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 FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #825963]
Sat, 14 October 2023 22:37 Go to next message
HamBlaster is currently online HamBlaster
Messages: 968
Registered: June 2007

No Cups

I'm appalled at our goaltending situation.

I'm not giving our defense a free pass here, but holy hell. Consistently, we have to outshoot and outchance our opponents to win games. Luckily, we have the players to do that... typically. But this goaltending is beyond bad... it's legitimately terrible.

Fire this guy that's been consistently icing sub-par goalies. What has he been teaching them? They come into the organization with high potential and good pedigree, and they end up looking like flaming carcasses under his watch.

Enough is enough, Oilers. Can this guy.



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #825979 is a reply to message #825963 ]
Sat, 14 October 2023 23:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 10692
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

HamBlaster wrote on Sat, 14 October 2023 22:37

I'm appalled at our goaltending situation.

I'm not giving our defense a free pass here, but holy hell. Consistently, we have to outshoot and outchance our opponents to win games. Luckily, we have the players to do that... typically. But this goaltending is beyond bad... it's legitimately terrible.

Fire this guy that's been consistently icing sub-par goalies. What has he been teaching them? They come into the organization with high potential and good pedigree, and they end up looking like flaming carcasses under his watch.

Enough is enough, Oilers. Can this guy.


Spector goes out of his way on twitter to tell people this is a tired old narrative. It's perfectly normal for a goalie coach to survive 3 GM's and 6 coaches, or whatever it's been, while also seeing every goalie under him (except a 39 year old set in his ways) regress under his tutelage. Completely normal, and we're dumb for thinking he is at all to blame for anything and there are better people out in the hockey world that could take his job.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #825982 is a reply to message #825979 ]
Sat, 14 October 2023 23:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 7156
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Kr55 wrote on Sat, 14 October 2023 23:28

HamBlaster wrote on Sat, 14 October 2023 22:37

I'm appalled at our goaltending situation.

I'm not giving our defense a free pass here, but holy hell. Consistently, we have to outshoot and outchance our opponents to win games. Luckily, we have the players to do that... typically. But this goaltending is beyond bad... it's legitimately terrible.

Fire this guy that's been consistently icing sub-par goalies. What has he been teaching them? They come into the organization with high potential and good pedigree, and they end up looking like flaming carcasses under his watch.

Enough is enough, Oilers. Can this guy.


Spector goes out of his way on twitter to tell people this is a tired old narrative. It's perfectly normal for a goalie coach to survive 3 GM's and 6 coaches, or whatever it's been, while also seeing every goalie under him (except a 39 year old set in his ways) regress under his tutelage. Completely normal, and we're dumb for thinking he is at all to blame for anything and there are better people out in the hockey world that could take his job.


When Spector is trying to calm down firing talk, it's a clear sign that that's a person who'll happily give him the dirt off the record. Even more reason to clean house on Schwartz.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826094 is a reply to message #825982 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 05:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike  is currently offline Mike
Messages: 1390
Registered: August 2005
Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

1 Cup

So about that…

Not sure it is a magic bullet that will fix all our goaltending woes, but as many have said many times over - not only has nobody improved on his watch, every single guys has fallen off a cliff.

What’s the worst that could happen if you turf this guy? We get regular sub .900 performances? icon_rolleyes



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826095 is a reply to message #826094 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 07:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
tardigrade81  is currently offline tardigrade81
Messages: 2199
Registered: November 2022
Location: Regina, Saskatchewan

2 Cups

Right now. The entire team stinks, but if we Dont improve at the goalie position we will be swept by Vegas or Colorado in the playoffs

If we even make playoffs



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826096 is a reply to message #826095 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 07:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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3 Cups

Go ahead, fire Schwartz if people want. Unless you expect the goalies to get shut outs ever game, it won't make a damn bit of difference. The team is flat out not playing well and their effort level from McD down is garbage.


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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826100 is a reply to message #826096 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 12:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 20 October 2023 07:52

Go ahead, fire Schwartz if people want. Unless you expect the goalies to get shut outs ever game, it won't make a damn bit of difference. The team is flat out not playing well and their effort level from McD down is garbage.


There are definitely lots of other things wrong with this team. Not sure that is an excuse to let this guy with 100 lives stick around and oversee every goalie we have regress though. Just makes no sense for him to survive 3 GM's and half a dozen coaches while getting only negative results. Only goalie that survived him was a 39 year old Mike Smith that was completely set in his ways.

Schwartz is just becoming a shining example of how unserious this org is at doing the best they can in every aspect to try to win.

[Updated on: Fri, 20 October 2023 12:10]


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826101 is a reply to message #826100 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 12:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nullterm  is currently offline nullterm
Messages: 1024
Registered: July 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC

1 Cup

I don’t expect a goalie to win us every game. But you would expect a goalie to on occasion stand on his head and win a game despite the rest of the team playing poorly. Or at least look good enough that you know he could have won if the team in front of him was a notch better. Have not seen either.

These coaching jobs should inherently only last a few years, unless we’re getting top tier performance consistently thru the guy’s tenure. Given how poor the goalie situation has been all the way back to Roloson… yikes. I mean Talbot had one good season and then fell apart. Dubnyk needed to find his game elsewhere.

[Updated on: Fri, 20 October 2023 12:30]


Illegitimi non carborundum.

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826102 is a reply to message #826100 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 13:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Kr55 wrote on Fri, 20 October 2023 12:06

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 20 October 2023 07:52

Go ahead, fire Schwartz if people want. Unless you expect the goalies to get shut outs ever game, it won't make a damn bit of difference. The team is flat out not playing well and their effort level from McD down is garbage.


There are definitely lots of other things wrong with this team. Not sure that is an excuse to let this guy with 100 lives stick around and oversee every goalie we have regress though. Just makes no sense for him to survive 3 GM's and half a dozen coaches while getting only negative results. Only goalie that survived him was a 39 year old Mike Smith that was completely set in his ways.

Schwartz is just becoming a shining example of how unserious this org is at doing the best they can in every aspect to try to win.

If people want to make him a scape goat, then sure go for it. I won't lose any sleep.

I watch the Oilers and I see a puck go in corner, the Oilers dman is first too it and AHL/NHL tweeners on the other team come out with the puck over and over again. Then they fire it out to the slot to an open guy and he rips it top corner. If the defender does his job, gets the puck and realizes that this isn't U11 hockey, you might have to try a little to keep possession, the play never happens. But if you want to point the finger at Schwartz, then sure. Go ahead.

Or they don't rim the puck and give up 2-0 breakaways. Or they tie up a stick in front instead letting a forward stand there and tip it in. Or on the PP they don't try to pass through a guy and give up an odd man rush. Or they hustle back on the back check instead of dogging it and let the guy walk down the slot unchecked. Or they don't have the puck on their stick on a routine play, fumble it then fire a pass on the tape of the opposition to let him walk in.

But I get. Schwartz has been here a long time. People need someone to blame other than their fav players so if firing the goalie coach makes people feel better, have at it. I don't think it helps what their problems right now are which is mostly effort but maybe it's worth a shot.



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826103 is a reply to message #826101 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 13:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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nullterm wrote on Fri, 20 October 2023 12:26

I don’t expect a goalie to win us every game. But you would expect a goalie to on occasion stand on his head and win a game despite the rest of the team playing poorly. Or at least look good enough that you know he could have won if the team in front of him was a notch better. Have not seen either.

These coaching jobs should inherently only last a few years, unless we’re getting top tier performance consistently thru the guy’s tenure. Given how poor the goalie situation has been all the way back to Roloson… yikes. I mean Talbot had one good season and then fell apart. Dubnyk needed to find his game elsewhere.


I'm not that versed in how long goalie coaches survive, but I think we used to fire ones for underperforming back in the day. Dubs seeing his performance crater triggered us to fire the last guy.

Once in a while you hear about a goalie coach with a long tenure, like the guy Nashville had, when Nashville seemed to be a goalie factory pumping out goalie after goalie. That guy even was a part of kicking Dubs in the butt about all his bad habits which was part of his half year process to get his game back together.

Guess could do more research to see if there are other coaches that just linger around through a decade of seeing 95% of goalies all regress on the same team. Maybe some other teams are as complacent as us.


One thing is clear, this org doesn't have a clue about goaltending still. That Campbell contract could hurt for quite a while and almost all goalie analytics were flashing caution for him before we signed him, historically poor high danger sav%. Skinner's confidence looks like it's just staying bottomed out too after a whole summer with the power of the Schwartz.

[Updated on: Fri, 20 October 2023 13:39]


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826104 is a reply to message #826102 ]
Fri, 20 October 2023 14:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt  is currently offline Dragon_Matt
Messages: 759
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Location: edmonton

No Cups

You're right, he's been here for a long time. That's where it ends though as every goalie we've had under his tenure has declined over their time here. Not simply 'not improved' but have actively regressed, some of them greatly.
If everything you do over a decade makes your business worse off, you shouldn't be there anymore.



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826108 is a reply to message #825963 ]
Sat, 21 October 2023 00:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
Messages: 2810
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

Gregor would argue that Skinner wasn’t expected to become anything and DS made him into something. I guess that’s possible. Assuming Skinner would not have improved without DS. Can’t think of any other goalie he improved. Gregor is pro Schwartz though. Or it’s just one of his “things” where he’s trying to be the smartest in the room when the masses are leaning the other way. He has told the microphone many many times to stop thinking about Nurses contract when watching him. I have. And I still have close to the same level of frustration.


#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826110 is a reply to message #826108 ]
Sat, 21 October 2023 10:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Location: AB Highway 100

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Gregor is pro whatever he's told to be in favor of until he's told not to be in favor of it. This isn't a unique trait among media. Dustin Schwartz may not be the problem, but I know he's not the solution. Personally I wouldn't fire him because I don't think there's a goalie coach on the planet that could make a 'tender look good playing behind the defenses we've watched for the last 5, 10, 20 years.

[Updated on: Sat, 21 October 2023 10:22]


Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826112 is a reply to message #826110 ]
Sat, 21 October 2023 10:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
Messages: 10692
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Location: Edmonton

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CrusaderPi wrote on Sat, 21 October 2023 10:19

Gregor is pro whatever he's told to be in favor of until he's told not to be in favor of it. This isn't a unique trait among media. Dustin Schwartz may not be the problem, but I know he's not the solution. Personally I wouldn't fire him because I don't think there's a goalie coach on the planet that could make a 'tender look good playing behind the defenses we've watched for the last 5, 10, 20 years.


Gregor just likes to argue and be disagreeable with fans. Works well to drive social media engagement. Spector is all about it as well.

Firing Schwartz probably would be a cheap attempt to buy time and make fans happy to distract them from the larger problems with the team. Same with firing Woodcroft. The wise thing to want is probably a new GM before anyone else is fired. In Brad Holland we trust...



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #826121 is a reply to message #825963 ]
Sat, 21 October 2023 20:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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2 Cups

Head coaches, assistant coaches turn over regularly due to lack of meaningful results or even just for a new voice, new strategy.

Somehow Dustin Schwartz has been with this organization since 2009.



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827180 is a reply to message #825963 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 11:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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This has to be a record, no?

GM's Schwartz has been under:
Craig MacTavish
Peter Chiarelli
Keith Gretzky (interim)
Ken Holland

Coaches Schwartz has been under:
Dallas Eakins
Todd Nelson
Todd McLellan
Ken Hitchcock
Dave Tippett
Jay Woodcroft
Kris Knoblauch


Schwartz is an absolute legend. 4 GM's (soon to be 5) and 7 head coaches. And a load of goalies that saw nothing but regression under him and Mike Smith.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827181 is a reply to message #827180 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 11:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 11:55

This has to be a record, no?

GM's Schwartz has been under:
Craig MacTavish
Peter Chiarelli
Keith Gretzky (interim)
Ken Holland

Coaches Schwartz has been under:
Dallas Eakins
Todd Nelson
Todd McLellan
Ken Hitchcock
Dave Tippett
Jay Woodcroft
Kris Knoblauch


Schwartz is an absolute legend. 4 GM's (soon to be 5) and 7 head coaches. And a load of goalies that saw nothing but regression under him and Mike Smith.


How many GMs and coaches did Buchberger see? He was a real survivor too. I believe Gulutzan is now on his 4th head coach too.

I think it's another symptom of the rot in the Oilers organization that their coach never really has a free hand to bring in his people. You do wonder if there's some different lines of reporting within the coaching staff as a result.

Has to be weird for Knoblauch that he gets no say in his staff to this point (although to be fair, it might be harder to recruit a whole new group mid-season).

Maybe there's a lack of decent goalie coaches out there, so challenging to find a replacement who's not going to be worse yet?



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827183 is a reply to message #827181 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 12:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Location: AB Highway 100

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Stop noticing things you two. The team and their media has told us Dustin isn't the problem. Move on already.


Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827206 is a reply to message #827181 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 15:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nullterm  is currently offline nullterm
Messages: 1024
Registered: July 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC

1 Cup

Adam wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 10:59

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 11:55

This has to be a record, no?

GM's Schwartz has been under:
Craig MacTavish
Peter Chiarelli
Keith Gretzky (interim)
Ken Holland

Coaches Schwartz has been under:
Dallas Eakins
Todd Nelson
Todd McLellan
Ken Hitchcock
Dave Tippett
Jay Woodcroft
Kris Knoblauch


Schwartz is an absolute legend. 4 GM's (soon to be 5) and 7 head coaches. And a load of goalies that saw nothing but regression under him and Mike Smith.


How many GMs and coaches did Buchberger see? He was a real survivor too. I believe Gulutzan is now on his 4th head coach too.

I think it's another symptom of the rot in the Oilers organization that their coach never really has a free hand to bring in his people. You do wonder if there's some different lines of reporting within the coaching staff as a result.

Has to be weird for Knoblauch that he gets no say in his staff to this point (although to be fair, it might be harder to recruit a whole new group mid-season).

Maybe there's a lack of decent goalie coaches out there, so challenging to find a replacement who's not going to be worse yet?


Knoblauch’s assistant choice wasn’t available until the summer so Coffey was drafted into the role against his wishes.



Illegitimi non carborundum.

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827211 is a reply to message #827206 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 16:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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nullterm wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 15:27


Knoblauch’s assistant choice wasn’t available until the summer so Coffey was drafted into the role against his wishes.


Yeah, I watched that trainwreck of an interview.

I'm just not sure that the only possible option for assistant coach was the team's Special Advisor to the Owner and Chairman (which is a weird title by the way. Is Coffey a chairman? or is he advising a chairman?)

Surely there must be guys available who've coached at a level higher than Bantam (and who haven't got tossed from the league for calling kids racial slurs).



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827214 is a reply to message #827211 ]
Wed, 15 November 2023 17:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nullterm  is currently offline nullterm
Messages: 1024
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1 Cup

Adam wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 15:32

nullterm wrote on Wed, 15 November 2023 15:27


Knoblauch’s assistant choice wasn’t available until the summer so Coffey was drafted into the role against his wishes.


Yeah, I watched that trainwreck of an interview.

I'm just not sure that the only possible option for assistant coach was the team's Special Advisor to the Owner and Chairman (which is a weird title by the way. Is Coffey a chairman? or is he advising a chairman?)

Surely there must be guys available who've coached at a level higher than Bantam (and who haven't got tossed from the league for calling kids racial slurs).


He hung up when he looked at the caller ID and it said “Oilers”



Illegitimi non carborundum.

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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827272 is a reply to message #827214 ]
Thu, 16 November 2023 14:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt  is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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No Cups

ok guys, let's get Coffey back to the suite and I'll do the job.
I would do that for you.



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827277 is a reply to message #827272 ]
Fri, 17 November 2023 13:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76  is currently offline inverno76
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2 Cups

Dragon_Matt wrote on Thu, 16 November 2023 14:13

ok guys, let's get Coffey back to the suite and I'll do the job.
I would do that for you.


I support this. Can I use your 2 free team tickets?



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 Re: FIRE DUSTIN SCHWARTZ [message #827278 is a reply to message #827277 ]
Fri, 17 November 2023 14:31 Go to previous message
Dragon_Matt  is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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No Cups

I think that's only fair.


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