers pretty much wouldn't have done this trade without a virtual guarantee of being able to sign him.

I have said it a few times. I know the Oilers management have made some mistakes but I don't see a scenario where they would trade for this guy if they didn't have a really good idea they could sign him. I would expect that once this kid is done in the College playoffs, he will be signed.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712581 is a reply to message #712548 ]	Tue, 27 March 2018 10:09

Kr55
Messages: 9830
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

NetBOG wrote on Tue, 27 March 2018 01:25

Ok, I'm trying to figure this out.

In this article in the Edmonton Sun, Jim Matheson says that Marody could just quit school right now, the Oilers would then have a 30 day window to sign him but if that window lapses, he would become UFA.

http://edmontonsun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers/coo per-marody-ahead-of-other-edmonton-oilers-prospects

I would tend to believe Jim, he's been doing this forever and he's in the HHOF, however, I don't think he's right on this one.

He seems to believe that just because Marody played in the USHL, he can leave early, but I think that rule only applies to player who plays their first college eligible year outside of college.

I believe this is the rule applies to Marody.

Article 8.6 (c)
(iii) If a Player drafted at age 18 or 19, who had received a Bona Fide Offer in accordance with Section 8.6(a)(ii) above, becomes a bona fide college student prior to the second June 1 following his selection in the Entry Draft and remains a bona fide college student through the graduation of his college class, his drafting Club shall retain the exclusive rights of negotiation for his services through and including the August 15 following the graduation of his college class.

Which means the Oilers would still retain his rights until next summer.

Again, I'm just a shmuck who thinks he can read legalese, so I might be wrong.

Matheson also states that Keith Gretzky was the one scouting Marody. He also states the Oilers pretty much wouldn't have done this trade without a virtual guarantee of being able to sign him.

edit: misread your point.

Does seem we keep his rights no matter what. But, since we love using contract spots, this kid is probably on an ELC very soon.

[Updated on: Tue, 27 March 2018 10:12]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #712583 is a reply to message #712581 ]	Tue, 27 March 2018 10:14

Goose
Messages: 1098
Registered: October 2006
Location: Vancouver

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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 27 March 2018 09:09

Pretty sure you're right. The rights stay if he stays in school. But, kid seems to be at least nipping at Spencer Foo level, so he probably knows he can get an NHL deal and doesn't need any more of that dumb education stuff.

Ya, that's kind of the key. If he thinks he could crack the NHL lineup (and given the Oilers forward depth, nothing is impossible), then he likely comes out a year early. If not, he goes back for his senior year.

My guess is that even on the Oilers, he's not going to be guaranteed a spot on the roster, so he goes back to school for a year. I'd be pretty surprised if the Oilers offered him a one-way deal, so then he's got to balance the risk of leaving school a year early to make $50k in Bakersfield.

Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713096 is a reply to message #712247 ]	Fri, 06 April 2018 01:37

NetBOG
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Eliminated from the Frozen Four tonight. 5 points in 3 games in the actual tournament (3 in the opening game, 1 each in the others).

I'm wondering if he isn't signed by the Oilers tomorrow and given a spot in the lineup Saturday. That is traditionally what happens with non-playoff teams that sign players who don't graduate. Just a little taste and a reward for choosing the team over staying in school.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713103 is a reply to message #712247 ]	Fri, 06 April 2018 11:19

Skookum Jim
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Recent interview with Marody before Frozen 4.. ...
https://www.livingstondaily.com/story/sports/2018/04/03/coop er-marody-michigan-wolverines-hockey/468002002/

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713166 is a reply to message #713103 ]	Sun, 08 April 2018 09:16

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

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According to what is posted in this article on Lowtides site, Marody is expected to sign with the Oilers soon.
http://lowetide.ca/2018/04/08/peace-frog/

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713169 is a reply to message #713166 ]	Sun, 08 April 2018 11:26

MJ
Messages: 248
Registered: November 1997
Location: Victoria

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RDOilerfan wrote on Sun, 08 April 2018 08:16

According to what is posted in this article on Lowtides site, Marody is expected to sign with the Oilers soon.
http://lowetide.ca/2018/04/08/peace-frog/

Didn't see an article online yet, but my Facebook feed says he's now signed:

Edmonton Oilers
20 mins ·
The #Oilers have signed Cooper Marody to a three-year entry-level contract. The 21-year-old forward, whose rights were acquired from the Philadelphia Flyers on March 21, led Michigan Hockey with 51 points (16 goals, 35 assists) in 40 games this season.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713173 is a reply to message #713169 ]	Sun, 08 April 2018 11:55

Oscargasm
Messages: 5742
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MJ wrote on Sun, 08 April 2018 11:26

RDOilerfan wrote on Sun, 08 April 2018 08:16

According to what is posted in this article on Lowtides site, Marody is expected to sign with the Oilers soon.
http://lowetide.ca/2018/04/08/peace-frog/

Didn't see an article online yet, but my Facebook feed says he's now signed:

Edmonton Oilers
20 mins ·
The #Oilers have signed Cooper Marody to a three-year entry-level contract. The 21-year-old forward, whose rights were acquired from the Philadelphia Flyers on March 21, led Michigan Hockey with 51 points (16 goals, 35 assists) in 40 games this season.

Should be good for depth, hopefully performs well in Bakersfield.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713174 is a reply to message #713173 ]	Sun, 08 April 2018 12:00

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

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https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/release-oilers-sign-marody-t o-entry-level-contract/c-297808480?tid=281885062

Official release from the Oilers. It didn't say if he was going to Bakersfield but I would guess he will. The Oilers don't have a lot of young forwards in the system. Hopefully he can develop into something. With a few of these college signings and some of their draft picks turning pro. Hopefully their will be a change in the AHL philosophy of playing young guys vs older AHL vets.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713189 is a reply to message #713174 ]	Sun, 08 April 2018 23:41

PlusOne
Messages: 1532
Registered: July 2006
Location: Regina, Sask

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RDOilerfan wrote on Sun, 08 April 2018 12:00

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/release-oilers-sign-marody-t o-entry-level-contract/c-297808480?tid=281885062

Official release from the Oilers. It didn't say if he was going to Bakersfield but I would guess he will. The Oilers don't have a lot of young forwards in the system. Hopefully he can develop into something. With a few of these college signings and some of their draft picks turning pro. Hopefully their will be a change in the AHL philosophy of playing young guys vs older AHL vets.

Good news. I was a little worried after reading the interview Skookum posted. Specifically this quote;

“It would be amazing, especially with me growing up and idolizing Michigan and wanting to be here so bad,” Marody said. “It would be something I’ve always dreamed about, never really knowing if I could accomplish it as a young kid. It’s something I’ve worked for my whole life. You’re going to see a really inspired Cooper Marody at the Frozen Four.”

I didnt realize his connection to the team. I was concerned he would have an unfinished business type reason to go back for another year.

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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

und(i)sputed O.L.F.N Heavybra(i)n Champ(i)on of the Woooooooooooooooooorld. Plus. One.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713195 is a reply to message #713189 ]	Mon, 09 April 2018 11:45

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

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I said it when the trade was made. In my opinion, I didn't see the Oilers making the trade unless they had an extremely good indication he would sign with them once he physically could. Michigan lost out of the frozen 4 Thursday night and the Oilers are announcing the signing Sunday Morning.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713198 is a reply to message #713195 ]	Mon, 09 April 2018 13:00

RDOilerfan
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Just heard on Oilersnow, that Marody is going down to Bakersfield. Here is the official release from the Oilers.

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/blog-marody-assigned-to-bake rsfield/c-297831898?tid=281885062

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713203 is a reply to message #713198 ]	Mon, 09 April 2018 15:13

Oscargasm
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RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 09 April 2018 13:00

Just heard on Oilersnow, that Marody is going down to Bakersfield. Here is the official release from the Oilers.

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/blog-marody-assigned-to-bake rsfield/c-297831898?tid=281885062

Cool beans, he’ll get a few games in this season

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713206 is a reply to message #713203 ]	Mon, 09 April 2018 16:03

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

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With Marody who's supposed to be an fast offensive guy. Benson turning pro who's an offensive guy.
Hebig is was a big time junior scorer. IN theory, there should be some offensive talent starting next year in Bakersfield. Those offensive guys need to translate the offensive ability to the pros but hopefully the AHL team will be able count on Oilers prospects making up the team rather than AHL vets.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713209 is a reply to message #713206 ]	Mon, 09 April 2018 19:12

mightyreasoner
Messages: 508
Registered: October 2005
Location: Edmonton

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RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 09 April 2018 16:03

With Marody who's supposed to be an fast offensive guy. Benson turning pro who's an offensive guy.
Hebig is was a big time junior scorer. IN theory, there should be some offensive talent starting next year in Bakersfield. Those offensive guys need to translate the offensive ability to the pros but hopefully the AHL team will be able count on Oilers prospects making up the team rather than AHL vets.

Yamamoto too.

It's a start. Wouldn't hurt to get a little more, particularly on defense and especially in goal. They really need a goalie prospect.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713215 is a reply to message #713209 ]	Tue, 10 April 2018 08:09

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

3 Cups

mightyreasoner wrote on Mon, 09 April 2018 19:12

RDOilerfan wrote on Mon, 09 April 2018 16:03

With Marody who's supposed to be an fast offensive guy. Benson turning pro who's an offensive guy.
Hebig is was a big time junior scorer. IN theory, there should be some offensive talent starting next year in Bakersfield. Those offensive guys need to translate the offensive ability to the pros but hopefully the AHL team will be able count on Oilers prospects making up the team rather than AHL vets.

Yamamoto too.

It's a start. Wouldn't hurt to get a little more, particularly on defense and especially in goal. They really need a goalie prospect.

You hear some good things about Skinner but goaltending seems to be the hardest to scout. But even if he turns out, he's years away.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713216 is a reply to message #713215 ]	Tue, 10 April 2018 08:38

b_1_b
Messages: 4
Registered: July 2005

No Cups

Not to totally hijack this thread and make it about Skinner but I have watched the last couple of games he has played vs MJ Warriors in the WHL playoffs and he needs work on rebound control. Very small sample size and maybe just a couple of sketchy games but many of the low shots/shoot ins by MJ turned into a scoring opportunities for them. He did get the shutout last game but MJ hit 2 cross bars and a post in the game. Oilers need as many prospects as possible going forward to at least compete for AHL spots in order to try and help right this ship.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #713219 is a reply to message #713216 ]	Tue, 10 April 2018 09:20

RDOilerfan
Messages: 3780
Registered: January 2016

3 Cups

b_1_b wrote on Tue, 10 April 2018 08:38

Not to totally hijack this thread and make it about Skinner but I have watched the last couple of games he has played vs MJ Warriors in the WHL playoffs and he needs work on rebound control. Very small sample size and maybe just a couple of sketchy games but many of the low shots/shoot ins by MJ turned into a scoring opportunities for them. He did get the shutout last game but MJ hit 2 cross bars and a post in the game. Oilers need as many prospects as possible going forward to at least compete for AHL spots in order to try and help right this ship.

I am sure he needs to work on a lot of things to have success in the pros. I am sure that is a big reason why so many guys drafted don't work out and the ones that do, you usually don't see them in the NHL until they are 22-23 yrs old.

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Re: Oilers Trade for Cooper Marody [message #766872 is a reply to message #712271 ]	Fri, 18 September 2020 12:21

GabbyDugan
Messages: 828
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton, AB

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Marody is headed to Austria.

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/release-oilers-loan-marody-t o-dornbirn-bulldogs/c-319002950

I don't know of any Calgary Flames or their prospects headed to Europe.

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