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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #726972 is a reply to message #726971 ]
Wed, 09 January 2019 23:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smyth260  is currently offline smyth260
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And flaunting the idea of hiring Keith Gretzky as interim GM. The media is still scared or out of touch of the real issues deeper than Peter Chiarelli.


Clean house or bust

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727017 is a reply to message #725085 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 13:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm  is currently offline Oscargasm
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Rishaug and Nielsen doing Oilers 3-in-3;

https://www.tsn.ca/nhl/video/oilers-3-in-3-have-chiarelli-s- recent-moves-hurt-more-than-help~1582974/oilers-3-in-3-have- chiarelli-s-recent-moves-hurt-more-than-help~1582974

3 questions;
1- How big of an impact has Klefbom’s absence had on the recent losing record? (3-8-2 since Klefbom’s injury)

2- Have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than help?

3- Should Edmonton consider moving their first round pick to help them improve right now?

Shall we get the Oilfans answers to these?
1- 60%... were without Russell for a large chunk of the 13 games. Goalie play not great since either. Related? Likely.

2- Definately hurt. (Though a large chunk of us think it’s further than his ‘recent’ moves that have hurt the team.

3- If it’s in a package to upgrade scoring from the wings, for a guy with min 2 years after this season, I’d do it. Let’s face it, I’m a fan, I want Oilers playoff hockey even if they don’t go far. Though, to reiterate, I’d only do it for a move that is a longer term gain.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727025 is a reply to message #727017 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 14:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne  is currently offline PlusOne
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Oscargasm wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 14:50



3 questions;
1- How big of an impact has Klefbom’s absence had on the recent losing record? (3-8-2 since Klefbom’s injury)

2- Have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than help?

3- Should Edmonton consider moving their first round pick to help them improve right now?




1. Huge. Russell out at the same time hurt. I think the last ten games is the worst stretch of Larsson's time as an Oiler. I dont think that is a coincidence and to me it is now clear who the best Oiler defenceman is.

2. Hurt. I dont know how they class recent specifically but there hasn't been a trade so far this year that has made the team better.

3.
NO as long as Chia is the one making the deal
Yes if Chia is gone and they are;
- adding a scoring winger or D that is a legit 1st top pair. IE at least better than Larsson
- under 28
- with term or team control IE RFA
The topic of turn around time of this mess has been discussed recently. I dont want short term, scrape into the playoff bandaids.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727040 is a reply to message #727017 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 18:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.



#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727042 is a reply to message #727040 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 18:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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g2k wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:37

I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that amateur scouting may be the only thing this org is at least average or above at now. Trading that 1st rounder would definitely be a mistake. No one currently hired in the org has the ability to turn it into something useful for the next 4-5 years in a trade.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727043 is a reply to message #727042 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 18:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:51

g2k wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:37

I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that amateur scouting may be the only thing this org is at least average or above at now. Trading that 1st rounder would definitely be a mistake. No one currently hired in the org has the ability to turn it into something useful for the next 4-5 years in a trade.

The current GM has effed the team up badly. They are not close enough to be a contender to trade themselves into an actual one. They are trying to plug 4 holes in the dam with 3 fingers. And if they mortgage the future and don’t become a contender....then what? This city would be burnt to the ground.

Sadly this team sucks at developing talent, so my approach may be just as fatal anyway.

Hope at an all time low these days.



#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727125 is a reply to message #727042 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 09:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:51

g2k wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:37

I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that amateur scouting may be the only thing this org is at least average or above at now. Trading that 1st rounder would definitely be a mistake. No one currently hired in the org has the ability to turn it into something useful for the next 4-5 years in a trade.


And how good is amateur scouting? There seems to be some excitement because we may have a couple of non-first round pick defencemen ready to graduate to the NHL. That is definitely better than we've had - I think Petry is probably the last full-time NHL defenceman the Oilers developed from draft pick to NHL (although Erik Gustafsson looks to be a real player - just not for us). But maybe that should be a baseline expectation.

The Oilers actually did manage to pick at least one non-first round guy in every year of 2009-2013 who are 100+ game players. They've also managed to find some decent college guys who could play in the league like Oesterle. There's been a lack of patience with many of those prospects which has seen the Oilers burn out on them and then they end up playing a lot of those games elsewhere - so maybe the issue has always been on the development side, rather than the pre-draft scouting?

Worth noting that the same scouting department that picked Bear and Jones also failed to convince the GM that he shouldn't trade a pick that could have been Barzal, Connor or Chabot for Griffin Reinhart - that's definitely a strike against them. And beyond those two players, there's no one really knocking at the door. Benson's had an okay season in Bakersfield (Bako? Baku?) but he's well under a point per game. He's not a slam dunk. Looking at the other picks from the last couple of years, there isn't a bunch of guys putting up really noteworthy numbers. I like the two Russians from the 2017 draft. McLeod's numbers are okay too...but we're still a long way from the NHL for those players. Lots can yet happen.

I just don't see the evidence that the team's amateur scouting department is greatly outperforming where they were - we were just so used to not graduating prospects that any success feels like its worlds different.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727129 is a reply to message #727125 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 09:29 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 09:16

Kr55 wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:51

g2k wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 18:37

I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.


I'm gonna go out on a limb and say that amateur scouting may be the only thing this org is at least average or above at now. Trading that 1st rounder would definitely be a mistake. No one currently hired in the org has the ability to turn it into something useful for the next 4-5 years in a trade.


And how good is amateur scouting? There seems to be some excitement because we may have a couple of non-first round pick defencemen ready to graduate to the NHL. That is definitely better than we've had - I think Petry is probably the last full-time NHL defenceman the Oilers developed from draft pick to NHL (although Erik Gustafsson looks to be a real player - just not for us). But maybe that should be a baseline expectation.

The Oilers actually did manage to pick at least one non-first round guy in every year of 2009-2013 who are 100+ game players. They've also managed to find some decent college guys who could play in the league like Oesterle. There's been a lack of patience with many of those prospects which has seen the Oilers burn out on them and then they end up playing a lot of those games elsewhere - so maybe the issue has always been on the development side, rather than the pre-draft scouting?

Worth noting that the same scouting department that picked Bear and Jones also failed to convince the GM that he shouldn't trade a pick that could have been Barzal, Connor or Chabot for Griffin Reinhart - that's definitely a strike against them. And beyond those two players, there's no one really knocking at the door. Benson's had an okay season in Bakersfield (Bako? Baku?) but he's well under a point per game. He's not a slam dunk. Looking at the other picks from the last couple of years, there isn't a bunch of guys putting up really noteworthy numbers. I like the two Russians from the 2017 draft. McLeod's numbers are okay too...but we're still a long way from the NHL for those players. Lots can yet happen.

I just don't see the evidence that the team's amateur scouting department is greatly outperforming where they were - we were just so used to not graduating prospects that any success feels like its worlds different.


I'm just blindly throwing some faith in Keith Gretzky's direction :) He wasn't here when we passed on Barzal. But, he is also not technically in amateur scouting by his job definition either.

Don't stop on my hopes and dreams man! Keith makes our amateur scouting at least average! I BELIEVE!!!



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- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727106 is a reply to message #727040 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 22:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smyth260  is currently offline smyth260
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g2k wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 17:37

I would like to hang onto the pick.

I just feel regardless of who the GM is, they will lose the deal.

They are not winning the Cup this year. They are not winning the Cup next year. They are not.

I don’t really want anymore picks going out. I want someone to build a team here. They are just too far away from being a contender.


I think a big reason why the team has been crap for so long is because we keep on keeping our high value picks and young assets. At some point, we have to start trading futures. I don't think Connor McDavid will be happy if we start doing that in year 7 of his career.

When is the last time we have sent away young promising players, or high picks for established players? #16 for Griffin Reinhart is the closest I can think of, and he was nowhere near established. This team could have been pretty bolstered if they kept their established players the last few years (Hall, Eberle mainly) and instead weren't scared to trade the Yamamoto pick, the Puljuljarvi pick, a young Nurse, the Bouchard pick etc. I just don't think there is any more time to wait for yet another rebuild when McDavid/Draisaitl are top 20 scoring leaders every year.




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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727109 is a reply to message #727106 ]
Thu, 10 January 2019 22:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
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smyth260 wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 21:34


I think a big reason why the team has been crap for so long is because we keep on keeping our high value picks and young assets. At some point, we have to start trading futures. I don't think Connor McDavid will be happy if we start doing that in year 7 of his career.

When is the last time we have sent away young promising players, or high picks for established players? #16 for Griffin Reinhart is the closest I can think of, and he was nowhere near established. This team could have been pretty bolstered if they kept their established players the last few years (Hall, Eberle mainly) and instead weren't scared to trade the Yamamoto pick, the Puljuljarvi pick, a young Nurse, the Bouchard pick etc. I just don't think there is any more time to wait for yet another rebuild when McDavid/Draisaitl are top 20 scoring leaders every year.




You're 100% right, except that the Oilers are in an ugly cap situation right now and trading picks for players just isn't an option. Unless you're throwing in a crappy contract the other way and then the player you are getting back is going to not be as good. So then you get marginal improvement on a team that is pretty bad which means they are only marginally better than pretty bad.

So now you're traded away a valuable piece to be mediocre.

Which is why I think the Oilers need to start thinking about where they want to be in 3 years, and start planning for that.



Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
18/19: 232 GF / 274 GA (-42)
19/20 (82 game pace): 257 GF / 254 GA (+3) in 64 games
2021 (82 game pace):269 GF / 235 GA (+34) after 38 games

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727115 is a reply to message #727109 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 00:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smyth260  is currently offline smyth260
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A good GM is going to have to exhaust all options to free salary. Russell, Kassian, Lucic, Sekera, Manning is an ugly list, but I don't think we can just tell McDavid that our hands are tied. Reach out to cap floor teams, evaluate buyout options, retained salary on trades. I am sure there is something a qualifed GM could do.


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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727120 is a reply to message #727115 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 07:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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smyth260 wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 00:53

A good GM is going to have to exhaust all options to free salary. Russell, Kassian, Lucic, Sekera, Manning is an ugly list, but I don't think we can just tell McDavid that our hands are tied. Reach out to cap floor teams, evaluate buyout options, retained salary on trades. I am sure there is something a qualifed GM could do.


If you fire everyone, I think you buy a couple years with McDavid. New head of the management team can rip a new a-hole into the old guys in the media to explain why there is so much stuff to fix.



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- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727139 is a reply to message #727115 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 10:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
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smyth260 wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 23:53

A good GM is going to have to exhaust all options to free salary. Russell, Kassian, Lucic, Sekera, Manning is an ugly list, but I don't think we can just tell McDavid that our hands are tied. Reach out to cap floor teams, evaluate buyout options, retained salary on trades. I am sure there is something a qualifed GM could do.


For sure, and if the Oilers are able to free up cap space that obviously gives them more flexibility to improve in the short and long term. I'm skeptical that many of those guys are moveable without paying a fairly steep price. Russell might have the most perceived value, but then you've still got to replace his minutes which won't be free.

And don't get me wrong, and I said it in another thread, if you can get a young player with some term for a package that includes the 1st then that could work. Those guys generally don't come cheap though.

But what I don't want to do is move it in a scenario where say Winnipeg is looking at their cap situation and needing to re-sign Laine and Connor so they decide to move on from Bryan Little. Yes, it makes the Oilers better today, but not enough to make them a contender. He's 31, so in 2-3 years when the Oilers might be in a position to do something, he's likely on the decline and still taking up $5M+ in cap space.



Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
18/19: 232 GF / 274 GA (-42)
19/20 (82 game pace): 257 GF / 254 GA (+3) in 64 games
2021 (82 game pace):269 GF / 235 GA (+34) after 38 games

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727117 is a reply to message #727017 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 06:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
shoop  is currently offline shoop
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Oscargasm wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 20:50

3 questions;
1- How big of an impact has Klefbom’s absence had on the recent losing record? (3-8-2 since Klefbom’s injury)

2- Have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than help?

3- Should Edmonton consider moving their first round pick to help them improve right now?


1. The brutal streak was coincident with losing Klefa and Russell. 2-1 since Russell is back.

2. Probably not. Caggiula? Meh. His defensive woes aren't enough to make up for the minimal, inconsistent offence he provided. The Manning contract does look pretty bad.

3. Only way the Oilers should consider moving their first rounder is if there is significant cap relief somehow as part of the deal.

Two points out of a playoff spot with a relatively easy schedule before the week off is a pretty decent position to be in. The Oilers should go 4-2-0 before the week off and will be in a good position if they can do it.

Chia keeps his job if the Oilers make the playoffs.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727119 is a reply to message #727117 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 07:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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shoop wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 06:18

Oscargasm wrote on Thu, 10 January 2019 20:50

3 questions;
1- How big of an impact has Klefbom’s absence had on the recent losing record? (3-8-2 since Klefbom’s injury)

2- Have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than help?

3- Should Edmonton consider moving their first round pick to help them improve right now?


1. The brutal streak was coincident with losing Klefa and Russell. 2-1 since Russell is back.

2. Probably not. Caggiula? Meh. His defensive woes aren't enough to make up for the minimal, inconsistent offence he provided. The Manning contract does look pretty bad.

3. Only way the Oilers should consider moving their first rounder is if there is significant cap relief somehow as part of the deal.

Two points out of a playoff spot with a relatively easy schedule before the week off is a pretty decent position to be in. The Oilers should go 4-2-0 before the week off and will be in a good position if they can do it.

Chia keeps his job if the Oilers make the playoffs.


Can you unencrypt your answer for #2 please?



#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727155 is a reply to message #727119 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 12:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
shoop  is currently offline shoop
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g2k wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 14:15


Can you unencrypt your answer for #2 please?


I was answering the "have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than they have helped"?

Assuming the 'recent moves' refers to the two trades in December.

Trade #1 - Caggiula/Garrison for Manning/Norrell

Caggiula wasn't a big loss. Too inconsistent and the defensive liabilities mean no big loss. Yeah, yeah when he was playing well he added a little offensive upside. Not much.

Garrison terrible not a big loss.

Manning is overpriced. Hopefully he gets sent down to Bako and can find his game there. Sending Manning down saves some cap space. In terms of this season not a huge issue. If something doesn't happen over the summer it looks bad. Norrell was just balancing out the contracts.

Trade #1 is a minor loss this season just because of the added cap. Not a big deal if Sekera doesn't come back.

Trade # 2 - Wideman/3rd rounder for Petrovic.

We will wait and see what the extent of Petrovic's injury is. Definitely an upgrade as a 5/6/7 defenceman. Good to dump Wideman. It was essentially a free 3rd rounder although the Oilers will move down a few slots in the draft depending where they finish.

Trade #2 is a minor win, but a decent 6/7 D was need.

Essentially a break even on the two trades with a little more plus side. The answer to the original question is no the recent moves didn't hurt the team more than they helped.

[Updated on: Fri, 11 January 2019 12:42]


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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727163 is a reply to message #727155 ]
Fri, 11 January 2019 13:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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shoop wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 12:36

g2k wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 14:15


Can you unencrypt your answer for #2 please?


I was answering the "have Peter Chiarelli's recent moves hurt the team more than they have helped"?

Assuming the 'recent moves' refers to the two trades in December.

Trade #1 - Caggiula/Garrison for Manning/Norrell

Caggiula wasn't a big loss. Too inconsistent and the defensive liabilities mean no big loss. Yeah, yeah when he was playing well he added a little offensive upside. Not much.

Garrison terrible not a big loss.

Manning is overpriced. Hopefully he gets sent down to Bako and can find his game there. Sending Manning down saves some cap space. In terms of this season not a huge issue. If something doesn't happen over the summer it looks bad. Norrell was just balancing out the contracts.

Trade #1 is a minor loss this season just because of the added cap. Not a big deal if Sekera doesn't come back.

Trade # 2 - Wideman/3rd rounder for Petrovic.

We will wait and see what the extent of Petrovic's injury is. Definitely an upgrade as a 5/6/7 defenceman. Good to dump Wideman. It was essentially a free 3rd rounder although the Oilers will move down a few slots in the draft depending where they finish.

Trade #2 is a minor win, but a decent 6/7 D was need.

Essentially a break even on the two trades with a little more plus side. The answer to the original question is no the recent moves didn't hurt the team more than they helped.

Again, more mixed signals in your stance.

Quote:

Manning is overpriced. Hopefully he gets sent down to Bako and can find his game there. Sending Manning down saves some cap space. In terms of this season not a huge issue. If something doesn't happen over the summer it looks bad.


Let’s say in the extremely certain likelyhood nobody takes tbis contract the Hawks spent a year trying to unload. You seem to agree with everyone here that it will look bad. When that day inevitably arrives, will you feel it will look bad enough to deem these recent GM moves in December a detriment to the team?



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727272 is a reply to message #727163 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 00:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
shoop  is currently offline shoop
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g2k wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 20:58

Again, more mixed signals in your stance.

Let’s say in the extremely certain likelyhood nobody takes this contract the Hawks spent a year trying to unload. You seem to agree with everyone here that it will look bad. When that day inevitably arrives, will you feel it will look bad enough to deem these recent GM moves in December a detriment to the team?



Not even remotely a mixed message.

If Chiarelli can't dump the Manning contract then yes, it will be a net loss to the team for those two trades. Big caveat is the ability to dump Manning. Minor net loss though.

I still think the impact of the Manning contract isn't that big a deal. He makes $2.25M but if he is buried in the AHL next year it brings the cap hit down to $1.2125. Still bad, but not crippling. (Not 100% sure on the numbers, but that's a decent guess based on Montoya being buried.)

I still contend that Chia keeps his job if he makes the playoffs this year.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727278 is a reply to message #727272 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 00:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Slim Jim Phantom Call  is currently offline Slim Jim Phantom Call
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shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 00:14

g2k wrote on Fri, 11 January 2019 20:58

Again, more mixed signals in your stance.

Let’s say in the extremely certain likelyhood nobody takes this contract the Hawks spent a year trying to unload. You seem to agree with everyone here that it will look bad. When that day inevitably arrives, will you feel it will look bad enough to deem these recent GM moves in December a detriment to the team?



Not even remotely a mixed message.

If Chiarelli can't dump the Manning contract then yes, it will be a net loss to the team for those two trades. Big caveat is the ability to dump Manning. Minor net loss though.

I still think the impact of the Manning contract isn't that big a deal. He makes $2.25M but if he is buried in the AHL next year it brings the cap hit down to $1.2125. Still bad, but not crippling. (Not 100% sure on the numbers, but that's a decent guess based on Montoya being buried.)

I still contend that Chia keeps his job if he makes the playoffs this year.

Let’s for a moment go over the the cap space had Chierrrr just waived Drake....
Cuz that’s essentially what he did, but somehow freaking GAINED salary on the cap!

Great GM. This is far from an nhl team let alone a playoff team.
Geeezus.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727283 is a reply to message #727278 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 01:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Ales Cooper wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 07:34

Great GM. This is far from an nhl team let alone a playoff team.
Geeezus.



Talk about overly dramatic. Far from an NHL team?

So there are 12 teams in a 31 team league that aren't "an NHL team"? confused2

In case you are wondering that's the Oilers plus the 11 teams they are ahead of in the standings.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727286 is a reply to message #727283 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 01:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 01:02

Ales Cooper wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 07:34

Great GM. This is far from an nhl team let alone a playoff team.
Geeezus.



Talk about overly dramatic. Far from an NHL team?

So there are 12 teams in a 31 team league that aren't "an NHL team"? confused2

In case you are wondering that's the Oilers plus the 11 teams they are ahead of in the standings.


Overly dramatic? Take out Connor and Drai, where is this team?
If it’s not for them, yes this is a glorified AHL team.



In fairness to Hall, I've wanted to throw a waterbottle at Eakins all season.
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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727288 is a reply to message #727286 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 07:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Ales Cooper wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 02:22

shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 01:02

Ales Cooper wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 07:34

Great GM. This is far from an nhl team let alone a playoff team.
Geeezus.



Talk about overly dramatic. Far from an NHL team?

So there are 12 teams in a 31 team league that aren't "an NHL team"? confused2

In case you are wondering that's the Oilers plus the 11 teams they are ahead of in the standings.


Overly dramatic? Take out Connor and Drai, where is this team?
If it’s not for them, yes this is a glorified AHL team.


Sigh. Look at that Ales, now you’ve upset shoop, or Peter, or Kevin, or Craig, or Scott, or whatever his name is.

100% you take those two away and this team (as it’s built) is a bottom 3 team. Call it an “overly dramatic” take it you must but you’d be wasting your time.

As much as I’d love to see Oilers playoff hockey this year, it’s not happening. Watch the games and you see a team that can’t compete when Conner is off the ice, a team that is “overly dramatic” when their opponent takes a lead or controls the flow causing the Oilers to seemingly crumble.

They’ll stay close, thanks to the aforementioned Conner and Leon, but playoffs aren’t happening with the current makeup of this team, which you can’t lay blame at Hitch’s feet. It’s Chiarelli who built this roster, it’s Chiarelli that cap strapped this franchise. It’s Chiarelli who couldn’t clean up the mess left by the OBC, who likely lurk in the shadows pulling the strings.

We won’t see a full cleaning out of the upper management... realistically all we can hope for is that Chiarelli is sent packing and someone competent can come in to fix the cap issues and the compete on the ice.

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727291 is a reply to message #727288 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 08:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Quote:

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.


Highly doubt he’s a plant.

Just a contrarian looking for some shock and awe attention. Figured that out a while ago.

I also contend that Chiarelli will likely keep his job if they make the playoffs. Because I’m beyond being shocked by the decisions of this organization.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727294 is a reply to message #727291 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 08:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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g2k wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 09:12

Quote:

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.


Highly doubt he’s a plant.

Just a contrarian looking for some shock and awe attention. Figured that out a while ago.

I also contend that Chiarelli will likely keep his job if they make the playoffs. Because I’m beyond being shocked by the decisions of this organization.


Fair point. I’ll try to not get sucked in any more.

I remember being relatively excited when the announcement of Chiarelli broke. Even with the evidence of how he put the bruins into cap heck and the handling of Seguin. My how times have changed, and it should/could have been forecasted however I don’t think anyone could have predicted how he’d effectively null our offence, with being gifted Connor McDavid who would join Hall, Eberle, Nuge, Draisatl and Yakupov when he became Oilers GM. My how times have changed.

My hope is to see Oilers playoff hockey this year. Every year. But I don’t see how it happens with the compete and demeanor this team has.

Happy Birthday to Conner, btw. Perhaps Oilers management will finally gift him a team.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727295 is a reply to message #727294 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 09:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Oscargasm wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 08:52

g2k wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 09:12

Quote:

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.


Highly doubt he’s a plant.

Just a contrarian looking for some shock and awe attention. Figured that out a while ago.

I also contend that Chiarelli will likely keep his job if they make the playoffs. Because I’m beyond being shocked by the decisions of this organization.


Fair point. I’ll try to not get sucked in any more.

I remember being relatively excited when the announcement of Chiarelli broke. Even with the evidence of how he put the bruins into cap heck and the handling of Seguin. My how times have changed, and it should/could have been forecasted however I don’t think anyone could have predicted how he’d effectively null our offence, with being gifted Connor McDavid who would join Hall, Eberle, Nuge, Draisatl and Yakupov when he became Oilers GM. My how times have changed.

My hope is to see Oilers playoff hockey this year. Every year. But I don’t see how it happens with the compete and demeanor this team has.

Happy Birthday to Conner, btw. Perhaps Oilers management will finally gift him a team.

Excitement about the initial Chiarelli hire was justified. We’d been a tire fire and Boston was significantly better. And there was the idea that people learn from and tend not to repeat their horrendous decisions. Turns out that’s not always the case



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727298 is a reply to message #727295 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 10:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 09:48


Excitement about the initial Chiarelli hire was justified. We’d been a tire fire and Boston was significantly better. And there was the idea that people learn from and tend not to repeat their horrendous decisions. Turns out that’s not always the case


It seemed to be a step out of the old habit of just hiring more of the super-friends...although in hindsight, just as with Nicholson, there were a bunch of long-time connections with Chiarelli.

There were warning signs even then though. Can anyone remember a time when a GM got demoted before MacTavish? Why would you keep him in the organization? Why would you keep Howson? They brought in a GM and basically said that everyone stays with a very minor shuffling of the deck.

Who would agree to that? Although maybe that's just one of the things that makes Pete so darned likable!



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727301 is a reply to message #727291 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 11:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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g2k wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:12

Quote:

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.


Highly doubt he’s a plant.

Just a contrarian looking for some shock and awe attention. Figured that out a while ago.

I also contend that Chiarelli will likely keep his job if they make the playoffs. Because I’m beyond being shocked by the decisions of this organization.


No. Not looking for attention by being contrarian.

Read the justification for the Oilers being AHL quality. No kidding this is an AHL team if you take McDavid and Draisaitl off this team.

Take those two off the team and this is barely a cap floor team. Take two all-stars off any team and they are going to struggle.

Make the criticisms reasonable. When you get such histrionic garbage like say that the Oilers are an AHL team if you take McDavid and Draisaitl off the team ... that's just incoherent, childish ranting and nothing else.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727303 is a reply to message #727301 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 11:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 12:10

g2k wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:12

Quote:

My apologies if that’s too dramatic for you, Peter, Kevin, Craig, Scott, shoop.


Highly doubt he’s a plant.

Just a contrarian looking for some shock and awe attention. Figured that out a while ago.

I also contend that Chiarelli will likely keep his job if they make the playoffs. Because I’m beyond being shocked by the decisions of this organization.


No. Not looking for attention by being contrarian.

Read the justification for the Oilers being AHL quality. No kidding this is an AHL team if you take McDavid and Draisaitl off this team.

Take those two off the team and this is barely a cap floor team. Take two all-stars off any team and they are going to struggle.

Make the criticisms reasonable. When you get such histrionic garbage like say that the Oilers are an AHL team if you take McDavid and Draisaitl off the team ... that's just incoherent, childish ranting and nothing else.



Ugh. I’m trying to just ignore your posts... but do you realize the (lack of) offensive output from players outside of those two?



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727318 is a reply to message #727303 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 16:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Oscargasm wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 18:35

Ugh. I’m trying to just ignore your posts... but do you realize the (lack of) offensive output from players outside of those two?



I do, but it's not just an Oilers phenomenon. It's the way of a cap world. You pay big money for a couple big stars then make do with decent players at the next tier.

Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727322 is a reply to message #727318 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 17:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 17:04

Oscargasm wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 18:35

Ugh. I’m trying to just ignore your posts... but do you realize the (lack of) offensive output from players outside of those two?



I do, but it's not just an Oilers phenomenon. It's the way of a cap world. You pay big money for a couple big stars then make do with decent players at the next tier.

Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?


Difference being the pens are a fringe playoff team without them while the oilers are a fringe playoff team WITH their stars. That’s indicative of a GM being incompetent when they can’t figure out how to evaluate lower end talent. GMs like that bring in guys like Brandon Manning who cost 2.25m a year



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727330 is a reply to message #727318 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 21:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:04


Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?


Take Wheeler, Scheiffele, and Connor off of the Jets. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 26 and 32 points. A total of 142 points.

Take Crosby, Kessel, and Malkin off of the Penguins. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 18 and 44 points. A total of 147 points.

Take McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge off of the Oilers. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 12 and 22 points. A total of 84 points.

I don't see how anyone could interpret the current Oilers top heavy scoring as a common phenomenon.

[Updated on: Mon, 14 January 2019 00:03]


Clean house or bust

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727332 is a reply to message #727330 ]
Sun, 13 January 2019 22:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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smyth260 wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 21:20

shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:04


Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?


Take Wheeler, Scheiffele, and Connor off of the Jets. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 26 and 32 points. A total of 142 points.

Take Crosby, Kessel, and Malkin off of the Penguins. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 18 and 44 points. A total of 147 points.

Take McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge off of the Oilers. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 12 and 22 points. A total of 84 points.

I don't see how anyone could interpet the current Oilers top heavy scoring as a common phenomenon.



And that's even more pronounced if you look at the forward groups. Three of the next five leading scorers are Nurse, Klefbom and Larsson. The top five forwards for the Oilers outside of the big 3 have scored 22 (Chiasson), 13 (Khaira), 9 (Lucic), 8 (Rattie) and 7 (Puljujarvi) for a total of 59 points. That doesn't include the 11 that Caggiula scored for us, because we dealt him for a defenceman who's 10th on the depth chart...

The Jets top five forwards outside their top 3? 124 points. That Kyle Connor that shoop scoffs about? He has 34 points - More than Khaira, Lucic and Rattie combined.

The Penguins? 122

Maybe you'll feel I'm cherry-picking looking at two really good teams, so what about the teams at the bottom of the NHL?

How about the Canucks? 95

The Red Wings? 101

Philadelphia? 88

Ottawa? A staggering 142

Fine, you say, but those teams may be near the bottom of the standings, but they're not the bottom of the goals for list...so let's look at those teams too:

Los Angeles? 80

Anaheim? 88 - including 19 for Pontus Aberg, who the Oilers couldn't forgive for missing a practice last year...

Arizona? 76

Dallas? 80

St. Louis? 89

Not ONE of these teams has a forward in their top 8 in scoring who is still in single digits for points. The Oilers have THREE of them. It's no wonder we're 17 points below the next closest team on this metric.

It's fine to suggest you think that other teams also would struggle without their all-star players, but the Oilers are objectively worse than other teams at this by almost any metric you can think of. If you have some secret stat that shows that our depth actually isn't as bad as it seems, I would love to see it.

Oh, and #FireChia, #FireLowe, #FireNicholson and #FireEveryone.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727350 is a reply to message #727332 ]
Mon, 14 January 2019 07:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 23:24

smyth260 wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 21:20

shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:04


Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?


Take Wheeler, Scheiffele, and Connor off of the Jets. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 26 and 32 points. A total of 142 points.

Take Crosby, Kessel, and Malkin off of the Penguins. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 18 and 44 points. A total of 147 points.

Take McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge off of the Oilers. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 12 and 22 points. A total of 84 points.

I don't see how anyone could interpet the current Oilers top heavy scoring as a common phenomenon.



And that's even more pronounced if you look at the forward groups. Three of the next five leading scorers are Nurse, Klefbom and Larsson. The top five forwards for the Oilers outside of the big 3 have scored 22 (Chiasson), 13 (Khaira), 9 (Lucic), 8 (Rattie) and 7 (Puljujarvi) for a total of 59 points. That doesn't include the 11 that Caggiula scored for us, because we dealt him for a defenceman who's 10th on the depth chart...

The Jets top five forwards outside their top 3? 124 points. That Kyle Connor that shoop scoffs about? He has 34 points - More than Khaira, Lucic and Rattie combined.

The Penguins? 122

Maybe you'll feel I'm cherry-picking looking at two really good teams, so what about the teams at the bottom of the NHL?

How about the Canucks? 95

The Red Wings? 101

Philadelphia? 88

Ottawa? A staggering 142

Fine, you say, but those teams may be near the bottom of the standings, but they're not the bottom of the goals for list...so let's look at those teams too:

Los Angeles? 80

Anaheim? 88 - including 19 for Pontus Aberg, who the Oilers couldn't forgive for missing a practice last year...

Arizona? 76

Dallas? 80

St. Louis? 89

Not ONE of these teams has a forward in their top 8 in scoring who is still in single digits for points. The Oilers have THREE of them. It's no wonder we're 17 points below the next closest team on this metric.

It's fine to suggest you think that other teams also would struggle without their all-star players, but the Oilers are objectively worse than other teams at this by almost any metric you can think of. If you have some secret stat that shows that our depth actually isn't as bad as it seems, I would love to see it.

Oh, and #FireChia, #FireLowe, #FireNicholson and #FireEveryone.

#fireschoop



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727349 is a reply to message #727330 ]
Mon, 14 January 2019 07:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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smyth260 wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 22:20

shoop wrote on Sun, 13 January 2019 15:04


Take Wheeler and Scheifle off the Jets and their leading scorer is Kyle Connor.

The Pens are lucky that Toronto is paying a decent chunk of Kessel's salary. Still what would the Pens look like without Malkin and Crosby. Better than the Oilers but a fringe playoff team.

So yes. I realize the "lack" of offensive output aside from McDavid and Draisaitl. Do you realize that it's not an uncommon phenomenon?


Take Wheeler, Scheiffele, and Connor off of the Jets. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 26 and 32 points. A total of 142 points.

Take Crosby, Kessel, and Malkin off of the Penguins. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 18 and 44 points. A total of 147 points.

Take McDavid, Draisaitl, and Nuge off of the Oilers. The next 5 highest scorers have scored between 12 and 22 points. A total of 84 points.

I don't see how anyone could interpret the current Oilers top heavy scoring as a common phenomenon.


Thanks for doing the work for me. It’s astounding and goes to show just how incompetent our GM is at building a team



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727544 is a reply to message #727349 ]
Tue, 15 January 2019 06:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 14 January 2019 14:25


Thanks for doing the work for me. It’s astounding and goes to show just how incompetent our GM is at building a team


It's not a matter of incompetence.

Do you really think this team would have been better off trading Draisaitl?

What is wrong with his $8.5M per season.

The post from @Adam is ridiculous. You have two all-stars on this team. That's a reasonable way to go. It is going to end with less scoring down the lineup.

This is a team on the fringe of the playoffs despite the constant hatred for Chia.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727546 is a reply to message #727544 ]
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shoop wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 06:31

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 14 January 2019 14:25


Thanks for doing the work for me. It’s astounding and goes to show just how incompetent our GM is at building a team


It's not a matter of incompetence.

Do you really think this team would have been better off trading Draisaitl?

What is wrong with his $8.5M per season.

The post from @Adam is ridiculous. You have two all-stars on this team. That's a reasonable way to go. It is going to end with less scoring down the lineup.

This is a team on the fringe of the playoffs despite the constant hatred for Chia.


Man, go over his list of trades on a trade by trade basis. If you still think he's good at his job, bring your arguments.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727552 is a reply to message #727544 ]
Tue, 15 January 2019 08:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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shoop wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 05:31


This is a team on the fringe of the playoffs despite the constant hatred for Chia.


It's a mirage. The playoff cut line is currently projected to be 85 points. That's a full 10 points less than a normal year. To put it in perspective, a team on pace for 95 points after 46 games would have 53 points right now (7 more than the Oilers).

And the roster outside of Nuge, Drai, and McDavid is objectively worse. They're scoring at an abysmal rate while not doing any better defensively.



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727571 is a reply to message #727544 ]
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3 Cups

shoop wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 06:31

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 14 January 2019 14:25


Thanks for doing the work for me. It’s astounding and goes to show just how incompetent our GM is at building a team


It's not a matter of incompetence.

Do you really think this team would have been better off trading Draisaitl?

What is wrong with his $8.5M per season.

The post from @Adam is ridiculous. You have two all-stars on this team. That's a reasonable way to go. It is going to end with less scoring down the lineup.

This is a team on the fringe of the playoffs despite the constant hatred for Chia.

What kind of money do the Oilers pay somebody to be a social media stooge?



You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.


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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727572 is a reply to message #727571 ]
Tue, 15 January 2019 10:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
Messages: 16157
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

CrudeRemarks wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 10:42

shoop wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 06:31

Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 14 January 2019 14:25


Thanks for doing the work for me. It’s astounding and goes to show just how incompetent our GM is at building a team


It's not a matter of incompetence.

Do you really think this team would have been better off trading Draisaitl?

What is wrong with his $8.5M per season.

The post from @Adam is ridiculous. You have two all-stars on this team. That's a reasonable way to go. It is going to end with less scoring down the lineup.

This is a team on the fringe of the playoffs despite the constant hatred for Chia.

What kind of money do the Oilers pay somebody to be a social media stooge?

Nothing! I’ve been asking for the troll job for years.

Real answer: the Oilers are notoriously cheap. They’d pay far below market value for your soul.



Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727615 is a reply to message #727572 ]
Tue, 15 January 2019 14:29 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Iamheretoday  is currently offline Iamheretoday
Messages: 182
Registered: August 2007

No Cups

My soul was born into it. icon_wink
It is an interesting observation that if a person tries to see the positive, IE tied for a playoff spot, others insist on pointing out that this is a down year for qualifying. The fact the Oilers are tied for a playoff spot is not a functional point within the discussion apparently.
Trying to enjoy hockey, which has been difficult over the years, and years, and years, is something we should enjoy. Calling someone out as a social media stooge, which I hope was in jest, has nothing to do with discussion.
As LA has proven making the playoffs in the last spot still means you can win the cup. Beating on management of the Oilers is not even fun anymore.

deadhorse



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 Re: "Playoffs preserve Chia's Job" - Nicholson [message #727631 is a reply to message #727615 ]
Tue, 15 January 2019 18:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
shoop  is currently offline shoop
Messages: 111
Registered: December 2018
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

Iamheretoday wrote on Tue, 15 January 2019 21:29

My soul was born into it. icon_wink
It is an interesting observation that if a person tries to see the positive, IE tied for a playoff spot, others insist on pointing out that this is a down year for qualifying. The fact the Oilers are tied for a playoff spot is not a functional point within the discussion apparently.
Trying to enjoy hockey, which has been difficult over the years, and years, and years, is something we should enjoy. Calling someone out as a social media stooge, which I hope was in jest, has nothing to do with discussion.

deadhorse


Not much of it is meant in jest, but that's ok.

I don't get the incessant negativity. Yes, playoffs preserve Chia's job.



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