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Oilers » Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)

Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4) [message #833906 is a reply to message #833901 ]	Tue, 14 May 2024 19:24

Kr55
Messages: 12930
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 17:39

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:33

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:25

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:12

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:03

RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 15:55

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:47

No matter what happens with Pickard or our goaltending in general, hope people know who the real culprit is in forcing Knob to make this decision.

Holland left us with the goalie that melted down last playoffs, a $5M goalie that melted down 2 years in a row plus struggled to find any footing in the AHL this year, and Calvin Pickard.

I think almost everyone in this forum foresaw a strong possibility that what has happened in these playoffs now would happen. Holland chose to just sit back and hope things would just work out for him in his last year of his $25,000,000 contract. In this season the whole org knew is crucial for the future of Drai and McDavid here. Just hopes the prayers from our lazy GM.

Who's the goalie the Oilers should have brought in? This isn't me sticking up for Old man Holland, I just see the same thing. So let's see a name.

As an example, I can't remember every trade that happened this year, but the only goaltender I can recall moving was Allen and Kahkonen. Do you think the Oilers should have out bid the Devils for Allen?

I am not looking for doubling down on Holland sucks. I am completely aware of your opinion on the guy and his short comings. I deal in solutions. So who's the goalie the Oilers should have got?

Let's keep in mind:
- Flames ownership stopped a trade of Markstrom because they wanted to keep him to stay in the hunt. So he's off the table.
- Preds weren't trading Saros because he got them to the playoffs.
- Fleury (who I never wanted, he's old and not good) stated he wasn't waiving his NMC.
- Mrazek got resigned.

Pay me $5M a year so I can quit my job and I'll take the time to come up with all kinds of options to fix obvious gaping holes in the lineup.

Or we can pay Holland $5M a year to do nothing. Oh wait, already did that.

Seriously though, what's available out there, and what moves can be made, much of that will never be known to fans. That's Holland's job to be out there looking and trying to fix his lineup. I doubt he even tried this year with goaltending. He clearly believed Skinner and Campbell would both bounce back. Half a disaster happened in the regular season with Campbell being barely functional. Now Skinner is looking beat as well.

So your answer to my question is to complain about Holland some more rather than give a name. I don't need to make 5 mill to be able to list off 4 guys that weren't available that everyone in the hockey world talked about all this past season. I just read a couple of things.

I don't have to give names. And you know as little as any of the rest of us do about what was possible.

All I know is that our GM failed miserably again and his failure was sadly very predictable. Most here done a much better job than you at predicting how this playoffs would go with the super obvious issues with the team smacking us all in the face again. Just blind faith and asking people what they would have done has lead you to almost no conclusions that have played out.

So you have information that shows the Oilers did nothing in the goaltending department? I am not talking your bias opinion, I am talking legit proof.

The Devils were a 112 pt team last year and this season they had 81 pts. From about 5 games in, they needed a goalie and all they could get was Allen and Kahkonen, 2 guys they could only get at the deadline who aren't very good and they missed the playoffs by a lot because of it.

So you know for sure, there was goalies to be had, they Oilers were just too lazy or stupid to get them. I am not arguing with you about the goaltending being a potential problem that could crush the Oilers but I just am not a fan of nonsensical rants about things that have no available solution.

You know what? Good GMs find a way to address the glaring holes in their lineup. It's not always going to be easy, but it's a pretty important part of the job.

If you are the highest paid general manager in the league and you have two of the top five players in the world, and the window to win before one or both is rapidly closing, then you can't just go "well, I checked Capfriendly and it doesn't look like there's any great UFAs so I guess we're done here."

And this isn't a one-year problem for Holland anyhow. This is his ENTIRE five years here that goaltending has been a gaping hole. He signed Smith as one of his first moves, despite Smith coming off a dreadful season in Calgary and kept Koskinen who his predecessor had bizarrely been allowed to keep in place. When that tandem failed...he did more of the same and kept them together for the whole first three years of his time here. He had Skinner in the minors who the Oilers tagged as goalie of the future (although I'd suggest there were some challenges even then and I thought he looked awful in his first NHL appearances). Despite the problems there, he didn't bother to ever upgrade while those two were options and in the end, Mike Smith was ridiculously bad in the 2022 playoffs leading to a quick exit versus Colorado (who had competent goaltending from Kuemper who, oh yeah, WAS one of the many goalies who became available in the period where he was busy signing Mike Smith to extensions).

Mike Smith gets...uhhh...injured, and Koskinen's contract runs out and we go and blow our brains out to sign a goalie that Toronto didn't even try to re-sign, preferring to ink the shell of Matt Murray as their guy instead. This is a guy who everyone knew tied himself in emotional knots during down spells and who it takes about 30 seconds of scouting to know he's erratic and unpredictable in goal. And we didn't just gamble one year on him - we gave him a giant 5-year contract. Not only did he now receive big money to ride AHL buses this year, but if Holland's successor decides to buy him out, we have substantial cap penalties for the next SIX years. He also quietly added Calvin Pickard at the same time to man the AHL crease for the team.

With Campbell melting down in his very first season here, the Oilers threw everything behind a rookie goalie, gave him a three-year extension before that rookie season was even half over, and then watched him completely self-destruct in the playoffs, costing us yet another valuable year while we try to prove to our two true superstars that we're really serious about winning here.

After all that and knowing how critical this year was and how big our goalie issues last year were, Holland decided his time and effort were better spent elsewhere.

Not, of course, on bolstering the defence that also looked a little shaky in last year's post-season, but rather by scoring the true coup of the summer - bringing on Connor Brown on an easy-to-achieve incentive-laden contract. After that, he quickly signed Bouchard to a "show-me" bridge deal so that his expiration lined up nicely with Draisaitl's and then headed off to the cabin to celebrate a full summer's work secure in knowing that the goaltending problem was finally solved, ironically with the same answer he gave the prior year.

Well said. Really nothing more needs to be said and the results speak for themselves. Trying to defend Holland and basically any Oilers manager since Katz bought the team by saying "what moves would YOU have done???? You don't have the answers!!!!" is pretty ridiculous, especially while Katz has probably been milked $100M+ by now paying for some of the worst managers the league has seen, various OBC and hockey Canada bros and their friends and family.

Anyone that can't acknowledge what a terrible job these guys have done as they waste the primes of multiple great players and a generational talent has their head in the sand.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: OilFans on Tue, 14 May 2024 02:00
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Oscargasm on Tue, 14 May 2024 08:03
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Skookum Jim on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:40
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 08:27
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 08:44
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 08:58
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 08:59
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 09:26
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Mike on Tue, 14 May 2024 09:30
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Skookum Jim on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:24
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: JPro on Tue, 14 May 2024 09:24
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Adam on Tue, 14 May 2024 09:27
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 10:52
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: MJ on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:02
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:13
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:15
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:33
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: g2k on Tue, 14 May 2024 12:45
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Adam on Tue, 14 May 2024 17:18
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:14
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Skookum Jim on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:29
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: inverno76 on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:42
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:51
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: kungpaobenji27 on Tue, 14 May 2024 11:47
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: NZ Oiler Fan on Tue, 14 May 2024 12:23
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 12:45
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 13:01
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 13:08
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 13:17
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Jay on Tue, 14 May 2024 13:22
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: tardigrade81 on Tue, 14 May 2024 13:57
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: halfafrog on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:45
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Oscargasm on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:46
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Adam on Tue, 14 May 2024 17:16
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: NZ Oiler Fan on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:48
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 14:47
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 15:55
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:03
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:12
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:25
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:33
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Adam on Tue, 14 May 2024 17:39
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 19:24
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: CrusaderPi on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:15
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: RDOilerfan on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:22
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Oscargasm on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:50
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Mike on Tue, 14 May 2024 19:03
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Suomalainen on Tue, 14 May 2024 15:33
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: NetBOG on Tue, 14 May 2024 15:54
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Kr55 on Tue, 14 May 2024 16:05
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Adam on Tue, 14 May 2024 17:47
Re: Pregame: Vancouver @ Edmonton (Game #4)	By: Skookum Jim on Tue, 14 May 2024 19:08

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