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 Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612700]
Fri, 01 November 2013 14:54 Go to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
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Registered: February 2007
Location: Fort McMurray

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I'm giving Dallas Eakins time to get these players to learn his system (that's all we can do as fans besides jump ship elsewhere) but truth to it I don't believe that all these players are cut out for the type of (winning?)Hockey he has in store for us. By the time we are winning I don't expect half the team we have to even be here... AT LEAST A FEW 4-5 changes and I think that's fair to say.
2 top 4 defenders to grow into top2 d men, 1 Veteran goalie to teach Dubie, 1 top 6 center & 1 winger perferably power forward who can play solid bottom 6 but step up.

Players I don't see here long term. Yakupov, Nick Schultz, Ryan Smyth(37), Eager, MacIntyre, Gazdik, Arcobello, LaBarbera. So that's 8.

Which has me thinking, which players should MacT target to help Eakins out.
Eakins wants players smart with and without the puck, who hit and shoot, back check and can save the goalie not just give the team an easy win like we have been.
I'm sure he wants our power play and penalty kill to be much better as well despite what we have seen thus far.

Here's my list so far.
Wayne Simmons (gritty power forward who can score)
Marcus Foligno
Brandon Dubinsky
Dan Girardi


Craig Anderson would be a huge upgrade in net and rumor has it he's available in Ottawa.

There's not much we can throw money at for the UFAs at the end of season.
Quincy, Klesla, Greene & Girardi for Defense.
Hiller, Halak & Elliot for Net.
Statsny, Grabovski, Boyle, Konopka for Center.
Winnik, Sutter, Kulemin, Downie & Yip for wing


[Updated on: Fri, 01 November 2013 15:42]


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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612703 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Fri, 01 November 2013 15:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Location: Edmonton, AB

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NCREDiBLE wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 14:54

I'm giving Dallas Eakins time to get these players to learn his system (that's all we can do as fans besides jump ship elsewhere) but truth to it I don't believe that all these players are cut out for the type of (winning?)Hockey he has in store for us. By the time we are winning I don't expect half the team we have to even be here.

Which has me thinking, which players should MacT target to help Eakins out.
Eakins wants players smart with and without the puck, who hit and shoot, back check and can save the goalie not just give the team an easy win like we have been.
I'm sure he wants our power play and penalty kill to be much better as well despite what we have seen thus far.

Here's my list so far.
Wayne Simmons (gritty power forward who can score)
Marcus Foligno
Brandon Dubinsky

Craig Anderson would be a huge upgrade in net and rumor has it he's available in Ottawa.

There's not much we can throw money at for the UFAs at the end of season.
Quincy, Klesla, Greene & Girardi for Defense.
Hiller, Halak & Elliot for Net.
Statsny, Grabovski, Boyle, Konopka for Center.
Winnik, Sutter, Kulemin, Downie & Yip for wing



Half the team, eh?

So with a roster of 23 players, you believe we're about a dozen players short of being a competitive team? That will take 2-3 years to have that much change.

Maybe, just maybe stability would be more valuable than changing over 30-35% of the roster every year?

And we already brought in a bunch of players from outside the organization this year, and the Perrons, Gordons, Ferences, etc. have also struggled with the new system and made their fair share of the mistakes.

Seriously, people have to stop looking at this like these players just can't get it done, because we've regularly had big changes the last few summers and managed the same thing over and over. We bring in a guy, we rave about the signing, we watch him come in and the same things happen. It's not just about the personnel any more. It's not just the coaching. It's the whole organization that has issues, and they stop when the expectation becomes that the team can be successful as is...and doesn't need more pieces from outside the organization to get there.

Will there still be changes? Yes. There will always be tweaks. However, the personnel we have can be successful, and the team has to let the players know that it's on them and that they're expected to be successful.

Look at Nashville. Year after year, people look at that team, realize that outside of a couple of great players, they have assembled an absolute pop-gun offence. And yet they contend for the playoffs every year.

Look at Detroit. At the start of last season, someone (v4nce maybe?) declared the team dead without Lidstrom. They made the semi-finals. They don't have the same personnel, but they succeed anyhow. I've used the examples before of Ottawa without Spezza and Karlsson and Los Angeles during the Dave King era, when they were setting records for most man-games lost and still contending for playoff spots year after year.

Saying we need someone who isn't on the roster is giving the current roster an excuse for why they can't succeed. The organization saying they badly need a power forward, a #1 defenceman and possibly an upgrade in net is telling the players that management doesn't believe they can do it. And it allows Hall and Nugent-Hopkins and Eberle and Yakupov and Schultz etc. to go home at night and say to themselves, "Well, I'm giving it my all, but we need them to hurry up and get that power forward and #1 defenceman if we're ever going to be successful." The team needs to let them know that this is the group. We have three #1 overall picks, a guy who's on a lot of people's short list for Team Canada in Eberle and a guy in Schultz that had the whole league bidding on his services a couple summers ago.

It's time to tell these guys we have enough pieces in place and there's no damn reason for them to fail, so stop thinking that there's any help coming. Don't hope for another coaching change. It's not happening and you're going to have to succeed under this one. Don't look at the GMs office, because there's no more help from there. Look at each other, figure out how to win and just damn well get it done.



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612705 is a reply to message #612703 ]
Fri, 01 November 2013 15:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
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I was in a rush posting, should have held off until I was ready.
Just killing time here at site.

I over exaggerated half the team needing to be changed.
Honestly the defense in my opinion could use three new faces at LEAST two top4 defenders as we won't be getting a top two anytime soon.

Nurse will be one of those.

Center needs to be fixed, Arco & Gagner don't seem right as a fit for me with Nuge there.
Nuge and Gordon right on, throw in a Dubinsky there or Statsny and we add strength that scores.
I like Gagner a lot he's gritty but he's small and two top 6 centres that small? I don't know.
Move Gags to wing?

The goalies need to be changed up, keep Dubnyk as a back up as we have invested so much and bring in a vet to teach him and guide him. Anderson from Ottawa

"Players I don't see here long term. Yakupov, Nick Schultz, Ryan Smyth(37), Eager, MacIntyre, Gazdik, Arcobello, LaBarbera. So that's 8." I edited that into original comment and that I believe we do need at LEAST 5 additions.

[Updated on: Fri, 01 November 2013 15:44]


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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612706 is a reply to message #612703 ]
Fri, 01 November 2013 15:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
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So what is it that makes the Phoenix's and the Nashvilles so good?
Poor offense, yet great solid defense and great coaching?

It's frustrating to watch teams that you know you have way better players than make the playoffs each year while we are on year 8 of no post season.

Great post Adam always enjoy your postings.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612708 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Fri, 01 November 2013 16:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
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I think if the Oilers could make three significant trades, and two significant signings, we'd be better off. This is kind of who I write down in marker:

Hall / RNH / Yakupov (or Eberle)
Perron / ________ / ________
______ / Gordon / Hemsky
Joensuu / _________ / Pitlick
Gazdic, Arcobello


_______ / Schultz
Smid / Petry
Nurse / Ference
Belov

_______
Bachman

1RW - One of Eberle or Yakupov slots in here. I think my preference would be Yakupov, since he's essentially a rookie and on an entry-level deal (I also like his upside).

2C - Brandon Dubinsky is my guy. Perfect fit for the Oilers. I'd see if the Oilers could send Gagner + Lander to the Jackets for Dubinsky + Jenner.

2RW - UFA signing. Hopefully Ryan Callahan or Steve Downie, but perhaps Nikolai Kulemin is an option also. Those guys will be sought after though, and I'm not sure why Edmonton would top the list.

3LW - Not sure here. Mason Raymond was my pick to play with these guys last summer, but he's probably priced himself beyond. Maybe you move Joensuu and re-sign Ryan Jones for the fourth line.

1D - This is who you'd be moving Eberle or Yakupov for, and there's only a handful of players that would fit this description for me. They need to be young, need to not be entering in UFA very soon, preferably a LH shot since we are loaded on the right side, and need to be studs who play hard minutes and big minutes. Oliver Ekman-Larsson and Victor Hedman would be two of them. Ryan McDonagh might be another. Apparently Kulikov is available, and I like him, but he's nowhere close enough to a return for one of those guys. There's not many and the guys who meet my criteria may not be available and if they don't, I'm hanging onto both guys (solving the 3LW problem).

1G - A decision needs to be made here. You could try to re-sign Dubnyk. You could try to sign someone like Halak or Hiller. Or you could try to trade for James Reimer. My preference is Reimer, but Toronto would have to be willing to take picks and prospects (Marincin, Klefbom) in return.

It's fun to play armchair GM, but the truth is, it's also pretty easy. We can add players to our teams who very well might be unavailable. We can propose trades that seem fair, but teams might rather stick with what they know rather than what they don't. In other words, I enjoy this type of thread, but I also understand that likely the very guys that I think would make this team better are currently making their own clubs better and MacTavish's job is much harder than my own.

[Updated on: Fri, 01 November 2013 17:50]


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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612751 is a reply to message #612708 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hemmer2Eberle  is currently offline Hemmer2Eberle
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mightyreasoner wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 16:32




_______ / Schultz
Smid / Petry
Nurse / Ference
Belov

_______


How do you slot Belov as the 7th D man when he has already outplayed both Smid and Schultz?



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612755 is a reply to message #612751 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
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Hemmer2Eberle wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:47

mightyreasoner wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 16:32




_______ / Schultz
Smid / Petry
Nurse / Ference
Belov

_______


How do you slot Belov as the 7th D man when he has already outplayed both Smid and Schultz?


Good problem to have, right? I mean if Belov is outplaying Smid, you play him instead of Smid (although Petry and Smid have been the only consistent pairing the Oilers have had since Gilbert/Whitney). If Nurse needs a night off, you play Belov instead of Nurse. I think you have to continue to play Justin Schultz since the team is relying heavily on him, but Belov will get his minutes.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612757 is a reply to message #612755 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 11:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hemmer2Eberle  is currently offline Hemmer2Eberle
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mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:52

Hemmer2Eberle wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:47

mightyreasoner wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 16:32




_______ / Schultz
Smid / Petry
Nurse / Ference
Belov

_______


How do you slot Belov as the 7th D man when he has already outplayed both Smid and Schultz?


Good problem to have, right? I mean if Belov is outplaying Smid, you play him instead of Smid (although Petry and Smid have been the only consistent pairing the Oilers have had since Gilbert/Whitney). If Nurse needs a night off, you play Belov instead of Nurse. I think you have to continue to play Justin Schultz since the team is relying heavily on him, but Belov will get his minutes.

I'm starting to get the feeling Schultz might not be what we had wanted him to be. Or maybe he just needs to be sent down for some good ol conditioning.

Personally I think Smid should go. He's mediocre, and Belov could do his job, and more without a problem.

Nurse needs a year in the AHL IMO as well. So my 7th D man is going to be either Larsen, or Smid if we can trade him.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612725 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Fri, 01 November 2013 22:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
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Will someone please explain to me the perpetual obsession that everyone has with Wayne SimmonDs? I seriously don't get it. Like, did everyone see the same replay where he killed Loki or something?

Unrelated: Joel Ward had a hat trick tonight. Maybe he's a guy we should target?



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612733 is a reply to message #612725 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 00:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ronster  is currently offline ronster
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hmc wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 21:44

Will someone please explain to me the perpetual obsession that everyone has with Wayne SimmonDs? I seriously don't get it. Like, did everyone see the same replay where he killed Loki or something?

Unrelated: Joel Ward had a hat trick tonight. Maybe he's a guy we should target?


Did you see what Simmonds did in that game by starting that line brawl? Literally ran over the defenseman and started chucking mitts with the next guy. That's a guy who was embarrassed like his team but stood up and did something. Unlike the oilers who get manhandled most of the time.

Damn rights I would love him here.



Adam wrote


Maybe it's fitting to have found religion in the room because on most nights this team doesn't have a prayer.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612738 is a reply to message #612733 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 08:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
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Loved your comment on Simmonds.

Hall / Dubinsky / Perron
Simmonds / Nuge / Eberle
Joensuu / Gordon / Hemsky
Jones / Konopka / Pitlick
Gazdic Arcobella(Acton)

Ehrhoff / Schultz
Smid / Girardi(Petry) If we trade Petry.
Belov / Ference
Fedun Larsen

Anderson
Dubnyk

This is the team I'd try out.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612741 is a reply to message #612733 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 09:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
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ronster wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 02:53

Did you see what Simmonds did in that game by starting that line brawl? Literally ran over the defenseman and started chucking mitts with the next guy. That's a guy who was embarrassed like his team but stood up and did something. Unlike the oilers who get manhandled most of the time.

Damn rights I would love him here.


I'm not at all against having a player like that, I just don't understand why, for years now, everyone's been obsessed with Simmonds specifically. He's an average player.



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612747 is a reply to message #612741 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rekkin  is currently offline Rekkin
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I do think Philly would be a good trade partner for the Oil. Both teams need to shake things up a bit and there are definitely a few players I would love to steal from them.


The people you are sure are wrong are just as sure that you are wrong. The only difference is they're wrong. - God @TheTweetOfGod

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612748 is a reply to message #612741 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
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Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612750 is a reply to message #612748 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
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Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?


I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612763 is a reply to message #612750 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 11:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
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mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?




I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.


That is why adding pieces like Lander & Marincin because of the UFA status of Hemsky. The Downie for Talbot trade has no Bering on a guy like Hemsky. Those guys are 3rd liners and not top 6 forwards. Downie has a little bit of offence, but has never been a consistent top 6 forward.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612769 is a reply to message #612763 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 11:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:38

mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?




I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.


That is why adding pieces like Lander & Marincin because of the UFA status of Hemsky. The Downie for Talbot trade has no Bering on a guy like Hemsky. Those guys are 3rd liners and not top 6 forwards. Downie has a little bit of offence, but has never been a consistent top 6 forward.



Marc Staal was invited to Team Canada's camp. I think he's going to have a little more value than an expiring contract and two prospects.

And I think he might be overrated anyhow. He's a great guy if you draft him or if you get him when he's young and his team is frustrated with him (see Greene, Matt) but you give up too much for him in a trade mid-career and you end up looking foolish when you realize he brings only average offence and he's had some major concussion issues that could end his hockey career early.



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612791 is a reply to message #612769 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 16:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
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Adam wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:54

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:38

mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?




I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.


That is why adding pieces like Lander & Marincin because of the UFA status of Hemsky. The Downie for Talbot trade has no Bering on a guy like Hemsky. Those guys are 3rd liners and not top 6 forwards. Downie has a little bit of offence, but has never been a consistent top 6 forward.



Marc Staal was invited to Team Canada's camp. I think he's going to have a little more value than an expiring contract and two prospects.

And I think he might be overrated anyhow. He's a great guy if you draft him or if you get him when he's young and his team is frustrated with him (see Greene, Matt) but you give up too much for him in a trade mid-career and you end up looking foolish when you realize he brings only average offence and he's had some major concussion issues that could end his hockey career early.


Totally disagree with you on Staal. He is a very big, mobile guy who plays smart & loves to take the body. Every team needs that and obviously we need that desperately IMO. Sometimes if a team is thinking differently on a guy (like I believe the Rangers are with Staal) then you can maybe try and pry him out of there with some decent stuff they might find useful & attractive. I think he could be had for a 2nd liner, a middling blue liner, & a high end Defensive prospect.
We have enough of all of these to get it done IMO. Just have to see what the Rangers are thinking & what they believe Staal is worth.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612803 is a reply to message #612791 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 19:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 16:02

Adam wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:54

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:38

mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?




I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.


That is why adding pieces like Lander & Marincin because of the UFA status of Hemsky. The Downie for Talbot trade has no Bering on a guy like Hemsky. Those guys are 3rd liners and not top 6 forwards. Downie has a little bit of offence, but has never been a consistent top 6 forward.



Marc Staal was invited to Team Canada's camp. I think he's going to have a little more value than an expiring contract and two prospects.

And I think he might be overrated anyhow. He's a great guy if you draft him or if you get him when he's young and his team is frustrated with him (see Greene, Matt) but you give up too much for him in a trade mid-career and you end up looking foolish when you realize he brings only average offence and he's had some major concussion issues that could end his hockey career early.


Totally disagree with you on Staal. He is a very big, mobile guy who plays smart & loves to take the body. Every team needs that and obviously we need that desperately IMO. Sometimes if a team is thinking differently on a guy (like I believe the Rangers are with Staal) then you can maybe try and pry him out of there with some decent stuff they might find useful & attractive. I think he could be had for a 2nd liner, a middling blue liner, & a high end Defensive prospect.
We have enough of all of these to get it done IMO. Just have to see what the Rangers are thinking & what they believe Staal is worth.



I think the only GMs that make that deal are on EA Sports games. No chance the Rangers trade Staal for spare parts.



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612804 is a reply to message #612803 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 19:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nullterm  is currently offline nullterm
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Only if it's Jared.


Illegitimi non carborundum.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612825 is a reply to message #612803 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 20:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
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Adam wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 19:10

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 16:02

Adam wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:54

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 11:38

mightyreasoner wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:44

Jakey wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 10:39

Sometimes you have to take some risks & trade for certain players that have a style of,play that you want except they are not havin a good year for various reasons. Also, I believe when looking for a trade when you are trading from a point of weakness because of,your own teams deficiencies then you need to look for another team that is having struggles as well.

When I look at the Rangers I think they are a good fit for us in a trade & have a struggling player we could get a little cheaper than in the past.

Marc Staal is who I would target. The Rangers need scoring up front and we need a shut-down dman on the back. The only player that might be attractive to them without trading away a bunch of future is Hemsky IMO. Maybe something like Hemsky, lander & Maricin for Stall & Boyle? Not sure on this, but just throwing out some kind of option that may give us the top 4 dman that could play the shutdown role. I realize Staal is coming off a huge injury, but I think he has the pedigree & character we could really use. The money lines up pretty close in my offer and also would give the Rangers a touch of cap space if they only keep Hemsky on the big club.

Thoughts out there on this?




I don't think you are going to get much for Hemsky as a pending UFA. You look at the return on Downie, and it was Max Talbot... Hemsky might be worth more than that, but I don't think he get you Marc Staal.

As it is, I don't think Hemsky's trade value is all that high, and he brings more to the Oilers than any player a trade of him would bring back. IF the Oilers are wanting to move a RWer, it might be best to re-sign Hemsky and move one of Yakupov, Eberle or Gagner. All three guys will bring in a much, much larger return, and Hemsky can seamlessly play in that Top-6 in their place. I'm not anxious to move any of them, but if we are looking for a quality return, we might have to look outside of 83.


That is why adding pieces like Lander & Marincin because of the UFA status of Hemsky. The Downie for Talbot trade has no Bering on a guy like Hemsky. Those guys are 3rd liners and not top 6 forwards. Downie has a little bit of offence, but has never been a consistent top 6 forward.



Marc Staal was invited to Team Canada's camp. I think he's going to have a little more value than an expiring contract and two prospects.

And I think he might be overrated anyhow. He's a great guy if you draft him or if you get him when he's young and his team is frustrated with him (see Greene, Matt) but you give up too much for him in a trade mid-career and you end up looking foolish when you realize he brings only average offence and he's had some major concussion issues that could end his hockey career early.


Totally disagree with you on Staal. He is a very big, mobile guy who plays smart & loves to take the body. Every team needs that and obviously we need that desperately IMO. Sometimes if a team is thinking differently on a guy (like I believe the Rangers are with Staal) then you can maybe try and pry him out of there with some decent stuff they might find useful & attractive. I think he could be had for a 2nd liner, a middling blue liner, & a high end Defensive prospect.
We have enough of all of these to get it done IMO. Just have to see what the Rangers are thinking & what they believe Staal is worth.



I think the only GMs that make that deal are on EA Sports games. No chance the Rangers trade Staal for spare parts.


I guess you are a genius to all things hockey!



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612753 is a reply to message #612725 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Hibernia  is currently offline Hibernia
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hmc wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 02:14

Unrelated: Joel Ward had a hat trick tonight. Maybe he's a guy we should target?


Because he's a big body who's not afraid to bang? Or because he scored three goals last night? Last night just upped the price. He was probably more attainable beforehand. And just as desirable.

You're right though, we do need a couple of guys like that. We need a new version of MGM line, where you could count on that line playing against the other teams top lines, throwing a few hits and almost every year one of 'em would pop in 20. Gordon might be the start of it. But unlike mightyreasoner I don't believe you can expect the remaining RW to be one of 'em. Move him up a notch.



Kool-Aid Addict!

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612764 is a reply to message #612753 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 11:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
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Hibernia wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 12:50

hmc wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 02:14

Unrelated: Joel Ward had a hat trick tonight. Maybe he's a guy we should target?


Because he's a big body who's not afraid to bang? Or because he scored three goals last night? Last night just upped the price. He was probably more attainable beforehand. And just as desirable.

You're right though, we do need a couple of guys like that. We need a new version of MGM line, where you could count on that line playing against the other teams top lines, throwing a few hits and almost every year one of 'em would pop in 20. Gordon might be the start of it. But unlike mightyreasoner I don't believe you can expect the remaining RW to be one of 'em. Move him up a notch.


Yeah, just a guy that can score, be responsible on a line with Gordon, and otherwise just provide some size. Again, I'm not against Simmonds, I just don't get the specific love for him. Lots of guys out there, none of whom should require giving up anything too major up to get them.



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612762 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 11:35 Go to previous messageGo to next message
the flying stortini  is currently offline the flying stortini
Messages: 634
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NCREDiBLE wrote on Fri, 01 November 2013 14:54


Craig Anderson would be a huge upgrade in net and rumor has it he's available in Ottawa



Sadly he was also available for better money than Khabbi four years ago. But realistically we wouldn't have the kids if we had a solid goalie the past few years.



http://i1186.photobucket.com/albums/z364/stortswasanoiler/Untitled-1.jpg中 RED DRAGONS 中
rukm01 wrote on Sun, 01 July 2012 21:54

Souray is a Duck is one letter away from being totally accurate.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612774 is a reply to message #612762 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 12:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
Messages: 1369
Registered: February 2007
Location: Fort McMurray

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Marc Staal would be awesome but the only way you're getting him is one of the big four.
So you better hope Yakupov finds his game, right now you'd be lucky to get Boyle for Hemsky.
Hemsky is worth most to the Oilers, I hope he's re-signed at a contract like iginlas.
Play a certain amount of games and get so many points and receive bonuses. But he needs a lower pay. $3.5M - $4m tops and I honestly don't even like thinking 4, with what he's brought last few years.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612775 is a reply to message #612774 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 12:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
Messages: 4054
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NCREDiBLE wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 14:22

Marc Staal would be awesome but the only way you're getting him is one of the big four.
So you better hope Yakupov finds his game, right now you'd be lucky to get Boyle for Hemsky.
Hemsky is worth most to the Oilers, I hope he's re-signed at a contract like iginlas.
Play a certain amount of games and get so many points and receive bonuses. But he needs a lower pay. $3.5M - $4m tops and I honestly don't even like thinking 4, with what he's brought last few years.


Only +35 and entry level contracts are allowed performance bonuses.



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612989 is a reply to message #612775 ]
Sun, 03 November 2013 12:41 Go to previous messageGo to next message
NCREDiBLE  is currently offline NCREDiBLE
Messages: 1369
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Location: Fort McMurray

1 Cup

hmc wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 12:28

NCREDiBLE wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 14:22

Marc Staal would be awesome but the only way you're getting him is one of the big four.
So you better hope Yakupov finds his game, right now you'd be lucky to get Boyle for Hemsky.
Hemsky is worth most to the Oilers, I hope he's re-signed at a contract like iginlas.
Play a certain amount of games and get so many points and receive bonuses. But he needs a lower pay. $3.5M - $4m tops and I honestly don't even like thinking 4, with what he's brought last few years.


Only +35 and entry level contracts are allowed performance bonuses.


Ah, thanks didn't know that.
So how about that Sutter kid on waivers today?
Good hockey family.

Makes me miss the rumours that Sutter was going to coach us.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #613000 is a reply to message #612774 ]
Sun, 03 November 2013 14:04 Go to previous message
Jakey  is currently offline Jakey
Messages: 648
Registered: November 2007
Location: Leduc

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NCREDiBLE wrote on Sat, 02 November 2013 12:22

Marc Staal would be awesome but the only way you're getting him is one of the big four.
So you better hope Yakupov finds his game, right now you'd be lucky to get Boyle for Hemsky.
Hemsky is worth most to the Oilers, I hope he's re-signed at a contract like iginlas.
Play a certain amount of games and get so many points and receive bonuses. But he needs a lower pay. $3.5M - $4m tops and I honestly don't even like thinking 4, with what he's brought last few years.


Remember what it would have took to get that 1st overall pick from the Oilers when they drafted Yakupov? I do, Probably a top 2 dman plus a quality 3rd liner and maybe even add a pick. Now I know you always get more hype at the draft, but Yakupov cache' hasn't dropped off the charts like everyone suggests. He IS WORTH Staal & THEN some more after that! Just because he is having a tough start doesn't mean he is worth an average amount. There are probably 12-14 teams that would offer a ton of prospects or picks for him which is NOT what we need. We need a quality top 2 dman, a #1 goalie & size/toughness in the forward group. Right now teams aren't willing to do a lot of that because everyone still thinks they have a shot at making the playoffs and you can't replace top 2 Dmen.

We all have opinions, but let's not toss out former #1 overall picks after 2 years without getting something we really need. He has a lot of value now and if/when he gets out of his funk he will have even more value.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612895 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 22:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dr. Oil  is currently offline Dr. Oil
Messages: 2146
Registered: June 2003
Location: BC

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Brad Marsh?
Lou Franceschetti?
Harold Snepsts?

Those players could probably swarm with the best of them.



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 Re: Players to target that can play Eakins system [message #612955 is a reply to message #612700 ]
Sat, 02 November 2013 23:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
Messages: 2794
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Location: Edmonton

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I'd rather have Ryan McDonagh than Marc Staal to be honest with you. The Rangers probably would like him more too.


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