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 Re: 2023-24 OOT Thread [message #829382 is a reply to message #829370 ]
Fri, 02 February 2024 17:34 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Adam is currently offline Adam
Messages: 7757
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB
6 Cups
RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 02 February 2024 13:46


There is nothing to consider. You think he's a bad coach. I don't. End of story. I don't know the guy, I don't want him as the Oilers coach. I am not a fan. I simply don't believe a guy coaches 1144 games and win almost 600 games in the NHL if you are a bad coach. You are free to not like his coaching style or the system he likes to do. That's cool. But to say he's bad at coaching is wrong, flat out wrong.

If you are going to respond, please don't use what I see as your standard, silly argument. I don't think every guy in NHL management is stupid and fans are smarter. I have my own opinions but I'm not arrogant enough to think I know more than guys who work in the industry. Doesn't mean they are always right, they are human, they make mistakes too but telling me what I expect you to say, which is telling me he's a bad coach and McLellan only gets jobs because GM's are stupid. I am sorry, I will never accept that and think it's utter BS.


Not to get too far off course, but you were upset at me because you thought my criticism of McLellan was somehow a personal attack on you, but now you are making direct personal attacks on my "standard silly" approach.

To address a couple of things in your post, never ever believe that I think fans generally are smarter than GMs and coaches. I think there are a lot of fans who I barely trust in the building as fans, never mind thinking they could capably fill those roles.

I think that it is an easier transition from a player to a coach than it is from player to GM. So less concerned about coaches making that jump although my preference is still guys who've maybe had some actual training and reps at lower levels, rather than jumping straight to the NHL untested.

I would suggest that many NHL teams don't put much thought in to their hires at GM, despite how critical that role is to their team's progression. I believe that's why so many teams who are bad stay bad, while some that are the class of the league can stay there for long periods of time, or when they do have a bad stretch, they bounce back quickly.

If you look at how the Oilers hired their GM's, for example, Kevin Lowe was the coach, so they just promoted him without any hiring process. Tambellini was buddies with Lowe from Team Canada and was an Assistant GM in Vancouver, so they hired him without running a process. Craig MacTavish was a former player and head coach and a very good friend of Kevin Lowe, so was again hired without any kind of process. Bob Nicholson was added to the management team because he was a buddy of Kevin Lowe from Team Canada and the team could say that they were addressing concerns with the team's poor play. I do think that he still hasn't yet finished his "forensic report" on the team's struggles. Then Chiarelli was hired while they still had a GM who they shuffled to an Assistant GM role. He was friends with Lowe from Team Canada, and besides, he'd won a Cup as GM (which none of the rest could say) and the heat on the team had really increased after 8 years of being absolutely awful. Keith Gretzky was brother of the team's vice-chair and buddy of the rest of the crew. The Oilers gave him the interim title and spent weeks talking about how they might actually do a process. They may have even done an interview or two, while getting Stauffer to talk up how much people liked Gretzky in the roll. Then, Bob Nicholson polled other GMs at the GMs meetings about what he should do and several told him that he should call the old guy that Detroit just put out to pasture. Holland had all the right credentials. He'd worked with Team Canada at various points. He knew Kevin Lowe. He'd even been GM for a couple of Cups - although none for a decade while presiding over a team in slow decline with dreadful drafting and no record of winning trades.

All that to say, yes, I think there are lots of fans who could be better candidates. If I was hiring a GM, I would be looking for some really important elements:
- a strong background in negotiations and a strong aptitude for them
- a quick grasp of new concepts and the ability to understand the value or lack thereof
- the ability to build a strong team with diverse viewpoints and skillsets
- great listening ability and an open mind
- great ability to delegate authority where appropriate

Played the game at the NHL level wouldn't be in my top-20 items on the wishlist, because I don't think playing hockey professionally prepares you for any of the above points. Most people who would apply would have either played the game at SOME level or been deeply immersed in it otherwise, but even that isn't as big a pre-requisite as the above items.

My point is not that GMs and coaches are stupid, it's that teams hire people who's skillsets don't align closely with the job that they're being asked to do - and in a lot of cases, just hire them because they either used to be a player, or they know a bunch of guys on the management team. I think that often hockey players like to run in packs and they feel most comfortable with a group of other hockey players so they tend to badly fail at building diverse teams. I think they're also the group most likely to dismiss new ideas simply because someone "didn't play the game".

To tie all this back to McLellan - he has had some level of success because given no adversity and a good team, he can win games as a head coach. But I think that his inability to adapt makes him a weak coach, and his approach to players and media makes him a bad coach.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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