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Oilers » "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson

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"Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725085]	Fri, 14 December 2018 17:17

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

This is behind the paywall, so I can't see the full text here, but if you can, apparently Nicholson says that Chia only needs playoffs to keep him in his seat for another year, despite cap mismanagement and a brutal trade record.

https://theathletic.com/715039/2018/12/14/qa-bob-nicholson-t alks-ken-hitchcock-peter-chiarelli-and-the-state-of-the-oile rs/

Here's Jonathan Willis on this:

Quote:

Jonathan Willis‏
@JonathanWillis

New, from @DNBsports: Bob Nicholson confirms that Peter Chiarelli's job is safe if Edmonton makes the playoffs.

That's...not smart. Chiarelli (and those above him) have been an unmitigated disaster, and so if they scrape in to the playoffs, that really should not absolve him of the responsibility for what's happened to this point. The team should be asking - is he the best person to lead the team forward. I can't think of any way that someone should look at his record here and believe that there aren't much better options out there.

Here's Oilfans Alumnus Dennis King weighing in on the article:

Quote:

Dennis King
@DKingBH

I have friends and acquaintances pimping that Nicholson interview but all I learned was that, in terms of on-ice contribution, he should be fired. Of course, I already knew that

[Updated on: Fri, 14 December 2018 17:46]

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725086 is a reply to message #725085 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 18:02

Ragnarok73
Messages: 2419
Registered: February 2011

2 Cups

Maybe he is only saying this to keep things in the upper levels of the organization from going into a state of flux. Regardless of what happens this year, they should grab any candidate for replacement if someone better than Chia is still available, such as Stevie Y.

Last night's game in Winnipeg showed just how little Chia did to address depth issues with the Oil D despite the fact that it was an issue last season and was easily one of the main reasons for their failure to get to the playoffs again. Now they have less scoring depth to go on top of that while being saddled with contracts that will strangle their cap room for years to come. Hitch can only cover up so much with his structured team defense system, and I hope Bobby Burgers is paying attention to this while watching the games.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725089 is a reply to message #725086 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 18:16

NetBOG
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Ragnarok73 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:02

Maybe he is only saying this to keep things in the upper levels of the organization from going into a state of flux. Regardless of what happens this year, they should grab any candidate for replacement if someone better than Chia is still available, such as Stevie Y.

Last night's game in Winnipeg showed just how little Chia did to address depth issues with the Oil D despite the fact that it was an issue last season and was easily one of the main reasons for their failure to get to the playoffs again. Now they have less scoring depth to go on top of that while being saddled with contracts that will strangle their cap room for years to come. Hitch can only cover up so much with his structured team defense system, and I hope Bobby Burgers is paying attention to this while watching the games.

Show me a team that would be ok losing 3 of their top 4 or 5 defensemen?

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725090 is a reply to message #725085 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 18:18

Kr55
Messages: 10770
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Bouchard, 1st in 2019 and 1st in 2020 for Pietro?

Yams, Pulju and 2nd in 2019 for Nyquist?

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725093 is a reply to message #725090 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 18:30

NetBOG
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Kr55 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:18

Bouchard, 1st in 2019 and 1st in 2020 for Pietro?

Yams, Pulju and 2nd in 2019 for Nyquist?

Bouchard is the one guy who can (eventually) help us fix our biggest problem and you want to trade him and a big future piece and another big future piece for a rental we couldn't afford to keep even if we wanted?

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725094 is a reply to message #725093 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 18:32

Kr55
Messages: 10770
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:30

Kr55 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:18

Bouchard, 1st in 2019 and 1st in 2020 for Pietro?

Yams, Pulju and 2nd in 2019 for Nyquist?

Bouchard is the one guy who can (eventually) help us fix our biggest problem and you want to trade him and a big future piece and another big future piece for a rental we couldn't afford to keep even if we wanted?

Hey man, if I can get a contract extension for making the playoffs this year, Bouchard can eat my shorts.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725101 is a reply to message #725089 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 19:32

PlusOne
Messages: 1594
Registered: July 2006
Location: Regina, Sask

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:16

Ragnarok73 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:02

Maybe he is only saying this to keep things in the upper levels of the organization from going into a state of flux. Regardless of what happens this year, they should grab any candidate for replacement if someone better than Chia is still available, such as Stevie Y.

Last night's game in Winnipeg showed just how little Chia did to address depth issues with the Oil D despite the fact that it was an issue last season and was easily one of the main reasons for their failure to get to the playoffs again. Now they have less scoring depth to go on top of that while being saddled with contracts that will strangle their cap room for years to come. Hitch can only cover up so much with his structured team defense system, and I hope Bobby Burgers is paying attention to this while watching the games.

Show me a team that would be ok losing 3 of their top 4 or 5 defensemen?

100% correct. Most teams cant handle that.
The issue for me is that the Oilers already had/have one of the weakest d groups in the league even before Sekera, Klefbom and Russell got hurt.

Klefbom started the season looking lost but the last 20 games or so was our best defencemen and really seemed to have turned a corner.
Larsson is a good shut down D but on a team with a good D group he isnt your top guy. Ideally he is the best on your 2D pairing
Nurse has been very up and down and should be on your second pairing but ideally with a steady guy like Larsson
Russell has been ok but still extremely frustrating some nights and ideally suited to the third pairing.
I have no confidence that Sekera will ever be a top 4 in the NHL again.

None of our other D this year are full time NHL caliber.

So no, very few teams would be ok with top 3 D out but for a lot of teams Sek, Russell and Klefbom would be in their bottom 3.
Every single one of them is playing one spot, one pairing and sometimes one league above their skill level so it becomes an A+ AHL lineup after the injuries.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725110 is a reply to message #725101 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 19:53

Ragnarok73
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PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:32

100% correct. Most teams cant handle that.
The issue for me is that the Oilers already had/have one of the weakest d groups in the league even before Sekera, Klefbom and Russell got hurt.

Klefbom started the season looking lost but the last 20 games or so was our best defencemen and really seemed to have turned a corner.
Larsson is a good shut down D but on a team with a good D group he isnt your top guy. Ideally he is the best on your 2D pairing
Nurse has been very up and down and should be on your second pairing but ideally with a steady guy like Larsson
Russell has been ok but still extremely frustrating some nights and ideally suited to the third pairing.
I have no confidence that Sekera will ever be a top 4 in the NHL again.

None of our other D this year are full time NHL caliber.

So no, very few teams would be ok with top 3 D out but for a lot of teams Sek, Russell and Klefbom would be in their bottom 3.
Every single one of them is playing one spot, one pairing and sometimes one league above their skill level so it becomes an A+ AHL lineup after the injuries.

This 100%. Hitch was in fact a great coach to replace Koala-head because his teams play tight defensive coverage systems that mask the weakness of individual players talent-wise. My only fear is that if the Oil become too successful, Chia's job could in fact be safe right to the end of his contract. Screw that.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725112 is a reply to message #725101 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 19:56

NetBOG
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PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:32

100% correct. Most teams cant handle that.
The issue for me is that the Oilers already had/have one of the weakest d groups in the league even before Sekera, Klefbom and Russell got hurt.

Klefbom started the season looking lost but the last 20 games or so was our best defencemen and really seemed to have turned a corner.
Larsson is a good shut down D but on a team with a good D group he isnt your top guy. Ideally he is the best on your 2D pairing
Nurse has been very up and down and should be on your second pairing but ideally with a steady guy like Larsson
Russell has been ok but still extremely frustrating some nights and ideally suited to the third pairing.
I have no confidence that Sekera will ever be a top 4 in the NHL again.

None of our other D this year are full time NHL caliber.

So no, very few teams would be ok with top 3 D out but for a lot of teams Sek, Russell and Klefbom would be in their bottom 3.
Every single one of them is playing one spot, one pairing and sometimes one league above their skill level so it becomes an A+ AHL lineup after the injuries.

There's only a handful of teams where one of those guys wouldn't be at least at #2. CAL, SJ, WIN, NSH, STL, and maybe BUF.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725115 is a reply to message #725112 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:03

PlusOne
Messages: 1594
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Location: Regina, Sask

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:56

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:32

100% correct. Most teams cant handle that.
The issue for me is that the Oilers already had/have one of the weakest d groups in the league even before Sekera, Klefbom and Russell got hurt.

Klefbom started the season looking lost but the last 20 games or so was our best defencemen and really seemed to have turned a corner.
Larsson is a good shut down D but on a team with a good D group he isnt your top guy. Ideally he is the best on your 2D pairing
Nurse has been very up and down and should be on your second pairing but ideally with a steady guy like Larsson
Russell has been ok but still extremely frustrating some nights and ideally suited to the third pairing.
I have no confidence that Sekera will ever be a top 4 in the NHL again.

None of our other D this year are full time NHL caliber.

So no, very few teams would be ok with top 3 D out but for a lot of teams Sek, Russell and Klefbom would be in their bottom 3.
Every single one of them is playing one spot, one pairing and sometimes one league above their skill level so it becomes an A+ AHL lineup after the injuries.

There's only a handful of teams where one of those guys wouldn't be at least at #2. CAL, SJ, WIN, NSH, STL, and maybe BUF.

Ok, I know that there will be a never ending debate on if Larsson and Klefbom belong on a top pairing so for the sake of discussion let's ignore them. For the record I REALLY like how Klefbom was coming on this year and think Larsson is a very good shut down player.

Focusing just on the bottom 4 can you honestly say that on a good D group these guys arent all playing one to three spots above their caliber?

Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725119 is a reply to message #725115 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:07

NetBOG
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PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:03

Ok, I know that there will be a never ending debate on if Larsson and Klefbom belong on a top pairing so for the sake of discussion let's ignore them. For the record I REALLY like how Klefbom was coming on this year and think Larsson is a very good shut down player.

Focusing just on the bottom 4 can you honestly say that on a good D group these guys arent all playing one to three spots above their caliber?

Just good look at what a lot of teams are icing on defence. It's not any better than what we have. Some teams like PIT or LA have 1 good guy, but a lot don't. Check out what DAL is putting out there at this point.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725120 is a reply to message #725112 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:08

Ragnarok73
Messages: 2419
Registered: February 2011

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:56

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 19:32

100% correct. Most teams cant handle that.
The issue for me is that the Oilers already had/have one of the weakest d groups in the league even before Sekera, Klefbom and Russell got hurt.

Klefbom started the season looking lost but the last 20 games or so was our best defencemen and really seemed to have turned a corner.
Larsson is a good shut down D but on a team with a good D group he isnt your top guy. Ideally he is the best on your 2D pairing
Nurse has been very up and down and should be on your second pairing but ideally with a steady guy like Larsson
Russell has been ok but still extremely frustrating some nights and ideally suited to the third pairing.
I have no confidence that Sekera will ever be a top 4 in the NHL again.

None of our other D this year are full time NHL caliber.

So no, very few teams would be ok with top 3 D out but for a lot of teams Sek, Russell and Klefbom would be in their bottom 3.
Every single one of them is playing one spot, one pairing and sometimes one league above their skill level so it becomes an A+ AHL lineup after the injuries.

There's only a handful of teams where one of those guys wouldn't be at least at #2. CAL, SJ, WIN, NSH, STL, and maybe BUF.

Don't forget TB, WAS, PIT, etc. Teams that want to contend for the Cup need to have legit top-pairing D-men who can match up against the firepower of top opposing teams.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725121 is a reply to message #725119 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:15

PlusOne
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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 21:07

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:03

Ok, I know that there will be a never ending debate on if Larsson and Klefbom belong on a top pairing so for the sake of discussion let's ignore them. For the record I REALLY like how Klefbom was coming on this year and think Larsson is a very good shut down player.

Focusing just on the bottom 4 can you honestly say that on a good D group these guys arent all playing one to three spots above their caliber?

Just good look at what a lot of teams are icing on defence. It's not any better than what we have. Some teams like PIT or LA have 1 good guy, but a lot don't. Check out what DAL is putting out there at this point.

I will be honest. Outside of highlights every day I see Oiler games and usually one Leafs game per week.
What I am saying is that I dont see a huge sample size of every single teams group. Perhaps the Oilers really arent as bad as a group as I think they are.

You didnt answer my question though. Do you think that anyone outside of Larsson and Klef are in a role they belong in and are doing it well?

Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725124 is a reply to message #725120 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:18

NetBOG
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Ragnarok73 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:08

Don't forget TB, WAS, PIT, etc. Teams that want to contend for the Cup need to have legit top-pairing D-men who can match up against the firepower of top opposing teams.

I'll take any of Larsson, Klefbom, or Nurse over Matt Niskinen, Brian Dumoulin, or Ryan McDonagh

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725138 is a reply to message #725124 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:31

PlusOne
Messages: 1594
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Location: Regina, Sask

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 21:18

Ragnarok73 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:08

Don't forget TB, WAS, PIT, etc. Teams that want to contend for the Cup need to have legit top-pairing D-men who can match up against the firepower of top opposing teams.

I'll take any of Larsson, Klefbom, or Nurse over Matt Niskinen, Brian Dumoulin, or Ryan McDonagh

Up front; the following is a genuine question, not loaded or disingenuous

What do you not like a bout McDonagh?
I have only seen the lighting play a couples games but he is playing high minutes on a team that is among the top in GAA.
He is over half a point game with limited PP points (two)

Only 29 so not over the hill yet.

I think TB has very good group and by all numbers he seems to be only slightly behind Hedman and Stralman in importance to that team.

Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725140 is a reply to message #725093 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Adam
Messages: 7176
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Location: Edmonton, AB

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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:30

Kr55 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:18

Bouchard, 1st in 2019 and 1st in 2020 for Pietro?

Yams, Pulju and 2nd in 2019 for Nyquist?

Bouchard is the one guy who can (eventually) help us fix our biggest problem and you want to trade him and a big future piece and another big future piece for a rental we couldn't afford to keep even if we wanted?

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725141 is a reply to message #725138 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

NetBOG
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PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:31

Up front; the following is a genuine question, not loaded or disingenuous

What do you not like a bout McDonagh?
I have only seen the lighting play a couples games but he is playing high minutes on a team that is among the top in GAA.
He is over half a point game with limited PP points (two)

Only 29 so not over the hill yet.

I think TB has very good group and by all numbers he seems to be only slightly behind Hedman and Stralman in importance to that team.

Nothing wrong with McDonagh, I'm just higher on the Oiler guys the most.

TB also has Stralman and Sergachev, so maybe they go in the list with the 5 or 6 others.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725142 is a reply to message #725140 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 20:53

NetBOG
Messages: 2948
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Adam wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

I haven't supported anything the OBC has done in at least 10 years.

On Chiarelli, I don't think he's the best, but I don't think he's the worst. He's made 2 terrible moves, 2 moves that were unpopular but had to be done, and has a few small wins. He's stabilized the farm system, set it up to at least have a chance to succeed, drafted quite well, and hasn't traded away the future to save himself now.

Would you trade Bouchard and 2 #1 picks for Pietrangelo?

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725146 is a reply to message #725141 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:01

PlusOne
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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 21:46

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:31

Up front; the following is a genuine question, not loaded or disingenuous

What do you not like a bout McDonagh?
I have only seen the lighting play a couples games but he is playing high minutes on a team that is among the top in GAA.
He is over half a point game with limited PP points (two)

Only 29 so not over the hill yet.

I think TB has very good group and by all numbers he seems to be only slightly behind Hedman and Stralman in importance to that team.

Nothing wrong with McDonagh, I'm just higher on the Oiler guys the most.

TB also has Stralman and Sergachev, so maybe they go in the list with the 5 or 6 others.

Fair enough,I was just surprised to see him on your list given I see him as WAY better than the two you grouped him with.

One thing I will say is that I think the Oilers D is trending up.
I have stated before what I like about Larsson. Hopefully Kelfbom maintains his trajectory and can stay healthy. Nurse has a ways to go but I still think he will be a very good player for a lot of years.
Hopefully Bouchard is the real deal as it would solve a lot of problems. A legit threat from the blue line and good puck mover would solve a lot of issues for the team.
Add in a couple of prospects who I think have a good chance in Bear and Jones and that is a pretty young group overall, that has a decent range of skills.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725147 is a reply to message #725090 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:02

welcometotheOC
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Holy overpays Batman!!!
And you want Chia-head fired !?!?

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725150 is a reply to message #725147 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:05

Kr55
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welcometotheOC wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 21:02

Holy overpays Batman!!!
And you want Chia-head fired !?!?

Those are my "make the playoffs this year at any cost to keep my job" trades. That's just the price you pay...to keep your job as GM.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725151 is a reply to message #725142 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:07

Adam
Messages: 7176
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NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:53

Adam wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

I haven't supported anything the OBC has done in at least 10 years.

On Chiarelli, I don't think he's the best, but I don't think he's the worst. He's made 2 terrible moves, 2 moves that were unpopular but had to be done, and has a few small wins. He's stabilized the farm system, set it up to at least have a chance to succeed, drafted quite well, and hasn't traded away the future to save himself now.

Would you trade Bouchard and 2 #1 picks for Pietrangelo?

Nope.

For one thing, the money doesn't work for the Oilers on a deal like that, but also there's going to be defencemen available this year, and you might be able to get a good one a lot cheaper than that. I don't believe in giving up your top assets in almost any circumstance, because those pieces are so hard to come by. Pietrangelo is on a contract that expires in a year and a bit. You're giving up too much for possibly too short a time.

A guy who comes and plays on our powerplay needs a long contract because if we get a decent powerplay coach, then that point person could put up a lot of points. Pietrangelo would either flop (likely due to injuries), or he would be too expensive to re-sign.

Bouchard for Parayko? Maybe - that's a real player for a might-be player - but even there, I'm not throwing first round picks on top of that. I"d rather deal the first rounders than Bouchard too...if the Oilers are properly managed, they shouldn't be picking in the top ten again.

FWIW - I don't think that was a serious proposal from Kr55 - he was saying that if Chia's job rides on making the playoffs and he still has full latitude to do his job now, he may mortgage the future for the short term goal.

[Updated on: Fri, 14 December 2018 21:09]

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725152 is a reply to message #725146 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:09

NetBOG
Messages: 2948
Registered: January 2006
Location: Parts Unknown

2 Cups

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 21:01

Fair enough,I was just surprised to see him on your list given I see him as WAY better than the two you grouped him with.

One thing I will say is that I think the Oilers D is trending up.
I have stated before what I like about Larsson. Hopefully Kelfbom maintains his trajectory and can stay healthy. Nurse has a ways to go but I still think he will be a very good player for a lot of years.
Hopefully Bouchard is the real deal as it would solve a lot of problems. A legit threat from the blue line and good puck mover would solve a lot of issues for the team.
Add in a couple of prospects who I think have a good chance in Bear and Jones and that is a pretty young group overall, that has a decent range of skills.

I put those 3 guys out there because they are (by TOI) the #2 d-men on the teams mentioned in the above post (PIT, WSH, and TB)

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725159 is a reply to message #725142 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:22

Magnum
Messages: 839
Registered: June 2009
Location: Rogers' Arena > Banff

No Cups

I thought he did everything right in the first year, and don’t mind the Reinhart move. Lots of good work in that year.

The next year was fine, except that the Hall trade was generationally bad.

Last year and last summer were comically bad. Koskinen was the one saving grace. Since the summer though, it’s been all good.

There’s someone better, yes, but will he be effective with Lowe and the boys on his backend 247? He seems to be making good decisions now, maybe he’s learned to navigate the OBC?

Maybe Todd really was the wrong coach for the situation, and he was the cause of the terrible play of the team? If so, can Chia really be blamed?

2015/2016 - This Kool-Aid tastes like McDavid flavoured Drain-O.
2016/2017 - This Kool-Aid is starting to taste like juice.
2017/2018 - I'm drinking this Kool-Aid, in hopes that it's Drain-O.
2018/2019 - Another round of Drain-O, good sir!

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725160 is a reply to message #725090 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:25

Magnum
Messages: 839
Registered: June 2009
Location: Rogers' Arena > Banff

No Cups

Kr55 wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 18:18

Bouchard, 1st in 2019 and 1st in 2020 for Pietro?

Yams, Pulju and 2nd in 2019 for Nyquist?

McDavid for Crosby and Malkin!

2015/2016 - This Kool-Aid tastes like McDavid flavoured Drain-O.
2016/2017 - This Kool-Aid is starting to taste like juice.
2017/2018 - I'm drinking this Kool-Aid, in hopes that it's Drain-O.
2018/2019 - Another round of Drain-O, good sir!

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725161 is a reply to message #725085 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 21:29

twilson1111
Messages: 106
Registered: October 2010
Location: Calgary

No Cups

I’ll probably get roasted for this, but, with how the guys are playing under Hitch, don’t Chia’s recent moves start to look better? I’m thinking Hitch, Koskinen, Chiasson... I think he redeems himself big time if this Hitch move makes the Oilers a top half playoff team. After all, he picked the new coach and seemed to give him the right guidance.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725174 is a reply to message #725142 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 22:28

g2k
Messages: 2840
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:53

Adam wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

I haven't supported anything the OBC has done in at least 10 years.

On Chiarelli, I don't think he's the best, but I don't think he's the worst. He's made 2 terrible moves, 2 moves that were unpopular but had to be done, and has a few small wins. He's stabilized the farm system, set it up to at least have a chance to succeed, drafted quite well, and hasn't traded away the future to save himself now.

Would you trade Bouchard and 2 #1 picks for Pietrangelo?

People really seem to forget the worst contract in the league.

And how many years are left on it? Yeah..

#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725178 is a reply to message #725174 ]	Fri, 14 December 2018 23:22

Ragnarok73
Messages: 2419
Registered: February 2011

2 Cups

g2k wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 22:28

NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:53

Adam wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

I haven't supported anything the OBC has done in at least 10 years.

On Chiarelli, I don't think he's the best, but I don't think he's the worst. He's made 2 terrible moves, 2 moves that were unpopular but had to be done, and has a few small wins. He's stabilized the farm system, set it up to at least have a chance to succeed, drafted quite well, and hasn't traded away the future to save himself now.

Would you trade Bouchard and 2 #1 picks for Pietrangelo?

People really seem to forget the worst contract in the league.

And how many years are left on it? Yeah..

The highest-paid 4th-liner in NHL history? Quite possibly.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725180 is a reply to message #725174 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 00:07

NetBOG
Messages: 2948
Registered: January 2006
Location: Parts Unknown

2 Cups

g2k wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 22:28

People really seem to forget the worst contract in the league.

And how many years are left on it? Yeah..

Signing Lucic was by far the worst thing Chiarelli has done. It didn't even make sense on day 1. Free Agency is the worst thing a GM can be involved with.

That being said, I'm pretty sure it's not the worst contract.

There's Ryan Kessler or Kyle Okposo or James Neal or Kevin Shattenkirk or David Backes or Brent Seabrook or Nate Horton or Bryan Little or Bobby Ryan or Dion Phaneuf or Brandon Dubinsky or David Clarkson or one of 4 guys sent to the salary graveyard in Arizona or Loui Erikson or Sam Gagner or Karl Alzner or Cal Clutterbuck or Andrew Ladd or Jordan Staal.

I'm sure 4 or 5 of those are worse.

[Updated on: Sat, 15 December 2018 00:15]

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725182 is a reply to message #725142 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 00:16

bigEfromGP
Messages: 816
Registered: July 2006
Location: GP, AB

No Cups

[quote title=NetBOG wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:53]

Adam wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 20:46

Serious questions for you:

1) If you had your choice of GM - would you really have Peter Chiarelli calling the shots? If so, why?

2) If you were building a hockey executive, would you include any of Lowe, MacTavish, Howson? If so, why?

It's easy to sit and complain about people complaining about management, but do you actually believe this is a good leadership crew, and that the Oilers are better for having those guys in charge?

I haven't supported anything the OBC has done in at least 10 years.

On Chiarelli, I don't think he's the best, but I don't think he's the worst. /quote]

Your performance evaluation of him is "well, as long as one other GM is doing a worse job then he should stay"?

He's not a GM that builds Cup winners in 2018, primarily because he loses on the big deals. No one is disputing that he has a knack for finding some gems in the rough but that's not going to cut it to be successful.

CrusaderPi wrote on Fri, 09 October 2020 13:17

CrudeRemarks wrote on Fri, 09 October 2020 13:00

The president thinks he has the ideal male body.
It's hard to disagree that he has the ideal male body.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725186 is a reply to message #725180 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 08:32

g2k
Messages: 2840
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

NetBOG wrote on Sat, 15 December 2018 00:07

g2k wrote on Fri, 14 December 2018 22:28

People really seem to forget the worst contract in the league.

And how many years are left on it? Yeah..

Signing Lucic was by far the worst thing Chiarelli has done. It didn't even make sense on day 1. Free Agency is the worst thing a GM can be involved with.

That being said, I'm pretty sure it's not the worst contract.

There's Ryan Kessler or Kyle Okposo or James Neal or Kevin Shattenkirk or David Backes or Brent Seabrook or Nate Horton or Bryan Little or Bobby Ryan or Dion Phaneuf or Brandon Dubinsky or David Clarkson or one of 4 guys sent to the salary graveyard in Arizona or Loui Erikson or Sam Gagner or Karl Alzner or Cal Clutterbuck or Andrew Ladd or Jordan Staal.

I'm sure 4 or 5 of those are worse.

Nice list.

And I would trade our 6 million dollar stiff for almost everyone on that list. Except Seabrook. That is a real problem. He’s 33 years old and has 6 years remaining. That’s really ugly.

So I rescind. The second worst contract in the NHL.

#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725190 is a reply to message #725150 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 10:03

overdue
Messages: 493
Registered: October 2014

No Cups

When does Chia's contract expire if he isn't let go? Right now things are going pretty good for the team and he'd be foolish to try to make a big splash trade. As much as goal tending can make or break a coach, it can also make or break a GM. Koskinen is the difference right now in my opinion although the team is playing so much better under Hitchcock. I wonder if hiring Mclellan was Chia's decision.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725192 is a reply to message #725161 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 10:40

overdue
Messages: 493
Registered: October 2014

No Cups

He has done some good things, you could throw Gravel in there too who has played above expectations. The Hall, Reinhart and especially the Lucic deals are the ones that stick in everybody's craw. At the time I thought the Reinhart deal was a good gamble given his pedigree. You can't win em all but the Lucic one looked bad right from the get go given the players age and lack of foot speed.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725193 is a reply to message #725192 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 11:13

g2k
Messages: 2840
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

overdue wrote on Sat, 15 December 2018 10:40

He has done some good things, you could throw Gravel in there too who has played above expectations. The Hall, Reinhart and especially the Lucic deals are the ones that stick in everybody's craw. At the time I thought the Reinhart deal was a good gamble given his pedigree. You can't win em all but the Lucic one looked bad right from the get go given the players age and lack of foot speed.

His age didn’t give me a lot of heartburn. To me it was just the type of player he was, the current league and his ability stay effective, given his style. You could already tell in Boston his best days were already behind him.

I had no idea how ineffective he was on the boards though. That took me by surprise.

#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725195 is a reply to message #725186 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 11:32

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Not sure why you're worried g2k - Chia's a genius.

Just ask Terry Jones:

https://edmontonsun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers/jo nes-hes-baaaaack-edmonton-oilers-gm-peter-chiarelli-looking- like-the-resident-genius?utm_term=Autofeed&utm_medium=So cial&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1544879025

So embarrassing the depths these guys will sink to.

And now the Cult of Hockey is falling in line too:

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey /why-im-ok-with-bob-nicholsons-line-in-the-sand-for-peter-ch iarelli

[Updated on: Sat, 15 December 2018 11:39]

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725196 is a reply to message #725195 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 12:04

g2k
Messages: 2840
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

Adam wrote on Sat, 15 December 2018 11:32

Not sure why you're worried g2k - Chia's a genius.

Just ask Terry Jones:

https://edmontonsun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/edmonton-oilers/jo nes-hes-baaaaack-edmonton-oilers-gm-peter-chiarelli-looking- like-the-resident-genius?utm_term=Autofeed&utm_medium=So cial&utm_source=Twitter#Echobox=1544879025

So embarrassing the depths these guys will sink to.

And now the Cult of Hockey is falling in line too:

https://edmontonjournal.com/sports/hockey/nhl/cult-of-hockey /why-im-ok-with-bob-nicholsons-line-in-the-sand-for-peter-ch iarelli

Resident genius? Good grief.

Listening to Millard on the way home from the game last night, I could have sworn he was pining for Stauffs job the way he was going on about the success of Chiarelli THIS season. It’s not even Christmas.

He brought up the bad deals prior to this season with exception to the Lucic signing, but didnt really shine much light on it. His side kick last night seemed pretty timid on opposing him, but gave it a school boy try at least.

The sports media in this town are so afraid of the boogeymen on Kingsway.

#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725197 is a reply to message #725196 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 12:39

nullterm
Messages: 1033
Registered: July 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC

1 Cup

The last thing want is Chia with a gun to his head at the trade deadline. Watch him trade away the future for a rental.

Illegitimi non carborundum.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725198 is a reply to message #725150 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 12:45

welcometotheOC
Messages: 646
Registered: April 2010
Location: Also, sadly, Cowtown

No Cups

Ah, ok then. Sarcasm meter needs to be calibrated ... sorry!

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725200 is a reply to message #725085 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 13:55

Burgeoboy
Messages: 33
Registered: July 2006
Location: Burgeo, Newfoundland

No Cups

I don"t like every move he as made and yes there's a couple that really sting, but after our long playoff drought and history of poor management, anyone that takes us to the playoffs 2 out 3 the last years, I'd probably keep them on as well. Now, as for Lowe and company, they all should have been gone years ago.

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Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #725213 is a reply to message #725200 ]	Sat, 15 December 2018 18:05

shoop
Messages: 106
Registered: December 2018
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

The interview by Ference last week definitely takes the sting off of some Chia's more controversial moves.

Hard to hear about the team Ference described and not agree that there were some personnel moves that had to be made. As a straight up hockey trade Hall for Larsson was not a good deal. But in light of the out drinking to 5 am the night after loss comments then it definitely makes some more sense. Same with the Eberle trade.

If the Oilers make the playoffs this season I think Chiarelli deserves at least one more season.

Bringing in a new GM is another re-set when Chiarelli's vision just might be coming to fruition.

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