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Oilers » GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20)

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722628 is a reply to message #722626 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 09:26

ziltoid
Messages: 150
Registered: January 2011

No Cups

Mike wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 08:45

ziltoid wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 11:26

Mike wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 07:32

As has been said - I don't think many dislike Larsson. He's pretty good and a good contract. But not straight up for Taylor freaking Hall. Good grief. I can't even fathom how that conversation went to end up with "OK, sure Ray, one of the best wingers on the planet for a decent stay at home Dman and nothing else. Sounds good."

I agree with the general sentiment, but I think calling Larsson a decent stay-at home D-man is selling him significantly short. His ES pts have been near the top of the team ever year (even during Klefbom's 38pt campaign, Larsson only had 3 less ES pts than Klefbom, and was T-60th in the league re: ES points by defensemen, Klefbom was T-50th), plus he plays the tough shutdown minutes to considerable success, and while on a great contract. Hall was an overpay, but Larsson is one of the 62 best D-men in the league.

I don't think I'm selling him short at all. I stand by my assertion - He's a decent stay at home Dman. Nothing disparaging about that. Nobody will argue he is a #1, and anyone would agree he is 100% more than a #4. I think most would agree he is at the very worst a #3, but realistically a #2. A middle of the pack/lower tier 2.

That's a valuable player in the NHL. No bones about it. But Taylor Hall just won the Hart trophy. Taylor Hall drives the play - he has been a driver since he came into the league. When he is on the ice, it's tilted toward the opposition end. Adam Larsson was a lackluster return for Taylor Hall - that's not a slight on Larsson. That's a monumental screw up by Chia

Yes, Hall trade was bad, but I think a pegging issue makes the trade seem worse that it actually was. Is a "decent stay at home D-man" one who is top 60-ish in ES points and is top 40-ish in GF%? Those are (lower end) top pairing ES offensive stats, which I think is better than "decent", and certainly better than a "decent stay at home D-man". Maybe it's a semantic issue, but "decent" implies "average" to me, and I think Larsson is above average in the shut-down role he is asked to play, especially considering his ES offensive numbers. Whether that constitutes a high-mid-low tier #2 depends on what role one thinks a #2 should play (e.g., offensive, 2-way, shut-down, etc.), so I can't really comment on that, but looking solely at Larsson as a shut-down guy, I think he is near the top portion of the league in that regard. Still not nearly enough to justify the Hall trade, though.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722605 is a reply to message #722593 ]	Sun, 18 November 2018 23:02

smyth260
Messages: 938
Registered: November 2007

No Cups

The Oilers trade/walk away for nothing team looks like a pretty good team to build around.

Hall-Barzal-Eberle
Maroon-xxxx-Perron
xxxx-xxxx-Pitlick

xxxx-Petry
xxxx-Schultz
Oesterle-xxxx

Dubnyk

Lot's of useful pieces. What the hell do we have from that?

Clean house or bust

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722614 is a reply to message #722605 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 01:06

Lew19
Messages: 46
Registered: February 2009

No Cups

Totally agree with what you are illustrating, but we were never going to draft Barzal.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722619 is a reply to message #722614 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 07:30

Mike
Messages: 1051
Registered: August 2005
Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

1 Cup

Lew19 wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 04:06

Totally agree with what you are illustrating, but we were never going to draft Barzal.

That's even worse if true. I was sitting at home watching that draft (as I'm sure most of us were), and as Barzal slipped and got to us, I was pumped. He was without question the BOA at that point. Adding him and McDavid? Wow!

For the Oilers to come out now (or last year) and say they wouldn't have drafted him anyway is even more of an indictment on the scouting team.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722642 is a reply to message #722593 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 11:14

Jay
Messages: 219
Registered: January 2007
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

inverno76 wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 21:29

Mike wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 20:55

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 23:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

So many great moves over the last few years...

Petry for a 2nd
Barzal plus early 2nd for Griffin Reinhart
Justin Schultz for a 3rd
Hall for Larsson
Yakupov for Pochiro and a 3rd
Eberle for Strome
Russell and Lucic contracts...

Reinhart trade was a killer. The other ones can be argued

No doubt. I don't even blame that one on Chia exactly. He showed up and fell in line. That one - like everything that happens with this team - had OBC written all over it. Didn't their amateur scout at the time even admit that he hadn't even watched Reinhart play since he left the Oil Kings? (pretty sure he kept his job to!)
But he was a rock during the mem cup run! Keagan had nothing but good things to say! Firing Chia/TMac really isn't going to change anything in the big picture. I've long since accepted this fact and I cheer pretty much exclusively for drama. Its entertainment after all, and actually winning anything that matters will never be a realistic option for this team as long as Katz/Lowe/Nichs are in charge.

"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722644 is a reply to message #722642 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 11:31

Kr55
Messages: 9508
Registered: May 2002
Location: Edmonton

6 Cups

Jay wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 11:14

inverno76 wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 21:29

Mike wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 20:55

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 23:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

Reinhart trade was a killer. The other ones can be argued

Peter Chiarelli @FakeOilersGM
Accountability starts at the top so that's why we're making the hard decision today of telling Katz' kid that he will not be attending the next draft.

Yup, this is pure drama at this point. It's a train wreck that keeps having new trains crashing into it every day. This team is mainly just good for a laugh at this point, at how ineptly run something can be when the people in charge all value friendships and loyalty over results. It's never gonna end until the top is cleaned out and that may never happen, so what's the point of getting too angry about it? Just sit back and enjoy making fun of it and joining others in enjoying talking about how stupid it all is.

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722671 is a reply to message #722642 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 18:26

g2k
Messages: 2600
Registered: January 2003
Location: The Hood

2 Cups

Jay wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 11:14

inverno76 wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 21:29

Mike wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 20:55

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 23:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

Reinhart trade was a killer. The other ones can be argued

Firing Chia/TMac really isn't going to change anything in the big picture. I've long since accepted this fact and I cheer pretty much exclusively for drama. Its entertainment after all, and actually winning anything that matters will never be a realistic option for this team as long as Katz/Lowe/Nichs are in charge.

This sums up my feelings pretty well. I’ve lost any hope until Daryl’s human hockey cards are gone. And I have seen no signs of that group getting widdled down through the lowest of lows, therefore I really carry no hope at all anymore.

I loathe this management team so badly, should McDavid ever somehow turn this thing around, I couldn’t bear to watch these bozo’s slipping around on the ice in suits with the cup over their heads. Should this situation arise, if they had any class (which they don’t), they would stay the Frick off the ice and let the players enjoy the moment. Do it out of respect of the fan base and ticket buyer. But they won’t. They will need to get there mugs out there for photographs and future regaling about their greatness.

Yeah. I’m ruined...

#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam #ownerisacreep

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722674 is a reply to message #722671 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 22:15

CrusaderPi
Messages: 7619
Registered: December 2003
Location: AB Highway 100

6 Cups

g2k wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 18:26

Jay wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 11:14

inverno76 wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 21:29

Mike wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 20:55

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 23:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

Reinhart trade was a killer. The other ones can be argued

Just think about last summer, so much hope, so much excitement. Oh! And Connor!

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722700 is a reply to message #722671 ]	Tue, 20 November 2018 07:46

Jay
Messages: 219
Registered: January 2007
Location: Edmonton

No Cups

g2k wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 18:26

if they had any class (which they don’t), they would stay the Frick off the ice and let the players enjoy the moment. Do it out of respect of the fan base and ticket buyer. But they won’t. They will need to get there mugs out there for photographs and future regaling about their greatness.

Lol I really don't think you need to worry. That is never going to happen.

They had what I can only describe as a dream situation going into the 2015 draft. I mean they got there through stockpiling draft picks and lottery balls over a decade+ of incompetence but still....it was all there for them. And they puked all over themselves.

That group will never have a look like that again and if they managed to turn THAT into THIS I think its pretty safe to say we don't need to worry about how they will ruin the Oilers cup celebration.

So the glass is half full!

"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722616 is a reply to message #722585 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 02:57

George
Messages: 6
Registered: October 2009

No Cups

Mike wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 20:55

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 23:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

- A 4th for Montoya
- Signed Gustavsson as a backup
- Maroon for a 3rd and Dudek
- ...and repeatedly stated the Oilers weren't as good as their record suggested in 2016/17 (which may have been true, but not advisable to say)

Chiarelli should have been fired last summer.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722606 is a reply to message #722581 ]	Sun, 18 November 2018 23:05

nullterm
Messages: 925
Registered: July 2007
Location: Port Moody, BC

No Cups

OilMJMOil wrote on Sun, 18 November 2018 19:43

So the Oilers fan Christmas wish list consists of;

New Head Coach
New GM
2 top 6 wingers
2 bottom 6 centres
2 bottom 6 wingers
A puckmoving rh d man
A number 1 goalie

Missing anything?

At this rate, a lump of coal would be optimistic.

Illegitimi non carborundum.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722627 is a reply to message #722606 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 08:58

sloiler
Messages: 8
Registered: October 2005
Location: Enemy Territory (near Cal...

No Cups

Someone should start a poll. What are the chances that the Oilers make any changes to the Coaching Management staff during this season. I am so "Meh" on this team that I would say None at all. Oilers Management and Owner I think are inept, but I don't think they care. The rink is full every night and they are making the same amount of money as if they were competing so who cares. I honestly think that there is going to come a day when McDavid is going to ask for a trade, if not there is no way that he signs here as a UFA in 7 more years, he is going to be out of here.

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722678 is a reply to message #722627 ]	Mon, 19 November 2018 22:26

stemhovlichski
Messages: 346
Registered: March 2006
Location: NSR

No Cups

sloiler wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 08:58

I honestly think that there is going to come a day when McDavid is going to ask for a trade, if not there is no way that he signs here as a UFA in 7 more years, he is going to be out of here.

So what you're saying is we have seven more years to figure out new ways to criticize the job Lowe, MacT, Nicholson, Chia, the scouts, the rest of the OBC, the former GMs and coaches have done in making this franchise into an epic loser crap garbage dumpster tire fire?

clapping

Awesommmmmme......time to buy a Jets' jersey.

Restored: "We're sucking hind banana here." - Pat Quinn, Jan 18, 2010

"...the Oilers have been rebuilding for so long that it’s hard not to be cynical." - NBC's Ryan Dadoun Jan 2, 2015

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Re: GDT: Vegas @ Edmonton (Game #20) [message #722698 is a reply to message #722678 ]	Tue, 20 November 2018 07:23

CrudeRemarks
Messages: 1698
Registered: November 2010
Location: Edmonton

1 Cup

stemhovlichski wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 22:26

sloiler wrote on Mon, 19 November 2018 08:58

I honestly think that there is going to come a day when McDavid is going to ask for a trade, if not there is no way that he signs here as a UFA in 7 more years, he is going to be out of here.

Awesommmmmme......time to buy a Jets' jersey.

You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you just might find, you can get a lottery pick.

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