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 Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812888]
Sun, 23 October 2022 10:25 Go to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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This is, to put it lightly, an albatross of a contract. The number of mistakes and mis-reads he makes a game is mind blowing. To be fair he should be a 3rd pair making 3 mill. My question, can the Oilers compete for a cup with 9.25 mill of cap space on one of thr worst dman in the league?

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812889 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 11:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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There’s probably no where to go. The contract is too long and big to move right now and even if they could, Nurse couldn’t be replaced. The defense and goaltending is what it is going to be for the next couple years.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812890 is a reply to message #812889 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 13:27 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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CrusaderPi wrote on Sun, 23 October 2022 11:26

There’s probably no where to go. The contract is too long and big to move right now and even if they could, Nurse couldn’t be replaced. The defense and goaltending is what it is going to be for the next couple years.


He is what he is. The contract is too big, but he's a pretty good defenceman. He's had a rough start to the season, and that's too bad, but let's all take a couple steps back from the ledge. It'll be okay. He's just coming off an injury and the Oilers decided they wanted to play a bunch of non-NHL guys in most of the pre-season games, so they're a bit slow getting up to speed. It'll come.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812893 is a reply to message #812890 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 14:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24 is currently offline K.McC#24
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Adam wrote on Sun, 23 October 2022 13:27

CrusaderPi wrote on Sun, 23 October 2022 11:26

There’s probably no where to go. The contract is too long and big to move right now and even if they could, Nurse couldn’t be replaced. The defense and goaltending is what it is going to be for the next couple years.


He is what he is. The contract is too big, but he's a pretty good defenceman. He's had a rough start to the season, and that's too bad, but let's all take a couple steps back from the ledge. It'll be okay. He's just coming off an injury and the Oilers decided they wanted to play a bunch of non-NHL guys in most of the pre-season games, so they're a bit slow getting up to speed. It'll come.


In terms of actual play, I'm more concerned with Kulak at the moment, and how long Murray has to be on the roster.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812894 is a reply to message #812890 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 14:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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IMO the Canadian Division covid crap, is the only time Nurse looked top 4. So, I have to disagree that it will come.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812896 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 15:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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The $9+M contract isn't my biggest concern, my problem with Nurse is he isn't a top shutdown D-man (way too many turn overs, bad defensive decisions).. and he isn't great offensively (at this stage in his career still can't QB the PP). IMO he has a better chance of being shutdown.. like a Paryko . But through 4 coaches his progression in that direction seems to have stalled.. young D eventually learn enough puck IQ to play well positionally snuffing out opposition chances against, as well as reducing their mistakes.. like turnovers. Nurse is 27, an 8 year vet, should've gotten the mistakes reduced by now.

Have no idea why he's stalled out, when he was in junior I thought the sky was the limit, he was skating circles around other guys in the OHL, thought he'd be one of the top D-men in the league..

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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812898 is a reply to message #812896 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 18:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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The 9 mill is why we are icing a team short a fwd, and may be a reason why 97 and 29 both won't be here in the future. That 9 million is a franchise crippling contact. I can't remember a d that stands out for his poor decisions as much as Nurse. Let alone one that makes 9 mill.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812899 is a reply to message #812898 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 20:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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I don’t think anyone believes he’s deserved of a 9M contract, but it’s signed and he’s here to stay. He’s not getting traded. He’s not getting bought out. Holland should’ve waited, but he panicked.

I also don’t believe many people have him pegged a bottom pairing d-man unless they are filled with blind rage. He’s a top pair guy in this organization. He has all the tools, here’s hoping Manson can fix his toolbox.

***buyouts, retention and LTIR are why this team is short a forward. Almost every team has an overpay in the lineup.

[Updated on: Sun, 23 October 2022 20:11]

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812904 is a reply to message #812899 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 05:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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I'd challenge anyone to find a worst value contact in the league.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812905 is a reply to message #812904 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 09:26 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 05:34

I'd challenge anyone to find a worst value contact in the league.


Weren't you railing against people for being negative just recently?

I think maybe there's a little hyperbole at work here. Nurse is certainly not a bargain at his price tag, and it means we're almost certainly stuck with him for the duration. However, he's far from the worst contract in the league. He has some great assets. He's a phenomenal skater, he puts up a significant number of points at even strength. He's tough, he hits, he battles. He kills penalties and he can fill in on the PP. Someone above mentions that he's not a quarterback on the powerplay - well, he doesn't need to be. He has done it before, but when you have Barrie and Bouchard on the team, then you don't need Nurse to take those minutes too. He does tend to log a lot of minutes anyhow, without the burden of powerplay.

I'm far from his biggest defender out there. I see the holes in his game. But I realize there's no perfect players, and you have a guy coming off an injury that we originally feared was going to keep him out of action to start the season, so maybe, just maybe we should wait a couple more weeks before sharpening the pitchforks.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812909 is a reply to message #812904 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 10:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AndersonRules is currently offline AndersonRules
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 05:34

I'd challenge anyone to find a worst value contact in the league.


Challenge accepted.

Milan Lucic
Carey Price
(bought-out) Zach Parise and Ryan Suter
T. J. Oshie
Sergei Bobrovsky
Kevin Hayes
J. T. Miller (the new contract which starts next year)
Brayden Schenn
Jamie Benn
Drew Doughty
Logan Couture
Erik Karlsson
M-E Vlasic
Jonathan Huberdeau (the new contract starting next year)

That didn't take a lot of thought ... you might disagree with some of the contracts I chose - and for many of them (Price, Miller, Doughty, Huberdeau) you might agree with me that they are good (or very good) players but are just overpriced.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812911 is a reply to message #812909 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 11:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skoobz is currently offline Skoobz
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AndersonRules wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 10:21

clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 05:34

I'd challenge anyone to find a worst value contact in the league.


Challenge accepted.

Milan Lucic
Carey Price
(bought-out) Zach Parise and Ryan Suter
T. J. Oshie
Sergei Bobrovsky
Kevin Hayes
J. T. Miller (the new contract which starts next year)
Brayden Schenn
Jamie Benn
Drew Doughty
Logan Couture
Erik Karlsson
M-E Vlasic
Jonathan Huberdeau (the new contract starting next year)

That didn't take a lot of thought ... you might disagree with some of the contracts I chose - and for many of them (Price, Miller, Doughty, Huberdeau) you might agree with me that they are good (or very good) players but are just overpriced.


You missed Seth Jones & Jonathan Toews

"[It was] really cool to throw on the Oilers gear, the gear that I want to play the rest of my life wearing. It was pretty cool to put it on. With all the history, it was a lot of fun." - Connor McDavid, July 1, 2015

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812913 is a reply to message #812911 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 11:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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You missed Rick Dipietro - bought out in 2013 and his contract is on the books until 2029!!! Good job NYI, half way there!

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812952 is a reply to message #812913 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AndersonRules is currently offline AndersonRules
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:-) DiPietro was the first one I thought of! Figured I'd be accused of cheating if I mentioned his ...

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812916 is a reply to message #812911 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 12:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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Milan Lucic - set to expire this year
Carey Price - LTIR
(bought-out) Zach Parise and Ryan Suter - fair
T. J. Oshie - Any day over Nurse
Sergei Bobrovsky - You got me
Kevin Hayes - meh, less ideal contract, less error focused role on team
J. T. Miller (the new contract which starts next year) - At least will have hockey IQ
Brayden Schenn - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Jamie Benn - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Drew Doughty - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Logan Couture - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Erik Karlsson - You got me
M-E Vlasic - ok maybe
Jonathan Huberdeau (the new contract starting next year) - Currently he at least has skill, nurse's one skill - he can play a lot of minutes. A Toyota Prius can drive far on a tank of gas too

That didn't take a lot of thought ... you might disagree with some of the contracts I chose - and for many of them (Price, Miller, Doughty, Huberdeau) you might agree with me that they are good (or very good) players but are just overpriced.


You missed Seth Jones & Jonathan Toews - Seth Jones and Nurse are twins on these contracts, send over Toews now in a one for one

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812918 is a reply to message #812916 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 13:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 12:46

send over Toews now in a one for one


Ignoring a bunch of your other comments where you admit there are several contracts you agree are worse than Nurse's, this one jumped out at me. Last year, Toews - a forward playing significant minutes, including 2:42 per game on the powerplay - had 37 points. Darnell Nurse - a defenceman who was the third choice for the team on the powerplay (1:09 per game) - scored 35.

I would suggest you're maybe thinking of the Jonathan Toews of several years ago, rather than today's Toews.

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812922 is a reply to message #812918 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 16:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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Toews contract expires soon

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812973 is a reply to message #812916 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 19:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AndersonRules is currently offline AndersonRules
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 12:46

Milan Lucic - set to expire this year
Carey Price - LTIR
(bought-out) Zach Parise and Ryan Suter - fair
T. J. Oshie - Any day over Nurse
Sergei Bobrovsky - You got me
Kevin Hayes - meh, less ideal contract, less error focused role on team
J. T. Miller (the new contract which starts next year) - At least will have hockey IQ
Brayden Schenn - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Jamie Benn - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Drew Doughty - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Logan Couture - Would trade 1 for 1 anyday
Erik Karlsson - You got me
M-E Vlasic - ok maybe
Jonathan Huberdeau (the new contract starting next year) - Currently he at least has skill, nurse's one skill - he can play a lot of minutes. A Toyota Prius can drive far on a tank of gas too

You missed Seth Jones & Jonathan Toews - Seth Jones and Nurse are twins on these contracts, send over Toews now in a one for one


You would really take Toews, Schenn, Benn, Couture, Oshie, or Doughty as a 1-for-1 trade for Nurse?!?! At THIS point in their respective careers? That sounds an awful lot like a GM trading Taylor Hall for Adam Larsson, because (a) Hall has flaws in his game, and (b) Larsson is a cheaper contract. Benn is (in my estimation) close to finished - he was terrible last year for a pretty decent Stars team (minus-13, only 45 points).

Meanwhile, you asked for value of contract: it's irrelevant to say that Price is on LTIR - his contract still sucks (for what he currently is and will be over the rest of the life of the contract). Ditto that Lucic only has one year left - the contract sucks and has for years; it's a worse value than Nurse's.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812901 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Sun, 23 October 2022 23:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55 is currently offline Kr55
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Have a hard time railing on 1 player at this point. So much of this team is playing like crap.

Did expect more from Nurse overall, but coming to terms with him being a Brent Burns kind of player, minus the laser wrist shot. Going to be all about his skating transition and jumping up in the play that lets him bring value. He has to play with a steady stay-home D that can pass reasonably well to make up for his shortcomings. His other value will just be generally being a horse that doesn't tire easily and can play loads of minutes near his capability. He does have good runs of playing well in his end as well, but obviously there is none of that so far this year. Same with most of the team.

No matter what any of us think though, he's here to stay as long as McDrai are. He's part of the core group of friends that want to win here.

[Updated on: Sun, 23 October 2022 23:25]

"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

5 x $5,000,000

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812919 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 16:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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This is such a classic, and predictable, Oilers fan thread/topic. After a few games our fan base loves to go off a weird cliff and blame the wrong things

I think almost all of us thought Nurses contract wasn't great. The fact is that the market for Dmen was set and the team had a choice to pay that market rate or trade Nurse. A few responses from quotes in this thread;

"9.25 mill of cap space on one of thr worst dman in the league"
The amount of hyperbole here is silly. Nurse isn't winning a Norris anytime soon but is the best defencemen on the Oilers, forget about worst in the league. Even if you think Ceci or Bouchard is better than Nurse it is still a ridiculous stance.

"Canadian Division covid crap, is the only time Nurse looked top 4"
Completely wrong by any measure. To suggest he is a bottom pairing guy is laughable.

"Nurse is he isn't a top shutdown D-man "
- A top shutdown D, maybe not but he isnt bad at it. For the most part the team is better when he is on the ice and one of the few Oilers defenceman in the last decade or so that doesn't scare me when I see him lined up in our own zone.

"(way too many turn overs, bad defensive decisions)"
- I think this is the same as people that criticize Drai turnovers. High skill players try things others wont and high minute players make more plays per game overall. This will lead to more turnovers and that is the risk/reward for this type of player

".. and he isn't great offensively "
- Nurse was 44th in D scoring last year. I suppose you used the term great but 44th puts him in pretty decent company.

"I'd challenge anyone to find a worst value contact in the league."
This has been addressed enough, but again, just completely wrong.

And finally, the coup de grace;
"The 9 mill is why we are icing a team short a fwd,"
- there is a series of overpays, buyouts and mistakes that lead to this issue. It is also a byproduct of having elite players making elite money.

"may be a reason why 97 and 29 both won't be here in the future."
- hahahahaha

"That 9 million is a franchise crippling contact."
- not a good contract, none seem to dispute that, but this is again hyperbolic to the point of parody.

"I can't remember a d that stands out for his poor decisions as much as Nurse."
- Right now, Murray and Kulak, stand out
- recently, Russell
- you need to watch teams other than the Oilers or get your memory checked. There are a LOT of way worse, poor decision making D around the league.
This is why the rate has jumped so quickly in recent years.


Lastly, let's just say this was his ask and the Oilers simply walked away, or traded him for futures, pre signing.
How would you go about a D group that has been constantly somewhere between bottom 3rd in the league at best to god awful at worst, for over a decade?
If you take Nurse off this team without replacing him with a equal or upgraded player the Oilers are proper F'd.

Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on


CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

und(i)sputed O.L.F.N Heavybra(i)n Champ(i)on of the Woooooooooooooooooorld. Plus. One.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812921 is a reply to message #812919 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 16:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi is currently offline CrusaderPi
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PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:16



Lastly, let's just say this was his ask and the Oilers simply walked away, or traded him for futures, pre signing.
How would you go about a D group that has been constantly somewhere between bottom 3rd in the league at best to god awful at worst, for over a decade?
If you take Nurse off this team without replacing him with a equal or upgraded player the Oilers are proper F'd.



This is why I don't think Nurse is much of an overpay. If Nurse and his contract magically went away, I don't think the Oilers can replace what he does with those dollars. Maybe the market for Nurse isn't 9 million dollars, but he's a lot closer than a lot of us were willing to admit. *IF* he's overpaid, according to the market, it's by less than a league minimum player and if he were to sign next year when the cap goes up, it wouldn't be an overpay.

To quote Oscar Gamble, "They don't think it be like it is but it do". Wise words.

Please do not feed the bears. Feeding the bears creates a dependent population unable to survive on their own. Bears.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812925 is a reply to message #812921 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 16:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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CrusaderPi wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:37

PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:16



Lastly, let's just say this was his ask and the Oilers simply walked away, or traded him for futures, pre signing.
How would you go about a D group that has been constantly somewhere between bottom 3rd in the league at best to god awful at worst, for over a decade?
If you take Nurse off this team without replacing him with a equal or upgraded player the Oilers are proper F'd.



This is why I don't think Nurse is much of an overpay. If Nurse and his contract magically went away, I don't think the Oilers can replace what he does with those dollars. Maybe the market for Nurse isn't 9 million dollars, but he's a lot closer than a lot of us were willing to admit. *IF* he's overpaid, according to the market, it's by less than a league minimum player and if he were to sign next year when the cap goes up, it wouldn't be an overpay.

To quote Oscar Gamble, "They don't think it be like it is but it do". Wise words.


Exactly.
Outside of my responses to other peoples thoughts this is the crux of my point. Finding an elite defensemen is perhaps the hardest acquisition to make in the NHL. When you have one who is good but not elite you need to pay to keep them.
The acquisition cost, be it by trade plus extension, or FA to upgrade Nurse would be a greater hit to the team.
Before my first response I was curious about UFA d signings. I got back a handful of years and didn't find even one that was a better (arbitrary) player than Nurse.

The Oilers would be screwed without him.

Survivor LX(I) and 67 Champ(i)on


CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812932 is a reply to message #812919 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 15:16

"Nurse is he isn't a top shutdown D-man "
- A top shutdown D, maybe not but he isnt bad at it.

"Not bad at it" isn't good enough to be a team's No.1 D-man.. on a Stanley Cup contending team anyway.

"(way too many turn overs, bad defensive decisions)"
- I think this is the same as people that criticize Drai turnovers. High skill players try things others wont and high minute players make more plays per game overall. This will lead to more turnovers and that is the risk/reward for this type of player

Big difference.. Leon is a forward.. if he turns over the puck its usually in the offensive/neutral zone.. and low risk.. Nurse turns it over and its in his own zone and a high danger chance against.. and a puck in your net.

".. and he isn't great offensively "
- Nurse was 44th in D scoring last year. I suppose you used the term great but 44th puts him in pretty decent company.

No he's not great offensively, Nurse isn't even on the PP on his own team.. he's 3rd behind both Barrie and Bouchard.

Nurse has the talent.. he just isn't processing the game at a high enough level.. which is the frustration.

[Updated on: Mon, 24 October 2022 17:40]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812933 is a reply to message #812932 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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Skookum Jim wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 17:38

PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 15:16

"Nurse is he isn't a top shutdown D-man "
- A top shutdown D, maybe not but he isnt bad at it.

That's not good enough to be a team's No.1 D-man.. on a Stanley Cup contending team anyway.

"(way too many turn overs, bad defensive decisions)"
- I think this is the same as people that criticize Drai turnovers. High skill players try things others wont and high minute players make more plays per game overall. This will lead to more turnovers and that is the risk/reward for this type of player

Big difference.. Leon is a forward.. if he turns over the puck its usually in the offensive zone.. and low risk.. Nurse turns it over and its in his own zone and a high danger chance against.. and a puck in your net.

".. and he isn't great offensively "
- Nurse was 44th in D scoring last year. I suppose you used the term great but 44th puts him in pretty decent company.

No he's not great offensively, Nurse isn't even on the PP on his own team.. he's 3rd behind both Barrie and Bouchard.

Nurse has the talent.. he just isn't processing the game at a high enough level.. which is the frustration.






We can agree to disagree, as it is clear we see Nurse very differently.
So my question remains. Let's pretend Nurse is bad and his contract is terrible. Go back in time with me. With one year left on his deal, the Oilers entering the window created by prime years of superstar forwards. That same window kept closed by substandard goaltending and defending.
How would you have fixed the problem?

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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812935 is a reply to message #812933 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:40


We can agree to disagree, as it is clear we see Nurse very differently.
So my question remains. Let's pretend Nurse is bad and his contract is terrible. Go back in time with me. With one year left on his deal, the Oilers entering the window created by prime years of superstar forwards. That same window kept closed by substandard goaltending and defending.
How would you have fixed the problem?



I'm not talking about the contract.. I'm talking about the fact he isn't playing at a high enough level to be a true No.1 D on a SC contending team.. and the team's chances will sufferer because of it.
My "fix" has been hoping every year he'd figure it out and get the chaos out of his game.. still waiting and hoping..
Most, or all, of his problems are mental, things you'd hope get learned and corrected after 8 years as a pro..

[Updated on: Mon, 24 October 2022 17:54]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
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Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812944 is a reply to message #812935 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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Skookum Jim wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 17:44

PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:40


We can agree to disagree, as it is clear we see Nurse very differently.
So my question remains. Let's pretend Nurse is bad and his contract is terrible. Go back in time with me. With one year left on his deal, the Oilers entering the window created by prime years of superstar forwards. That same window kept closed by substandard goaltending and defending.
How would you have fixed the problem?



I'm not talking about the contract.. I'm talking about the fact he isn't playing at a high enough level to be a true No.1 D on a SC contending team.. and the team's chances will sufferer because of it.
My "fix" has been hoping every year he'd figure it out and get the chaos out of his game.. still waiting and hoping..
Most, or all, of his problems are mental, things you'd hope get learned and corrected after 8 years as a pro..



So he isn't good but needs to turn into a player he isn't? Do I have that right.

Completely unrelated;
I had a coach once back in the day, I was 15 or so. When things were going poorly you could count on the same feedback. When you were about 6 feet from the bench, coming in on a line change, he would bellow "DO BETTER". I don't recall exactly but I dont think we had a successful season.



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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812923 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 16:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Oscargasm is currently offline Oscargasm
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There’s nothing that’s going to happen with him nor this contract. It is what it is. He’s a professional athlete who took advantage of the situation he was in at the time. Selfish, sure. But I would rather have him than Werenski at their cap hits.

I know it’s in our nature as humans, especially in the Tech age, to use all the info available to us to formulate opinions and the cap being so tight puts a spotlight on Nurse current deal, but when it comes down to it regardless of money he is the Oilers number 1 dman. And for what he brings, night in and night out, that’s what limits the Oilers. He’s the teams best defenseman, then Ceci then really a bunch of 4-7 dmen. Nurse and Ceci are by default a 1-2. When in reality they shouldn’t be anything more than a 2-3/3-4.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812926 is a reply to message #812923 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 16:48

He’s the teams best defenseman, then Ceci then really a bunch of 4-7 dmen. Nurse and Ceci are by default a 1-2. When in reality they shouldn’t be anything more than a 2-3/3-4.


I 100% agree with this but it is largely irrelevant to Nurse, his contract, and value to the team.
Nurse got market value for a player in his situation. I will never blame a player or call them greedy for asking for, negotiation (agent) and accepting a contract for as much as they can.

Nurse would have gotten this contract from the Oilers or from another team. If it wasn't the Oilers they would be a worse team. Publicly there were no better options to become the teams new #1 D'man though trade and the last number of years there are no better option.

The fact is the Oilers D has been a problem for a very long time and losing Nurse would have been catastrophic.


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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812931 is a reply to message #812923 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:25 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Oscargasm wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 15:48

.. Nurse and Ceci are by default a 1-2. When in reality they shouldn’t be anything more than a 2-3/3-4.


Exactly.. and the Oiler's problem going forward.

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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812937 is a reply to message #812931 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 17:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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Good teams would have used Nurses name and draft moxy and traded him for someone more suddle but way more effective. Looks how colorado every so swiftly won the duchene trade...

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812940 is a reply to message #812937 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skoobz is currently offline Skoobz
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Well. This might be the worst start to a game I’ve ever seen Nurse have. Doesn’t cover a top 20 all time player and then carelessly high sticks him on the next play.

"[It was] really cool to throw on the Oilers gear, the gear that I want to play the rest of my life wearing. It was pretty cool to put it on. With all the history, it was a lot of fun." - Connor McDavid, July 1, 2015

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812988 is a reply to message #812940 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 22:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam is currently offline Adam
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Skoobz wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 18:31

Well. This might be the worst start to a game I’ve ever seen Nurse have. Doesn’t cover a top 20 all time player and then carelessly high sticks him on the next play.


I don't think that second goal was on Nurse. If you watch, he took his man - the first guy on the attack. Rackell hit the second guy in Crosby. Draisaitl is tracking back on him, but Crosby has a step. Great pass by Jarry to set it all up. Fortunately, that was about the last thing Jarry did right all night!

"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812946 is a reply to message #812937 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:38 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 17:52

Good teams would have used Nurses name and draft moxy and traded him for someone more suddle but way more effective. Looks how colorado every so swiftly won the duchene trade...


I am confused as to what the Colorado trade has in common with Nurse and any improvement to the team that includes him not being on it.

So, what would you have done with Nurse instead of re-signing him?

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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812947 is a reply to message #812946 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
clutchlikeeberle is currently offline clutchlikeeberle
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Trade his sorry but for something even semi useful. Jeez, at this rate someone who has video skills to show the coaching staff the players think they are beer league would be more helpful then nurse caysally skating around blind for 30 minutes a night.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812948 is a reply to message #812947 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 18:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne is currently offline PlusOne
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clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 18:42

Trade his sorry but for something even semi useful. Jeez, at this rate someone who has video skills to show the coaching staff the players think they are beer league would be more helpful then nurse caysally skating around blind for 30 minutes a night.


Well, we have left any chance of reasonable discourse, insight and intelligence. Carry on with the hating of Nurse.

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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812991 is a reply to message #812948 ]
Mon, 24 October 2022 23:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
inverno76 is currently offline inverno76
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PlusOne wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 18:44

clutchlikeeberle wrote on Mon, 24 October 2022 18:42

Trade his sorry but for something even semi useful. Jeez, at this rate someone who has video skills to show the coaching staff the players think they are beer league would be more helpful then nurse caysally skating around blind for 30 minutes a night.


Well, we have left any chance of reasonable discourse, insight and intelligence. Carry on with the hating of Nurse.


No point in arguing. No one is going to be convinced to change their stance, and the situation isn’t going anywhere for at least 6 years, and more than likely it’ll be the full-term.

This Pens’ team won a Cup with a ragtag blue line , and great forwards. It can be done. Even the Rangers last year were a tire fire in their own end and were bailed out by elite goaltending. Not much changed aside from more experience and they’re a Cup contender.

I’m willing to roll with this team, but if was looking to move any d-man for backend help it would start and end with Broberg.


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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #812994 is a reply to message #812991 ]
Tue, 25 October 2022 09:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Dragon_Matt is currently offline Dragon_Matt
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Nurse is a solid D. He's absolutely overpaid and was done so in an unforced error by signing him when he still had a year on his existing contract and after he posted his best year ever.
Hopefully/un-hopefully he's jsut dealing with some lingering issue that can resolve itself.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #813000 is a reply to message #812994 ]
Tue, 25 October 2022 15:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ragnarok73 is currently offline Ragnarok73
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Maybe Nurse is overrated and overpaid. Maybe he isn't. The most important question is this: who is there to replace him? Even if Nurse regresses, the Oil don't exactly have a lot of prospects who could take over.

"There's no greater springboard to development than failure." - Craig MacTavish, April 13/15.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #813001 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Tue, 25 October 2022 16:12 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Rocksteady is currently offline Rocksteady
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Sorry gals and pals were you all clamoring to sign Nurse to a contract before his bridge deal? Weren't some of you just gob smacked over his ability to needle and grind the opposition. I don't know I seem to recall that.

What y'all have now is buyers remorse, and while Nurse looks far away from the 9M he's currently making, he's still young he should be entering his prime next year but he will make mistakes. Holland was said in this thread that he panicked and I agree with that. He had media and fan pressure to keep Nurse and I think the comment was, if not Nurse, then who?

There was and still is no one else in the Oilers system. Had Klefbom not got injured Nurse may have been expendable for assets but that's just not our lot.

The very definition of insanity is doing the exact same thing expecting different results.

Generally Disappointed.

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 Re: Nurse - Where do we go? [message #813004 is a reply to message #812888 ]
Tue, 25 October 2022 17:29 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Skookum Jim is currently offline Skookum Jim
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https://moneypuck.com/stats.htm
(sort by give-aways)

Here's some stats to chew on.. small sample size.. but that's the sample we're judging the Oilers on so far.. stat of note is the high-risk, defensive zone give-aways..

.. also notice that while Leon leads in give-aways.. they don't usually occur in the defensive zone

Nurse (or Bouchard) can't be at the top of this list if the Oilers are going to win in the Playoffs.

Oh.. and for a limited comparison.. Colton Parayko has One (1) give-away this season.. entire St. Louis team has a total of 21.. Tory Krug has zero.

NHL Leaders.. All Zone Giveaways .. (Defensive Zone Giveaways)
1 Leon Draisaitl 16 (3)
2 Darnell Nurse 14 (13)
3 Kaiden Guhle 14 (10)
4 David Pastrnak 12 (4)
5 Evan Bouchard 11 (9)
6 Mitchell Marner 11 (3)
7 Erik Karlsson 10 (4)
8 Alexander Romanov 10 (7)
9 Noah Dobson 9 (6)
10 Connor McDavid 9 (2)

NHL Leaders.. Defensive Zone Giveaways
1 Kaiden Guhle 13
2 Darnell Nurse 10
3 Evan Bouchard 9
4 Nate Schmidt 8
5 Alexander Romanov 7
6 Esa Lindell 7
7 Noah Dobson 6
8 Matt Roy 6
9 Justin Holl 6
10 Mark Giordano 6

[Updated on: Thu, 27 October 2022 00:57]

McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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