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 Speculation » What's the deal with this team's goaltending?
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 What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839648]
Wed, 18 December 2024 02:15 Go to next message
HamBlaster  is currently offline HamBlaster
Messages: 1008
Registered: June 2007

1 Cup

I know this is continuing to beat a dead horse, but what gives? Honestly?

I'm not going to talk about DS, because the Lord only knows why that guy is still around 10 years later.

Why does every goddamn goalie that plays for Vancouver look like a freaking Vezina candidate and our goaltending situation is a tire fire more often than not?

Outside of Skinner's recent run that came to a screeching halt against the Cats, he's been dreadful this season and was dreadful to start last year. He's having a significantly worse season than Pickard (who should take over starting duties until Stu figures his brainfarts out - that giveaway for the goal in the Knights game and the insanely terrible effort on Reinhart's goal last night are perfect examples.

He's statistically in the conversation of the worst goalies in all of NHL history in the playoffs, which is shocking considering goalies in the 80s wore pads that were half the size of the current era.

I'm sorry... but he's not a starting goalie in the NHL. He has his moments where he seems to figure something out for a bit, but then he predictably comes crashing back down to Earth in dramatic fashion. Happens all the time with him.

Why do the Oilers continue to see him as that guy? Look at so many other goalies in this league that are emerging and have passed Stu by in development and ceiling potential. Why do the Oilers not try to improve this part of the team? It seems like they see him as part of the core and a ride or die, but WHY??? He's rocking an .892 save percentage this season? How is this starter material?

Sorry, I know that this is a long-winded rant, but I'm so tired of the Oilers having incredibly suspect goaltending. They could have found a better option, but complacency and recency bias seems to always be a thing with our management (regardless of who is in the seat).

[Updated on: Wed, 18 December 2024 02:17]


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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839650 is a reply to message #839648 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 08:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 10866
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Our goaltending is like the Calgary Lames over the last 3 decades. Just enough little spurts of looking good that management always thinks there is another level there that will emerge if you're just patient enough.

You rarely ever year that our management is looking for a real goalie upgrade outside of the odd bad and impuslive decisions made at the UFA deadline. Actually trading for a good goalie? Can't remember the last time I heard a rumor like that.

[Updated on: Wed, 18 December 2024 09:34]


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

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- MacT, 2015

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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839651 is a reply to message #839648 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 09:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Location: AB Highway 100

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The Oilers suffer from two (almost three) decades of bad management. They get a goalie who is close enough to being good enough and check the box. Us dummies on the internet are able to notice Smith and Koskinen were never going to be able to successfully backstop a competitive team, but the smartest men in the room had their two goalies and that box was checked. Moving on and how dare you question the experts.

The OIG had too much trust in ex-Oilers and Katz... I don't know what Katz has, but he certainly doing something to enable 16 years (!?) of lazy decision making in management.



Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839652 is a reply to message #839648 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 09:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike  is currently offline Mike
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Registered: August 2005
Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

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HamBlaster wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 05:15

I'm not going to talk about DS, because the Lord only knows why that guy is still around 10 years later.


Why won't you talk about him? As many have said many times - he may not be the problem, but he sure as hell isn't the solution. People were point to Skinner as a feather in his cap, but like many before him, the longer Skinner is with DS, the worse his save % gets.

I would say overhaul all the entire goalie development department and go from there.



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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839655 is a reply to message #839652 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 11:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt  is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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Location: edmonton

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I directly blame him...


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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839653 is a reply to message #839648 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 09:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hibernia  is currently offline Hibernia
Messages: 104
Registered: October 1998
Location: Sin John's

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HamBlaster wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 05:45

the insanely terrible effort on Reinhart's goal last night are perfect examples.


I stopped reading when I got here. When McDavid scores this goal, we talk about the great skill. But when Reinhart does it, it's because of an "insanely terrible effort" on the part of our goalie. If you're going to complain any goal from the FLA game, this isn't it.

Every goalie has bad games and the Oilers spend less than just about everyone on goaltending. If you're expecting Vezina level goaltending from start-to-finish every season, good luck. Sure, the Rangers are about to pay their #1 more than anyone in the history of the sport (and with a Milan Lucic style bulletproof contract) for most the next decade and their dude hasn't played as well as Skinner since the beginning of December.

deadhorse



What happened to all of my messages? lol (I guess it's been awhile) BlueSky: StefBarnes

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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839657 is a reply to message #839653 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 11:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 7191
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

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Hibernia wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 09:51

HamBlaster wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 05:45

the insanely terrible effort on Reinhart's goal last night are perfect examples.


I stopped reading when I got here. When McDavid scores this goal, we talk about the great skill. But when Reinhart does it, it's because of an "insanely terrible effort" on the part of our goalie. If you're going to complain any goal from the FLA game, this isn't it.

Every goalie has bad games and the Oilers spend less than just about everyone on goaltending. If you're expecting Vezina level goaltending from start-to-finish every season, good luck. Sure, the Rangers are about to pay their #1 more than anyone in the history of the sport (and with a Milan Lucic style bulletproof contract) for most the next decade and their dude hasn't played as well as Skinner since the beginning of December.

deadhorse


I've seen the Edm media beating this drum too lately - look how the Oilers manage to get semi-competent goaltending while spending less than anyone! But is that a good decision? Yes, you can never have a perfect team in a cap season, so there's always some level of compromise at some position but the goalie is the only player on the ice 60ish minutes a game, and he's the one who can single-handedly lose games or series for you, so should we be skimping there?

As CrusaderPi pointed out, we've gone several seasons in a row with relatively cheap but mediocre tandems and the result is that goaltending has been a significant weakness through that time. Mike Smith imploding was a big factor in the sweep to Colorado (and if the Oilers hadn't blown the doors off Calgary offensively, he could have cost us that prior series too as he was awful throughout). Skinner completely crapped the bed against Vegas two years ago and almost duplicated that against Vancouver last year. I believe Koskinen/Smith were pretty terrible against Chicago and Winnipeg too.

At what point do we think that maybe under-spending on goaltending might be holding us back?



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839659 is a reply to message #839657 ]
Wed, 18 December 2024 13:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
oilfan94  is currently offline oilfan94
Messages: 424
Registered: June 2006
Location: USA

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Adam wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 13:33

Hibernia wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 09:51

HamBlaster wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 05:45

the insanely terrible effort on Reinhart's goal last night are perfect examples.


I stopped reading when I got here. When McDavid scores this goal, we talk about the great skill. But when Reinhart does it, it's because of an "insanely terrible effort" on the part of our goalie. If you're going to complain any goal from the FLA game, this isn't it.

Every goalie has bad games and the Oilers spend less than just about everyone on goaltending. If you're expecting Vezina level goaltending from start-to-finish every season, good luck. Sure, the Rangers are about to pay their #1 more than anyone in the history of the sport (and with a Milan Lucic style bulletproof contract) for most the next decade and their dude hasn't played as well as Skinner since the beginning of December.

deadhorse


I've seen the Edm media beating this drum too lately - look how the Oilers manage to get semi-competent goaltending while spending less than anyone! But is that a good decision? Yes, you can never have a perfect team in a cap season, so there's always some level of compromise at some position but the goalie is the only player on the ice 60ish minutes a game, and he's the one who can single-handedly lose games or series for you, so should we be skimping there?

As CrusaderPi pointed out, we've gone several seasons in a row with relatively cheap but mediocre tandems and the result is that goaltending has been a significant weakness through that time. Mike Smith imploding was a big factor in the sweep to Colorado (and if the Oilers hadn't blown the doors off Calgary offensively, he could have cost us that prior series too as he was awful throughout). Skinner completely crapped the bed against Vegas two years ago and almost duplicated that against Vancouver last year. I believe Koskinen/Smith were pretty terrible against Chicago and Winnipeg too.

At what point do we think that maybe under-spending on goaltending might be holding us back?


Problem as well is that when the Oilers did spend on a goalie, it was on the wrong guy. There were a lot of warming signs that Campbell was not going to fit well on the Oilers, but they went for it, and now we basically have several million in dead cap space related to goalies for the next 3 years after this season (up to $2.6M in 2027 still going to Campbell).

The contracts that both our goalies are on right now are actually pretty good for what they give us overall. We pay for 2 backups and that is what we have. Goaltending is a fickle position, and if the Oilers went out and spent to get someone with a solid track record, I am not convinced it would be substantially better than what we have now, unless we got Conner Hellebuyck. Skinner's stats are pretty bad right now due to the bad start (again), and it would be great to have someone more consistent, but if you look at his quality starts stat on hockey-reference.com he is actually above average. Problem is just when he has a bad game, it is a really, really bad game.



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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839697 is a reply to message #839657 ]
Fri, 20 December 2024 09:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76  is currently offline inverno76
Messages: 2353
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Location: Prince Albert, Saskatchew...

2 Cups

Adam wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 11:33

Hibernia wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 09:51

HamBlaster wrote on Wed, 18 December 2024 05:45

the insanely terrible effort on Reinhart's goal last night are perfect examples.


I stopped reading when I got here. When McDavid scores this goal, we talk about the great skill. But when Reinhart does it, it's because of an "insanely terrible effort" on the part of our goalie. If you're going to complain any goal from the FLA game, this isn't it.

Every goalie has bad games and the Oilers spend less than just about everyone on goaltending. If you're expecting Vezina level goaltending from start-to-finish every season, good luck. Sure, the Rangers are about to pay their #1 more than anyone in the history of the sport (and with a Milan Lucic style bulletproof contract) for most the next decade and their dude hasn't played as well as Skinner since the beginning of December.

deadhorse


I've seen the Edm media beating this drum too lately - look how the Oilers manage to get semi-competent goaltending while spending less than anyone! But is that a good decision? Yes, you can never have a perfect team in a cap season, so there's always some level of compromise at some position but the goalie is the only player on the ice 60ish minutes a game, and he's the one who can single-handedly lose games or series for you, so should we be skimping there?

As CrusaderPi pointed out, we've gone several seasons in a row with relatively cheap but mediocre tandems and the result is that goaltending has been a significant weakness through that time. Mike Smith imploding was a big factor in the sweep to Colorado (and if the Oilers hadn't blown the doors off Calgary offensively, he could have cost us that prior series too as he was awful throughout). Skinner completely crapped the bed against Vegas two years ago and almost duplicated that against Vancouver last year. I believe Koskinen/Smith were pretty terrible against Chicago and Winnipeg too.

At what point do we think that maybe under-spending on goaltending might be holding us back?



Can we trust their ability to find a competent goalie in a trade, or through free agency? All of our recent swings have been huge misses lately.




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 Re: What's the deal with this team's goaltending? [message #839759 is a reply to message #839653 ]
Tue, 24 December 2024 10:42 Go to previous message
HamBlaster  is currently offline HamBlaster
Messages: 1008
Registered: June 2007

1 Cup

You're missing that when McDavid does this, it's usually during a quick transition attack, he's skating super fast and the goalie is off balance and is looking for a potential cross-crease pass.

That Reinhart goal (go look at the highlight of it) involved ONLY Reinhart in the zone, with all the Oilers players in good positions, the shot coming from almost the goal line... no pressure or speed at all...... and Skinner just completely forgetting to properly cover the post and watch for the puck (and deflecting it into his net with his mask). It was a nice shot by Sam, no doubt, but the chance of that shot going in against an NHL calibre goalie should be almost non-existent.

That goal is 99% Skinner not being alert and too lackadaisical, the same way he is behind the net while playing the puck. Way too loose and takes too long to make a play, and he and the team pay for it.

He needs to be better.



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