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 Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721357]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:30 Go to next message
OilFans  is currently offline OilFans
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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721363 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76  is currently offline inverno76
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Less than a minute left. Lucic and Larsson on the ice.

Really?

*****I said 6-3-2. 6-4-1? Id call that a great October all considered.

[Updated on: Tue, 30 October 2018 21:41]


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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721368 is a reply to message #721363 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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4 Cups

inverno76 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 20:38

Less than a minute left. Lucic and Larsson on the ice.

Really?


I turned it off after 4-3... not surprised at the deployment..

Well it was fun while lasted folks.. probably see PulJu next game.

Lot of guys non-factors again.

Noticed Caggulia returning to his mean.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721367 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ragnarok73  is currently offline Ragnarok73
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Special teams killed the team tonight.


"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721369 is a reply to message #721367 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Ragnarok73 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 21:40

Special teams killed the team tonight.


Only issue is when you actually review the options, who else is McLellan putting out with McDavid, Nugent-Hopkins and Draisaitl?

Strome has 0 points in 11 games.
Yamamoto is a youngster who McLellan already demoted in this one.
Caggiula is Caggiula.
Kassian, Brodziak, Khaira are fourth liners.
Rieder isn't known as a point producer and hasn't scored yet this year.
That leaves the hot hand in Chiasson, but he was a PTO signing just a month ago...

Hall or Eberle would have looked nice in that spot though...



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721370 is a reply to message #721369 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 21:46

Ragnarok73 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 21:40

Special teams killed the team tonight.


Only issue is when you actually review the options, who else is McLellan putting out with McDavid, Nugent-Hopkins and Draisaitl?

Strome has 0 points in 11 games.
Yamamoto is a youngster who McLellan already demoted in this one.
Caggiula is Caggiula.
Kassian, Brodziak, Khaira are fourth liners.
Rieder isn't known as a point producer and hasn't scored yet this year.
That leaves the hot hand in Chiasson, but he was a PTO signing just a month ago...

Hall or Eberle would have looked nice in that spot though...


Not just the players, it's the strategy as well. We're still playing Woodcroft's PP, there's so little creativity out there. Krueger and Nelson had lesser lineups than this whipping pucks around creating shots at open nets. Neither of those guys had McDavid and Drai. This PP is just a disaster right from square 1, the guy in charge, which I have to believe now has been McLellan all along, and Woodcroft was just his echo.

This PP does nothing aside from hoping McDavid will do stuff on the right wall. Lucic apparently is coached to never screen a goalie (he would lose his spot on the PP if he wasn't listening right?...right?). Freakin Lander was 10 times the net front presence under Nelson than Lucic is right now. Everyone else hangs around the perimeter most of the time. We refuse to put any right shooter out there so McDavid is always passing across players bodies, unless they are OK having their back to the net. It's just...ugh.

[Updated on: Tue, 30 October 2018 21:54]


"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721372 is a reply to message #721370 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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I'd like to see the PP cycle or switch more often up high to get some movement and some gaps. An opposite shot would help too. That's what Minnesota did to kill Edmonton a couple times tonight.


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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721405 is a reply to message #721370 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 09:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 20:49


Not just the players, it's the strategy as well. We're still playing Woodcroft's PP, there's so little creativity out there. Krueger and Nelson had lesser lineups than this whipping pucks around creating shots at open nets. Neither of those guys had McDavid and Drai. This PP is just a disaster right from square 1, the guy in charge, which I have to believe now has been McLellan all along, and Woodcroft was just his echo.

This PP does nothing aside from hoping McDavid will do stuff on the right wall. Lucic apparently is coached to never screen a goalie (he would lose his spot on the PP if he wasn't listening right?...right?). Freakin Lander was 10 times the net front presence under Nelson than Lucic is right now. Everyone else hangs around the perimeter most of the time. We refuse to put any right shooter out there so McDavid is always passing across players bodies, unless they are OK having their back to the net. It's just...ugh.


Ya, despite an okay overall percentage, the PP doesn't really generate much at all.

27th in the NHL in SF/60 at 46.2
25th in CF/60 at 87.0

I know it's easy to pile on after a loss,but I've tried to avoid saying anything negative after wins. But really this is a pretty average team, and despite a solid start points wise, I dont think they're a playoff team.

-2 in goal differential. I didn't discover this, but I've been saying for a couple years now, teams with negative goal differentials rarely make the playoffs. Yes, it's early and they're only -2, but a few more weeks and some divisional games and we'll have a pretty good idea of how this season is going to shake out.

At 5x5 the Oilers are pretty average. 19th in CF% at 48.9% and 12th in SF% at 51.0% (this is the one number that gives me hope right now).

Good to see Leon have a good night, he needs to contribute consistently at 5x5 and he hasn't really been doing that. By the numbers he got crushed by CHI and WAS and was decent against NSH and PIT (but given those teams, probably meant he played pretty well, just to break even).

Overall, the Oilers are kind of treading water (but have banked some points despite a very tough schedule, which is great), but McLellan has been going to the whip and running his top line/pair/goalie ragged pretty much from the start of the season. The one interesting thing we'll find out is how sustainable this is.

Maybe the most glaring tell is that Rattie is out and this team can't replace him.



[Updated on: Wed, 31 October 2018 10:47]


Wins in a row the Oilers need to get to playoff pace: infinity
games!!

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721412 is a reply to message #721405 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 10:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrudeRemarks is currently online CrudeRemarks
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No Cups

Goose wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 09:08

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 20:49


Not just the players, it's the strategy as well. We're still playing Woodcroft's PP, there's so little creativity out there. Krueger and Nelson had lesser lineups than this whipping pucks around creating shots at open nets. Neither of those guys had McDavid and Drai. This PP is just a disaster right from square 1, the guy in charge, which I have to believe now has been McLellan all along, and Woodcroft was just his echo.

This PP does nothing aside from hoping McDavid will do stuff on the right wall. Lucic apparently is coached to never screen a goalie (he would lose his spot on the PP if he wasn't listening right?...right?). Freakin Lander was 10 times the net front presence under Nelson than Lucic is right now. Everyone else hangs around the perimeter most of the time. We refuse to put any right shooter out there so McDavid is always passing across players bodies, unless they are OK having their back to the net. It's just...ugh.


Ya, despite an okay overall percentage, the PP doesn't really generate much at all.

27th in the NHL in SF/60 at 46.2
25th in CF/60 at 87.0

I know it's easy to pile on after a loss,but I've tried to avoid saying anything negative after wins. But really this is a pretty average team, and despite a solid start points wise, I dont think they're a playoff team.

-2 in goal differential. I didn't discover this, but I've been saying for a couple years now, teams with negative goal differentials rarely make the playoffs. Yes, it's early and they're only -2, but a few more weeks and some divisional games and we'll have a pretty good idea of how this season is going to shake out.

At 5x5 the Oilers are pretty average. 19th in CF% at 48.9% and 12th in SF% at 51.0% (this is the one number that gives me hope right now).

Good to Leon have a good night, he needs to contribute consistently at 5x5 and he hasn't really been doing that. By the numbers he got crushed by CHI and WAS and was decent against NSH and PIT (but given those teams, probably meant he played pretty well, just to break even).

Overall, the Oilers are kind of treading water (but have banked some points despite a very tough schedule, which is great), but McLellan has been going to the whip and running his top line/pair/goalie ragged pretty much from the start of the season. The one interesting thing we'll find out is how sustainable this is.

Maybe the most glaring tell is that Rattie is out and this team can't replace him.





This is the essence of the issue. The roster is not strong past the first line. And the coach isn't the sort of coach who can get players to consistently perform above their level. I still think it's possible for McDavid to will the team to the playoffs like Hall did in NJ last year, but it would be a short run and would only extend the careers of the coach and GM.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721413 is a reply to message #721412 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 10:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 10:45

Goose wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 09:08

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 20:49


Not just the players, it's the strategy as well. We're still playing Woodcroft's PP, there's so little creativity out there. Krueger and Nelson had lesser lineups than this whipping pucks around creating shots at open nets. Neither of those guys had McDavid and Drai. This PP is just a disaster right from square 1, the guy in charge, which I have to believe now has been McLellan all along, and Woodcroft was just his echo.

This PP does nothing aside from hoping McDavid will do stuff on the right wall. Lucic apparently is coached to never screen a goalie (he would lose his spot on the PP if he wasn't listening right?...right?). Freakin Lander was 10 times the net front presence under Nelson than Lucic is right now. Everyone else hangs around the perimeter most of the time. We refuse to put any right shooter out there so McDavid is always passing across players bodies, unless they are OK having their back to the net. It's just...ugh.


Ya, despite an okay overall percentage, the PP doesn't really generate much at all.

27th in the NHL in SF/60 at 46.2
25th in CF/60 at 87.0

I know it's easy to pile on after a loss,but I've tried to avoid saying anything negative after wins. But really this is a pretty average team, and despite a solid start points wise, I dont think they're a playoff team.

-2 in goal differential. I didn't discover this, but I've been saying for a couple years now, teams with negative goal differentials rarely make the playoffs. Yes, it's early and they're only -2, but a few more weeks and some divisional games and we'll have a pretty good idea of how this season is going to shake out.

At 5x5 the Oilers are pretty average. 19th in CF% at 48.9% and 12th in SF% at 51.0% (this is the one number that gives me hope right now).

Good to Leon have a good night, he needs to contribute consistently at 5x5 and he hasn't really been doing that. By the numbers he got crushed by CHI and WAS and was decent against NSH and PIT (but given those teams, probably meant he played pretty well, just to break even).

Overall, the Oilers are kind of treading water (but have banked some points despite a very tough schedule, which is great), but McLellan has been going to the whip and running his top line/pair/goalie ragged pretty much from the start of the season. The one interesting thing we'll find out is how sustainable this is.

Maybe the most glaring tell is that Rattie is out and this team can't replace him.





This is the essence of the issue. The roster is not strong past the first line. And the coach isn't the sort of coach who can get players to consistently perform above their level. I still think it's possible for McDavid to will the team to the playoffs like Hall did in NJ last year, but it would be a short run and would only extend the careers of the coach and GM.


I honestly wonder how any players could ever get a rhythm or build chemistry when the coaches sole focus is to get McDavid as much ice time as humanly possibly and everyone else is just being line blendered with minimal ice time. We're basically a basketball team with the coach saying "Pass it to Will (McDavid)". "Hey! McDavid caught his breath, GTHO the ice ya bums so I can get him back out there!!"



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721415 is a reply to message #721412 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 11:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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CrudeRemarks wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 10:45

Goose wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 09:08

Kr55 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 20:49


Not just the players, it's the strategy as well. We're still playing Woodcroft's PP, there's so little creativity out there. Krueger and Nelson had lesser lineups than this whipping pucks around creating shots at open nets. Neither of those guys had McDavid and Drai. This PP is just a disaster right from square 1, the guy in charge, which I have to believe now has been McLellan all along, and Woodcroft was just his echo.

This PP does nothing aside from hoping McDavid will do stuff on the right wall. Lucic apparently is coached to never screen a goalie (he would lose his spot on the PP if he wasn't listening right?...right?). Freakin Lander was 10 times the net front presence under Nelson than Lucic is right now. Everyone else hangs around the perimeter most of the time. We refuse to put any right shooter out there so McDavid is always passing across players bodies, unless they are OK having their back to the net. It's just...ugh.


Ya, despite an okay overall percentage, the PP doesn't really generate much at all.

27th in the NHL in SF/60 at 46.2
25th in CF/60 at 87.0

I know it's easy to pile on after a loss,but I've tried to avoid saying anything negative after wins. But really this is a pretty average team, and despite a solid start points wise, I dont think they're a playoff team.

-2 in goal differential. I didn't discover this, but I've been saying for a couple years now, teams with negative goal differentials rarely make the playoffs. Yes, it's early and they're only -2, but a few more weeks and some divisional games and we'll have a pretty good idea of how this season is going to shake out.

At 5x5 the Oilers are pretty average. 19th in CF% at 48.9% and 12th in SF% at 51.0% (this is the one number that gives me hope right now).

Good to Leon have a good night, he needs to contribute consistently at 5x5 and he hasn't really been doing that. By the numbers he got crushed by CHI and WAS and was decent against NSH and PIT (but given those teams, probably meant he played pretty well, just to break even).

Overall, the Oilers are kind of treading water (but have banked some points despite a very tough schedule, which is great), but McLellan has been going to the whip and running his top line/pair/goalie ragged pretty much from the start of the season. The one interesting thing we'll find out is how sustainable this is.

Maybe the most glaring tell is that Rattie is out and this team can't replace him.





This is the essence of the issue. The roster is not strong past the first line. And the coach isn't the sort of coach who can get players to consistently perform above their level. I still think it's possible for McDavid to will the team to the playoffs like Hall did in NJ last year, but it would be a short run and would only extend the careers of the coach and GM.


To illustrate this, I looked at the top 15 scorers in the league and what percentage of their team's goals they are in on.

McDavid is in on 56.25% of the Oilers goals right now. The only ones even in the same stratosphere are Rantanen (51.22%) and Bergeron (51.35%). Sebastian Aho (47.22%) is the only other player over 45%. Even the Kings, with a paltry 22 goals for so far, don't have anyone approaching McDavid's goal share.

The Oilers are 22nd in goals for. Every other top 15 scorer right now is on a team in the top 13 in the league in goals for. They're 13th in goals against, which has kept them somewhat respectable, and they're very good in OT with three extra wins coming that route in the first ten games (and one OTL). But the team's record is hiding some big flaws at the moment, and we saw them in action last night.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721371 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 21:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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That was a thud back to earth again.

Not a great team game, some passengers. Breakout wasn't near what we've seen recently. Just a lack of hunger and tenacity. A team on the arse end of back to backs with a backup just took the lunch money and gave them a wedgie. Last year's penalty kill showed up...hello old friend, lots of lanes and open looks..

Can't settle for a s-it game like this where you crap the bed on the PK and you let clots like Minnesota pull 2 regulation points out of your building. Next game will be telling.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721373 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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Rob Brown being critical about players standing there like a tripod beside the net instead of in front of the net like Chiasson does.




Limecat Logic

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721375 is a reply to message #721373 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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g2k wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:09

Rob Brown being critical about players standing there like a tripod beside the net instead of in front of the net like Chiasson does.




No worries, McLellan will get Chiasson tripoding in no time :)



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721377 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Another 27 minutes for Klefbom tonight. He's currently playing the second most minutes per game of any player in the league. Only Doughty is playing more often.

McDavid with just under 23 minutes. He's #27 in the league (still 1st amongst forwards). Nuge is tied for 5th among forwards and Draisaitl is 26th. They all had over 20 minutes again.

Strategy is still just play the top guys until the wheels fall off, because there's nobody else.

Every player was over 10 minutes tonight though...



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721382 is a reply to message #721377 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:14

Another 27 minutes for Klefbom tonight. He's currently playing the second most minutes per game of any player in the league. Only Doughty is playing more often.

McDavid with just under 23 minutes. He's #27 in the league (still 1st amongst forwards). Nuge is tied for 5th among forwards and Draisaitl is 26th. They all had over 20 minutes again.

Strategy is still just play the top guys until the wheels fall off, because there's nobody else.

Every player was over 10 minutes tonight though...


Strategy is still just play the top guys until the wheels fall off, because the head coach has no idea how to get anything out of anyone else.

Only players that would consistently produce if there was no coach at all succeed over the long term with this coach. Anyone below top 50 in the NHL status need not apply.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721379 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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Rishaug starts going into a question about the PP and McLellan immediately cuts him off and starts blaming the players. Bad passing. Not sharp etc. All Rishaug managed to get out of his mouth was, “Todd was there a common theme with the power play where..”.

Now Gregor being critical of the tripod sitting beside the net on the PP. Gregor didn’t mention who, so the coach had to ask. “You mean Lucic?” I wish Jason would have said, “no I mean Jesse Pujujarvi.

[Updated on: Tue, 30 October 2018 22:19]


Limecat Logic

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721380 is a reply to message #721379 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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g2k wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:16

Rishaug starts going into a question about the PP and McLellan immediately cuts him off and starts blaming the players. Bad passing. Not sharp etc. All Rishaug managed to get out of his mouth was, “Todd was there a common theme with the power play where..”.

Now Gregor being critical of the tripod sitting beside the net on the PP.


Seriously, players must just hate playing for McLellan. It's never his fault, there's nothing wrong with any of the systems...it's just the players execution time and time again...and he's happy to throw them under the bus for it at a second's notice.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721381 is a reply to message #721380 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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Adam wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:18

g2k wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:16

Rishaug starts going into a question about the PP and McLellan immediately cuts him off and starts blaming the players. Bad passing. Not sharp etc. All Rishaug managed to get out of his mouth was, “Todd was there a common theme with the power play where..”.

Now Gregor being critical of the tripod sitting beside the net on the PP.


Seriously, players must just hate playing for McLellan. It's never his fault, there's nothing wrong with any of the systems...it's just the players execution time and time again...and he's happy to throw them under the bus for it at a second's notice.

When Gregor was asking about the net front presence on the poweplay, Todd actually asked if Jason was talking about Lucic.



Limecat Logic

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721383 is a reply to message #721380 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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Adam wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:18

g2k wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 22:16

Rishaug starts going into a question about the PP and McLellan immediately cuts him off and starts blaming the players. Bad passing. Not sharp etc. All Rishaug managed to get out of his mouth was, “Todd was there a common theme with the power play where..”.

Now Gregor being critical of the tripod sitting beside the net on the PP.


Seriously, players must just hate playing for McLellan. It's never his fault, there's nothing wrong with any of the systems...it's just the players execution time and time again...and he's happy to throw them under the bus for it at a second's notice.

He couldn’t even wait for Ryan to finish the freaking question. Just right into piling on his players. He is brutal.



Limecat Logic

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721387 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Anyone see what Caggiula did to deserve a bump up playing with McDavid?

McDavid without Caggiula: 19 CF, 6 CA, High Danger Chances For 9, HDCA 2
McDavid with Caggiula: 3 CF, 5 CA, HDCF 0, HDCA 2

Caggiula neutralizing McDavid. 99% of the time, it works every time.


Just doing that crap period makes this a well earned loss.



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721389 is a reply to message #721387 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 22:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ales Cooper  is currently offline Ales Cooper
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Great first period, but layed off the gas from there. Maybe they expected Minni to get tired and have an easy last half, but dismal special teams (along with a weak as hell call) and a lack of actual team play and frustration cost em.
Wish I could stop saying this, but hopefully they learn.
Strome tho.....oooooffffff.



In fairness to Hall, I've wanted to throw a waterbottle at Eakins all season.
~nullterm 03/22/2014

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721393 is a reply to message #721387 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 23:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Kr55 wrote on Tue, 30 October 2018 21:43

Anyone see what Caggiula did to deserve a bump up playing with McDavid?

McDavid without Caggiula: 19 CF, 6 CA, High Danger Chances For 9, HDCA 2
McDavid with Caggiula: 3 CF, 5 CA, HDCF 0, HDCA 2

Caggiula neutralizing McDavid. 99% of the time, it works every time.


Just doing that crap period makes this a well earned loss.



I think the idea was that Yamo was pretty ineffective, which he was. Answer is not Caggulia obviously. Can't wait for Rattie to get back.

Caggulia is also not good on the PK .. that experiment went bad tonight.



McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks, K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721392 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Tue, 30 October 2018 23:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Smells like old times.

Home Game ... <Check!>
Visiting Team comes in on 2nd game of Back-to-backs ... <Check!>
Visiting Team gets beat badly by the Canucks/Flames in the 1st of the back to backs ... <Check!>
Visiting Team plays back up goalie ... <Check!>
PK is brutal ... <Check!>
PP is brutal ... <Check!>
McDavid plays all World and on the ice most of the game, keeps Oilers in it... <Check!>

Oilers find a way to lose ... <CHECK!>

At least the loss against the Preds was against a great team, this was a winnable game against a beatable team, they squandered a great opportunity in the schedule for 2 points.

That PP was terrible. No way #27 should be put in a position to be doing any stick handling on the PP, instant turnover. Oh.. and what's with #77's blind drop passes at center ice for a trailing McD or LD on the PP break in .. without at least a glance back first .. so many times he's dropped it back to nobody, looks pretty dopey, one day they'll get burned big time!



McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks, K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721394 is a reply to message #721392 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 06:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle  is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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You guys do realize loses will happen throughout the year? Holy man, get back off the edge of the roof a bit. Wow - making to wonder people hate playing in Canada fans or so cynical - I am a Canadian too by the way but holy crap.


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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721396 is a reply to message #721394 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 07:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Magnum  is currently offline Magnum
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It's not the loss per se, it's the manner of the loss. It's that the fundamental issues with the structure of the power play and PK that are still in place after a year of terrible power plays and penalty kills.


2015/2016 - This Kool-Aid tastes like McDavid flavoured Drain-O.
2016/2017 - This Kool-Aid is starting to taste like juice.
2017/2018 - I'm drinking this Kool-Aid, in hopes that it's Drain-O.
2018/2019 - Another round of Drain-O, good sir!

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721398 is a reply to message #721394 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 08:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 06:49

You guys do realize loses will happen throughout the year? Holy man, get back off the edge of the roof a bit. Wow - making to wonder people hate playing in Canada fans or so cynical - I am a Canadian too by the way but holy crap.

Welcome to the website Oilfans!!

I thought Garrison had a tough night. I thought Strome who has been really good and doing everything except score, I didn't think he was that good last night. I didn't think Nurse was very good. I know Yamamoto does some good things but him not scoring yet with McDavid is a problem. Rattie needs to come back soon. I thought Lucic who has been pretty good for most games was extra bad handling the puck. I am waiting for Khaira to wake up. I didn't think Talbot was very good. Caggulia had rough spots. Benning was just so-so, maybe his partner being a train wreck didn't help him.

Stauffer raised the point about teams who don't practice the day before a game often come out sloppy in the first. The Oilers had a CBA day off on Monday so they didn't practice. The team came out guns a blazing in the first and should have had more goals but it didn't happen. After that, they were sloppy. It's an excuse. But at the end of the day, given the schedule they had, I will take a 6-4-1 record.

On the positive, Leon has been looking damn good lately. Stalock for the Wild was outstanding.

[Updated on: Wed, 31 October 2018 08:15]


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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721406 is a reply to message #721398 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 09:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 08:03

clutchlikeeberle wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 06:49

You guys do realize loses will happen throughout the year? Holy man, get back off the edge of the roof a bit. Wow - making to wonder people hate playing in Canada fans or so cynical - I am a Canadian too by the way but holy crap.

Welcome to the website Oilfans!!

I thought Garrison had a tough night. I thought Strome who has been really good and doing everything except score, I didn't think he was that good last night. I didn't think Nurse was very good. I know Yamamoto does some good things but him not scoring yet with McDavid is a problem. Rattie needs to come back soon. I thought Lucic who has been pretty good for most games was extra bad handling the puck. I am waiting for Khaira to wake up. I didn't think Talbot was very good. Caggulia had rough spots. Benning was just so-so, maybe his partner being a train wreck didn't help him.

Stauffer raised the point about teams who don't practice the day before a game often come out sloppy in the first. The Oilers had a CBA day off on Monday so they didn't practice. The team came out guns a blazing in the first and should have had more goals but it didn't happen. After that, they were sloppy. It's an excuse. But at the end of the day, given the schedule they had, I will take a 6-4-1 record.

On the positive, Leon has been looking damn good lately. Stalock for the Wild was outstanding.


The next game will be telling whether this is a disappointing aberration. When you see the team galvanize and play so well against a stack of really good teams, a result like this against clearly a team of lower caliber than they've played, is going to be disappointing. Welcome to fandom, it's a function of people being highly invested in this team through some pretty thin times. Luckily for Oilers ownership, the fanbase has chosen not to be indifferent.

You can generally tell what kind of night it's going to be for LD by watching his feet, if he's got the puck and they're making skating motions it's generally good. If he's got the puck and he's stationary or coasting, it's the opposite. I notice his wheels are a little better, and he's cut back on the turnovers from bad decisions/low percentage passes/dangerous passes.

3 power play goals against says your main penalty killer, your 'tender, didn't shut the door. The Minnesota power play, the juggernaut of 26th going into last night, got too many looks and the Oilers needed another stop or two. So last year....

Yamamoto just hasn't had dangerous opportunities on that line that Rattie did. Probably going to see a change there sooner than later.





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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721408 is a reply to message #721406 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 09:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 09:09

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 08:03

clutchlikeeberle wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 06:49

You guys do realize loses will happen throughout the year? Holy man, get back off the edge of the roof a bit. Wow - making to wonder people hate playing in Canada fans or so cynical - I am a Canadian too by the way but holy crap.

Welcome to the website Oilfans!!

I thought Garrison had a tough night. I thought Strome who has been really good and doing everything except score, I didn't think he was that good last night. I didn't think Nurse was very good. I know Yamamoto does some good things but him not scoring yet with McDavid is a problem. Rattie needs to come back soon. I thought Lucic who has been pretty good for most games was extra bad handling the puck. I am waiting for Khaira to wake up. I didn't think Talbot was very good. Caggulia had rough spots. Benning was just so-so, maybe his partner being a train wreck didn't help him.

Stauffer raised the point about teams who don't practice the day before a game often come out sloppy in the first. The Oilers had a CBA day off on Monday so they didn't practice. The team came out guns a blazing in the first and should have had more goals but it didn't happen. After that, they were sloppy. It's an excuse. But at the end of the day, given the schedule they had, I will take a 6-4-1 record.

On the positive, Leon has been looking damn good lately. Stalock for the Wild was outstanding.


The next game will be telling whether this is a disappointing aberration. When you see the team galvanize and play so well against a stack of really good teams, a result like this against clearly a team of lower caliber than they've played, is going to be disappointing. Welcome to fandom, it's a function of people being highly invested in this team through some pretty thin times. Luckily for Oilers ownership, the fanbase has chosen not to be indifferent.

You can generally tell what kind of night it's going to be for LD by watching his feet, if he's got the puck and they're making skating motions it's generally good. If he's got the puck and he's stationary or coasting, it's the opposite. I notice his wheels are a little better, and he's cut back on the turnovers from bad decisions/low percentage passes/dangerous passes.

3 power play goals against says your main penalty killer, your 'tender, didn't shut the door. The Minnesota power play, the juggernaut of 26th going into last night, got too many looks and the Oilers needed another stop or two. So last year....

Yamamoto just hasn't had dangerous opportunities on that line that Rattie did. Probably going to see a change there sooner than later.




I didn't have Yamamoto on the team this year as I thought he needed at least a year in the AHL. Small guys can play in the NHL now but they need AHL time in my opinion. His preseason dictated he should start in the NHL. While he hasn't been bad, you have to produce something especially when you have played mostly in the top 6 which he has. I think both Yamo and JP should be down in the AHL.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721407 is a reply to message #721394 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 09:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 06:49

You guys do realize loses will happen throughout the year? Holy man, get back off the edge of the roof a bit. Wow - making to wonder people hate playing in Canada fans or so cynical - I am a Canadian too by the way but holy crap.


I might already be a splatter on the pavement. Just alive enough to still complain :)



"The Edmonton Oilers are not where they should be right now and that is unacceptable. We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
-Kevin Lowe, April 2013


"Next year (15/16) I would forecast as another developmental year"
- #2, April 2015

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721414 is a reply to message #721357 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 11:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rocksteady  is currently offline Rocksteady
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Yeah 5 on 5 they looked great, like everyone has said special teams killed them. Some line combos were confusing to me and yes I get why everyone says fire the coach, but I doubt Yawney Gulutzen could do any better, I'm not in that fire TMac camp at all really.

Lucic should be in front of the net but I think he hates it there getting hit by pucks all the time and the crap and abuse form the defenders, it's a hard job and he should do it, but I think he clearly hates it. We need in his prime Smytty, he'd do that all day every day.

Drake needs to sit and then finally leave. Garrison and Benning are also two exceptionally poor defenders.

Chaisson and Reider continue to surprise me. I like being pleasantly surprised.



The very definition of insanity is doing the exact same thing expecting different results.

Generally Disappointed.

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721417 is a reply to message #721414 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 11:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Rocksteady wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:03

Yeah 5 on 5 they looked great, like everyone has said special teams killed them. Some line combos were confusing to me and yes I get why everyone says fire the coach, but I doubt Yawney Gulutzen could do any better, I'm not in that fire TMac camp at all really.

Lucic should be in front of the net but I think he hates it there getting hit by pucks all the time and the crap and abuse form the defenders, it's a hard job and he should do it, but I think he clearly hates it. We need in his prime Smytty, he'd do that all day every day.

Drake needs to sit and then finally leave. Garrison and Benning are also two exceptionally poor defenders.

Chaisson and Reider continue to surprise me. I like being pleasantly surprised.

I am on record as saying I like having a big body in front of the net to screen the goalie, clean up the garbage and create problems in front. If Lucic is indeed reluctant to do that fully, then I would put someone else in that spot.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721423 is a reply to message #721417 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 11:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:14


I am on record as saying I like having a big body in front of the net to screen the goalie, clean up the garbage and create problems in front. If Lucic is indeed reluctant to do that fully, then I would put someone else in that spot.


I think size is over-rated in the net-front presence, especially post 2004 lockout, as defenders aren't given free reign to hammer people with crosschecks like they once were. None of the most effective net-front guys the Oilers have had - Simpson, Smyth, Horcoff - were massive bodies. They were good at tipping pucks, keeping position, getting to rebounds, but we've never had a monster in front who was really effective. I remember Rishaug asking about Laraque in front, but that's the same mistake - size is a nice to have only in that player.

Chiasson's tip last night was pretty sweet - maybe he should be replacing Lucic there. It will be interesting to see if there's any tweaks to the PP now, or if McLellan's stubbornness continues.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721425 is a reply to message #721423 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 12:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
OilMJMOil  is currently offline OilMJMOil
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Adam wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:53



Chiasson's tip last night was pretty sweet - maybe he should be replacing Lucic there. It will be interesting to see if there's any tweaks to the PP now, or if McLellan's stubbornness continues.


If TMac has shown us anything, it’s that his stubbornness will continue.




2016: We need to get heavier, and we need a defenseman!

2018: We need to get faster, and we need a defenseman!

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721426 is a reply to message #721425 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 12:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
GabbyDugan  is currently offline GabbyDugan
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....a few lineup tweaks at the morning practice....

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/blog-practice-updates-1031/c -301469200?tid=281885062


..."Kris Russell is not skating.

Lines at practice appear to be:

Nugent-Hopkins - McDavid - Caggiula/Rattie

Rieder - Draisaitl - Chiasson/Yamamoto

Lucic - Strome - Puljujarvi

Khaira - Brodziak - Kassian

Defence:

Klefbom - Larsson

Nurse - Bouchard

Garrison - Benning"...

.....didn't notice anything in last night's game that might be keeping Kris Russell out of the lineup....maybe just a maintenance day....

....good to see Chaisson get a chance to move up an of course Puljujarvi get a shot....





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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721429 is a reply to message #721426 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 13:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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GabbyDugan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:46

....a few lineup tweaks at the morning practice....

https://www.nhl.com/oilers/news/blog-practice-updates-1031/c -301469200?tid=281885062


..."Kris Russell is not skating.

Lines at practice appear to be:

Nugent-Hopkins - McDavid - Caggiula/Rattie

Rieder - Draisaitl - Chiasson/Yamamoto

Lucic - Strome - Puljujarvi

Khaira - Brodziak - Kassian

Defence:

Klefbom - Larsson

Nurse - Bouchard

Garrison - Benning"...

.....didn't notice anything in last night's game that might be keeping Kris Russell out of the lineup....maybe just a maintenance day....

....good to see Chaisson get a chance to move up an of course Puljujarvi get a shot....




Russell probably blocked a shot somewhere..
What happened to Gravel, did he go back?

So who comes out if PulJu and Rattie come in?



McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks, K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier

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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721431 is a reply to message #721429 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 15:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Skookum Jim wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 13:39


Russell probably blocked a shot somewhere..
What happened to Gravel, did he go back?

So who comes out if PulJu and Rattie come in?



I didn't see the transaction, but Gravel must have been sent back - if we have Puljujarvi, Marody and Bouchard as the healthy scratches, they would have had to demote Gravel again...and Marody will have to go once the Oilers activate Rattie, barring another injury.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721427 is a reply to message #721423 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 12:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:53

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:14


I am on record as saying I like having a big body in front of the net to screen the goalie, clean up the garbage and create problems in front. If Lucic is indeed reluctant to do that fully, then I would put someone else in that spot.


I think size is over-rated in the net-front presence, especially post 2004 lockout, as defenders aren't given free reign to hammer people with crosschecks like they once were. None of the most effective net-front guys the Oilers have had - Simpson, Smyth, Horcoff - were massive bodies. They were good at tipping pucks, keeping position, getting to rebounds, but we've never had a monster in front who was really effective. I remember Rishaug asking about Laraque in front, but that's the same mistake - size is a nice to have only in that player.

Chiasson's tip last night was pretty sweet - maybe he should be replacing Lucic there. It will be interesting to see if there's any tweaks to the PP now, or if McLellan's stubbornness continues.


We will disagree then on size. When a lot of the starters are 6'3 or bigger - Talbot is 6'4. Having Caggulia who is 5'10, Rieder who is 5'11, or Yamamoto who is 5'8 and lighter than a lot of highschool students is not providing much of a screen and I have a hard time believing he will be able to hold his position in front of the goal vs almost anyone. You aren't putting Nuge, Leon, McDavid in front of the goal. If you have a problem with Lucic and his skill on the PP then Brodziak, Kassian and Khaira should be scratched because they are less offensive than Lucic. I might be wrong but I don't see Rattie who's hurt or Strome being a good net front guy. So now you are down to Lucic, Chiasson, Puljujarvi.

In my opinion, unless the goalie sucks, at this level if he sees it, he will stop almost every one.



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721430 is a reply to message #721427 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 13:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
jds308  is currently offline jds308
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:47

Adam wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:53

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:14


I am on record as saying I like having a big body in front of the net to screen the goalie, clean up the garbage and create problems in front. If Lucic is indeed reluctant to do that fully, then I would put someone else in that spot.


I think size is over-rated in the net-front presence, especially post 2004 lockout, as defenders aren't given free reign to hammer people with crosschecks like they once were. None of the most effective net-front guys the Oilers have had - Simpson, Smyth, Horcoff - were massive bodies. They were good at tipping pucks, keeping position, getting to rebounds, but we've never had a monster in front who was really effective. I remember Rishaug asking about Laraque in front, but that's the same mistake - size is a nice to have only in that player.

Chiasson's tip last night was pretty sweet - maybe he should be replacing Lucic there. It will be interesting to see if there's any tweaks to the PP now, or if McLellan's stubbornness continues.


We will disagree then on size. When a lot of the starters are 6'3 or bigger - Talbot is 6'4. Having Caggulia who is 5'10, Rieder who is 5'11, or Yamamoto who is 5'8 and lighter than a lot of highschool students is not providing much of a screen and I have a hard time believing he will be able to hold his position in front of the goal vs almost anyone. You aren't putting Nuge, Leon, McDavid in front of the goal. If you have a problem with Lucic and his skill on the PP then Brodziak, Kassian and Khaira should be scratched because they are less offensive than Lucic. I might be wrong but I don't see Rattie who's hurt or Strome being a good net front guy. So now you are down to Lucic, Chiasson, Puljujarvi.

In my opinion, unless the goalie sucks, at this level if he sees it, he will stop almost every one.


I would give Chiasson a crack at that spot. He's been hot, so Tmac can show he's rewarding someone, plus he's been hot so maybe he helps with the PP. Move Lucic to the 2nd unit, they couldn't do any less at this point.

Oh wait, Chaisson shoots right. Dam, deal breaker...



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 Re: Review: Minnesota @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #721432 is a reply to message #721427 ]
Wed, 31 October 2018 15:37 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 12:47

Adam wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:53

RDOilerfan wrote on Wed, 31 October 2018 11:14


I am on record as saying I like having a big body in front of the net to screen the goalie, clean up the garbage and create problems in front. If Lucic is indeed reluctant to do that fully, then I would put someone else in that spot.


I think size is over-rated in the net-front presence, especially post 2004 lockout, as defenders aren't given free reign to hammer people with crosschecks like they once were. None of the most effective net-front guys the Oilers have had - Simpson, Smyth, Horcoff - were massive bodies. They were good at tipping pucks, keeping position, getting to rebounds, but we've never had a monster in front who was really effective. I remember Rishaug asking about Laraque in front, but that's the same mistake - size is a nice to have only in that player.

Chiasson's tip last night was pretty sweet - maybe he should be replacing Lucic there. It will be interesting to see if there's any tweaks to the PP now, or if McLellan's stubbornness continues.


We will disagree then on size. When a lot of the starters are 6'3 or bigger - Talbot is 6'4. Having Caggulia who is 5'10, Rieder who is 5'11, or Yamamoto who is 5'8 and lighter than a lot of highschool students is not providing much of a screen and I have a hard time believing he will be able to hold his position in front of the goal vs almost anyone. You aren't putting Nuge, Leon, McDavid in front of the goal. If you have a problem with Lucic and his skill on the PP then Brodziak, Kassian and Khaira should be scratched because they are less offensive than Lucic. I might be wrong but I don't see Rattie who's hurt or Strome being a good net front guy. So now you are down to Lucic, Chiasson, Puljujarvi.

In my opinion, unless the goalie sucks, at this level if he sees it, he will stop almost every one.


The puck is coming from low, and goalies tend to crouch, so you don't have to be taller than the goalie to provide an adequate screen. You'll note, I never said put Yamamoto in that spot - I think he may have issues holding position against big defenders.

I'm saying that simply being big isn't enough and that a smaller guy who can actually do any of the required skills is better than Lucic - who doesn't even screen well, since he typically spins to the side whenever a shot looks like it might come through. Size doesn't help you at all if you're simply standing off to the side of the goalie watching the play.

For what it's worth, I would try Draisaitl in front of the net. He's got great hands and an ability to get to loose pucks. He's got a good sense for when McDavid is going to pass to him, and, as an added bonus, he is also big. I'd have Nugent-Hopkins in Draisaitl's spot and a right shot where Nuge is standing - preferably Puljujarvi, as I think he's got the best shot, but I could be convinced to try Chiasson for a spell, or even Yamamoto.

Lucic is a no-brainer to move to the second unit, because he's showing bad plays every night, and only a couple of good plays on the PP all season.



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