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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610250 is a reply to message #610249 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 08:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
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Jay wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:36

hmc wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:16

Taylor Hall finished 9th in the league in scoring last year, averaged over a point a game, is 13th in PPG over the last 2 and a bit years, and is tied for the team lead in scoring. I think we can forgive him for *looking* bad so far this season, no? It's not like he's on an island with this team.

Do you think hall is a better player now than he was in 2010?


Last year he was. And like with Dubnyk I don't want to comment on his play so far because it's such a small sample. He's putting up points, but looking bad doing it. His past performance indicates that he'll keep putting up points, and likely start looking a hell of a lot better in the process.

Why people want to make so many snap judgments this early in the season is beyond me.



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610252 is a reply to message #610250 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 08:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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hmc wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:40

Jay wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:36

hmc wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:16

Taylor Hall finished 9th in the league in scoring last year, averaged over a point a game, is 13th in PPG over the last 2 and a bit years, and is tied for the team lead in scoring. I think we can forgive him for *looking* bad so far this season, no? It's not like he's on an island with this team.

Do you think hall is a better player now than he was in 2010?


Last year he was. And like with Dubnyk I don't want to comment on his play so far because it's such a small sample. He's putting up points, but looking bad doing it. His past performance indicates that he'll keep putting up points, and likely start looking a hell of a lot better in the process.

Why people want to make so many snap judgments this early in the season is beyond me.

A snap judgement tempered by 4-7 years of bad bad hockey.



WAC's and GAB's. WAC's and GAB's.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610253 is a reply to message #610252 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 08:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
hmc  is currently offline hmc
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:48

A snap judgement tempered by 4-7 years of bad bad hockey.


I mean on individual player performance, where we know who a player is based on past performance, but so far they've been struggling. Bayesian priors, and all that.

That said, I don't think the team has been THAT bad. Average goaltending and nobody's panicking.

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm listening to the new Chavril song.



Then I'll just regress, because I feel I've made myself perfectly redundant.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610251 is a reply to message #610243 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 08:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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hmc wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:16

Taylor Hall finished 9th in the league in scoring last year, averaged over a point a game, is 13th in PPG over the last 2 and a bit years, and is tied for the team lead in scoring. I think we can forgive him for *looking* bad so far this season, no? It's not like he's on an island with this team.


And even despite looking bad, he has 6 points in seven games. He also made a pretty nice stop to save an empty net goal last night.

I actually thought the Oilers looked a lot better last night. LaBarbera leaked a couple pucks through, one which he managed to stop, one which ended in the Kunitz goal, but he made some strong saves too. As for the Malkin goal, both Smid and he froze on the fanned shot, maybe they could have reacted better, but Malkin made a great shot and had a wicked release.

Not by any means a perfect game...they had a rough ride in that first period, for starters. The Penguins are a very good team, a Cup contender, and the Oilers hung with them all game.

As for toughness, I thought the Oilers pushed back well. Hall battled hard with Crosby throughout the night. They got up from the clean hits by Orpik (and they were clean hits, so I'm not sure why people have their panties in a knot about them). I didn't like the charge by Kobasew on Schultz, but it was sidestepped with no damage. The stats show the Oilers were outhit 31-21, but I don't think they ran us out of the building.

I'd be more concerned about the ineffective powerplay and the lack of third period shots when the Penguins were protecting the lead.

I do think the Oilers are trying to be too cute some of the time. Lots of drop passes to no one by Eberle last night, especially in the first period. Yakupov looked low confidence out there. I don't know that Eakins has found the best motivational tools for #64 yet.

I'd really like to see Ryan Jones get a push...maybe extended time on the first line so that he can pick up a few more points...



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610254 is a reply to message #610251 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 09:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bigEfromGP  is currently offline bigEfromGP
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Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:43

hmc wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:16

Taylor Hall finished 9th in the league in scoring last year, averaged over a point a game, is 13th in PPG over the last 2 and a bit years, and is tied for the team lead in scoring. I think we can forgive him for *looking* bad so far this season, no? It's not like he's on an island with this team.


And even despite looking bad, he has 6 points in seven games. He also made a pretty nice stop to save an empty net goal last night.

I actually thought the Oilers looked a lot better last night. LaBarbera leaked a couple pucks through, one which he managed to stop, one which ended in the Kunitz goal, but he made some strong saves too. As for the Malkin goal, both Smid and he froze on the fanned shot, maybe they could have reacted better, but Malkin made a great shot and had a wicked release.

Not by any means a perfect game...they had a rough ride in that first period, for starters. The Penguins are a very good team, a Cup contender, and the Oilers hung with them all game.

As for toughness, I thought the Oilers pushed back well. Hall battled hard with Crosby throughout the night. They got up from the clean hits by Orpik (and they were clean hits, so I'm not sure why people have their panties in a knot about them). I didn't like the charge by Kobasew on Schultz, but it was sidestepped with no damage. The stats show the Oilers were outhit 31-21, but I don't think they ran us out of the building.

I'd be more concerned about the ineffective powerplay and the lack of third period shots when the Penguins were protecting the lead.

I do think the Oilers are trying to be too cute some of the time. Lots of drop passes to no one by Eberle last night, especially in the first period. Yakupov looked low confidence out there. I don't know that Eakins has found the best motivational tools for #64 yet.

I'd really like to see Ryan Jones get a push...maybe extended time on the first line so that he can pick up a few more points...



The Oilers were complete non-factors offensively for the 1st and 3rd. I agree that this was a game that realistically they shouldn't win, and that a 3-2 score isnt that bad, but had they gotten involved in the first or last period, they might have been able to get a point out of it.

And, the record doesn't lie; one win, and that was in a shoot out. It's early to push the panic button, but CONCERNED button should be fully depressed by now.



oilerinvan should never leave Oilfans.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610256 is a reply to message #610251 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 09:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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This is almost a perfect reflection of Hall's start last season. Looking like a total goof 90% of the time but still maintaining an almost ppg pace because he's just out there and around the puck so much eventually he pulls something good off and the puck ends up in the net. Just need to wait it out until that goof percentage works its way down to his regular 50% of the time icon_wink

I think this game was pretty close to the best we can expect from Labarbera. I as well would have liked to see a 2nd effort from him on the Malkin goal. Just some kind of reaction would have been nice because he should have been able to pick up the puck slowly moving over to Malkin. But he's just another big lug goalie that just can't bring himself to do that type of thing very often.

Nuge really looked like a guy that has played a heck of a lot of hockey too soon after coming back from an injury. Hopefully he can play as well as we know he can again soon.



..talk is cheap
..success is coming
..the game that we present and stage for the fans most nights is one of very, very high entertainment
..limitless potential
..good structural improvement

Eakins: I know EXACTLY what we need to do next year...

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610273 is a reply to message #610251 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 09:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mars  is currently offline Mars
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Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 08:43


And even despite looking bad, he has 6 points in seven games. He also made a pretty nice stop to save an empty net goal last night.

I actually thought the Oilers looked a lot better last night. LaBarbera leaked a couple pucks through, one which he managed to stop, one which ended in the Kunitz goal, but he made some strong saves too. As for the Malkin goal, both Smid and he froze on the fanned shot, maybe they could have reacted better, but Malkin made a great shot and had a wicked release.

Not by any means a perfect game...they had a rough ride in that first period, for starters. The Penguins are a very good team, a Cup contender, and the Oilers hung with them all game.

As for toughness, I thought the Oilers pushed back well. Hall battled hard with Crosby throughout the night. They got up from the clean hits by Orpik (and they were clean hits, so I'm not sure why people have their panties in a knot about them). I didn't like the charge by Kobasew on Schultz, but it was sidestepped with no damage. The stats show the Oilers were outhit 31-21, but I don't think they ran us out of the building.

I'd be more concerned about the ineffective powerplay and the lack of third period shots when the Penguins were protecting the lead.

I do think the Oilers are trying to be too cute some of the time. Lots of drop passes to no one by Eberle last night, especially in the first period. Yakupov looked low confidence out there. I don't know that Eakins has found the best motivational tools for #64 yet.

I'd really like to see Ryan Jones get a push...maybe extended time on the first line so that he can pick up a few more points...



I agree, I thought the they looked much better last night, but I never got the feeling they were going to beat the Penguins. Regardless of the hit-count, the Oilers were picking themselves up off the ice far too often, especially once segment of the 3rd period.

I had to think long and hard about you last sentence...then the caffeine kicked in and I got it. doh I didn't notice him much last night.



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610276 is a reply to message #610242 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ronster  is currently offline ronster
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bigEfromGP wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 07:10

Jay wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 07:39

Magnum wrote on Tue, 15 October 2013 23:29


Hall is the dumbest elite player we have

He might be the dumbest elite player in the league, and certainly the dumbest first overall pick.

Im not sure elite is the right word to describe him right now though.

4 years in and he is still making the same plays shift after shift after shift.


It's almost like the team that drafted him is completely lost when it comes to development of it's players. But that could only be true if the team as a whole didn't show improvement in the 4 years of Hall...

All these young, #1 picks had great success prior to becoming Oiler's property, and how many more experienced players have come here with the idea that they would be a solid addition only to have some of the worst seasons of their careers?

I am getting very tired of how this team is ran. The Oiler's have an unprecedented amount of 1st overall picks, but does it even look close to that on ice?

I feel like a broken record when talking about Lowe and Co. It's sickening how much of a free pass former Oiler's get in management.



When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.



Adam wrote


Maybe it's fitting to have found religion in the room because on most nights this team doesn't have a prayer.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610278 is a reply to message #610276 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01

bigEfromGP wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 07:10

Jay wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 07:39

Magnum wrote on Tue, 15 October 2013 23:29


Hall is the dumbest elite player we have

He might be the dumbest elite player in the league, and certainly the dumbest first overall pick.

Im not sure elite is the right word to describe him right now though.

4 years in and he is still making the same plays shift after shift after shift.


It's almost like the team that drafted him is completely lost when it comes to development of it's players. But that could only be true if the team as a whole didn't show improvement in the 4 years of Hall...

All these young, #1 picks had great success prior to becoming Oiler's property, and how many more experienced players have come here with the idea that they would be a solid addition only to have some of the worst seasons of their careers?

I am getting very tired of how this team is ran. The Oiler's have an unprecedented amount of 1st overall picks, but does it even look close to that on ice?

I feel like a broken record when talking about Lowe and Co. It's sickening how much of a free pass former Oiler's get in management.



When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.



WAC's and GAB's. WAC's and GAB's.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610280 is a reply to message #610278 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mars  is currently offline Mars
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610284 is a reply to message #610280 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



WAC's and GAB's. WAC's and GAB's.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610289 is a reply to message #610284 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 11:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Location: Edmonton, AB

6 Cups

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26

Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



Let's say you're hired in to a new job. You have a couple people under you. Your new boss says "I think they're doing a great job and deserve to stay, but it's really up to you. Oh yeah, and they happen to be my old buddies. But if you really think they need to go, just let me know and we can fire them. But I just want to reiterate...I think they're doing a great job and I've known them for 30 years."

Would you fire them?



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610293 is a reply to message #610289 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 11:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike  is currently offline Mike
Messages: 6484
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Location: Moncton, New Brunswick

6 Cups

Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 14:17

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26

Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



Let's say you're hired in to a new job. You have a couple people under you. Your new boss says "I think they're doing a great job and deserve to stay, but it's really up to you. Oh yeah, and they happen to be my old buddies. But if you really think they need to go, just let me know and we can fire them. But I just want to reiterate...I think they're doing a great job and I've known them for 30 years."

Would you fire them?


Yeah, MacT's presser didn't leave much doubt that Buchy and Smith would be kept on. "It's up to him, but I think they've done a good job and hope they stay" or something to that effect.

It's not about blaming the assistants for the team's troubles in view - it's just that they keep changing head coaches and claim they want a culture change, but these guys keep hanging around.



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610298 is a reply to message #610293 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 11:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
Messages: 9900
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Location: Edmonton, AB

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Mike wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 11:24

Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 14:17

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26

Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



Let's say you're hired in to a new job. You have a couple people under you. Your new boss says "I think they're doing a great job and deserve to stay, but it's really up to you. Oh yeah, and they happen to be my old buddies. But if you really think they need to go, just let me know and we can fire them. But I just want to reiterate...I think they're doing a great job and I've known them for 30 years."

Would you fire them?


Yeah, MacT's presser didn't leave much doubt that Buchy and Smith would be kept on. "It's up to him, but I think they've done a good job and hope they stay" or something to that effect.

It's not about blaming the assistants for the team's troubles in view - it's just that they keep changing head coaches and claim they want a culture change, but these guys keep hanging around.



It's funny, people always get concerned about a country club atmosphere with professional athletes, but I think the real country club with the Oilers is at a level above the players.

I didn't care much one way or another about the cosmetic dressing room changes that Eakins effected - I kind of think it's silly to think that taking down a couple old photos changes things much, but at least they didn't go full Lieweke and start pulling down banners - but it's a pretty futile thing to take down all their pictures when the actual subjects of those photos go wandering through the dressing room on a pretty regular basis.



#FireLowe #FireMacT #FireHowson #FireEakins #FireActon #FireSmith #FireBuchberger #FireMoores #Burnitdown #KeepJoey

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610307 is a reply to message #610289 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 12:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mars  is currently offline Mars
Messages: 797
Registered: February 2013
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Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 11:17

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26

Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



Let's say you're hired in to a new job. You have a couple people under you. Your new boss says "I think they're doing a great job and deserve to stay, but it's really up to you. Oh yeah, and they happen to be my old buddies. But if you really think they need to go, just let me know and we can fire them. But I just want to reiterate...I think they're doing a great job and I've known them for 30 years."

Would you fire them?


Been there, done that, not with a buddy of someone important but with someone's favourite employee. Quite honestly, I assessed and then demonstrated to my boss why that person needed to go. It got blocked by my boss' boss, so I found somewhere else to work. My replacement ended up removing the person I tried to remove.



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610323 is a reply to message #610307 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 12:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 12:15

Adam wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 11:17

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26

Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:15

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:07

ronster wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:01


When it comes to development, it seems on the Oilers, one constant has prevailed: the assistants.

Smith, Buchy have been there from the get go. Same old message delivered to these guys year after year. If we wanted to make a culture change, I think they needed to go as well.

Personally I think Hall's improvement in some ways was due to their time down in OKC. I think Nelson and crew have done a good job down there, even though there was a comment by MacT about Nelson only using veterans for the stretch runs...still sticks in my mind.

One constant? There are a few constants higher up in the organization.


Well, to offer some resemblance of balance, Lowe isn't responsible for developing the draft picks. Unless you are telling us that Lowe has mandated every GM and Head Coach to keep Buchy and Smith I'm not sure how culpable Lowe would be in this.

My opinion is that Buchy and Smith should have been removed at the end of last season. I'm interested in what Eakins does at the end of the season. Heck, I'm curious if Buchy and Smith have picked up Eakins "swarm" system.


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



Let's say you're hired in to a new job. You have a couple people under you. Your new boss says "I think they're doing a great job and deserve to stay, but it's really up to you. Oh yeah, and they happen to be my old buddies. But if you really think they need to go, just let me know and we can fire them. But I just want to reiterate...I think they're doing a great job and I've known them for 30 years."

Would you fire them?


Been there, done that, not with a buddy of someone important but with someone's favourite employee. Quite honestly, I assessed and then demonstrated to my boss why that person needed to go. It got blocked by my boss' boss, so I found somewhere else to work. My replacement ended up removing the person I tried to remove.


Well, we're now on the the replacement's replacement's replacement's replacement. I think. No one has done any replacing. Time for a Plan B (or Plan F - whatever)



WAC's and GAB's. WAC's and GAB's.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610291 is a reply to message #610284 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 11:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ChasinStanley  is currently offline ChasinStanley
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2 Cups

I don't get the hate on for Hall, he is 21 years old and has played 2 1/2 NHL seasons. The Kid is dynamic when he has the puck and is always creating something, more often than not he is getting the puck into the offensive zone and causing the other team fits, no matter which line he is on. He also plays with his heart on his sleeve and is always trying to do something which is why he often puts himself in these compromising situations, with a little more experience and coaching he'll learn how and when to pick his spots. Does he have giveaways, yes that is a result of trying things other than dump an chase. 99 was consistently the leader in giveaways when he played. No I am not comparing Hall to 99 just stating that giveaways are a result of trying things.

A couple of weeks ago Hall was being anointed captain of this team now he's a dumb player?



Taylor Hall, June 25 2010

With the five Cups they won it would mean a lot to me to join their organization, hopefully bring another one up there. That is the ultimate goal for me and the franchise

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610305 is a reply to message #610284 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 12:10 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mars  is currently offline Mars
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CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



I find it odd that Buchy and Smith weren't fired, but the GM might honestly think the two do good work, but he did leave it up to the new head coach. The people I hold most accountable for the assistant coaches are the head coaches. If there is a problem with the assistant coaches, the head coach should have either replaced them or not accepted a head coaching position where it is being dictated who their employees will be.

But like you, I'm some guy on the internet and living in Calgary I'm not as close to the scene and some of the rest of you.

I find the bolded part of your comment fascinating. Do most feel this way? Is this even possible? Or is the real issue that Lowe made plenty of mistakes late in his tenure as GM and then perhaps his biggest error in hiring/retaining Tambalini and the organization is still trying to recover from this? Is it a culture thing that prevents the head coach from replacing the assistants, or is it that the wrong head coaches were hired? Maybe its semantics and its the same thing confused2



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610324 is a reply to message #610305 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 12:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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Mars wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 12:10

CrusaderPi wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 10:26


I blame Katz and Lowe for this mess. They're at the top of the hockey operations org chart. If Katz and Lowe aren't the ones plotting the course for this cursed hockey team, then who is? Anyone? Now, I'm not saying Lowe told MacT to tell Eakins the assistant coaches stay, although maybe that's what happened. I'm saying Katz and Lowe (and anyone else in upper management I don't know about) have created a culture inside Oiler-land that led to Eakins keeping those coaches even if they aren't what's best for the team on the ice.

Of course, I'm an internet guy with no sources or knowledge of anything. I could be wrong. I am open to other theories.



I find it odd that Buchy and Smith weren't fired, but the GM might honestly think the two do good work, but he did leave it up to the new head coach. The people I hold most accountable for the assistant coaches are the head coaches. If there is a problem with the assistant coaches, the head coach should have either replaced them or not accepted a head coaching position where it is being dictated who their employees will be.

But like you, I'm some guy on the internet and living in Calgary I'm not as close to the scene and some of the rest of you.

I find the bolded part of your comment fascinating. Do most feel this way? Is this even possible? Or is the real issue that Lowe made plenty of mistakes late in his tenure as GM and then perhaps his biggest error in hiring/retaining Tambalini and the organization is still trying to recover from this? Is it a culture thing that prevents the head coach from replacing the assistants, or is it that the wrong head coaches were hired? Maybe its semantics and its the same thing confused2

I apply what I've observed in my workplaces to the Oilers because I feel like internal politics almost always play out the same way. The only difference the Oilers do it publicly and can't fudge their quarterly results.



WAC's and GAB's. WAC's and GAB's.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610351 is a reply to message #610324 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 14:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ronster  is currently offline ronster
Messages: 1040
Registered: October 2005

1 Cup

With Eakins new way of making the assistants handle the Morning Skate while he sits in the rafters makes me wonder if the players are getting mixed messages.


Eakins is preaching a new style of hockey, supposedly. You're telling me Smith and Buchy after going thru 3 or 4 different HCs are going to adapt to his new way?

I think the fact the players AND the Assistants aren't on the same page. Plus the fact of coercing players like Yak to play a team game takes time from learning and teaching the system.



The biggest difference between a team like the Oilers and a Stanley Cup contender is the fact everybody is part of the plan, from players to coaches to management.

We win games on sure luck and talent. We lose games simply because we have no structure or some semblance of strategy. And the opposing teams know that.






Adam wrote


Maybe it's fitting to have found religion in the room because on most nights this team doesn't have a prayer.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610377 is a reply to message #610351 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 20:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nullterm  is currently offline nullterm
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6 Cups

Might be right. I think he's still trying to dissect who the players are. I think he's trying to scout his own team and judge based on actions he sees, not what they are saying on ice.

Mind you the morning skate is more about drills and game prep as a check list? Practice days would be where Eakins would making an impact on team goals and structure.



Illegitimi non carborundum.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610257 is a reply to message #610162 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 09:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rocksteady  is currently offline Rocksteady
Messages: 2951
Registered: March 2007

2 Cups

It's only game 7 and I feel like I'm watching pre-season where I don't care about the wins or losses, my interest level is that low. I also pay attention like it's preseason too, reading my tablet, the game is on in the background, with the occasional swear at my team as I watch a dumb play.

Yet I watch every. single. game.

I love my captors.




Here Come the Oilers™ icon_rolleyes

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610279 is a reply to message #610162 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 10:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
Messages: 2841
Registered: October 2005
Location: Edmonton

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If I'm correct, and I think I am, this 1-6 start is the worst start to a season for the Oilers since 1995-1996. They did it a few other times in the early-90s as well. Good times.


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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610346 is a reply to message #610279 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 14:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oilerman53  is currently offline Oilerman53
Messages: 942
Registered: September 2007
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No Cups

Ha I rememner getting slammed by some posters on here over the Oilers lack of nasty temperment through the lineup. This team gets folded like a bush of flowers every night by every team there is little to no reaction from our bench. Hemsky is a guy who has played through it all and hes probably still scratching his head. I think our last great leader was Jason Smith, he was all sorts of nasty in his own end and no one from the other team messed with our top guys. This team needs to stop with the Detroit model and find their own identity. Oiler hockey is about speed and forechecking, none of these guys know how to throw a damn hit. I think if there was ever a time to make a bold move it should be now. We need some size and nastiness on our front lines and in our own zone. Call Philly and see if Yak or Ebs would be enough for Hartnell and Coburn.


After 8 years of ineptitude you begin to wonder whose the real schmuck? Them for sucking or me for cheering....... *cracks open bottle of whiskey*.

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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610378 is a reply to message #610346 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 21:05 Go to previous message
Prince Albert 1  is currently offline Prince Albert 1
Messages: 603
Registered: February 2006
Location: Prince Albert,Sk

No Cups

Oilerman53 wrote on Wed, 16 October 2013 14:09

Ha I rememner getting slammed by some posters on here over the Oilers lack of nasty temperment through the lineup. This team gets folded like a bush of flowers every night by every team there is little to no reaction from our bench. Hemsky is a guy who has played through it all and hes probably still scratching his head. I think our last great leader was Jason Smith, he was all sorts of nasty in his own end and no one from the other team messed with our top guys. This team needs to stop with the Detroit model and find their own identity. Oiler hockey is about speed and forechecking, none of these guys know how to throw a damn hit. I think if there was ever a time to make a bold move it should be now. We need some size and nastiness on our front lines and in our own zone. Call Philly and see if Yak or Ebs would be enough for Hartnell and Coburn.


If you're trading Yak or even Eberle to the Flyers the return better include 1 of Simmonds, Schenn or Courturier and then start adding to the package from there.



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 Re: Review: Edmonton @ Pittsburgh (Game #7) [message #610341 is a reply to message #610162 ]
Wed, 16 October 2013 13:55 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dr. Oil  is currently offline Dr. Oil
Messages: 2148
Registered: June 2003
Location: BC

2 Cups

In the lead up to Eberle's goal last night, Hall showed superhuman speed through the neutral zone to catch up with the play, and try to slot the puck over to the snakebitten Arcobello, before almost stuffing in a rebound himself. That one rush illustrates the danger of Taylor Hall quite nicely, and I'd love to see more and more of that. In fact, I think he's at his best when someone else carries the puck into the zone. Even though he's incredibly adept at gaining the blueline, I think he lacks the creativity or timing of some of his teammates in terms of actually dishing it off or making a play once in the zone.


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