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Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837686]	Tue, 20 August 2024 08:06

AndersonRules
Messages: 94
Registered: April 2008
Location: Shawnee, Oklahoma (OKC ar...

No Cups

As per NHL.com, the Oilers decline to match St. Louis's offer.

https://www.nhl.com/news/philip-broberg-dylan-holloway-join- st-louis-edmonton-doesnt-match-offers

Fascinating bit of commentary the Oilers implicitly make. They clear sufficient cap space to match both offers, clearly telling the Blues (and the players) "we can match if we want to". The organizational refusal to match, then, indicates that they think the contracts are both overpays and not worth matching. Gotta give Bowman & Jackson credit: even if they're wrong in their bet, they are putting their money (or in this case NOT putting their money) where their mouth is. I like the declarative statement, even if I would have made a different bet in this case.

Also of note - the Blues send the Oilers a 3rd-round pick in 2028 and the rights to an unsigned 2023 5th-rounder (Paul Fischer) for 'future considerations'. So perhaps the Oilers cleared the cap space in order to press the Blues for greater compensation for Broberg and Holloway.

Either way, kudos to management for their handling of the offer sheets. Again, I would have made a different decision (I would have matched both contracts), but I like that they cleared the space to match both if they wanted to.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837688 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 08:44

Adam
Messages: 7164
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

It’s hard not to see this through the lens of the Draisaitl/Bouchard/McDavid negotiations. You’re trying to get your best players to agree to take team friendly contracts and then you have two guys with 100 NHL games trying to force the organization into giving them absolutely massive raises. They may perform to those contracts but it’s such a big risk and it kind of destroys the messaging around being team first so that we can make something special happen.

I don’t blame the players for taking those deals, and I think the Blues really need someone to replace Krug so Broberg will get a push there, but I think the message sent by the organization here might be the most important thing and hopefully it helps to get us to a couple of contract announcements in the coming weeks.

Also gives us space if we can find a top-4 RHD rather than playing Broberg on his off-side and may have forced our hand a little in pulling the trigger on a Cody Ceci deal which was pretty essential. Maybe in the end we are thanking the Blues for this.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837689 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 08:50

oilfan94
Messages: 404
Registered: June 2006
Location: USA

No Cups

It's hard not to be annoyed at the Blues to some degree, which is a bummer because they are my second favourite team. Also, while I understand its a lot of money and the players did what was best for themselves, I reserve the right to actively cheer against them like anyone who plays for Calgary. If Broberg especially doesn't live up to his contract I won't feel too bad for him.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837690 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 08:50

smyth260
Messages: 1065
Registered: November 2007

1 Cup

I guess we will see how much damage Broberg can do as a left defender. We just didn’t have any reference point on him other than what he did in Bakersfield.

I would bet on him not living up to that contract.

Holloway could have had a great opportunity here with fantastic players, it’s a real shame he left for a smallish raise early in his career but don’t blame anybody for taking more money.

I hope I never hear the words overripe again. What a disaster Holland’s draft and development plan left us with.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 08:52]

Clean house or bust

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837693 is a reply to message #837690 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 09:37

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 08:50

I guess we will see how much damage Broberg can do as a left defender. We just didn’t have any reference point on him other than what he did in Bakersfield.

I would bet on him not living up to that contract.

Holloway could have had a great opportunity here with fantastic players, it’s a real shame he left for a smallish raise early in his career but don’t blame anybody for taking more money.

I hope I never hear the words overripe again. What a disaster Holland’s draft and development plan left us with.

It's such a hard situation, because neither of these guys were any good in the NHL in the time they got (minus some luck and underdog energy for spurts in playoffs). There is no getting around it, these are 2 players with very questionable hockey sense, which was in all the scouting reports of them. Wonderful physical attributes, but we have seen players like this over and over again. Pulju a recent example that almost had the exact same handling as Broberg, although ended up with a rare hip issue that further derailed his career. Wasn't our former head scout a poster boy for being that kind of player? :) Physical ability far exceeding brains.

In any case. Overpaying fringe NHLers would be pretty bad for the situation we are in with Bouch, Drai and McDavid, and anyone else we negotiate with really.

Summer is honestly going close to what i hoped. The whole "Ceci is popular in the room, trading him with disrupt the chemistry" bullcrap the media fed us was clearly that, bullcrap. Bowman moving on from him gives me hope. And he must be aware of the massive hole we had/have on Nurse's right side and is on the lookout.

Maybe we have a little difficult period to start the year and he will be patient and see if some teams struggle out of the gate. Maybe a good RHD has a rough start of the year on a struggling team and we can pounce, with an extra 2nd round pick in hand and Kane's LTIR space. We're so used to GM's right zero patience that feel they have to check the boxes ASAP to go relax. Zero chance Holland trades Ceci IMO, and likely our July 1st would have been uneventful because of the fear of offersheets. We would have just gone into next season praying Knob can make a NUrse pair work with Ceci, Broberg and Stecher. I absolutely hated that idea, it wouldn't have worked and would have been a pain for Knob all year. I'm pretty happy that's not how it's gonna go.

Forgot the wildcard Emberson. If he just steps in and plays well with Nurse, I think we're all just laughing :) But, not getting my hopes up for that right now.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 09:56]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837694 is a reply to message #837693 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 09:57

Adam
Messages: 7164
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 09:37

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 08:50

I guess we will see how much damage Broberg can do as a left defender. We just didn’t have any reference point on him other than what he did in Bakersfield.

I would bet on him not living up to that contract.

Holloway could have had a great opportunity here with fantastic players, it’s a real shame he left for a smallish raise early in his career but don’t blame anybody for taking more money.

I hope I never hear the words overripe again. What a disaster Holland’s draft and development plan left us with.

It's such a hard situation, because neither of these guys were any good in the NHL in the time they got (minus some luck and underdog energy for spurts in playoffs). There is no getting around it, these are 2 players with very questionable hockey sense, which was in all the scouting reports of them. Wonderful physical attributes, but we have seen players like this over and over again. Pulju a recent example that almost had the exact same handling as Broberg, although ended up with a rare hip issue that further derailed his career. Wasn't our former head scout a poster boy for being that kind of player? :) Physical ability far exceeding brains.

In any case. Overpaying fringe NHLers would be pretty bad for the situation we are in with Bouch, Drai and McDavid, and anyone else we negotiate with really.

Summer is honestly going close to what i hoped. The whole "Ceci is popular in the room, trading him with disrupt the chemistry" bullcrap the media fed us was clearly that, bullcrap. Bowman moving on from him gives me hope. And he must be aware of the massive hole we had/have on Nurse's right side and is on the lookout.

Maybe we have a little difficult period to start the year and he will be patient and see if some teams struggle out of the gate. Maybe a good RHD has a rough start of the year on a struggling team and we can pounce, with an extra 2nd round pick in hand and Kane's LTIR space. We're so used to GM's right zero patience that feel they have to check the boxes ASAP to go relax. Zero chance Holland trades Ceci IMO, and likely our July 1st would have been uneventful because of the fear of offersheets. We would have just gone into next season praying Knob can make a NUrse pair work with Ceci, Broberg and Stecher. I absolutely hated that idea, it wouldn't have worked and would have been a pain for Knob all year. I'm pretty happy that's not how it's gonna go.

One positive sign:

In 2016-17, Zack Kassian had 3 goals in 14 playoff games. A couple of them were really big goals that provided emotional moments. He also threw some big hits. The Oilers were so enamoured with that that even with a different GM a year and a half later, the team gave him a big contract and referenced his playoff performance...even though 3-0-3 in 14 games isn't in hindsight a particularly significant number.

Holloway had 5-2-7 this playoff (25 games), and again some of those goals were really big and memorable ones. It seems almost like a coming out party for the player and there's a temptation to see that as a coming out party and that he's now going to be an impact player. But again, 7 points in 25 games isn't phenomenal production. A large percentage of those points came when he was elevated to the top six - he didn't generate a lot when it wasn't on Draisaitl's wings. And it's a small sample size. Just as Kassian's regular season history showed a guy who would contribute a point only every 5 or 6 games, similarly, Holloway hasn't shown a lot for hands on any consistent basis. He had just 9 points in 38 regular season games this year.

I like that the Oilers aren't getting seduced by a single playoff performance as an indicator of future value.

This week does seem like a complete repudiation of the Ken Holland era in Edmonton though. We now have no more of his first round picks left, and it's very likely that we'll start next year with ZERO of his draft picks in the roster. That's just incredible given his 5-year tenure.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837697 is a reply to message #837694 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 10:25

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 09:57

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 09:37

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 08:50

I guess we will see how much damage Broberg can do as a left defender. We just didn’t have any reference point on him other than what he did in Bakersfield.

I would bet on him not living up to that contract.

Holloway could have had a great opportunity here with fantastic players, it’s a real shame he left for a smallish raise early in his career but don’t blame anybody for taking more money.

I hope I never hear the words overripe again. What a disaster Holland’s draft and development plan left us with.

It's such a hard situation, because neither of these guys were any good in the NHL in the time they got (minus some luck and underdog energy for spurts in playoffs). There is no getting around it, these are 2 players with very questionable hockey sense, which was in all the scouting reports of them. Wonderful physical attributes, but we have seen players like this over and over again. Pulju a recent example that almost had the exact same handling as Broberg, although ended up with a rare hip issue that further derailed his career. Wasn't our former head scout a poster boy for being that kind of player? :) Physical ability far exceeding brains.

In any case. Overpaying fringe NHLers would be pretty bad for the situation we are in with Bouch, Drai and McDavid, and anyone else we negotiate with really.

Summer is honestly going close to what i hoped. The whole "Ceci is popular in the room, trading him with disrupt the chemistry" bullcrap the media fed us was clearly that, bullcrap. Bowman moving on from him gives me hope. And he must be aware of the massive hole we had/have on Nurse's right side and is on the lookout.

Maybe we have a little difficult period to start the year and he will be patient and see if some teams struggle out of the gate. Maybe a good RHD has a rough start of the year on a struggling team and we can pounce, with an extra 2nd round pick in hand and Kane's LTIR space. We're so used to GM's right zero patience that feel they have to check the boxes ASAP to go relax. Zero chance Holland trades Ceci IMO, and likely our July 1st would have been uneventful because of the fear of offersheets. We would have just gone into next season praying Knob can make a NUrse pair work with Ceci, Broberg and Stecher. I absolutely hated that idea, it wouldn't have worked and would have been a pain for Knob all year. I'm pretty happy that's not how it's gonna go.

One positive sign:

In 2016-17, Zack Kassian had 3 goals in 14 playoff games. A couple of them were really big goals that provided emotional moments. He also threw some big hits. The Oilers were so enamoured with that that even with a different GM a year and a half later, the team gave him a big contract and referenced his playoff performance...even though 3-0-3 in 14 games isn't in hindsight a particularly significant number.

Holloway had 5-2-7 this playoff (25 games), and again some of those goals were really big and memorable ones. It seems almost like a coming out party for the player and there's a temptation to see that as a coming out party and that he's now going to be an impact player. But again, 7 points in 25 games isn't phenomenal production. A large percentage of those points came when he was elevated to the top six - he didn't generate a lot when it wasn't on Draisaitl's wings. And it's a small sample size. Just as Kassian's regular season history showed a guy who would contribute a point only every 5 or 6 games, similarly, Holloway hasn't shown a lot for hands on any consistent basis. He had just 9 points in 38 regular season games this year.

I like that the Oilers aren't getting seduced by a single playoff performance as an indicator of future value.

This week does seem like a complete repudiation of the Ken Holland era in Edmonton though. We now have no more of his first round picks left, and it's very likely that we'll start next year with ZERO of his draft picks in the roster. That's just incredible given his 5-year tenure.

Crazy. And likely the #1 reason Bobby Burgers (who suddenly was saying "overripe" every second sentence after calling his friends to learn was a GM and POHO does after Chia was fired) hired Holland was for his drafting and development history. $25M.

lol, Kassian. Tricked Holland twice. Playing hard for 2 months and jumping Tkachuk got him an even bigger overpay for 4 years. He was barely seen again after that deal was signed mid-season.

Do really hope we are done with falling in love with short time frames, and Bowman actually has a larger plan to fix the D.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837705 is a reply to message #837690 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:42

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

smyth260 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 07:50

I guess we will see how much damage Broberg can do as a left defender. We just didn’t have any reference point on him other than what he did in Bakersfield.

I would bet on him not living up to that contract.

Holloway could have had a great opportunity here with fantastic players, it’s a real shame he left for a smallish raise early in his career but don’t blame anybody for taking more money.

I hope I never hear the words overripe again. What a disaster Holland’s draft and development plan left us with.

It was probably a decent development plan except he didn't sign the players back when he had leverage.. careless.

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837692 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 09:30

benv
Messages: 597
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Have to say I'm really surprised that I didn't at least match Holloway. His salary would have been manageable and obviously the 3rd rounder is not sufficient compensation.

I have to agree that the decision not to match, particularly for Holloway has more to do with messaging. I have a feeling in Bowman's presser we'll here something along the lines of we don't want players who value money over winning.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837704 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837707 is a reply to message #837704 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

CrusaderPi
Messages: 7793
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837710 is a reply to message #837707 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:50

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 10:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Maybe they have a trade up their sleeve for a RHD that includes the St. Louis picks.. and they preemptively cleared cap to to do it.. but I doubt it .. wishful thinking.. Mr. Emberson looks our Broberg replacement

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837712 is a reply to message #837707 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:50

nullterm
Messages: 1028
Registered: July 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC

1 Cup

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 10:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Yeah, the Ceci trade is now a big w.t.f in hindsight (except for people that didn't like his play).

Maybe if that Emberson kid pans out it makes sense.

And, https://puckpedia.com/team/edmonton-oilers

Illegitimi non carborundum.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837714 is a reply to message #837712 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:52

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

nullterm wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:50

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 10:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Yeah, the Ceci trade is now a big w.t.f in hindsight (except for people that didn't like his play).

Maybe if that Emberson kid pans out it makes sense.

And, https://puckpedia.com/team/edmonton-oilers

It's possible Emberson is a better NHL player than Broberg already, so there is that.

Ceci is also not good, and replacing him has probably always been a must for this team to have a solid top 4 D group.

It would be funny if Grier (aka Greer), was the one that called up Bowman looking for Ceci, thinking he could take advantage of us being on the ropes :)

Where we stand now, we have lots of cap space with Kane going to LTIR to actually fix this D group. And some extra picks to make a trade. It's not too bad.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837716 is a reply to message #837712 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:58

Adam
Messages: 7164
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

nullterm wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:50

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 10:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Yeah, the Ceci trade is now a big w.t.f in hindsight (except for people that didn't like his play).

Maybe if that Emberson kid pans out it makes sense.

And, https://puckpedia.com/team/edmonton-oilers

That's a player in full decline with a $3.25MM contract for this year. He can't possibly live up to that deal, so trading him is a net benefit.

Having the ability to match the offer was probably pretty key in negotiating the additional compensation from St. Louis. A 3rd in 2028 and a 19-year old former 5th round pick are not huge pieces, but they are better than just a 2nd and a 3rd alone for those two players.

We now have room to buy if there's a piece that's worth acquiring. If we find someone who's a top-4 RHD, we can just act without trying to find a way to park a contract to make it work. There's a real value to that.

Finally, if the team doesn't make any more moves, they can start the season with Kane on the roster and then put him on LTIR. I don't quite understand the mechanics, but that's better for the Oilers than if they put him on LTIR before the season.

I think Emberton is a pretty good gamble and may be better than Ceci as early as now.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837717 is a reply to message #837716 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:03

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:58

nullterm wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:50

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 10:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Yeah, the Ceci trade is now a big w.t.f in hindsight (except for people that didn't like his play).

Maybe if that Emberson kid pans out it makes sense.

And, https://puckpedia.com/team/edmonton-oilers

That's a player in full decline with a $3.25MM contract for this year. He can't possibly live up to that deal, so trading him is a net benefit.

Having the ability to match the offer was probably pretty key in negotiating the additional compensation from St. Louis. A 3rd in 2028 and a 19-year old former 5th round pick are not huge pieces, but they are better than just a 2nd and a 3rd alone for those two players.

We now have room to buy if there's a piece that's worth acquiring. If we find someone who's a top-4 RHD, we can just act without trying to find a way to park a contract to make it work. There's a real value to that.

Finally, if the team doesn't make any more moves, they can start the season with Kane on the roster and then put him on LTIR. I don't quite understand the mechanics, but that's better for the Oilers than if they put him on LTIR before the season.

I think Emberton is a pretty good gamble and may be better than Ceci as early as now.

I think LTIR before season, your cap limit becomes your current roster + Kane's cap hit. Which could be lower than the normal cap limit + Kane's cap.

So, say you need to be 2M over the cap (90M) to start the season and need to use Kane's LTIR to be under the limit, you actually only get +2M on the 88M cap to work with to start the year. Your cap limit is 90M until Kane comes off LTIR (you need to move 2M out to do that) and resets your limit to 88M.

But, say you are at 88M or under, including Kane, and don't need Kane on LTIR to start the year. You go into the year with the normal 88M limit, and then can LTIR Kane to have the full 5.125M of extra space.

I think that's how it works at least. Basically it's a punishment for not being able to be under the cap to start the year without using LTIR.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837723 is a reply to message #837717 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:18

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:03

.. I think LTIR before season, your cap limit becomes your current roster + Kane's cap hit. Which could be lower than the normal cap limit + Kane's cap.

So, say you need to be 2M over the cap (90M) to start the season and need to use Kane's LTIR to be under the limit, you actually only get +2M on the 88M cap to work with to start the year. Your cap limit is 90M until Kane comes off LTIR (you need to move 2M out to do that) and resets your limit to 88M.

But, say you are at 88M or under, including Kane, and don't need Kane on LTIR to start the year. You go into the year with the normal 88M limit, and then can LTIR Kane to have the full 5.125M of extra space.

I think that's how it works at least. Basically it's a punishment for not being able to be under the cap to start the year without using LTIR.

If that's the case maybe any trade they are looking at for a RHD that costs some cap will happen after start of season so they don't need to put Kane on LTIR before the season to be cap compliant.. ??

What a mess.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 12:19]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837713 is a reply to message #837707 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:51

bigEfromGP
Messages: 816
Registered: July 2006
Location: GP, AB

No Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Who knows, maybe Ceci has been on the block all summer and this was the only opportunity that came forward to move him. I don't think the loss of Ceci and Broberg changes this team's chances of making the playoffs.

CrusaderPi wrote on Fri, 09 October 2020 13:17

CrudeRemarks wrote on Fri, 09 October 2020 13:00

The president thinks he has the ideal male body.
It's hard to disagree that he has the ideal male body.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837720 is a reply to message #837713 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:10

CrusaderPi
Messages: 7793
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

bigEfromGP wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:51

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

Trading Ceci at a time when they had no leverage and knew they needed someone to fill his spot is the part that I don't understand. Losing a couple of prospects because of cap troubles and not overpaying is mostly fine. But why trade Ceci now?

Is there a new capfriendly site?

Who knows, maybe Ceci has been on the block all summer and this was the only opportunity that came forward to move him. I don't think the loss of Ceci and Broberg changes this team's chances of making the playoffs.

I don't mind that way of thinking. The offer sheets stirred up the sleepy cabin folk in Muskoka and finally got some interest up. I agree the team can make the playoffs and be successful without Ceci, but they've lost 3 defense now and only returned 1. I have some concern about the depth. We'll see. A lot of summer left

I also see they got something named Paul Fischer and a 2028 (lol) 3rd rounder out of the Blues for not matching and future considerations. So that's nice.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837730 is a reply to message #837707 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:00

Adrean
Messages: 46
Registered: January 2006
Location: Calgary (for work, not th...

No Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

Is there a new capfriendly site?

https://capwages.com/

benv wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 Adrean wins his first Survivor title!
CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 13 February 2019 Mighty Adrean is a two time champion
CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 19 February 2020 For the third time Adam's Dad stands victorious

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837732 is a reply to message #837730 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:05

CrusaderPi
Messages: 7793
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

Adrean wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 13:00

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

Is there a new capfriendly site?

https://capwages.com/

Beauty. Thank you.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837734 is a reply to message #837732 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:06

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:05

Adrean wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 13:00

CrusaderPi wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:43

Is there a new capfriendly site?

https://capwages.com/

Beauty. Thank you.

https://puckpedia.com/team/edmonton-oilers

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837708 is a reply to message #837704 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:44

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:39

Brutal.

Two 1st rounders.. developed into NHL players.. gone for nothing..

Had the cap space.. choose to do nothing.. big loss in roster value for the franchise..

Have no idea now why they traded Ceci when they did.

hey, we got a 2nd and a 3rd! :)

Broberg couldn't have been worth more than a 2nd before that little playoff stint. Former 1st round pick, trending to be a bottom pair D.

For sure you'd rather see these guys you developed so long play out, but Broberg probably got 3x his current value, and Holloway an extra 700k or so. Good for them on the payday. And we get some extra players to cheer against, which is always fun :)

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837715 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 11:54

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

UPDATE: from Stauffer..

Oilers squeezed an extra 3rd and a prospect from St. Louis NOT to qualify Broberg and Holloway..
Still a loss..

Quote:

Edmonton Oilers@EdmontonOilers

The Oilers have announced they will not match contract offer sheets presented by St. Louis to Dylan Holloway & Philip Broberg.

In a separate transaction, Edmonton acquires a 2028 third-round pick & the rights to defenceman Paul Fischer from the Blues.

Fischer is a LHD.. picked 5th round by St. Louis.. 19 years old.. at Notre Dame.. sounds like a stay at home D-man.. I suspect he's like a Phil Kemp .. throw in

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 12:01]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837721 is a reply to message #837715 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:11

smyth260
Messages: 1065
Registered: November 2007

1 Cup

That’s very interesting. I would have never thought to squeeze an extra asset out of St. Louis by threatening to match.

Getting out of Ceci, acquiring a couple potential replacements, and squeezing out an extra 3rd by just saying “we’ll match if you don’t pay up…”, some nice work in a bad situation.

Clean house or bust

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837718 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:07

Adam
Messages: 7164
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Quote:

Colton Pankiw
@Coltonpankiw

Fun tidbit, not sure if it’s already been put out there. Players need at least 80 NHL games to be eligible for an offer sheet. Broberg had 81. Two less games and he’d remain with the #Oilers

Bruce McCurdy
@BruceMcCurdy

Broberg got called up & played the last 2 games of the regular season -- blowout losses at ARZ & COL -- to get ready for possible playoff action. Seemed like a good idea at the time.

Haha - oops! I do think we should have someone on staff who looks at some of these player decisions and pushes back if we're going to needlessly trigger some level of pain on ourselves. I think it was Alex Stalock who we started a couple games late in the year for no good reason and cost us an upgraded pick in the trade. Someone should be talking to the coach at some point and flagging that there's a real cost there so if we don't absolutely need the player in the lineup, it should be considered before we're making that call.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837722 is a reply to message #837718 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:13

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Adam wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:07

Quote:

Colton Pankiw
@Coltonpankiw

Fun tidbit, not sure if it’s already been put out there. Players need at least 80 NHL games to be eligible for an offer sheet. Broberg had 81. Two less games and he’d remain with the #Oilers

Bruce McCurdy
@BruceMcCurdy

Broberg got called up & played the last 2 games of the regular season -- blowout losses at ARZ & COL -- to get ready for possible playoff action. Seemed like a good idea at the time.

Haha - oops! I do think we should have someone on staff who looks at some of these player decisions and pushes back if we're going to needlessly trigger some level of pain on ourselves. I think it was Alex Stalock who we started a couple games late in the year for no good reason and cost us an upgraded pick in the trade. Someone should be talking to the coach at some point and flagging that there's a real cost there so if we don't absolutely need the player in the lineup, it should be considered before we're making that call.

What a gong show.. I'm guessing no one thought an offer sheet was ever likely.. every team will now limit their RFA games to under 80 unless they can't .. RFA's are going to be treated a lot differently after this I think..

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837725 is a reply to message #837718 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:35

smyth260
Messages: 1065
Registered: November 2007

1 Cup

Adam wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:07

Quote:

Colton Pankiw
@Coltonpankiw

Fun tidbit, not sure if it’s already been put out there. Players need at least 80 NHL games to be eligible for an offer sheet. Broberg had 81. Two less games and he’d remain with the #Oilers

Bruce McCurdy
@BruceMcCurdy

Broberg got called up & played the last 2 games of the regular season -- blowout losses at ARZ & COL -- to get ready for possible playoff action. Seemed like a good idea at the time.

Haha - oops! I do think we should have someone on staff who looks at some of these player decisions and pushes back if we're going to needlessly trigger some level of pain on ourselves. I think it was Alex Stalock who we started a couple games late in the year for no good reason and cost us an upgraded pick in the trade. Someone should be talking to the coach at some point and flagging that there's a real cost there so if we don't absolutely need the player in the lineup, it should be considered before we're making that call.

Also Bouchard the year before played the final game, got a point to hit 40, and made his bonus. The cap overage went onto the next year.

Although it’s probably not a good long term game with a player to prevent them from hitting performance bonuses.

Clean house or bust

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837719 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:09

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Now hoping Broberg and Holloway turn into complete busts.

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837724 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:23

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Oilers lost some of their best skaters McLeod, Holloway and especially Broberg.. I saw him play AHL.. best skater on the ice by another level..

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837726 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:46

Adam
Messages: 7164
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Out:
Ceci
Broberg
Holloway
3rd
In:
Podkolzin
Emberson
Fischer
2nd
3rd
3rd (2028)
Cap Space

With our familiarity to the guys departing here and their roles in the playoffs it's easy to look at that and think maybe it's creating some holes, but here's their stats with their replacements:

Holloway - 89GP 9-9-18
Podkolzin - 137GP 18-17-35

Broberg - 81GP 2-11-13
Emberson - 30GP 1-9-10

If you look at those as close, then you have basically traded Ceci & a 3rd for a 2nd, two 3rds, a prospect and cap space.

That's a pretty good week.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837735 is a reply to message #837726 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:08

CrusaderPi
Messages: 7793
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:46

Out:
Ceci
Broberg
Holloway
3rd
In:
Podkolzin
Emberson
Fischer
2nd
3rd
3rd (2028)
Cap Space

With our familiarity to the guys departing here and their roles in the playoffs it's easy to look at that and think maybe it's creating some holes, but here's their stats with their replacements:

Holloway - 89GP 9-9-18
Podkolzin - 137GP 18-17-35

Broberg - 81GP 2-11-13
Emberson - 30GP 1-9-10

If you look at those as close, then you have basically traded Ceci & a 3rd for a 2nd, two 3rds, a prospect and cap space.

That's a pretty good week.

I had forgotten the Oilers traded away their first five picks in the upcoming draft. If they didn't see Broberg, Holloway, or Ceci as big pieces of their short term success, they probably made he right call. Need a D though.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837727 is a reply to message #837686 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:52

stemhovlichski
Messages: 349
Registered: March 2006
Location: NSR

No Cups

Just hearing this info:

"Currently to be tendered an offer sheet, a player must: Have at least one NHL contract expire. Have played at least 80 NHL games if a forward or defenseman..."

Philip Broberg Career Stats: GP 81

Oilers played him on April 17 and 18, thereby exposing him to an offer sheet. Keep him off the bench for 2 meaningless games and he is not eligible for the offer sheet.

"Asset management" is not in the Oilers' dictionary.

Restored: "We're sucking hind banana here." - Pat Quinn, Jan 18, 2010

"...the Oilers have been rebuilding for so long that it’s hard not to be cynical." - NBC's Ryan Dadoun Jan 2, 2015

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837729 is a reply to message #837727 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 12:53

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

stemhovlichski wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:52

Just hearing this info:

"Currently to be tendered an offer sheet, a player must: Have at least one NHL contract expire. Have played at least 80 NHL games if a forward or defenseman..."

Philip Broberg Career Stats: GP 81

Oilers played him on April 17 and 18, thereby exposing him to an offer sheet. Keep him off the bench for 2 meaningless games and he is not eligible for the offer sheet.

"Asset management" is not in the Oilers' dictionary.

Do playoff games count toward the total?
If they don't.. Oilers really screwed up.

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837738 is a reply to message #837729 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:30

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:53

stemhovlichski wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:52

Just hearing this info:

"Currently to be tendered an offer sheet, a player must: Have at least one NHL contract expire. Have played at least 80 NHL games if a forward or defenseman..."

Philip Broberg Career Stats: GP 81

Oilers played him on April 17 and 18, thereby exposing him to an offer sheet. Keep him off the bench for 2 meaningless games and he is not eligible for the offer sheet.

"Asset management" is not in the Oilers' dictionary.

Do playoff games count toward the total?
If they don't.. Oilers really screwed up.

Regular season only.

Issue would be, his agent would know this and likely would have been pressuring for Broberg to get over the 80 game mark. And Holland is such a nice guy, he probably kept Broberg in as long as he did to try to work the relationship.

MacT once shut Drai down 1 game before he would have burned an RFA year and that came back to bite us a bit with his agent. Players/agents know what's up.

Considering the Broberg relationship was already kinda sour, I wouldn't have given in and let them get the 80 games. He'd be holding out right now asking for a trade, and we could try to work a better trade for the org after his playoffs. Oh well though, Holland is out.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 13:31]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837743 is a reply to message #837738 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:41

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:30

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:53

stemhovlichski wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:52

Just hearing this info:

"Currently to be tendered an offer sheet, a player must: Have at least one NHL contract expire. Have played at least 80 NHL games if a forward or defenseman..."

Philip Broberg Career Stats: GP 81

Oilers played him on April 17 and 18, thereby exposing him to an offer sheet. Keep him off the bench for 2 meaningless games and he is not eligible for the offer sheet.

"Asset management" is not in the Oilers' dictionary.

Do playoff games count toward the total?
If they don't.. Oilers really screwed up.

Regular season only.

Issue would be, his agent would know this and likely would have been pressuring for Broberg to get over the 80 game mark. And Holland is such a nice guy, he probably kept Broberg in as long as he did to try to work the relationship.

MacT once shut Drai down 1 game before he would have burned an RFA year and that came back to bite us a bit with his agent. Players/agents know what's up.

Considering the Broberg relationship was already kinda sour, I wouldn't have given in and let them get the 80 games. He'd be holding out right now asking for a trade, and we could try to work a better trade for the org after his playoffs. Oh well though, Holland is out.

Somebody really F'd up here then.
How do you NOT have a guy/system who monitors EVERY players RFA/UFA/contract status in real time? Just write a rudimentary computer program ..

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 13:44]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837744 is a reply to message #837743 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:44

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 13:41

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:30

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:53

stemhovlichski wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 11:52

Just hearing this info:

"Currently to be tendered an offer sheet, a player must: Have at least one NHL contract expire. Have played at least 80 NHL games if a forward or defenseman..."

Philip Broberg Career Stats: GP 81

Oilers played him on April 17 and 18, thereby exposing him to an offer sheet. Keep him off the bench for 2 meaningless games and he is not eligible for the offer sheet.

"Asset management" is not in the Oilers' dictionary.

Do playoff games count toward the total?
If they don't.. Oilers really screwed up.

Regular season only.

Issue would be, his agent would know this and likely would have been pressuring for Broberg to get over the 80 game mark. And Holland is such a nice guy, he probably kept Broberg in as long as he did to try to work the relationship.

MacT once shut Drai down 1 game before he would have burned an RFA year and that came back to bite us a bit with his agent. Players/agents know what's up.

Considering the Broberg relationship was already kinda sour, I wouldn't have given in and let them get the 80 games. He'd be holding out right now asking for a trade, and we could try to work a better trade for the org after his playoffs. Oh well though, Holland is out.

Somebody really F'd up here then.
How do you NOT have a guy/system who monitors EVERY players RFA/UFA/contract status in real time?

Giving our management the benefit of the doubt that they did know, but let him his 80 anyways. In general Holland didn't seem to care about our cap or what ppl would deal with after he would be gone, hence the Connor Brown deal and bonuses for Perry. Also, Holland seems to always take the nice generous guy approach with most things. Can afford to, the generational talents will always come through in the end, right? :)

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837746 is a reply to message #837744 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:54

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:44

.. Giving our management the benefit of the doubt that they did know, but let him his 80 anyways. )

You might be right ..

Crew: "Captain looks like there's an iceberg ahead.."

Captain: ".. full speed ahead.."

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837747 is a reply to message #837746 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 13:55

Kr55
Messages: 10713
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 13:54

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:44

.. Giving our management the benefit of the doubt that they did know, but let him his 80 anyways. )

You might be right ..

Crew: "Captain looks like there's an iceberg ahead.."

Captain: ".. full speed ahead.."

Everyone notices the Captain is sailing away on the last lifeboat

Thankfully the mess left behind isn't THAT bad. One could argue the iceberg is Nurse though icon_biggrin

icon_biggrin

Maybe a little bit the 5 years of weak drafting as well.

[Updated on: Tue, 20 August 2024 13:57]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Broberg and Holloway GONE [message #837748 is a reply to message #837747 ]	Tue, 20 August 2024 14:02

Skookum Jim
Messages: 4405
Registered: March 2006
Location: Burnaby, BC

4 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:55

Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 13:54

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 20 August 2024 12:44

.. Giving our management the benefit of the doubt that they did know, but let him his 80 anyways. )

You might be right ..

Crew: "Captain looks like there's an iceberg ahead.."

Captain: ".. full speed ahead.."

Everyone notices the Captain is sailing away on the last lifeboat

Thankfully the mess left behind isn't THAT bad. One could argue the iceberg is Nurse though icon_biggrin

icon_biggrin

Maybe a little bit the 5 years of weak drafting as well.

LOL! Yeah you're right .. the real picture was;

Crew: "Captain looks like there's an iceberg ahead.."

Captain (from Life Boat) : ".. full speed ahead.."

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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