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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788470 is a reply to message #788468 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 11:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 11:20

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 10:30

Different player but goes in line with Nuge as a key UFA that I think the Oilers need to resign as he was pretty critical to their success and has been singled out by name but the coach but more importantly their 2 franchise players as a critical member of the team that needs to be back.

If Larsson will resign for a cap hit that is lower than what he makes now, for a term you are comfortable with, do you sign him now knowing you have to protect him? I know some people including myself think in a perfect world you have a deal in place just not filed so you don't protect him then as soon as the expansion draft is over, you file it but would he even do that and what happens if Seattle who has a early window to talk to UFA's says they'd give him more? He does want to stay but you run the risk of the price being driven up and ever 100K counts.


Honestly, it probably doesn't matter now unless the team is sure that Klefbom is done. The Oilers are losing something of value now, because they can't protect 4 defencemen any more. The advantage of not signing Larsson is that you can protect an extra player, so you can decide whether it's Klefbom or Jones that they protect. Whether you like Jones or not, there's trade value to a young defenceman like him - so I'd prefer to keep him. I think all the recent stories about Klefbom are the team indicating that they won't protect him in this expansion draft.

If they lose him and he does return to form, it's a huge error on the part of management because they really should know better than anyone his prognosis and his mindset.

I would have liked a situation where you could protect both Klefbom and Jones, but now at least one is available either way. If we don't sign Larsson, we have the option of who we lose. If we do protect Larsson? Then Seattle just gets to pick who they like.

The other x-factor is if the Oilers are having any sidebar conversations with the Kraken about controlling who they take. I would give up a significant amount to the Kraken in order for them to take James Neal (or Koskinen for that matter). That give could include Jones or Kassian and potentially draft picks on top of that. If we were able to use this draft to clear millions off the salary cap? That's a huge gift.

Why would it be a good idea to protect Klefbom at all? Taking away the report it's 95% certain he's done. Why would it make sense to protect a guy who unless it's 100% certain he's fine, he's 1 bump away from being out or done forever. So you protect him hoping he will be OK and as a result, you lose someone else. Camp comes along or the first preseason game comes because the guy hasn't played hockey in over 1.5 yrs so you are goign to want to get him into games. Some junior guy or AHLer trying to make an impression, runs him and he's done.

I never understood the rational behind potentially protecting a guy who odds were against him being able to play anytime soon.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788472 is a reply to message #788470 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 11:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 11:33


Why would it be a good idea to protect Klefbom at all? Taking away the report it's 95% certain he's done. Why would it make sense to protect a guy who unless it's 100% certain he's fine, he's 1 bump away from being out or done forever. So you protect him hoping he will be OK and as a result, you lose someone else. Camp comes along or the first preseason game comes because the guy hasn't played hockey in over 1.5 yrs so you are goign to want to get him into games. Some junior guy or AHLer trying to make an impression, runs him and he's done.

I never understood the rational behind potentially protecting a guy who odds were against him being able to play anytime soon.


The Oilers should understand better than anyone exactly how surgery went and what the odds are of Klefbom's return. They should know his mindset - is he hoping to return? Or is he pretty resigned and contemplating retirement.

It's notable that A) Holland was beaming about the surgery right after it happened and B) Klefbom has not been made available to media in any open interview. He hasn't indicated publicly that he's contemplating retirement.

If the team is confident he's done, then by all means, leave him unprotected. If he's back partways through next season though, they have egg on their face, and they'll have likely contributed the best player the Kraken will get through the expansion draft.

I don't trust reports from Oilers media on his health, because it's got so little backing it. Gregor's article says he spoke to people who spoke to Klefbom, and that those people aren't doctors. That's pretty shaky.

Also, while there's no cure for arthritis, it can absolutely be treated a number of different ways - through injections, through medicine.

I am skeptical of the reports, because without any primary sources, those sources could absolutely be planted by the Oilers who are hoping to pull off a daring move - exposing Klefbom and hoping the Kraken don't take him, while fully expecting him to return. Hell, that "closer to Oscar" source could be Ken Holland himself.

It isn't like the Oilers to be that sneaky, so I at least would appreciate it if they are, but it seems like if you're going to those lengths to sneak Klefbom through, then you should probably also make the less risky move of getting a handshake with Larsson and then not officially signing him until after that draft.

By the way, the "some kid trying to make a name for himself takes a run at him and he's done" argument is not a strong one. Technically, it could happen to anyone on the team, from Connor McDavid to Devin Shore. You don't typically see it happen, so it's a weird hypothetical, and if you're talking about a first or second pairing LHD who's better than anyone else on the roster not named Darnell Nurse? I don't think you can make a decision based on what if in the future some guy takes a run at him and lands a dirty, career-ending injury.



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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788473 is a reply to message #788472 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 12:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 11:52

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 11:33


Why would it be a good idea to protect Klefbom at all? Taking away the report it's 95% certain he's done. Why would it make sense to protect a guy who unless it's 100% certain he's fine, he's 1 bump away from being out or done forever. So you protect him hoping he will be OK and as a result, you lose someone else. Camp comes along or the first preseason game comes because the guy hasn't played hockey in over 1.5 yrs so you are goign to want to get him into games. Some junior guy or AHLer trying to make an impression, runs him and he's done.

I never understood the rational behind potentially protecting a guy who odds were against him being able to play anytime soon.


The Oilers should understand better than anyone exactly how surgery went and what the odds are of Klefbom's return. They should know his mindset - is he hoping to return? Or is he pretty resigned and contemplating retirement.

It's notable that A) Holland was beaming about the surgery right after it happened and B) Klefbom has not been made available to media in any open interview. He hasn't indicated publicly that he's contemplating retirement.

If the team is confident he's done, then by all means, leave him unprotected. If he's back partways through next season though, they have egg on their face, and they'll have likely contributed the best player the Kraken will get through the expansion draft.

I don't trust reports from Oilers media on his health, because it's got so little backing it. Gregor's article says he spoke to people who spoke to Klefbom, and that those people aren't doctors. That's pretty shaky.

Also, while there's no cure for arthritis, it can absolutely be treated a number of different ways - through injections, through medicine.

I am skeptical of the reports, because without any primary sources, those sources could absolutely be planted by the Oilers who are hoping to pull off a daring move - exposing Klefbom and hoping the Kraken don't take him, while fully expecting him to return. Hell, that "closer to Oscar" source could be Ken Holland himself.

It isn't like the Oilers to be that sneaky, so I at least would appreciate it if they are, but it seems like if you're going to those lengths to sneak Klefbom through, then you should probably also make the less risky move of getting a handshake with Larsson and then not officially signing him until after that draft.

By the way, the "some kid trying to make a name for himself takes a run at him and he's done" argument is not a strong one. Technically, it could happen to anyone on the team, from Connor McDavid to Devin Shore. You don't typically see it happen, so it's a weird hypothetical, and if you're talking about a first or second pairing LHD who's better than anyone else on the roster not named Darnell Nurse? I don't think you can make a decision based on what if in the future some guy takes a run at him and lands a dirty, career-ending injury.



It's arthritis, there is no cure. This isn't a torn ligament you stitch up and in a few months and some rehab all his good. It's inflamation in the shoulder that flares up when you use it, especially when you put trauma on it like a body check which is a standard play in hockey. It's very likely that is you play hockey and you slam your shoulder into someone else or the boards 100's of times a season, chances are it will come back. You won't know when but it will most likely come back. So regardless of knowing the surgery better than other team, you'd be protecting a guy with a known medical condition who at any time could be out.

So I think it would be completely foolish of the Oilers unless they know 100% he's cure which isn't the case, to protect a guy when you have no clue how long he can play. The point is to ice the best team. In order to do that, guys have to actually be on the ice. So use whatever excuse you want about the Oilers management being incompetent or the media lying or excuses for Klefbom because you like the player but he's got a known, incurable medical condition. This isn't from the Oilers telling us, it's from his own mouth. If he was not an Oiler, just a UFA and the Oilers announced they signed him for 2 years a 4.1666 mill per year with his known medical condition and all the uncertainty of if he can even play ever, I highly doubt most people in here would celebrating it as a good signing.

[Updated on: Wed, 30 June 2021 12:23]

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788475 is a reply to message #788473 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 12:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:16


It's arthritis, there is no cure. This isn't a torn ligament you stitch up and in a few months and some rehab all his good. It's inflamation in the shoulder that flares up when you use it, especially when you put trauma on it like a body check which is a standard play in hockey. It's very likely that is you play hockey and you slam your shoulder into someone else or the boards 100's of times a season, chances are it will come back. You won't know when but it will most likely come back. So regardless of knowing the surgery better than other team, you'd be protecting a guy with a known medical condition who at any time could be out.

So I think it would be completely foolish of the Oilers unless they know 100% he's cure which isn't the case, to protect a guy when you have no clue how long he can play. The point is to ice the best team. In order to do that, guys have to actually be on the ice. So use whatever excuse you want about the Oilers management being incompetent or the media lying or excuses for Klefbom because you like the player but he's got a known, incurable medical condition. This isn't from the Oilers telling us, it's from his own mouth. If he was not an Oiler, just a UFA and the Oilers announced they signed him for 2 years a 4.1666 mill per year with his known medical condition and all the uncertainty of if he can even play ever, I highly doubt most people in here would celebrating it as a good signing.


Maybe you should go do some research on arthritis before you post about this again.

Yes, it can't be cured. It CAN be treated.

I have some arthritis in my hip. I had a steroid injection earlier this summer. I feel great and have no ill-effects of the arthritis for now. It was not debilitating before - more like a constant tightness and ache, but now it's not even that. It can be treated, and it's not like a battered ligament where it's more likely to get ripped or torn. It's just pain, so if you can manage that, then you're fine to do just about anything you were doing before without risk.

There's more to it than just arthritis with Klefbom - clearly his surgery was more invasive than the needle I got. However, if it's just managing arthritis, that can absolutely be done.

As for teams taking on a player coming off injury - it depends if you've done your homework on that player. There are times when that risk is ABSOLUTELY worth taking. Teemu Selanne looked done from his knee injuries before the 2004-05 lockout. Turns out he was still a pretty good signing after he'd recovered. Considering that if someone IS injured you can replace their whole salary under the cap, it's not a bad bet.

If you're the Kraken, and you are going to pick 29 players, you know you have at least 6 who aren't roster guys, so you can afford to make some riskier picks - taking the prospects who've plateaued, or someone like Klefbom who if he returns would be on their first pairing. I think there's an excellent chance they take him if he's available. That is fine if the Oilers know that he's out forever. But management should be skewered if they blow it there.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788476 is a reply to message #788475 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 12:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:37

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:16


It's arthritis, there is no cure. This isn't a torn ligament you stitch up and in a few months and some rehab all his good. It's inflamation in the shoulder that flares up when you use it, especially when you put trauma on it like a body check which is a standard play in hockey. It's very likely that is you play hockey and you slam your shoulder into someone else or the boards 100's of times a season, chances are it will come back. You won't know when but it will most likely come back. So regardless of knowing the surgery better than other team, you'd be protecting a guy with a known medical condition who at any time could be out.

So I think it would be completely foolish of the Oilers unless they know 100% he's cure which isn't the case, to protect a guy when you have no clue how long he can play. The point is to ice the best team. In order to do that, guys have to actually be on the ice. So use whatever excuse you want about the Oilers management being incompetent or the media lying or excuses for Klefbom because you like the player but he's got a known, incurable medical condition. This isn't from the Oilers telling us, it's from his own mouth. If he was not an Oiler, just a UFA and the Oilers announced they signed him for 2 years a 4.1666 mill per year with his known medical condition and all the uncertainty of if he can even play ever, I highly doubt most people in here would celebrating it as a good signing.


Maybe you should go do some research on arthritis before you post about this again.

Yes, it can't be cured. It CAN be treated.

I have some arthritis in my hip. I had a steroid injection earlier this summer. I feel great and have no ill-effects of the arthritis for now. It was not debilitating before - more like a constant tightness and ache, but now it's not even that. It can be treated, and it's not like a battered ligament where it's more likely to get ripped or torn. It's just pain, so if you can manage that, then you're fine to do just about anything you were doing before without risk.

There's more to it than just arthritis with Klefbom - clearly his surgery was more invasive than the needle I got. However, if it's just managing arthritis, that can absolutely be done.

As for teams taking on a player coming off injury - it depends if you've done your homework on that player. There are times when that risk is ABSOLUTELY worth taking. Teemu Selanne looked done from his knee injuries before the 2004-05 lockout. Turns out he was still a pretty good signing after he'd recovered. Considering that if someone IS injured you can replace their whole salary under the cap, it's not a bad bet.

If you're the Kraken, and you are going to pick 29 players, you know you have at least 6 who aren't roster guys, so you can afford to make some riskier picks - taking the prospects who've plateaued, or someone like Klefbom who if he returns would be on their first pairing. I think there's an excellent chance they take him if he's available. That is fine if the Oilers know that he's out forever. But management should be skewered if they blow it there.

I did research buddy.

Are you a professional athlete? I know you don't like to give a straight answer to anything and prefer just to belittle me but I am going to guess that whatever the hell you do on a daily basis is WAY less physically taxing than what the average professional athlete does. Yes I am fully aware that you can treat arthritis and with treatment it allow you to do most things. But I am guessing your doctor after getting treatment gave you a list things you probably should avoid or at least modify so you don't potentially aggravate things.

So while I am not a medical expert and based on what you have told me repeatedly about every last thing, I am not an expert on every like you are, if you have arthritis in your shoulder and you are slamming that shoulder into something over and over again, there is a good chance, you do damage to it.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788478 is a reply to message #788476 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 12:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:45

Adam wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:37

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:16


It's arthritis, there is no cure. This isn't a torn ligament you stitch up and in a few months and some rehab all his good. It's inflamation in the shoulder that flares up when you use it, especially when you put trauma on it like a body check which is a standard play in hockey. It's very likely that is you play hockey and you slam your shoulder into someone else or the boards 100's of times a season, chances are it will come back. You won't know when but it will most likely come back. So regardless of knowing the surgery better than other team, you'd be protecting a guy with a known medical condition who at any time could be out.

So I think it would be completely foolish of the Oilers unless they know 100% he's cure which isn't the case, to protect a guy when you have no clue how long he can play. The point is to ice the best team. In order to do that, guys have to actually be on the ice. So use whatever excuse you want about the Oilers management being incompetent or the media lying or excuses for Klefbom because you like the player but he's got a known, incurable medical condition. This isn't from the Oilers telling us, it's from his own mouth. If he was not an Oiler, just a UFA and the Oilers announced they signed him for 2 years a 4.1666 mill per year with his known medical condition and all the uncertainty of if he can even play ever, I highly doubt most people in here would celebrating it as a good signing.


Maybe you should go do some research on arthritis before you post about this again.

Yes, it can't be cured. It CAN be treated.

I have some arthritis in my hip. I had a steroid injection earlier this summer. I feel great and have no ill-effects of the arthritis for now. It was not debilitating before - more like a constant tightness and ache, but now it's not even that. It can be treated, and it's not like a battered ligament where it's more likely to get ripped or torn. It's just pain, so if you can manage that, then you're fine to do just about anything you were doing before without risk.

There's more to it than just arthritis with Klefbom - clearly his surgery was more invasive than the needle I got. However, if it's just managing arthritis, that can absolutely be done.

As for teams taking on a player coming off injury - it depends if you've done your homework on that player. There are times when that risk is ABSOLUTELY worth taking. Teemu Selanne looked done from his knee injuries before the 2004-05 lockout. Turns out he was still a pretty good signing after he'd recovered. Considering that if someone IS injured you can replace their whole salary under the cap, it's not a bad bet.

If you're the Kraken, and you are going to pick 29 players, you know you have at least 6 who aren't roster guys, so you can afford to make some riskier picks - taking the prospects who've plateaued, or someone like Klefbom who if he returns would be on their first pairing. I think there's an excellent chance they take him if he's available. That is fine if the Oilers know that he's out forever. But management should be skewered if they blow it there.

I did research buddy.

Are you a professional athlete? I know you don't like to give a straight answer to anything and prefer just to belittle me but I am going to guess that whatever the hell you do on a daily basis is WAY less physically taxing than what the average professional athlete does. Yes I am fully aware that you can treat arthritis and with treatment it allow you to do most things. But I am guessing your doctor after getting treatment gave you a list things you probably should avoid or at least modify so you don't potentially aggravate things.

So while I am not a medical expert and based on what you have told me repeatedly about every last thing, I am not an expert on every like you are, if you have arthritis in your shoulder and you are slamming that shoulder into something over and over again, there is a good chance, you do damage to it.


Not a lot actually. They said take it easy for a couple days. That's all.

I don't think you have any clue what you're talking about on arthritis. I wish Dr. Oil was still posting here. It would be great to have a real doctor weigh in.

I actually really appreciate you as a poster RDOF. There's this sizable weird section of Oilers fans who just eat up anything the Oilers media tells them, and spends more time and energy screaming online at people who criticize Oilers management (especially people from out of market) then they ever do critically examining the teams moves. That can be really hard to understand, especially when you frequent this place full of smart, savvy posters who do tend to dig in to things and don't blindly fall in behind management hoping beyond hope that this time they're really going to figure it out. You offer a different perspective from most here, and it gives some insight in to what's going on in the heads of those people on twitter flaming a Toronto reporter for pointing out that Edmonton hasn't exactly given McDavid a lot to work with, or that they spend more time explaining why they can't do more than trying to do more...

But that said, know when you're out of your depth. Arthritis doesn't suddenly get worse because you get body-checked. That just isn't how it works.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788480 is a reply to message #788478 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 13:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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Depends on the kind of arthritis. There are some kinds of arthritis you can get in your shoulder that can cause permanent damage. There is no cure for it, but some of them can be treated.
I couldn't find anything online saying what kind of arthritis Klef has been diagnosed with, but I'll post this here.


Also known as "wear-and-tear" arthritis, osteoarthritis is a condition that destroys the smooth outer covering (articular cartilage) of bone. As the cartilage wears away, it becomes frayed and rough, and the protective space between the bones decreases. During movement, the bones of the joint rub against each other, causing pain.

Osteoarthritis usually affects people over 50 years of age and is more common in the acromioclavicular joint than in the glenohumeral shoulder joint.


Rheumatoid arthritis (RA) is a chronic disease that attacks multiple joints throughout the body. It is symmetrical, meaning that it usually affects the same joint on both sides of the body.

The joints of your body are covered with a lining — called synovium — that lubricates the joint and makes it easier to move. Rheumatoid arthritis causes the lining to swell, which causes pain and stiffness in the joint.

Rheumatoid arthritis is an autoimmune disease. This means that the immune system attacks its own tissues. In RA, the defenses that protect the body from infection instead damage normal tissue (such as cartilage and ligaments) and soften bone.

Rheumatoid arthritis is equally common in both joints of the shoulder.



Posttraumatic arthritis is a form of osteoarthritis that develops after an injury, such as a fracture or dislocation of the shoulder.



Arthritis can also develop after a large, long-standing rotator cuff tendon tear. The torn rotator cuff can no longer hold the head of the humerus in the glenoid socket, and the humerus can move upward and rub against the acromion. This can damage the surfaces of the bones, causing arthritis to develop.

The combination of a large rotator cuff tear and advanced arthritis can lead to severe pain and weakness, and the patient may not be able to lift the arm away from the side.



Avascular necrosis (AVN) of the shoulder is a painful condition that occurs when the blood supply to the head of the humerus is disrupted. Because bone cells die without a blood supply, AVN can ultimately lead to destruction of the shoulder joint and arthritis.

Avascular necrosis develops in stages. As it progresses, the dead bone gradually collapses, which damages the articular cartilage covering the bone and leads to arthritis. At first, AVN affects only the head of the humerus, but as AVN progresses, the collapsed head of the humerus can damage the glenoid socket.

Causes of AVN include high dose steroid use, heavy alcohol consumption, sickle cell disease, and traumatic injury, such as fractures of the shoulder. In some cases, no cause can be identified; this is referred to as idiopathic AVN.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788481 is a reply to message #788480 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 13:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Dragon_Matt wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:42

Depends on the kind of arthritis. There are some kinds of arthritis you can get in your shoulder that can cause permanent damage. There is no cure for it, but some of them can be treated.
I couldn't find anything online saying what kind of arthritis Klef has been diagnosed with, but I'll post this here.


Also known as "wear-and-tear" arthritis, osteoarthritis is a condition that destroys the smooth outer covering (articular cartilage) of bone. As the cartilage wears away, it becomes frayed and rough, and the protective space between the bones decreases. During movement, the bones of the joint rub against each other, causing pain.

Osteoarthritis usually affects people over 50 years of age and is more common in the acromioclavicular joint than in the glenohumeral shoulder joint.


Rheumatoid arthritis (RA) is a chronic disease that attacks multiple joints throughout the body. It is symmetrical, meaning that it usually affects the same joint on both sides of the body.

The joints of your body are covered with a lining — called synovium — that lubricates the joint and makes it easier to move. Rheumatoid arthritis causes the lining to swell, which causes pain and stiffness in the joint.

Rheumatoid arthritis is an autoimmune disease. This means that the immune system attacks its own tissues. In RA, the defenses that protect the body from infection instead damage normal tissue (such as cartilage and ligaments) and soften bone.

Rheumatoid arthritis is equally common in both joints of the shoulder.



Posttraumatic arthritis is a form of osteoarthritis that develops after an injury, such as a fracture or dislocation of the shoulder.



Arthritis can also develop after a large, long-standing rotator cuff tendon tear. The torn rotator cuff can no longer hold the head of the humerus in the glenoid socket, and the humerus can move upward and rub against the acromion. This can damage the surfaces of the bones, causing arthritis to develop.

The combination of a large rotator cuff tear and advanced arthritis can lead to severe pain and weakness, and the patient may not be able to lift the arm away from the side.



Avascular necrosis (AVN) of the shoulder is a painful condition that occurs when the blood supply to the head of the humerus is disrupted. Because bone cells die without a blood supply, AVN can ultimately lead to destruction of the shoulder joint and arthritis.

Avascular necrosis develops in stages. As it progresses, the dead bone gradually collapses, which damages the articular cartilage covering the bone and leads to arthritis. At first, AVN affects only the head of the humerus, but as AVN progresses, the collapsed head of the humerus can damage the glenoid socket.

Causes of AVN include high dose steroid use, heavy alcohol consumption, sickle cell disease, and traumatic injury, such as fractures of the shoulder. In some cases, no cause can be identified; this is referred to as idiopathic AVN.


You're right there is a very wide range regarding an "arthritic" condition. Most people if they get a CT scan will find they have some degree of "arthritis" in their joints, but have no real symptoms. I think the verdict on Klefbom's pro career won't be known for a while, the public doesn't know the severity of the "arthritis" he has, the longer it takes to resolve, the less chance he has of playing.. unless they play possum and pull a Koocherov like TB did, and bring him back for the playoffs!

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788518 is a reply to message #788480 ]
Thu, 01 July 2021 12:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dr. Oil is currently offline Dr. Oil
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Dragon_Matt wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:42

Depends on the kind of arthritis. There are some kinds of arthritis you can get in your shoulder that can cause permanent damage. There is no cure for it, but some of them can be treated.
I couldn't find anything online saying what kind of arthritis Klef has been diagnosed with, but I'll post this here.


Also known as "wear-and-tear" arthritis, osteoarthritis is a condition that destroys the smooth outer covering (articular cartilage) of bone. As the cartilage wears away, it becomes frayed and rough, and the protective space between the bones decreases. During movement, the bones of the joint rub against each other, causing pain.

Osteoarthritis usually affects people over 50 years of age and is more common in the acromioclavicular joint than in the glenohumeral shoulder joint.


Rheumatoid arthritis (RA) is a chronic disease that attacks multiple joints throughout the body. It is symmetrical, meaning that it usually affects the same joint on both sides of the body.

The joints of your body are covered with a lining — called synovium — that lubricates the joint and makes it easier to move. Rheumatoid arthritis causes the lining to swell, which causes pain and stiffness in the joint.

Rheumatoid arthritis is an autoimmune disease. This means that the immune system attacks its own tissues. In RA, the defenses that protect the body from infection instead damage normal tissue (such as cartilage and ligaments) and soften bone.

Rheumatoid arthritis is equally common in both joints of the shoulder.



Posttraumatic arthritis is a form of osteoarthritis that develops after an injury, such as a fracture or dislocation of the shoulder.



Arthritis can also develop after a large, long-standing rotator cuff tendon tear. The torn rotator cuff can no longer hold the head of the humerus in the glenoid socket, and the humerus can move upward and rub against the acromion. This can damage the surfaces of the bones, causing arthritis to develop.

The combination of a large rotator cuff tear and advanced arthritis can lead to severe pain and weakness, and the patient may not be able to lift the arm away from the side.



Avascular necrosis (AVN) of the shoulder is a painful condition that occurs when the blood supply to the head of the humerus is disrupted. Because bone cells die without a blood supply, AVN can ultimately lead to destruction of the shoulder joint and arthritis.

Avascular necrosis develops in stages. As it progresses, the dead bone gradually collapses, which damages the articular cartilage covering the bone and leads to arthritis. At first, AVN affects only the head of the humerus, but as AVN progresses, the collapsed head of the humerus can damage the glenoid socket.

Causes of AVN include high dose steroid use, heavy alcohol consumption, sickle cell disease, and traumatic injury, such as fractures of the shoulder. In some cases, no cause can be identified; this is referred to as idiopathic AVN.



icon_nod What he said.

Have they ever publicly announced which type of arthritis Oscar has? His prognosis would differ considerably based on the subtypes, as Dragon Matt has nicely categorized above.

His surgery likely involved debridement of the rough, frayed cartilage at the very least. I'm thinking it has to be one of the OA subtypes. Surgery in this case would not likely be "curative" but may provide considerable relief of symptoms in combination with other pain relief treatments. But arthroscopic debridement surgery is not always efficacious even in laypeople; I would suspect that a high level athlete in a high-impact sport would have some difficulty getting to the point of complete comfort to do his job well.

Not sure if surgery would have been on the table if it was rheumatoid arthritis, and it's likely that more joints in his body would be affected than just his shoulder, and there would be considerably more discussion about medication management, many of which suppress the immune system and carry unwanted side effects.

Really like Oscar as a player, and I would love to see him back on our blueline (after Seattle passes on him to select Kassian icon_wink ). But I think we shouldn't write his name into future lineups with anything other than pencil.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788479 is a reply to message #788475 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 13:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
welcometotheOC is currently offline welcometotheOC
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Adam wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:37

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 12:16


It's arthritis, there is no cure. This isn't a torn ligament you stitch up and in a few months and some rehab all his good. It's inflamation in the shoulder that flares up when you use it, especially when you put trauma on it like a body check which is a standard play in hockey. It's very likely that is you play hockey and you slam your shoulder into someone else or the boards 100's of times a season, chances are it will come back. You won't know when but it will most likely come back. So regardless of knowing the surgery better than other team, you'd be protecting a guy with a known medical condition who at any time could be out.

So I think it would be completely foolish of the Oilers unless they know 100% he's cure which isn't the case, to protect a guy when you have no clue how long he can play. The point is to ice the best team. In order to do that, guys have to actually be on the ice. So use whatever excuse you want about the Oilers management being incompetent or the media lying or excuses for Klefbom because you like the player but he's got a known, incurable medical condition. This isn't from the Oilers telling us, it's from his own mouth. If he was not an Oiler, just a UFA and the Oilers announced they signed him for 2 years a 4.1666 mill per year with his known medical condition and all the uncertainty of if he can even play ever, I highly doubt most people in here would celebrating it as a good signing.


Maybe you should go do some research on arthritis before you post about this again.

Yes, it can't be cured. It CAN be treated.

I have some arthritis in my hip. I had a steroid injection earlier this summer. I feel great and have no ill-effects of the arthritis for now. It was not debilitating before - more like a constant tightness and ache, but now it's not even that. It can be treated, and it's not like a battered ligament where it's more likely to get ripped or torn. It's just pain, so if you can manage that, then you're fine to do just about anything you were doing before without risk.

There's more to it than just arthritis with Klefbom - clearly his surgery was more invasive than the needle I got. However, if it's just managing arthritis, that can absolutely be done.

As for teams taking on a player coming off injury - it depends if you've done your homework on that player. There are times when that risk is ABSOLUTELY worth taking. Teemu Selanne looked done from his knee injuries before the 2004-05 lockout. Turns out he was still a pretty good signing after he'd recovered. Considering that if someone IS injured you can replace their whole salary under the cap, it's not a bad bet.

If you're the Kraken, and you are going to pick 29 players, you know you have at least 6 who aren't roster guys, so you can afford to make some riskier picks - taking the prospects who've plateaued, or someone like Klefbom who if he returns would be on their first pairing. I think there's an excellent chance they take him if he's available. That is fine if the Oilers know that he's out forever. But management should be skewered if they blow it there.


Durolane seems to work well for my knee. It is not really true that you can do whatever you want without fear of making it worse. For knees the cartilage tends to tear more easily. My surgeon: you CAN play soccer again, but I wouldn't advise it (this was after surgery for a 4th degree tear and seeing that arthritis was causing "orange-peeling" of the cartilage surface). I can usually go about 9-10 months before I feel the need for another injection.
I may soon have to start getting Durolane in my other knee due to "knee-gap" arthritis.
Mucho dinero - sigh...

Now, for shoulder arthritis (not knowing Klefbom's exact condition) there may be the possibility for cartilage replacement surgery. My surgeon is one of the pioneers of this procedure, though the last time I asked about it he said there was very little donor cartilage available in the pandemic and even for about a year prior to that.

[Updated on: Wed, 30 June 2021 13:43]

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788482 is a reply to message #788479 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 14:19 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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I think we need this. RDOF vs Adam.

After this pandemic is over, I’m going to be at the Holiday Inn in Lake Placid on August 1st, 2nd and 3rd. I’ll rent a barn, let’s see who will kick who’s ass, I’ll drive the loser to the hospital and we get this behind us.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788506 is a reply to message #788482 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 20:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ragnarok73 is currently offline Ragnarok73
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inverno76 wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 14:19

I think we need this. RDOF vs Adam.

After this pandemic is over, I’m going to be at the Holiday Inn in Lake Placid on August 1st, 2nd and 3rd. I’ll rent a barn, let’s see who will kick who’s ass, I’ll drive the loser to the hospital and we get this behind us.

But will this resolve the sexual tension? icon_eek

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788507 is a reply to message #788506 ]
Wed, 30 June 2021 20:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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Ragnarok73 wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 20:07

inverno76 wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 14:19

I think we need this. RDOF vs Adam.

After this pandemic is over, I’m going to be at the Holiday Inn in Lake Placid on August 1st, 2nd and 3rd. I’ll rent a barn, let’s see who will kick who’s ass, I’ll drive the loser to the hospital and we get this behind us.

But will this resolve the sexual tension? icon_eek


Careful. Sounds like you might be alluding to them being gay. RDOF does not like jokes of that type and will get his totally manly underoos in up his butt. NOT his panties in a bunch, by using that cliche you are calling him a cross dresser and you DONT want to cross that line. Just not something you can joke about.
When I call him the team's cheerleader and head of the pom pom brigade it is in the modern perspective where straight, male cheerleaders are completely normal and accepted.


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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788515 is a reply to message #788507 ]
Thu, 01 July 2021 10:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I’m still giggling. The Lowe vs Burke/RDOF vs Adam narrative is spot on.

One is a person likes to remind you how accomplished they are and has an air of misguided self-confidence, while the other is respected, but a bit of a know-it-all that can rub you wrong from time to time.

I’m not going to label either person, but if you have to ask the question….#justbugging

Now it makes me wonder if every poster here had an NHL alter ego, who would you be. I am unfortunately a Pierre McGuire/Nuge hybrid. Sometimes annoying, often creepy, definitely will be overpaid later in my career for what I bring to the table and can’t grow a moustache even though I’m an adult.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #788526 is a reply to message #788507 ]
Thu, 01 July 2021 22:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24 is currently offline K.McC#24
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PlusOne wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 20:49

Ragnarok73 wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 20:07

inverno76 wrote on Wed, 30 June 2021 14:19

I think we need this. RDOF vs Adam.

After this pandemic is over, I’m going to be at the Holiday Inn in Lake Placid on August 1st, 2nd and 3rd. I’ll rent a barn, let’s see who will kick who’s ass, I’ll drive the loser to the hospital and we get this behind us.

But will this resolve the sexual tension? icon_eek


Careful. Sounds like you might be alluding to them being gay. RDOF does not like jokes of that type and will get his totally manly underoos in up his butt. NOT his panties in a bunch, by using that cliche you are calling him a cross dresser and you DONT want to cross that line. Just not something you can joke about.
When I call him the team's cheerleader and head of the pom pom brigade it is in the modern perspective where straight, male cheerleaders are completely normal and accepted.



I'm not going to get into the undertones, but other than that.....I can see it now, my guess is you'll be at Lake Placid to slide a folding chair into the ring for Adam to use on RDOF! Can I be the ref? I'm easily distracted, especially when I've partaken in devil juice.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #812088 is a reply to message #788400 ]
Thu, 22 September 2022 17:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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11 years apart

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdRhVs4aUAE5A7K?format=jpg&name=small



Nice to commit long term to players that don't age.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #812089 is a reply to message #812088 ]
Thu, 22 September 2022 17:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
welcometotheOC is currently offline welcometotheOC
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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 22 September 2022 17:01

@oilygifs
11 years apart

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdRhVs4aUAE5A7K?format=jpg&name=small



Nice to commit long term to players that don't age.


Aside from the jersey, it's hard to tell which pic is newer ! Nuge the vampire.

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 Re: RNH to sign 8yr/41M extension [message #812091 is a reply to message #812088 ]
Thu, 22 September 2022 21:19 Go to previous message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 22 September 2022 16:01

@oilygifs
11 years apart

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdRhVs4aUAE5A7K?format=jpg&name=small



Nice to commit long term to players that don't age.


Guy has finally gone through adolescence and old enough to shave!
He's just approaching his peak!

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