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Oilers » Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673875 is a reply to message #673867 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:50

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:23

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 13:50

Klefbom / Larsson
Sekera / Demers
Davidson / Oesterle
Fayne

I mean, sure, I guess that's better than what we had last year. But that's not playoff calibre defense, and we just trade a franchise player and our absolute best trading chip to arrive at that place.

Fayne instead of Nurse? Do you really believe Nurse is that far off he wouldn't crack that top 7. Besides wouldn't him playing and gaining experience be the best for his learning at this point?

I'm of the belief that since he has limited AHL-eligibility left, it would be wise for them to learn from Gagner, Paajarvi, etc. and actually allow him to develop in the AHL. He *might* be better than Fayne right here, right now, but I think it's best for him and the Oilers to develop in the AHL while he can. He struggled at the end of last year.

I'm okay with Nurse on the farm unless he's seen a big leap from last year. He was struggling badly down the stretch.

I also don't want him in and out of the lineup as a seventh guy. Would rather see him get 25 minutes in Bakersfield.

His bonus cushion is an issue too. If Puljujarvi is on the team, then we need all the bonus space we can get.

I have a hard time believing we're getting Demers too, but who knows.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673856 is a reply to message #673794 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:41

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 13:50

Klefbom / Larsson
Sekera / Demers
Davidson / Oesterle
Fayne

I mean, sure, I guess that's better than what we had last year. But that's not playoff calibre defense, and we just trade a franchise player and our absolute best trading chip to arrive at that place.

Just brutal. I hate that this happened. I hate that I saw this coming for weeks.

I hate that even the line being parroted by Stauffer now, I predicted: Don't think of it as Hall for Larsson, if we get Lucic, then think of it as Hall for Lucic and Larsson.

Shero took Chiarelli to the woodshed on this. Just terrible, terrible trade.

I think we can expect the character assassination of Hall through the Edmonton media to start very soon, talking about him as not a leader, a bad influence in the dressing room, unhappy to be #2, etc. etc.

I don't care. He was the second best player on the team, and we've traded him for someone who might not be our second best DEFENCEMAN now.

I wanted the team to draft Larsson for much of 2011, but he has topped out at 26 points in a season so far. He almost never scores goals. He's never managed to crack the rotation for powerplay on New Jersey where they had NO ONE who could put up points from the blueline. And he basically slotted in to the same spot where Fayne looked really good.

There is no excuses for this trade. It becomes clear that that same old group just added a buddy to the playhouse in Oilers management. They're all incompetent.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireBobbyNicks

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673945 is a reply to message #673794 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 16:03

feepa
Messages: 408
Registered: November 2002
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 13:50

Klefbom / Larsson
Sekera / Demers
Davidson / Oesterle
Fayne

I mean, sure, I guess that's better than what we had last year. But that's not playoff calibre defense, and we just trade a franchise player and our absolute best trading chip to arrive at that place.

Where does Nurse and Reinhart fit in?

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673946 is a reply to message #673945 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 16:04

eedok
Messages: 21
Registered: March 2010
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

feepa wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 16:03

mightyreasoner wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 13:50

Klefbom / Larsson
Sekera / Demers
Davidson / Oesterle
Fayne

I mean, sure, I guess that's better than what we had last year. But that's not playoff calibre defense, and we just trade a franchise player and our absolute best trading chip to arrive at that place.

Where does Nurse and Reinhart fit in?

Bakersfield where they belong, they're not ready to make the jump yet

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673795 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:50

vsove
Messages: 66
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Saw this coming. 'Friend of a friend' type of thing, but they mentioned a couple of weeks ago that Taylor wanted out, in large part because he wasn't going to be the #1 guy anymore - and he saw that life outside of the Oilers meant you could actually win a cup.

Really underwhelming return. Only way it all makes sense is if we have other pieces that are going to fall into place. Even then, I would hope for at least Larsson+.

No Mo' Lowe | Fire McLellan | Fire everyone.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673798 is a reply to message #673795 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:55

Mike
Messages: 1397
Registered: August 2005
Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

1 Cup

So...can I have that Hall+ for Subban deal I wasn't crazy about now instead? Man - what a punch in the gut. What a terrible return for one of the best wingers on the planet.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673804 is a reply to message #673795 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:59

cosmicheretic
Messages: 38
Registered: November 2007

No Cups

Chia has done this before so it shouldn't be a surprise. What happened to 'waiting for the right deal'? Well this is the wrong deal. The pundits were right when having doubts about him as our GM. Hall will now blossom even more like Segin. So bad. angryfire

angryfire

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673805 is a reply to message #673795 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:59

inverno76
Messages: 2343
Registered: September 2005
Location: Prince Albert, Saskatchew...

2 Cups

Blown away. I didn't mind trading Hall, but for that return? Larsson better have another gear.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673801 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:57

Ragnarok73
Messages: 2419
Registered: February 2011

2 Cups

I can learn to live with this if the Oil improve their D overall after the summer. A top-heavy team with an AHL-calibre defense isn't going anywhere, as the past few seasons have shown. It would be nice if they could also somehow get a guy like Shattenkirk to come to town...

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673803 is a reply to message #673801 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:57

mazankowski
Messages: 27
Registered: June 2006
Location: Kelowna BC

No Cups

Ragnarok73 wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 12:57

I can learn to live with this if the Oil improve their D overall after the summer. A top-heavy team with an AHL-calibre defense isn't going anywhere, as the past few seasons have shown. It would be nice if they could also somehow get a guy like Shattenkirk to come to town...

We need that type of Defenceman now

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673802 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 13:57

K.McC#24
Messages: 2834
Registered: March 2004
Location: ALBERTA

2 Cups

Oilers and pundits can sell this anyway possible, but this is one of the worst deals in Oiler history on the face of it.

I don't give a damn for future moves, Lucic coming, whatever. The Oilers had a top 3/4 LW in the league, young, under a reasonable contract, who CARRIED this hockey team since joining the Oilers.....and got a 2nd pairing Dman who does NOT produce offensively straight up in return. Not nearly good enough, and a fail of a deal.

Of all the $6 million contracts on the team, this should have been the absolute LAST to go out the door.

Again, regardless of what else happens, unless somehow Chiarelli hoses 2 other GMs the way he just got hosed by NJ, this is an utter failure. Making a bad deal for the sake of dealing is not the approach we're looking for here.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673809 is a reply to message #673802 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:01

Magnum
Messages: 839
Registered: June 2009
Location: Rogers' Arena > Banff

No Cups

Reading the Stauffer tea leaves pays again!

That dude is a telegraph of the Oilers' front office par excellence!

2015/2016 - This Kool-Aid tastes like McDavid flavoured Drain-O.
2016/2017 - This Kool-Aid is starting to taste like juice.
2017/2018 - I'm drinking this Kool-Aid, in hopes that it's Drain-O.
2018/2019 - Another round of Drain-O, good sir!

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673808 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:00

vsove
Messages: 66
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

I don't hate the deal because I think it makes our team significantly worse, I hate it because I think the value was incredibly underwhelming.

Who knows. Maybe I vastly overvalued Taylor Hall. But it's still disappointing.

No Mo' Lowe | Fire McLellan | Fire everyone.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673810 is a reply to message #673808 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:02

Ragnarok73
Messages: 2419
Registered: February 2011

2 Cups

vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:00

I don't hate the deal because I think it makes our team significantly worse, I hate it because I think the value was incredibly underwhelming.

Who knows. Maybe I vastly overvalued Taylor Hall. But it's still disappointing.

I think the best way to look at it is not as just Hall for Larsson, but the overall change of Hall for Larsson, Lucic, and Demers. I'm 100% that Chia would never have pulled the trigger on this trade if he hadn't gotten an agreement made with both of the latter two guys.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

5-14-6-1

"Sabres think the suck is their ally? They merely adopted the suck. The Oilers were born in it...molded by it."

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673811 is a reply to message #673810 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:03

vsove
Messages: 66
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Ragnarok73 wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:02

vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:00

I don't hate the deal because I think it makes our team significantly worse, I hate it because I think the value was incredibly underwhelming.

Who knows. Maybe I vastly overvalued Taylor Hall. But it's still disappointing.

I think the best way to look at it is not as just Hall for Larsson, but the overall change of Hall for Larsson, Lucic, and Demers. I'm 100% that Chia would never have pulled the trigger on this trade if he hadn't gotten an agreement made with both of the latter two guys.

Which is why I don't think our team will be made worse by this deal. I think it opens up the space we needed.

But if all you can get to clear up that space for Hall is Adam Larsson, it's underwhelming. New Jersey isn't giving us Demers and Lucic, they're giving us Adam Larsson, and I would have liked to see more for him.

No Mo' Lowe | Fire McLellan | Fire everyone.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673825 is a reply to message #673810 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:09

K.McC#24
Messages: 2834
Registered: March 2004
Location: ALBERTA

2 Cups

Ragnarok73 wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:02

vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:00

I don't hate the deal because I think it makes our team significantly worse, I hate it because I think the value was incredibly underwhelming.

Who knows. Maybe I vastly overvalued Taylor Hall. But it's still disappointing.

I think the best way to look at it is not as just Hall for Larsson, but the overall change of Hall for Larsson, Lucic, and Demers. I'm 100% that Chia would never have pulled the trigger on this trade if he hadn't gotten an agreement made with both of the latter two guys.

The best way to look at it if you want to cast a sunny light on a terrible trade is to look at other moves that haven't even been consummated yet......and Edmonton STILL will not have a top D-man, and has lost one of the 3 best LW's in the league.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673812 is a reply to message #673808 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:03

Prince Albert 1
Messages: 33
Registered: February 2006
Location: Prince Albert,Sk

No Cups

Chia must be getting in early on the Nolan Patrick sweepstakes.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673822 is a reply to message #673812 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:08

George
Messages: 6
Registered: October 2009

No Cups

Travis Yost ‏@travisyost 3m3 minutes ago

Team executive just now: "They should've called us -- we easily put together a better package than Adam Larsson for Taylor Hall."

I'm speechless.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673834 is a reply to message #673822 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:15

Prince Albert 1
Messages: 33
Registered: February 2006
Location: Prince Albert,Sk

No Cups

George wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:08

Travis Yost ‏@travisyost 3m3 minutes ago

Team executive just now: "They should've called us -- we easily put together a better package than Adam Larsson for Taylor Hall."

I'm speechless.

This is absolutely horrid. Of course they could have got a better package for Taylor Hall. This is worse than what PC did to the Bruins when he traded Seguin and that's gone down as one of the 2 or 3 worst trades of the last decade or so.

Now I know why my friends who are Bruin fans were jumping for joy when Neely sent him kicking rocks down the road. I feel stupid for arguing with them then that he was going to do good things for the Oilers.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673828 is a reply to message #673812 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:13

scotiaoiler
Messages: 15
Registered: April 2006

No Cups

Seems like we got fleeced hard. Looks like the GM is going to overpay for fa's and put us in the position Boston was in when he left. So much for being patient. If this is patient then maybe he should have made the wrong deal at the draft. I can't imagine he didn't have more on the table then. Hall probably was a cancer but you get way more for him then a 3-4 defenseman. Maybe we need a new GM already.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673823 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:08

TheJesman
Messages: 8
Registered: February 2013
Location: Detroit

No Cups

Had so much to do today....this has ruined my day and nothing is going to get done. I can usually find a sliver of hope in most trades even when I don't agree, but of all the guys we could have traded besides McDavid we trade the one other guy who doesn't need McDavid to score.

I feel bad for Larsson the amount of pressure on him to produce will be ridiculous and if he doesn't oh man will he be hated.

Adam Larsson 23
RNHopkins 23
Nail Yakupov 22
Oscar Klefbom 22
Darnell Nurse 21
Leon Draisaitl 20
Connor McDavid 19
Jesse Puljujarvi 18

The future looks bright...

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673837 is a reply to message #673823 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:21

stemhovlichski
Messages: 349
Registered: March 2006
Location: NSR

No Cups

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:08

I feel bad for Larsson the amount of pressure on him to produce will be ridiculous and if he doesn't oh man will he be hated.

Jordan Eberle 24
Justin Schultz 24
Taylor Hall 22
Leon Draisaitl 18
RNHopkins 21
Nail Yakupov 21
Darnell Nurse 19
Oscar Klefbom 21

The future looks bright...

The future doesn't look quite as bright...

No idea why this trade took place. It looks like another case of asset mismanagement of the MacT-type. Hall's fire and compete always impressed me, especially his calling out coaches over stupid decisions.

Restored: "We're sucking hind banana here." - Pat Quinn, Jan 18, 2010

"...the Oilers have been rebuilding for so long that it’s hard not to be cynical." - NBC's Ryan Dadoun Jan 2, 2015

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673849 is a reply to message #673837 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:28

TheJesman
Messages: 8
Registered: February 2013
Location: Detroit

No Cups

stemhovlichski wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:21

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:08

I feel bad for Larsson the amount of pressure on him to produce will be ridiculous and if he doesn't oh man will he be hated.

Jordan Eberle 24
Justin Schultz 24
Taylor Hall 22
Leon Draisaitl 18
RNHopkins 21
Nail Yakupov 21
Darnell Nurse 19
Oscar Klefbom 21

The future looks bright...

The future doesn't look quite as bright...

No idea why this trade took place. It looks like another case of asset mismanagement of the MacT-type. Hall's fire and compete always impressed me, especially his calling out coaches over stupid decisions.

haha yea i needed to update that...but having McDavid on this roster as of now is reason enough for the future being bright...even if I do hate this trade. I just find it hard to believe we couldn't get more is all...Hall may not be Mcdavid but he is a franchise player and is only 24

Adam Larsson 23
RNHopkins 23
Nail Yakupov 22
Oscar Klefbom 22
Darnell Nurse 21
Leon Draisaitl 20
Connor McDavid 19
Jesse Puljujarvi 18

The future looks bright...

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673827 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:12

NetBOG
Messages: 2948
Registered: January 2006
Location: Parts Unknown

2 Cups

Look to me like it's Larsson's contract they like as much as anything else. So long and so cheap.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673832 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:15

eedok
Messages: 21
Registered: March 2010
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Haven't the Oilers learned from Fayne that you do not trade for the defenceman on NJD that's paired with Greene?

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673833 is a reply to message #673755 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:15

Kr55
Messages: 10770
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Any dirt being released on Hall yet? Slept with a teammates wife? McDavid said he was a jerk? Management heard him snorting something in a washroom? Or just the old lockerroom cancer thing?

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673836 is a reply to message #673833 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:20

George
Messages: 6
Registered: October 2009

No Cups

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:15

Any dirt being released on Hall yet? Slept with a teammates wife? McDavid said he was a jerk? Management heard him snorting something in a washroom? Or just the old lockerroom cancer thing?

I'm sure we're going to hear this from Stauffer and others in the following days as people try to put a positive spin on the trade...

Even if it were 100% true, the trade is still awful.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673839 is a reply to message #673836 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:24

Team Dean
Messages: 22
Registered: April 2010
Location: Central Alberta

No Cups

Fire Chia now.

He is a total idiot. This is the worst trade I have ever seen.
The #1LW in the game, for a guy who is not even good? Fayne is better than Larsson. No debate on that.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673847 is a reply to message #673839 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:28

spoonful
Messages: 13
Registered: April 2008
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Team Dean wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:24

Fire Chia now.

He is a total idiot. This is the worst trade I have ever seen.
The #1LW in the game, for a guy who is not even good? Fayne is better than Larsson. No debate on that.

I think the problem is we over rate our wingers a tad. He wasn't good enough to make Team Canada yet he's the #1 LW in the game?

The Oilers lose this trade but they moved a forward for defense, a sorely needed move for this team. I think they're a better team next year because of this.

Klefbom-Larsson
Sekera-Demers
Davidson-Fayne

That's at least a playoff calibre defense. Having Klefbom remain healthy is vital going forward.

The Edmonton Oilers - "Craig's on it"

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673855 is a reply to message #673847 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:35

ryanc182
Messages: 13
Registered: July 2008
Location: Red Deer

No Cups

Exactly my thoughts. Mr. Ovechkin might have something to say about this.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673883 is a reply to message #673855 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:55

Prince Albert 1
Messages: 33
Registered: February 2006
Location: Prince Albert,Sk

No Cups

ryanc182 wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:35

Exactly my thoughts. Mr. Ovechkin might have something to say about this.

He's not #1 LW in the league but he's definitely top 5 and probably top 3. Ovechkin and Benn are both ahead of him for sure and from there its debatable form #3-#5. Hall definitely in that range. Larsson is a top 10 RH Dman though. Right? Right?

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673866 is a reply to message #673847 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

TheJesman
Messages: 8
Registered: February 2013
Location: Detroit

No Cups

spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:28

Team Dean wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:24

Fire Chia now.

He is a total idiot. This is the worst trade I have ever seen.
The #1LW in the game, for a guy who is not even good? Fayne is better than Larsson. No debate on that.

I think the problem is we over rate our wingers a tad. He wasn't good enough to make Team Canada yet he's the #1 LW in the game?

The Oilers lose this trade but they moved a forward for defense, a sorely needed move for this team. I think they're a better team next year because of this.

Klefbom-Larsson
Sekera-Demers
Davidson-Fayne

That's at least a playoff calibre defense. Having Klefbom remain healthy is vital going forward.

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

Adam Larsson 23
RNHopkins 23
Nail Yakupov 22
Oscar Klefbom 22
Darnell Nurse 21
Leon Draisaitl 20
Connor McDavid 19
Jesse Puljujarvi 18

The future looks bright...

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673887 is a reply to message #673866 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

spoonful
Messages: 13
Registered: April 2008
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

The Edmonton Oilers - "Craig's on it"

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673891 is a reply to message #673887 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:01

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

HA HA HA.

If they gave up Hall for Larsson, what the #$%& are they going to give to get this "offensive defenceman"? We'll have nothing left.

You know what kinds of teams lose trades? Losing teams. Teams that make this sort of deal don't usually win Stanley Cups. Just stupid.

I hope Gregor at least carves them. He was apparently ripping in to management and keeping Lowe and MacT around on his show today after the deal came down.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673897 is a reply to message #673887 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:02

vsove
Messages: 66
Registered: May 2006
Location: Edmonton

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spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

For me it's weird, because I agree with you on Larsson. I think he's absolutely the right player for the Oilers. I think we have a better balance on our team now, and I think Larsson is one of a few pieces we needed to push us over the hump.

I just don't know how you don't get better value for Hall. That's the stickler for me. I would be happy with this trade if there had been more coming from Jersey.

That being said, I guess if you're one of the top 2 defensemen on a team like Jersey and end the season at +15, you're probably worth more than we're willing to accept. Anyone reading Jersey fans reactions to all of this?

No Mo' Lowe | Fire McLellan | Fire everyone.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673899 is a reply to message #673897 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:04

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 15:02

spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

For me it's weird, because I agree with you on Larsson. I think he's absolutely the right player for the Oilers. I think we have a better balance on our team now, and I think Larsson is one of a few pieces we needed to push us over the hump.

I just don't know how you don't get better value for Hall. That's the stickler for me. I would be happy with this trade if there had been more coming from Jersey.

That being said, I guess if you're one of the top 2 defensemen on a team like Jersey and end the season at +15, you're probably worth more than we're willing to accept. Anyone reading Jersey fans reactions to all of this?

Only thing I've heard is that they're ecstatic and think Shero robbed the Oilers blind.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673905 is a reply to message #673899 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:09

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 15:04

vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 15:02

spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

For me it's weird, because I agree with you on Larsson. I think he's absolutely the right player for the Oilers. I think we have a better balance on our team now, and I think Larsson is one of a few pieces we needed to push us over the hump.

I just don't know how you don't get better value for Hall. That's the stickler for me. I would be happy with this trade if there had been more coming from Jersey.

That being said, I guess if you're one of the top 2 defensemen on a team like Jersey and end the season at +15, you're probably worth more than we're willing to accept. Anyone reading Jersey fans reactions to all of this?

Only thing I've heard is that they're ecstatic and think Shero robbed the Oilers blind.

http://www.allaboutthejersey.com/2016/6/29/12061200/devils-a cquire-taylor-hall-for-adam-larsson

Quote:

However, losing Larsson is tough for all New Jersey fans. We've seen "total bust" Larsson develop into an elite defensive force on the blueline for the Devils and was becoming a force to be reckoned with. Although Larsson never put up elite offense, his defense made up for it and he was part of one of the top defensive pairs in the league. However, Larsson's skating will never be elite and will eventually hold him back offensively in the long-term.

At face value, the Devils win this trade big. Larsson was a big piece for New Jersey, but acquiring a top NHL player like Taylor Hall for Larsson is an unreal value and a trade that Shero had to make. Larsson could very well end up as a #1 guy in the NHL and steady force for the Oilers, but as a team starved for offense, the Devils did the right thing and acquired elite talent.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673914 is a reply to message #673905 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:14

Adam
Messages: 7176
Registered: August 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

Here's a neutral third party on the deal:

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/news/oilers-send-taylor-hall-to -devils-in-stunning-trade/

Quote:

On the surface it is one of the most stunning and unbelievable trades in recent memory because it just seems to be so lopsided in favor of the Devils. It also continues what has been a disturbing trend in the career of Oilers general manager Peter Chiarelli when it comes to trading young, impact forwards still in the prime of their careers.

.

Quote:

But the most unbelievable thing about this trade is that it is yet another high-level, top-line forward in the prime of his career that Chiarelli has traded as Hall now joins a list that also includes Phil Kessel and Tyler Seguin.
Since Chiarelli became the general manager of the Boston Bruins back in 2006, there have been 55 players in the NHL that have appeared in at least 200 games averaged more than .77 points per game during that stretch.
Out of that group, the only four players that were traded at age 26 or younger during that stretch have been Ilya Kovalchuk, Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin, and Phil Kessel.
Three of those players (Hall, Seguin and Kessel) were traded by Chiarelli. The fourth player, Kovalchuk, was traded at the deadline in a contract year by Atlanta when it was clear they could not re-sign him.
In other words: Players like Taylor Hall (age, production, skill, etc.) simply do not get traded in the NHL right now ... unless Peter Chiarelli is the general manager of their team.
Hall and Seguin were the top-two picks in the 2010 NHL draft with Hall going to Edmonton and Seguin to Boston. Chiarelli has now traded both of them.
The Kessel trade at least had the potential to work out because it helped the Bruins land Seguin and Dougie Hamilton. But Chiarelli turned it into a loss by trading Seguin to Dallas for Loui Eriksson, Joe Morrow, Mark Fraser and Reilly Smith. With Eriksson set to leave the Bruins as a free agent, the only thing Boston has to show for that trade today is Morrow and Jimmy Hayes (acquired from the Florida Panthers in a trade for Smith a year ago).

And another piece from Scott Cullen:

http://www.tsn.ca/statistically-speaking-oilers-don-t-get-ne arly-enough-for-hall-1.517957

Quote:

Hall, 24, has been one of the best offensive wingers in the league. Not in a, “Hey, he’s pretty good,” kind of way, but more like, “Wow, this guy is a superstar!” Over the past four seasons, here are the leaders in points per 60 during 5-on-5 play:

TOP 5-ON-5 SCORERS, 2012-2013 TO 2015-2016
PLAYER TEAM POS PTS/60
Sidney Crosby Pittsburgh C 2.71
Jamie Benn Dallas LW 2.54
Taylor Hall Edmonton LW 2.49
Ryan Getzlaf Anaheim C 2.42
Vladimir Tarasenko St. Louis RW 2.42
Tyler Seguin Dallas C 2.41
Patrick Kane Chicago RW 2.41
Corey Perry Anaheim RW 2.36
Matt Duchene Colorado C 2.32
Rick Nash N.Y. Rangers LW 2.31
Keep in mind, that Hall put up these numbers on a team that controlled less than 43% of 5-on-5 shot attempts during that four-year period, so putting up elite scoring numbers in that situation is remarkable.

Quote:

He’s not a big scorer, managing a career-high 24 points in 64 games in 2014-2015, and has been a mediocre possession player. Admittedly, Larsson has taken on tougher assignments while partnered with Andy Greene, but that duo was buried last season, with the Devils controlling just 43.8% of 5-on-5 shot attempts when they were partners.
In Edmonton, the Oilers will need Larsson to play big minutes. He can play the right side, alongside Oskar Klefbom, on Edmonton’s top pair, which ought to improve Edmonton’s defence (it’s hard to get worse, right?). It’s just difficult to imagine how it will improve the team overall.
Larsson is signed for five more seasons, at a cap hit of $4,166,666. There is a little cost savings when compared to Hall’s contract, but nowhere close to addressing the relative impact that each player has on the game.
Verdict: This is a landslide win for New Jersey. Even if the Edmonton Oilers are, as rumoured, poised to sign left winger Milan Lucic as a free agent, there is no justification for the Oilers to only get Larsson in return for Hall. Strictly in terms of asset management, it’s unacceptable.

[Updated on: Wed, 29 June 2016 15:16]

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673900 is a reply to message #673897 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:04

Suomalainen
Messages: 900
Registered: May 2002
Location: Boulder, CO

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vsove wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 15:02

For me it's weird, because I agree with you on Larsson. I think he's absolutely the right player for the Oilers. I think we have a better balance on our team now, and I think Larsson is one of a few pieces we needed to push us over the hump.

I just don't know how you don't get better value for Hall. That's the stickler for me. I would be happy with this trade if there had been more coming from Jersey.

That being said, I guess if you're one of the top 2 defensemen on a team like Jersey and end the season at +15, you're probably worth more than we're willing to accept. Anyone reading Jersey fans reactions to all of this?

I think had it be for 93 or 14, we'd at least feel this was fair-ish.

97.

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673941 is a reply to message #673887 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 15:57

ChasinStanley
Messages: 30
Registered: December 2003
Location: in the shadow of a large ...

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spoonful wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:59

TheJesman wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:47

This is only assuming we sign Demers though, and you're right I'm sure we do overrate our wingers because Jamie Benn is probably the best LW, but he was definitely snubbed by team Canada because no other Canadian LW outscored him (Besides Benn). He's definitely one of the best LW in the league and that is still saying something...can you really say that about Larsson? Also it's not like Taylor is old he's only 24.

But they have a lot of forwards. Hall is one of the best (top 5 I would think) LW in the league but the Oil need defense badly. Everyone knows it and if this was the best they could do, so be it.

It doesn't mean they won the trade "value wise" but this is what they had to do. I really feel that Larsson will be that top minute munching defenseman that gets the Oilers into the playoffs. He immediately moves the rest of the D down a spot (except Klefbom) and that was more important than having a top 5 LW. The Oil have McDavid and Draisatl and now have added Pullujarvi. Forward is still a strength for the Oil.

And from Chia's press conference it seems as though they are still trying to get a more offensive defenseman as well.

I will judge all these moves once he's done and based on the results next season.

Finally someone speaking sense, value is perceived and not real. We had to get better d than we had and as long as it wasn't 97 going the other way we had to do whatever it took. If this is what the market dictated then so be it. I think this helps the team move forward one of the biggest holes is partially filled. We could have stood pat, done nothing and gone into next year with last years D and ended up in the same spot as this year. This also send a big message to those who remain that we mean business and the anointed core better step up.

Does this mean we can close the books on rebuild 2.0 and call it a failure?

Renaissance 2015

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Re: Oilers Trade Hall to Devils for Larsson [message #673851 is a reply to message #673839 ]	Wed, 29 June 2016 14:31

TheJesman
Messages: 8
Registered: February 2013
Location: Detroit

No Cups

Team Dean wrote on Wed, 29 June 2016 14:24

Fire Chia now.

He is a total idiot. This is the worst trade I have ever seen.
The #1LW in the game, for a guy who is not even good? Fayne is better than Larsson. No debate on that.

Besides Fayne being better than Larsson...I agree 100% w/ everything you said

Adam Larsson 23
RNHopkins 23
Nail Yakupov 22
Oscar Klefbom 22
Darnell Nurse 21
Leon Draisaitl 20
Connor McDavid 19
Jesse Puljujarvi 18

The future looks bright...

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