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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829364 is a reply to message #829362 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 12:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 11:38

Adam wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 10:28

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 09:58

I feel bad for McLellan. He's a good coach. Not his fault his GM tried what the Oilers did for years, roll the dice on mediocre goalies and hope they elevate. Talbot is a back up goalie. He had spirts of showing he could maybe start a few years ago but he's a back up goalie. Played well to start but has fallen off to what he is.

Plus the Dubois trade is looking like a disaster. Year 1 so maybe he can turn it around but he's lazy. That's what his big issue has been before the Kings. Lack of compete. You can't coach out lazy. That trade for the Jets looks like an absolutely robbery.

But firing the coach is what happens first.


I feel bad for the Oilers. Todd McLellan is not a good coach, and it's great when your divisional rivals have poor coaching.

Especially nice when they have poor biased coaching that leads him to make snap judgements on players who he deems lazy or entitled or Russian and grinds their playing time or even leaks stories to the media about them (McLellan was obviously the source for the character assassination on young Brandt Clarke to Elliotte Friedman recently).

I'm glad that the Kings just promoted his assistant and so far haven't gone to try to find an improvement out there.

And people come at me giving me crap for apparently being passive aggressive and lashing out at people when I have comments like this thrown at me.

The guy has coached 1144 games, 2 short of 600 wins. He won 164 games for the Kings, lead them to 99 and 104 pt seasons and he's a bad coach. Whatever you say. Holy F man.


He's OK, right up until he faces adversity and needs to adjust, and then everything just crumbles.

He's like the Johnny Gaudreau of coaches. Except Johnny knows what he is so he ran away to hide in a place with gauranteed early summers.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829365 is a reply to message #829362 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 13:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 11:38

Adam wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 10:28

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 09:58

I feel bad for McLellan. He's a good coach. Not his fault his GM tried what the Oilers did for years, roll the dice on mediocre goalies and hope they elevate. Talbot is a back up goalie. He had spirts of showing he could maybe start a few years ago but he's a back up goalie. Played well to start but has fallen off to what he is.

Plus the Dubois trade is looking like a disaster. Year 1 so maybe he can turn it around but he's lazy. That's what his big issue has been before the Kings. Lack of compete. You can't coach out lazy. That trade for the Jets looks like an absolutely robbery.

But firing the coach is what happens first.


I feel bad for the Oilers. Todd McLellan is not a good coach, and it's great when your divisional rivals have poor coaching.

Especially nice when they have poor biased coaching that leads him to make snap judgements on players who he deems lazy or entitled or Russian and grinds their playing time or even leaks stories to the media about them (McLellan was obviously the source for the character assassination on young Brandt Clarke to Elliotte Friedman recently).

I'm glad that the Kings just promoted his assistant and so far haven't gone to try to find an improvement out there.

And people come at me giving me crap for apparently being passive aggressive and lashing out at people when I have comments like this thrown at me.

The guy has coached 1144 games, 2 short of 600 wins. He won 164 games for the Kings, lead them to 99 and 104 pt seasons and he's a bad coach. Whatever you say. Holy F man.


I could maybe understand your outrage if you were Todd McLellan, but nothing I said attacked you. You weren't even mentioned.

Todd McLellan has had the good fortune to coach several really good teams, but he doesn't win championships. I always wondered when he was on the Sharks why they never got over that hill - and being an Oilers fan, I was happy to blame it on the Sharks star players at the time. But the fact is, McLellan was always a big issue. He doesn't adjust strategy at all to what's being thrown at him, and his static approach makes it easier for other teams to game plan on how to beat his teams.

He also is quick to throw players under the bus and make snap judgements on them. Remember Ryan Strome's brief time in Edmonton? In one pre-season game, McLellan decided he was lazy and couldn't play higher than 3rd line here. We played a struggling Milan Lucic for 50 games with top players, in hopes of finally getting him a goal, but Strome never got a second look.

And he leaks to the media both about his own players and about management. The whole "red wine summits" article is so clearly directly from McLellan that you can almost hear his voice as you read it out. The stuff on Clarke this year too. There is a reason why Joe Thornton was vocal that the coach lost the trust of the players in San Jose. Think about how rare it would be to hear a player say something like that about a coach...and I believe Thornton said it before McLellan was even gone suggesting that McLellan had work to do to try to win back the room.

You are absolutely free to have your own opinions on Todd McLellan. Me believing the opposite and saying so is never an attack on you. But you might want to consider my arguments because I think they're pretty strong.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829370 is a reply to message #829365 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 13:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 13:20

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 11:38

Adam wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 10:28

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 09:58

I feel bad for McLellan. He's a good coach. Not his fault his GM tried what the Oilers did for years, roll the dice on mediocre goalies and hope they elevate. Talbot is a back up goalie. He had spirts of showing he could maybe start a few years ago but he's a back up goalie. Played well to start but has fallen off to what he is.

Plus the Dubois trade is looking like a disaster. Year 1 so maybe he can turn it around but he's lazy. That's what his big issue has been before the Kings. Lack of compete. You can't coach out lazy. That trade for the Jets looks like an absolutely robbery.

But firing the coach is what happens first.


I feel bad for the Oilers. Todd McLellan is not a good coach, and it's great when your divisional rivals have poor coaching.

Especially nice when they have poor biased coaching that leads him to make snap judgements on players who he deems lazy or entitled or Russian and grinds their playing time or even leaks stories to the media about them (McLellan was obviously the source for the character assassination on young Brandt Clarke to Elliotte Friedman recently).

I'm glad that the Kings just promoted his assistant and so far haven't gone to try to find an improvement out there.

And people come at me giving me crap for apparently being passive aggressive and lashing out at people when I have comments like this thrown at me.

The guy has coached 1144 games, 2 short of 600 wins. He won 164 games for the Kings, lead them to 99 and 104 pt seasons and he's a bad coach. Whatever you say. Holy F man.


You are absolutely free to have your own opinions on Todd McLellan. Me believing the opposite and saying so is never an attack on you. But you might want to consider my arguments because I think they're pretty strong.

There is nothing to consider. You think he's a bad coach. I don't. End of story. I don't know the guy, I don't want him as the Oilers coach. I am not a fan. I simply don't believe a guy coaches 1144 games and win almost 600 games in the NHL if you are a bad coach. You are free to not like his coaching style or the system he likes to do. That's cool. But to say he's bad at coaching is wrong, flat out wrong.

If you are going to respond, please don't use what I see as your standard, silly argument. I don't think every guy in NHL management is stupid and fans are smarter. I have my own opinions but I'm not arrogant enough to think I know more than guys who work in the industry. Doesn't mean they are always right, they are human, they make mistakes too but telling me what I expect you to say, which is telling me he's a bad coach and McLellan only gets jobs because GM's are stupid. I am sorry, I will never accept that and think it's utter BS.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829382 is a reply to message #829370 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 17:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 13:46


There is nothing to consider. You think he's a bad coach. I don't. End of story. I don't know the guy, I don't want him as the Oilers coach. I am not a fan. I simply don't believe a guy coaches 1144 games and win almost 600 games in the NHL if you are a bad coach. You are free to not like his coaching style or the system he likes to do. That's cool. But to say he's bad at coaching is wrong, flat out wrong.

If you are going to respond, please don't use what I see as your standard, silly argument. I don't think every guy in NHL management is stupid and fans are smarter. I have my own opinions but I'm not arrogant enough to think I know more than guys who work in the industry. Doesn't mean they are always right, they are human, they make mistakes too but telling me what I expect you to say, which is telling me he's a bad coach and McLellan only gets jobs because GM's are stupid. I am sorry, I will never accept that and think it's utter BS.


Not to get too far off course, but you were upset at me because you thought my criticism of McLellan was somehow a personal attack on you, but now you are making direct personal attacks on my "standard silly" approach.

To address a couple of things in your post, never ever believe that I think fans generally are smarter than GMs and coaches. I think there are a lot of fans who I barely trust in the building as fans, never mind thinking they could capably fill those roles.

I think that it is an easier transition from a player to a coach than it is from player to GM. So less concerned about coaches making that jump although my preference is still guys who've maybe had some actual training and reps at lower levels, rather than jumping straight to the NHL untested.

I would suggest that many NHL teams don't put much thought in to their hires at GM, despite how critical that role is to their team's progression. I believe that's why so many teams who are bad stay bad, while some that are the class of the league can stay there for long periods of time, or when they do have a bad stretch, they bounce back quickly.

If you look at how the Oilers hired their GM's, for example, Kevin Lowe was the coach, so they just promoted him without any hiring process. Tambellini was buddies with Lowe from Team Canada and was an Assistant GM in Vancouver, so they hired him without running a process. Craig MacTavish was a former player and head coach and a very good friend of Kevin Lowe, so was again hired without any kind of process. Bob Nicholson was added to the management team because he was a buddy of Kevin Lowe from Team Canada and the team could say that they were addressing concerns with the team's poor play. I do think that he still hasn't yet finished his "forensic report" on the team's struggles. Then Chiarelli was hired while they still had a GM who they shuffled to an Assistant GM role. He was friends with Lowe from Team Canada, and besides, he'd won a Cup as GM (which none of the rest could say) and the heat on the team had really increased after 8 years of being absolutely awful. Keith Gretzky was brother of the team's vice-chair and buddy of the rest of the crew. The Oilers gave him the interim title and spent weeks talking about how they might actually do a process. They may have even done an interview or two, while getting Stauffer to talk up how much people liked Gretzky in the roll. Then, Bob Nicholson polled other GMs at the GMs meetings about what he should do and several told him that he should call the old guy that Detroit just put out to pasture. Holland had all the right credentials. He'd worked with Team Canada at various points. He knew Kevin Lowe. He'd even been GM for a couple of Cups - although none for a decade while presiding over a team in slow decline with dreadful drafting and no record of winning trades.

All that to say, yes, I think there are lots of fans who could be better candidates. If I was hiring a GM, I would be looking for some really important elements:
- a strong background in negotiations and a strong aptitude for them
- a quick grasp of new concepts and the ability to understand the value or lack thereof
- the ability to build a strong team with diverse viewpoints and skillsets
- great listening ability and an open mind
- great ability to delegate authority where appropriate

Played the game at the NHL level wouldn't be in my top-20 items on the wishlist, because I don't think playing hockey professionally prepares you for any of the above points. Most people who would apply would have either played the game at SOME level or been deeply immersed in it otherwise, but even that isn't as big a pre-requisite as the above items.

My point is not that GMs and coaches are stupid, it's that teams hire people who's skillsets don't align closely with the job that they're being asked to do - and in a lot of cases, just hire them because they either used to be a player, or they know a bunch of guys on the management team. I think that often hockey players like to run in packs and they feel most comfortable with a group of other hockey players so they tend to badly fail at building diverse teams. I think they're also the group most likely to dismiss new ideas simply because someone "didn't play the game".

To tie all this back to McLellan - he has had some level of success because given no adversity and a good team, he can win games as a head coach. But I think that his inability to adapt makes him a weak coach, and his approach to players and media makes him a bad coach.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829395 is a reply to message #829382 ]
Mon, 05 February 2024 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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I'd also like to point out that winning nearly 600 games while coaching nearly 1200 games REALLY isn't a feather in the cap... Solid 50%.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829363 is a reply to message #829355 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 11:56 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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inverno76 wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 09:35

T-Mac is gonzo out of LA. From Jack Adams talk to the unemployment line.


Was following the Kings pretty close this year. TMac has not changed at all. Falls back on vets and stops trusting young players when things are going bad, no ability to adjust, runs 1 goalie into the ground.

Did all the same stuff he did here. It's too bad they fired him though, I think LA has a decent team. Hopefully they don't recover this year.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829390 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Sun, 04 February 2024 14:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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Ok, that's finally over. Amazing 8 forward 1 D team 3v3 nappy time hockey.

Just.hope the Oilers can come out still rolling.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829429 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Tue, 06 February 2024 12:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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No wants to mention that the Bison King has returned to the NHL? Two years at pretty much league minimum. I hope he is healthy and finds his way. You need to admire his determination to pursue his NHL dream. I am sure he could have made a very nice living in Europe.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829431 is a reply to message #829429 ]
Tue, 06 February 2024 12:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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inverno76 wrote on Tue, 06 February 2024 12:01

No wants to mention that the Bison King has returned to the NHL? Two years at pretty much league minimum. I hope he is healthy and finds his way. You need to admire his determination to pursue his NHL dream. I am sure he could have made a very nice living in Europe.

He would make WAY less in Europe than the NHL. I am sure this is his last chance.

His 2 yr deal is really 1.5. With the cap going up next year, I bet 800k is league min. He's making appropriate money for what he is which is a bottom 6, defensive forward.

Worth a shot by the Pens. The need lots of forwards.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829434 is a reply to message #829431 ]
Tue, 06 February 2024 12:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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RDOilerfan wrote on Tue, 06 February 2024 12:05

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 06 February 2024 12:01

No wants to mention that the Bison King has returned to the NHL? Two years at pretty much league minimum. I hope he is healthy and finds his way. You need to admire his determination to pursue his NHL dream. I am sure he could have made a very nice living in Europe.

He would make WAY less in Europe than the NHL. I am sure this is his last chance.

His 2 yr deal is really 1.5. With the cap going up next year, I bet 800k is league min. He's making appropriate money for what he is which is a bottom 6, defensive forward.

Worth a shot by the Pens. The need lots of forwards.


Unless things have changed since my friends have played overseas there are a lot of benefits that come with playing in Europe. Money is less, but the lifestyle was great. Living costs were absorbed by the team. Family set up with good jobs and the team will take care of you after your hockey career.

It sounds kind of like how a player can make much less immediate money being a star in the CFL, over being a practice roster player in the NFL, but long-term there is a valid argument to staying in the lesser league for long-term stability.


That being said, Jesse is chasing his potential much like how Daigle never completely quit on the NHL.

Speaking of the Alex the Great, has anyone watched his new Doc on Crave? I'm downloading it for a future flight. He had an extremely interesting career path.

https://youtu.be/kdajo9qvIdg?si=LJP5xy5qY2ya0lQy

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829436 is a reply to message #829434 ]
Tue, 06 February 2024 13:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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JP is only 25. There is still time for him to establish an NHL career. I would guess though that if he doesn't do well with the Pens. After next season, he will be in Europe. At 800K, it's not a bad bet for the Pens. I'd assume he will get the rest of this season to see if he can play. If he can't, you can bury all of his 800K next season.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829506 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829507 is a reply to message #829506 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 14:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00

Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.

About time the rich pay their fair share.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829529 is a reply to message #829507 ]
Thu, 08 February 2024 09:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:09

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00

Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.

About time the rich pay their fair share.


It is hard to feel bad for him when he is just being taxed like everyone else in our country. Fortunately for him, missing 40% of a paycheque still allows him to do whatever the eff he wants to do.


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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829508 is a reply to message #829506 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 14:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829512 is a reply to message #829508 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 16:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kungpaobenji27 is currently offline kungpaobenji27
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 15:10

Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.


Sad when even Big Daddy Bettman loses patience with the Coyotes situation...

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829518 is a reply to message #829512 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 19:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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kungpaobenji27 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 16:46

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 15:10

Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.


Sad when even Big Daddy Bettman loses patience with the Coyotes situation...

Amazing it only took *checks notes* 28 years.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #831751 is a reply to message #829512 ]
Wed, 10 April 2024 13:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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kungpaobenji27 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 16:46

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 15:10

Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.


Sad when even Big Daddy Bettman loses patience with the Coyotes situation...

Rumors are swirling on X, and maybe elsewhere, that the Coyotes maybe moving to Salt Lake as early as next season.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #831812 is a reply to message #831751 ]
Fri, 12 April 2024 14:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kungpaobenji27 is currently offline kungpaobenji27
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 10 April 2024 14:35

kungpaobenji27 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 16:46

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 15:10

Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.


Sad when even Big Daddy Bettman loses patience with the Coyotes situation...

Rumors are swirling on X, and maybe elsewhere, that the Coyotes maybe moving to Salt Lake as early as next season.


Yep yep...NHL has drafted two schedules for this franchise with one being based out of Phoenix/Tempe & other SLC.

There's supposedly other suitors for their prospective land grab in the Phoenix area too; looks like whatever land grab they can successfully acquire will have to be allocated for another expansion franchise.

Skookum Jim wrote on Fri, 12 April 2024 13:38

Hey what were the (Vegas) odds of this happening? lmao

Quote:

Golden Knights' Mark Stone cleared to practice in non-contact jersey

https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/golden-knights-mark-sto ne-cleared-to-practise-in-non-contact-jersey/


NHL is a JOKE.

He'll be ready to go game #1 of playoffs just as predicted.. by everyone.. I like the part where Vegas "clears" Stone to practice with a "non-contact" jersey rofl .. Vegas is basically telling the NHL "yeah.. we pulled another cap fraud scam.. what are you going to do about it.. that's right - nothing.. you putz.. LOL! "

Dr. Gregor was telling everyone that "lacerated spleen" is a very SERIOUS injury.. "all YOU people that think he'll be back for game #1 are so dumb.. you know nothing about medicine.. morons.. "
Gregor is the chump.. he actually believed the Vegas medical staff.. like they couldn't be persuaded ($) to embellish an injury prognosis.


Oh.. and Vegas just signed Hanifin to a 8 x $7.375M contract..



Oh yes...the miracle none of us expected....

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #831838 is a reply to message #831751 ]
Fri, 12 April 2024 21:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kungpaobenji27 is currently offline kungpaobenji27
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 10 April 2024 14:35

kungpaobenji27 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 16:46

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 15:10

Meanwhile the NHL is harassing the Coyotes to figure their situation out. Apparently the league is going to make an announcement concerning the yotes after the super bowl. Source Any Strickland on X.

Salt Lake City, here we come.


Sad when even Big Daddy Bettman loses patience with the Coyotes situation...

Rumors are swirling on X, and maybe elsewhere, that the Coyotes maybe moving to Salt Lake as early as next season.


And it's been confirmed....according to Friedman, Coyotes GM has informed players of the move to SLC before this current Oilers tilt...

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #831897 is a reply to message #831838 ]
Mon, 15 April 2024 08:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NZ Oiler Fan is currently offline NZ Oiler Fan
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Fingers crossed that LA can win out, starting tonight vs Minny. I really don't want to face Vegas in round 1, and Vegas has an easy last couple of games (Chi, Ana)

Let Dallas deal with Vegas.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829509 is a reply to message #829506 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 16:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00

Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.


I'm super curious to hear the tax planning that allows him to pay just 15% on that kind of earnings. Most people would be paying close to 50%.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829520 is a reply to message #829509 ]
Wed, 07 February 2024 22:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kungpaobenji27 is currently offline kungpaobenji27
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Adam wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 17:20

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00

Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.


I'm super curious to hear the tax planning that allows him to pay just 15% on that kind of earnings. Most people would be paying close to 50%.


Even in "no state income tax locations" of the US, it'd be somewhere around 37%.

The loopholes only come if you own your own business (extra independent contractor agreements on endorsements/sponsorships/commercials in the case of professional athletes) and not a base salary from an employer....

[Updated on: Wed, 07 February 2024 22:18]

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829538 is a reply to message #829509 ]
Thu, 08 February 2024 14:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Greg is currently offline Greg
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Adam wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 16:20

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 07 February 2024 14:00

Rick Westhead

@rwesthead
Maple Leafs captain John Tavares is fighting the Canada Revenue Agency over an $8M tax bill.
Tavares says he should owe 15% on a US$15.3M signing bonus he received when he signed with Toronto in 2018. The CRA says the bonus should be taxed at 38%.
via
@glen_mcgregor




JT only wears the Maple Leaf jammies when it's convenient for him.


I'm super curious to hear the tax planning that allows him to pay just 15% on that kind of earnings. Most people would be paying close to 50%.


Maybe this: https://gblinc.ca/the-rca-helping-professional-hockey-player s-pay-substantially-less-income-tax/

More info here: https://ca.rbcwealthmanagement.com/documents/17271/17295/Rei trement+Compensation+Arrangements+%28RCAs%29%20for+NHL.pdf

[Updated on: Thu, 08 February 2024 14:08]

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829560 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Fri, 09 February 2024 12:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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I was listening to Stauffer the other day after the Vegas game and a guy texted in something about "look up Vegas penalty minutes for 22-23" .. the guys on air weren't sure what he was talking about so I looked it up.. I think he was implying that Vegas gets some preferential ref treatment.. maybe in return for some home game VIP passes on the Strip? ;)

So I looked it up.. Pretty interesting ..in 22-23 season .. Vegas was dead last in penalties.. hard to believe.. with the style Vegas plays.. apparently the refs consider them the NHL's Lady Byng team.. maybe they should get a team award :)
Vegas had 589.. Ottawa had the most 1,027 .. Oilers 706

https://www.espn.com/nhl/stats/team/_/view/skating/season/20 23/seasontype/2/table/penalties/sort/penaltyMinutes/dir/desc

2022-23
1	Vegas Golden Knights	589
2	Buffalo Sabres	        608
3	Carolina Hurricanes	614
4	New York Rangers	625
5	New Jersey Devils	632
6	Dallas Stars	        637
7	St. Louis Blues	        641
8	Columbus Blue Jackets	654
9	New York Islanders	656
10	Detroit Red Wings	662
11	San Jose Sharks	        667
12	Colorado Avalanche	675
13	Toronto Maple Leafs	691
14	Seattle Kraken	        698
15	Winnipeg Jets	        699
16	Los Angeles Kings	703
17	Pittsburgh Penguins	705
18	Edmonton Oilers        706
19	Chicago Blackhawks	707
20	Washington Capitals	713
21	Vancouver Canucks	734
22	Calgary Flames	        757
23	Nashville Predators	791
24	Philadelphia Flyers	855
25	Boston Bruins	        861
26	Minnesota Wild	        925
27	Anaheim Ducks	        929
28	Montreal Canadiens	955
29	Arizona Coyotes	        972
30	Tampa Bay Lightning	995
31	Florida Panthers        998
32	Ottawa Senators	1,027


year before 2021-22
1	Dallas Stars       551
2	Pittsburgh Penguins	566
3	St. Louis Blues           611
4	Vegas Golden Knights	624
5	Washington Capitals	631
6	Columbus Blue Jackets	635
7	Los Angeles Kings	635
8	Chicago Blackhawks	646
9	Vancouver Canucks	655
10	Edmonton Oilers         666
11	Buffalo Sabres          667
12	New Jersey Devils	668
13	New York Rangers	675
14	Seattle Kraken           700
15	Toronto Maple Leafs	702
16	Winnipeg Jets            722
17	San Jose Sharks        725
18	New York Islanders	729
19	Detroit Red Wings	733
20	Philadelphia Flyers	739
21	Colorado Avalanche	742
22	Calgary Flames          744
23	Carolina Hurricanes	758
24	Anaheim Ducks           759
25	Boston Bruins           809
26	Ottawa Senators         822
27	Florida Panthers        832
28	Montreal Canadiens	836
29	Arizona Coyotes         840
30	Minnesota Wild          882
31	Tampa Bay Lightning     901
32	Nashville Predators	1,035


Table below is last 6 years including this year.. Vegas ranks 5th lowest (excluding Kraken)
Note: over last 5 full seasons Vegas has ranked 1, 4, 9, 14, 5 in fewest penalty minutes..

		               23-24	22-23	21-22 	20-21 	19-20	18-19	
1	Seattle Kraken	        403	698	700				 1,801 
2	Columbus Blue Jackets  402	654	635	391	458	512	 3,052 
3	Buffalo Sabres	        488	608	667	342	479	570	 3,154 
4	Dallas Stars	        362	637	551	410	568	631	 3,159 
5	St. Louis Blues	        330	641	611	456	513	623	 3,174 
6	Vegas Golden Knights	408	589	624	408	566	583	 3,178 
7	Toronto Maple Leafs	447	691	702	390	472	503	 3,205 
8	Pittsburgh Penguins	347	705	566	441	517	675	 3,251 
9	Los Angeles Kings	398	703	635	395	479	663	 3,273 
10	Chicago Blackhawks	467	707	646	368	548	600	 3,336 
11	New York Islanders	390	656	729	370	575	644	 3,364 
12	Carolina Hurricanes	457	614	758	414	588	618	 3,449 
13	New Jersey Devils	400	632	668	385	666	745	 3,496 
14	Detroit Red Wings	456	662	733	412	599	649	 3,511 
15	Winnipeg Jets	        408	699	722	404	525	759	 3,517 
16	Edmonton Oilers     	448	706	666	434	577	754	 3,585 
17	Calgary Flames	        432	757	744	449	615	695	 3,692 
18	Washington Capitals	405	713	631	527	699	730	 3,705 
19	Vancouver Canucks	458	734	655	551	643	721	 3,762 
20	Colorado Avalanche	525	675	742	499	597	772	 3,810 
21	San Jose Sharks	        498	667	725	514	723	749	 3,876 
22	Arizona Coyotes	        603	972	840	446	454	579	 3,894 
23	Philadelphia Flyers	544	855	739	517	526	731	 3,912 
24	New York Rangers	431	625	675	565	781	854	 3,931 
25	Montreal Canadiens	496	955	836	465	546	682	 3,980 
26	Minnesota Wild	        590	925	882	498	560	656	 4,111 
27	Nashville Predators	503	791	1,035	514	618	686	 4,147 
28	Boston Bruins	        527	861	809	533	682	797	 4,209 
29	Florida Panthers        635	998	832	568	500	688	 4,221 
30	Ottawa Senators     	566	1,027	822	509	682	693	 4,299 
31	Anaheim Ducks	        711	929	759	500	725	736	 4,360 
32	Tampa Bay Lightning	530	995	901	597	723	779	 4,525 
	Total	                15,065  24,081  23,240  14,272  8,204   21,077

[Updated on: Fri, 09 February 2024 12:03]

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829561 is a reply to message #829560 ]
Fri, 09 February 2024 12:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Steve is currently offline Steve
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Those numbers aren't too far out of whack to be a real concern. More likely it has to do with good management and coaching. I wouldn't be surprised if they scout each ref in the league and come into the game with penalty-management plan.

"Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us."

- Calvin

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829564 is a reply to message #829561 ]
Fri, 09 February 2024 14:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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I'd kinda be curious to see how those lined up with PP chances for.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829568 is a reply to message #829561 ]
Fri, 09 February 2024 17:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Steve wrote on Fri, 09 February 2024 11:43

Those numbers aren't too far out of whack to be a real concern. More likely it has to do with good management and coaching.[/COLOR I wouldn't be surprised if they scout each ref in the league and come into the game with penalty-management plan. [COLOR=blue]]



.. or .. scout which VIP room each ref prefers.. with bonus perks for the refs to "keep it fair.." 😉
https://media1.tenor.com/m/GkNqWQvQFQUAAAAd/caddyshack-keep-it-fair.gif

[Updated on: Sat, 10 February 2024 01:25]

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829632 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Sat, 10 February 2024 19:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NetBOG is currently offline NetBOG
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Morgan Reilly chrosschecks Ridley Greig in the head after he scores an empty net goal.

Toronto homer announcers completely play it down.

Toronto homer analysts all down play it except Hrudy who truthfully says it should be a 5 or 6 game suspension,

Now Ron McLean just grasping straws for excuses (we noticed this little thing earlier in the game).

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829633 is a reply to message #829632 ]
Sat, 10 February 2024 20:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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NetBOG wrote on Sat, 10 February 2024 19:53

Morgan Reilly chrosschecks Ridley Greig in the head after he scores an empty net goal.

Toronto homer announcers completely play it down.

Toronto homer analysts all down play it except Hrudy who truthfully says it should be a 5 or 6 game suspension,

Now Ron McLean just grasping straws for excuses (we noticed this little thing earlier in the game).


Reilly always comes off as an entitled brat when things aren't going his way. He chases McDavid around all the time, acting like a fake tough guy, because he can never get over that goal where McDavid completely embarrassed him, just jumping around him from a standstill.

Hope a suspension for Reilly. Definitely agree the hnic panel embarrassed themselves. The lady even said he liked that Reilly went for a hit (because Grieg shot into the empty net disrespectfully hard), 5 seconds after the play was dead and the goal was scored. Yeah, lots of love for a cheap shot attempt, chasing a guy down on a dead play.

[Updated on: Sat, 10 February 2024 20:04]

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- Lowe, 2013

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829666 is a reply to message #829633 ]
Sun, 11 February 2024 07:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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I like the fact that Reilly went over to Greig, but that was beyond excessive. I hope they hammer Reilly.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829708 is a reply to message #829666 ]
Tue, 13 February 2024 19:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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inverno76 wrote on Sun, 11 February 2024 06:49

I like the fact that Reilly went over to Greig, but that was beyond excessive. I hope they hammer Reilly.


If Reilly just went over to Grieg and dropped the gloves that would have been a reasonable and understandable response, one on one confrontation.. but he came over cross checked him square in the head.. clear stick infraction.. 5 games is on par.. likely more (6+) if he had previous infractions.. 8 if he was an Oiler ;)

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829667 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Sun, 11 February 2024 11:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NetBOG is currently offline NetBOG
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Sportsnet panel just embarrassing themselves trying to defend Reilly.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829673 is a reply to message #829667 ]
Mon, 12 February 2024 09:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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I got no issue if Reilly went over and gave Grieg a shove or got in his face. Greig did that to rub it in their face. But jumping on him and pounding away is unnecessary.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829686 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Mon, 12 February 2024 14:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NetBOG is currently offline NetBOG
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Leafs media outraged, OUTRAGED! today that Reilly is getting more than a 2 game suspension for crosschecking somebody in the face after the play with 5 seconds left in the game.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829688 is a reply to message #829686 ]
Mon, 12 February 2024 15:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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I think part of the problem is Reilly isn't a player who does that kind of stuff ever or is even a physical dman. So you sometimes see guys who aren't physical at all, when they try to be, it doesn't go well or they cross the line a bit unintentionally.

I don't think Reilly intended on hitting him in the face when he responded, but it happened. That being said, you still have to give him a good suspension to make it known to others.

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829691 is a reply to message #829686 ]
Mon, 12 February 2024 18:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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https://forums.hfboards.com/attachments/img_8049-jpeg.818285/

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829692 is a reply to message #829686 ]
Mon, 12 February 2024 18:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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NetBOG wrote on Mon, 12 February 2024 14:58

Leafs media outraged, OUTRAGED! today that Reilly is getting more than a 2 game suspension for crosschecking somebody in the face after the play with 5 seconds left in the game.


It is really something. TSN's site is just DOMINATED with breathless coverage of it and we haven't even heard what the suspension is yet.

It was an absolutely stupid play to come in with stick high after the play. The precedents on that are generally pretty severe. It's not Dale Hunter-serious because there wasn't the same injury, but it's in the same spirit. The play is long dead and there's just no reason that justifies that play.

And now he'll have a long time to sit and think about what he did.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829694 is a reply to message #829692 ]
Tue, 13 February 2024 08:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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Adam wrote on Mon, 12 February 2024 18:33

NetBOG wrote on Mon, 12 February 2024 14:58

Leafs media outraged, OUTRAGED! today that Reilly is getting more than a 2 game suspension for crosschecking somebody in the face after the play with 5 seconds left in the game.


It is really something. TSN's site is just DOMINATED with breathless coverage of it and we haven't even heard what the suspension is yet.

It was an absolutely stupid play to come in with stick high after the play. The precedents on that are generally pretty severe. It's not Dale Hunter-serious because there wasn't the same injury, but it's in the same spirit. The play is long dead and there's just no reason that justifies that play.

And now he'll have a long time to sit and think about what he did.


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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829709 is a reply to message #825593 ]
Tue, 13 February 2024 19:22 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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LA losing to Buffalo 7-0 .. the coaching change has fizzled already.. emptied their emotional tank vs. the Oilers..

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!! (Thank you Lord!)
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World

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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829715 is a reply to message #829709 ]
Tue, 13 February 2024 20:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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Skookum Jim wrote on Tue, 13 February 2024 19:22

LA losing to Buffalo 7-0 .. the coaching change has fizzled already.. emptied their emotional tank vs. the Oilers..


They definitely played that game against us like it was game 7 of the finals. Hope they crater hard

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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