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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701501 is a reply to message #701473 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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K.McC#24 wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 21:07

Skookum Jim wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 21:36

Imbecile refs were a key in this one.
Points of note, Larsson has real slow feet. Klefbom has a real slow brain. Auvitu should be in the ECHL, KY needs to get on a WHL bus soon, Strome is what he is (I think I'd take Pouliot over this plug, at least Pouliot played PK), Maroon's next contract is shrinking by the game, Benning's upside is looking limited.. what we saw last year might have been the peak, my lofty expectations for Slepychev are getting dashed, he's not been noticeable at all, Russell <sigh> doesn't seem to make a positive difference at either end of the ice, Lucic is in top shape yet moves so slow, his turnovers are getting predictable

Hmmm.. feeling kind of negative tonight for some reason





Can't disagree with much of that, I think last year was ahead of the curve, but this year is behind. This should be a playoff team at the least after going deep into the 2nd round last year.

What the hell do they change? Keep shuffling the deck chairs? Is it execution on special teams or is it the braintrust behind the philosophy? I would think the guys on the staff that are looking after special teams shouldn't have a lot of rope left before they're relieved of that particular duty or sacked. Something's gotta give, because teams has been the difference in most losses this year.

I don't want to see a revolving door behind the bench or in the front office, but this start just brings both the HC and the GM under some scrutiny, because although I think a lot of this is execution, the coach's and in particular the GM's prints are all over this.




I think that's the problem, there's too many guys on the team that are just not good enough to play competitively in the NHL. That failure is on the GM, the player personnel master mind, too many of his choices have proven to be bad ones. Getting Hamonic would have solved one problem, but instead they traded a good asset for Strome, who they will probably walk away from, where they could have bundled Eberle and a draft pick, and had a very solid top 4. Instead they used the money they saved from Eberle, and gave it to Russell. With Hamonic you probably could have not bothered signing Russel, or at least give him a low ball offer.
Strome is another swing and a miss.

Matt Barzal would probably look good in an Oiler uniform right about now..

[Updated on: Wed, 01 November 2017 22:51]


McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
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P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701471 is a reply to message #701435 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:04 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Yamamoto back to Jr? I think his pre-season momentum has been fully sapped from him now with all the sitting and limited ice time. Had a good run, some nice money in the bank. Hopefully he is walking on some tree trunks for next season.


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701480 is a reply to message #701435 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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I’m so miffed, I feel like I’m gonna do something crazy on here.

Like start a poll..



#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701482 is a reply to message #701435 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
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The Oilers are broken. And they don't have the right people to fix them.


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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701498 is a reply to message #701435 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:44 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701500 is a reply to message #701498 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:44

Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


It's not even a matter of speed. They were all just coasting and no one really did anything on the play. No one expected any of what ended up happening. They all just expected the Pens to hit the brakes at the blue line and try to set up.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701502 is a reply to message #701500 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:46

Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:44

Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


It's not even a matter of speed. They were all just coasting and no one really did anything on the play. No one expected any of what ended up happening.


You watch them though, and it's like they all looked at each other and thought they were in position. They were doing just like coach said!

My beer league team used to have a goalie who had done a nice job improving his play. He spent a lot of time at goalie schools and he'd gone from a beginner to a decent mens' league goalie. But then at some point he became too technical. Stopped using instincts at all, didn't lunge for pucks, just always tried to keep his shape in the net and move the way he'd been instructed. He was fantastically frustrating to watch, because several times a game you'd see him get scored on, evaluate his angles, give himself a nod to acknowledge he'd played that one properly, and then move on.

This goal reminds me a little of that. They're all exactly where they're supposed to be and the puck is in the net because they stuck entirely to the system as the system broke down. I wonder if this isn't a failing that comes from having a coach who's going to identify by name the guy who's out of position on each goal. You want to play perfectly to the system, whether it's the right play or not.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701504 is a reply to message #701502 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 22:57 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:51

Kr55 wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:46

Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:44

Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


It's not even a matter of speed. They were all just coasting and no one really did anything on the play. No one expected any of what ended up happening.


You watch them though, and it's like they all looked at each other and thought they were in position. They were doing just like coach said!

My beer league team used to have a goalie who had done a nice job improving his play. He spent a lot of time at goalie schools and he'd gone from a beginner to a decent mens' league goalie. But then at some point he became too technical. Stopped using instincts at all, didn't lunge for pucks, just always tried to keep his shape in the net and move the way he'd been instructed. He was fantastically frustrating to watch, because several times a game you'd see him get scored on, evaluate his angles, give himself a nod to acknowledge he'd played that one properly, and then move on.

This goal reminds me a little of that. They're all exactly where they're supposed to be and the puck is in the net because they stuck entirely to the system as the system broke down. I wonder if this isn't a failing that comes from having a coach who's going to identify by name the guy who's out of position on each goal. You want to play perfectly to the system, whether it's the right play or not.


Yeah, they thought their magic box was just gonna scare away any attack down the middle, and there is just pure shock when someone decides to skate right through it. They were already prepared in their heads to start defending a regular Pens PP formation in their zone.

I don't know what's going on with this team. McLellan seems to be in the endless search now of the perfect defensive game. He was ranting about how in the NHL you don't get 5 or 6 or 7 goals anymore. You have to win with 3-4 goals, and all the focus needs to be on keeping the GA down to win that way. So, the pursuit of perfection on D seems to be the forever focus of the team, and the brutal mistakes just keep on coming.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

"In Brad we trust"
- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701507 is a reply to message #701504 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 23:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:57


Yeah, they thought their magic box was just gonna scare away any attack down the middle, and there is just pure shock when someone decides to skate right through it. They were already prepared in their heads to start defending a regular Pens PP formation in their zone.

I don't know what's going on with this team. McLellan seems to be in the endless search now of the perfect defensive game. He was ranting about how in the NHL you don't get 5 or 6 or 7 goals anymore. You have to win with 3-4 goals, and all the focus needs to be on keeping the GA down to win that way. So, the pursuit of perfection on D seems to be the forever focus of the team, and the brutal mistakes just keep on coming.


They're afraid to make any mistakes, so they're super tight and they eventually all make them.

Does Klefbom's play start to remind you a bit of Schultz in McLellan's first year? Trying to button down defence, at the huge expense of offence and with more glaring errors appearing?

At the risk of seeming too negative, maybe Todd McLellan isn't the right coach for the Edmonton Oilers. Maybe he's our Michel Therrien...

Only problem is he's signed for another three years...



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701536 is a reply to message #701500 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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Kr55 wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:46

Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 22:44

Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


It's not even a matter of speed. They were all just coasting and no one really did anything on the play. No one expected any of what ended up happening. They all just expected the Pens to hit the brakes at the blue line and try to set up.


On the Malkin goal, the urgency attention to detail on that PK was akin to that at an All-Star game, or and Old Star game.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701509 is a reply to message #701498 ]
Wed, 01 November 2017 23:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skookum Jim  is currently offline Skookum Jim
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Adam wrote on Wed, 01 November 2017 21:44

Watching that 3-2 goal again. Wow. Oilers players look slow. Perfect tight box formation that is completely ineffective because the Penguins attack with speed and a single nice pass.


Yep, specifically Larsson on that one, almost like his 2 on 1 coverage attempt at the end of the 2nd, didn't look like he knew what he wanted to do, got caught doing nothing much.
Klefbom has looked even worse lately.



McDAVID! Oh YEAH Baby!!
Tic-Tac-Tao!
Keep on Rockin' in the Free World
P. Chiarelli math.. T. Hall = A. Larsson, Yak= bag o'pucks (OK he got one right...) K. Russell = $4.1 M+NMC, G. Reinhart= M. Barzal + A. Beauvillier, J. Eberle = R. Spooner,

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701537 is a reply to message #701435 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701538 is a reply to message #701537 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:39 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike is currently online Mike
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K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 13:20

This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.


This is where Katz should step in and finally say "NOPE - GTFO of here, all of you!" How the architects of the worst decade of North American professional team sports history are all still employed with the organization is mind blowing.

But, since we know that will never happen, some change on special teams at the very least would be a good first step. 29th ranked PP, 30th ranked PK. 31st total special teams (PP%+PK%) with 81.50 - almost 4% less than the Coyotes. nono



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701539 is a reply to message #701538 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:49 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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Mike wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:39

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 13:20

This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.


This is where Katz should step in and finally say "NOPE - GTFO of here, all of you!" How the architects of the worst decade of North American professional team sports history are all still employed with the organization is mind blowing.

But, since we know that will never happen, some change on special teams at the very least would be a good first step. 29th ranked PP, 30th ranked PK. 31st total special teams (PP%+PK%) with 81.50 - almost 4% less than the Coyotes. nono


Well, you can probably look at special teams as looming large in pretty much each and every loss this year so far. They'd probably be sitting at .500 even if teams was mediocre.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701541 is a reply to message #701539 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:49

Mike wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:39

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 13:20

This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.


This is where Katz should step in and finally say "NOPE - GTFO of here, all of you!" How the architects of the worst decade of North American professional team sports history are all still employed with the organization is mind blowing.

But, since we know that will never happen, some change on special teams at the very least would be a good first step. 29th ranked PP, 30th ranked PK. 31st total special teams (PP%+PK%) with 81.50 - almost 4% less than the Coyotes. nono


Well, you can probably look at special teams as looming large in pretty much each and every loss this year so far. They'd probably be sitting at .500 even if teams was mediocre.



Unbelievable how bad penalty kill has been. It's in the 60s for percentage success rate right now. It's a strange one, because what have been the changes from last year? No Pouliot, but other than that, what are the differences on personnel? Not much. Clearly other teams have a pretty good sense as to what the Oilers are trying to do, and they're exploiting the system mercilessly. I thought Cam Talbot was pretty good last night too. Other teams are generating way too many high quality scoring chances.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701546 is a reply to message #701541 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 11:00 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:49

Mike wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:39

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 13:20

This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.


This is where Katz should step in and finally say "NOPE - GTFO of here, all of you!" How the architects of the worst decade of North American professional team sports history are all still employed with the organization is mind blowing.

But, since we know that will never happen, some change on special teams at the very least would be a good first step. 29th ranked PP, 30th ranked PK. 31st total special teams (PP%+PK%) with 81.50 - almost 4% less than the Coyotes. nono


Well, you can probably look at special teams as looming large in pretty much each and every loss this year so far. They'd probably be sitting at .500 even if teams was mediocre.



Unbelievable how bad penalty kill has been. It's in the 60s for percentage success rate right now. It's a strange one, because what have been the changes from last year? No Pouliot, but other than that, what are the differences on personnel? Not much. Clearly other teams have a pretty good sense as to what the Oilers are trying to do, and they're exploiting the system mercilessly. I thought Cam Talbot was pretty good last night too. Other teams are generating way too many high quality scoring chances.


I'm pretty sure you could give a number of special teams coaches in the NHL a bunch of AHlers and he would ice a much better PK. No idea what the hell this team is doing. And it's not getting at all better. Swapping 1 or 2 forwards should not kill your PK and turn it ECHL quality y/y. You have Letestu, you have Jokinen, McDavid, Drai, Nuge and others. You can't get these players that have the ability to think and read plays (I assume) to run a PK? The D to PK is basically all the same as last year.

[Updated on: Thu, 02 November 2017 11:02]


"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701540 is a reply to message #701537 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
CrusaderPi  is currently offline CrusaderPi
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K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701542 is a reply to message #701540 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701543 is a reply to message #701542 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.



East of the Rockies and west of the rest.

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701545 is a reply to message #701543 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701547 is a reply to message #701545 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 11:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”


Lol. My mistake. Clearly this team is in win now mode, as evidenced by the win now moves the Oilers made this summer.

They're going to keep KY, aren't they?



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #702815 is a reply to message #701547 ]
Fri, 17 November 2017 14:31 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 11:05

Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”


Lol. My mistake. Clearly this team is in win now mode, as evidenced by the win now moves the Oilers made this summer.

They're going to keep KY, aren't they?


Well, Chia's disappointed that all this isn't going quite to plan:

http://www.espn.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0723281908015831873-4

Quote:

"We're in second-last in the division, so it's obviously not satisfactory. I think the way that we started we were loose, and now we've tightened up, and when you tighten up generally as a team you have trouble scoring goals. We're almost at the 20-game mark and it's obviously disappointing where we are, but I see some positives and it's a grind. We have to get some traction in terms of winning just one game or losing just one. …[The] general takeaway is general disappointment. There's your headline. But I do believe in the critical mass of the team and I do believe that we're still in it." – Edmonton Oilers GM Peter Chiarelli on his team, which is second to last in the Western Conference at 7-10-2.


General disappointment.

Of course, there were some that suggested this team wasn't exactly pushing the "Win Now" buttons this summer, but Chia outsmarted all of us by stockpiling cap space! Of course, if we're out of the playoff picture long before we have a chance to use it, it doesn't do us a lot of good.




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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #702826 is a reply to message #702815 ]
Fri, 17 November 2017 16:21 Go to previous message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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Adam wrote on Fri, 17 November 2017 14:31

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 11:05

Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”


Lol. My mistake. Clearly this team is in win now mode, as evidenced by the win now moves the Oilers made this summer.

They're going to keep KY, aren't they?


Well, Chia's disappointed that all this isn't going quite to plan:

http://www.espn.com/espn/now?nowId=21-0723281908015831873-4

Quote:

"We're in second-last in the division, so it's obviously not satisfactory. I think the way that we started we were loose, and now we've tightened up, and when you tighten up generally as a team you have trouble scoring goals. We're almost at the 20-game mark and it's obviously disappointing where we are, but I see some positives and it's a grind. We have to get some traction in terms of winning just one game or losing just one. …[The] general takeaway is general disappointment. There's your headline. But I do believe in the critical mass of the team and I do believe that we're still in it." – Edmonton Oilers GM Peter Chiarelli on his team, which is second to last in the Western Conference at 7-10-2.


General disappointment.

Of course, there were some that suggested this team wasn't exactly pushing the "Win Now" buttons this summer, but Chia outsmarted all of us by stockpiling cap space! Of course, if we're out of the playoff picture long before we have a chance to use it, it doesn't do us a lot of good.





I doubt any team could use the 30M of deadline space Chia is sitting on. He's just being a goof.

Larger article of his chat with the media:

http://www.tsn.ca/chiarelli-oilers-losing-runway-to-turn-sea son-around-1.918861

A little comment for the fans:

Quote:

One thing Chiarelli said not to expect is a major overhaul - at least in the short-term - to bail out the oilers. There is no cavalry coming in Oil Country.

"Listen, all of the teams in the league need more help," Chiarelli said. "I believe in the team. But I think at this point, these guys have to figure it out also."

[Updated on: Fri, 17 November 2017 16:29]


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- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701548 is a reply to message #701545 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 11:06 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”



Did you make that last quote up? I'm scared to look at the article because I might find out it's real.

oh, nvm, from the summer when the only barrier to success is the limit of your imagination.



"We need to get better immediately. That starts today"
- Lowe, 2013

"Next year I would forecast as another developmental year"
- MacT, 2015

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- All Oilers fans, Present Day

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701549 is a reply to message #701548 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 11:13 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Kr55 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 11:06

Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:59

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


https://globalnews.ca/news/3777337/peter-chiarelli-sees-edmo nton-oilers-as-stanley-cup-contenders-heading-into-season-th ree-as-gm/

Quote:

“We’ve made some mistakes but we’ve done a lot of good things and were contending, and were contending now,” added Chiarelli. “Did I think that we would be contending in year three? Maybe I was a year off. Maybe this year I thought would be like last year, but things are falling into place. I’m happy with where we are right now.”



Did you make that last quote up? I'm scared to look at the article because I might find out it's real.

oh, nvm, from the summer when the only barrier to success is the limit of your imagination.


Not so! It was from September 29th as the Oilers barn-stormed through pre-season!



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701550 is a reply to message #701543 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 11:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.


Did management actually admit the team is in win now mode? I may have missed that, but I was under the impression the team was trying to reign in the expectations and get us to calm our jets.


Management hasn't admitted it, but unless the cap inflates considerably, isn't that what nearly all the observers are implying? The Oilers are going to be limited after Connor's deal kicks in next year. I mean, Nuge, who's the 2nd best player on the team right now, will almost certainly be traded due to cap constraints prior to next year....and if Strome was the return for an Eberle salary dump, the return for Nuge probably won't look like a hockey deal either.




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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701544 is a reply to message #701542 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.



Another thing I don't understand. Chiarelli's inactivity at the trade deadline last year at least made sense from the perspective that he said the team wasn't a contender yet (although in hindsight, it looks like a bad decision as maybe one more higher end player could have got us over the hump and taken us to third or fourth round).

But to do what he did this summer, when he says we're a Stanley Cup Contender? It makes no sense at all. Did the Oilers really think that having Eberle was the biggest reason we didn't win the Cup last year?



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701554 is a reply to message #701544 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 12:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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I have been a PC supporter but the more I think and read the more I agree. Too much complacency as per usual with the Oil. Katz and Nicholson need to address this NOW and not let a season be wasted. Coaching clear out is needed without a doubt. These guys are not playing or listening to Todd.


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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701555 is a reply to message #701544 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 12:34 Go to previous messageGo to next message
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Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:58

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:54

CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:51

K.McC#24 wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 10:20

Where from here? No help coming after only 11 games, no one is going to get skidded behind the bench, less so in the front office. I'd love to see special teams undertake a change in philosophy, but I can't see McClellan's guys getting the axe.

In the short term, it's on the players. Collectively the team has to be better, quickly, or they're in the same position after 20 games. If they're in a similar position in another 10 games or so, it would take a pretty heroic push after that to make the playoffs. This is where your leadership group steps in and gets everyone going the same direction. We'll see what happens.

They're already in heroic push to make the playoffs territory. The playoff % site has the Oilers at 9% and need to go 38-24-9 the rest of the way to have a better than 50% chance of qualifying. That's possible, but 14 games over in 71 games is a tough road.

Ugghh....that puts it in perspective in a season after management put the team in a 'win now' window.



Another thing I don't understand. Chiarelli's inactivity at the trade deadline last year at least made sense from the perspective that he said the team wasn't a contender yet (although in hindsight, it looks like a bad decision as maybe one more higher end player could have got us over the hump and taken us to third or fourth round).

But to do what he did this summer, when he says we're a Stanley Cup Contender? It makes no sense at all. Did the Oilers really think that having Eberle was the biggest reason we didn't win the Cup last year?

If the Oilers still had Eberle and he was like he was for much of last season and the playoffs, I don't see him helping much. For whatever reason the Oilers PP isn't working right now. It was awesome last year and can't score this year. Eberle was lousy on the PP so I don't see him helping much there. Their PK is garbage and losing them games. Eberle doesn't kill penalties so he is no help there. Could he score the odd 5 on 5 goal, maybe but when your PK is giving up 2 or 3 PP goals a game an extra goal the odd time doesn't make a lot of difference.

I see the Eberle trading going down as follows.
You have a GM that was outside the organization but has been a GM over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because all teams scout everyone and he has seen Eberle play a bit. But until you are on the team, you watch the guy practice and see him play every night, you don't know what he is like entirely. So Chia comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think Chia looked at Eberle after watching him for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe a new coach would help because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. I have to pay this guy 6 mill for 2 more years? At some point I need to cut some salary so I better get rid of this guy while I can still get something for him.

Then you have a coach that was outside the organization but has been a coach that coached against Eberle over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because he's watched film on him many times and coached a ton of games against him. When making up the game plan for his team that would kick the Oilers butts routinely, he knows exactly how to neutralize Eberle. But as a coach you think "maybe I can coach him up, maybe I can make him better when the other coaches who weren't that good couldn't. So McLellan comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think you have a coach that coached Eberle for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe I could fix him because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. It doesn't matter what I do or how many times I talk to him, he's never going to give a crap about defense. He's always going to a liability and now I can't count on him when games get tough to produce anything. How can I keep rolling him out there when I don't trust him.

So that is what I think probably happened. They both watched Eberle for 2 years and both came to the conclusion rightly or wrongly that they needed to change him out.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701556 is a reply to message #701555 ]
Thu, 02 November 2017 12:43 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 12:34


If the Oilers still had Eberle and he was like he was for much of last season and the playoffs, I don't see him helping much. For whatever reason the Oilers PP isn't working right now. It was awesome last year and can't score this year. Eberle was lousy on the PP so I don't see him helping much there. Their PK is garbage and losing them games. Eberle doesn't kill penalties so he is no help there. Could he score the odd 5 on 5 goal, maybe but when your PK is giving up 2 or 3 PP goals a game an extra goal the odd time doesn't make a lot of difference.

I see the Eberle trading going down as follows.
You have a GM that was outside the organization but has been a GM over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because all teams scout everyone and he has seen Eberle play a bit. But until you are on the team, you watch the guy practice and see him play every night, you don't know what he is like entirely. So Chia comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think Chia looked at Eberle after watching him for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe a new coach would help because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. I have to pay this guy 6 mill for 2 more years? At some point I need to cut some salary so I better get rid of this guy while I can still get something for him.

Then you have a coach that was outside the organization but has been a coach that coached against Eberle over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because he's watched film on him many times and coached a ton of games against him. When making up the game plan for his team that would kick the Oilers butts routinely, he knows exactly how to neutralize Eberle. But as a coach you think "maybe I can coach him up, maybe I can make him better when the other coaches who weren't that good couldn't. So McLellan comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think you have a coach that coached Eberle for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe I could fix him because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. It doesn't matter what I do or how many times I talk to him, he's never going to give a crap about defense. He's always going to a liability and now I can't count on him when games get tough to produce anything. How can I keep rolling him out there when I don't trust him.

So that is what I think probably happened. They both watched Eberle for 2 years and both came to the conclusion rightly or wrongly that they needed to change him out.


Ignoring all the stats that say you're wrong and that Eberle was still fairly productive at both ES and PP last year despite playing on the second unit for most of the year, I have a question for you.

Do you believe the Oilers roster with Eberle and Pouliot gone and Jokinen and Strome in their places is a stronger one? Do you believe that it makes us closer to a Championship?

[Updated on: Thu, 02 November 2017 12:50]


"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701599 is a reply to message #701556 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 12:43

RDOilerfan wrote on Thu, 02 November 2017 12:34


If the Oilers still had Eberle and he was like he was for much of last season and the playoffs, I don't see him helping much. For whatever reason the Oilers PP isn't working right now. It was awesome last year and can't score this year. Eberle was lousy on the PP so I don't see him helping much there. Their PK is garbage and losing them games. Eberle doesn't kill penalties so he is no help there. Could he score the odd 5 on 5 goal, maybe but when your PK is giving up 2 or 3 PP goals a game an extra goal the odd time doesn't make a lot of difference.

I see the Eberle trading going down as follows.
You have a GM that was outside the organization but has been a GM over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because all teams scout everyone and he has seen Eberle play a bit. But until you are on the team, you watch the guy practice and see him play every night, you don't know what he is like entirely. So Chia comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think Chia looked at Eberle after watching him for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe a new coach would help because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. I have to pay this guy 6 mill for 2 more years? At some point I need to cut some salary so I better get rid of this guy while I can still get something for him.

Then you have a coach that was outside the organization but has been a coach that coached against Eberle over Eberle's entire career. He knows Eberle's warts because he's watched film on him many times and coached a ton of games against him. When making up the game plan for his team that would kick the Oilers butts routinely, he knows exactly how to neutralize Eberle. But as a coach you think "maybe I can coach him up, maybe I can make him better when the other coaches who weren't that good couldn't. So McLellan comes in and watches him night after night. He gets to see the warts and how bad they are. He gets to see him practice, he gets to see him in the dressing room, he gets to see how he is when times are tough and when the games get tough. He watched him the first year, another down year. Eberle was OK but his warts were just as bad as usual but the games meant squat because they sucked. Next season comes, the Oilers improved big time and they improved primarily with Eberle being lousy. He can't play with McDavid, he couldn't produce on the PP, so they dropped him down and dropped his mins. Eberle still sucked. As the season went on and the games got tougher, Eberle got worse. When they reached the playoffs and the games ramped up even more, Eberle got even worse and was the goat on several goals that cost them games.

So I think you have a coach that coached Eberle for 2 seasons and said "Holy crap. I had heard about what was wrong with Eberle and I thought maybe I could fix him because the others before were terrible but I didn't think it was this bad. He produces when the games don't mean anything but as soon as something is on the line, he disappears and actually plays worse and costs my team goals against. It doesn't matter what I do or how many times I talk to him, he's never going to give a crap about defense. He's always going to a liability and now I can't count on him when games get tough to produce anything. How can I keep rolling him out there when I don't trust him.

So that is what I think probably happened. They both watched Eberle for 2 years and both came to the conclusion rightly or wrongly that they needed to change him out.


Ignoring all the stats that say you're wrong and that Eberle was still fairly productive at both ES and PP last year despite playing on the second unit for most of the year, I have a question for you.

Do you believe the Oilers roster with Eberle and Pouliot gone and Jokinen and Strome in their places is a stronger one? Do you believe that it makes us closer to a Championship?


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.




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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701603 is a reply to message #701599 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

[Updated on: Fri, 03 November 2017 10:46]


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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701615 is a reply to message #701603 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 11:42 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

Question for you.
I am going to be the bigger person and back out of the argument with you. It's pointless. We obviously have 2 vastly different opinions on the team and different opinions on who run it. I don't think as a coach or GM you have any success in this league by fluke or just sitting back and throwing McDavid over the boards. I don't care how good McDavid is, if you do nothing with that garbage team that Chia took over other than put McDavid on that garbage team, while being slightly better, they aren't much better. If you are a crap coach with crap systems, you aren't winning a ton of games if all you do is say "McDavid, go score me a goal". I don't think all the moves the coaches and GM's have made have been right. I think there is definitely room to improve both on the coaching and management side. I do not think the Oilers team today is the finished product but I don't think it is a complete pile of crap that you seem to think it is. Nor do I think the sky is falling.

You think the coach and GM suck and basically everything they do is wrong. You think the sky is falling. So I don't see a point in continuing to "debate" with you about these topics because unless I change my opinion to exactly match yours, its not going to go anywhere.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701616 is a reply to message #701615 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 12:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 11:42

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

Question for you.
I am going to be the bigger person and back out of the argument with you. It's pointless. We obviously have 2 vastly different opinions on the team and different opinions on who run it. I don't think as a coach or GM you have any success in this league by fluke or just sitting back and throwing McDavid over the boards. I don't care how good McDavid is, if you do nothing with that garbage team that Chia took over other than put McDavid on that garbage team, while being slightly better, they aren't much better. If you are a crap coach with crap systems, you aren't winning a ton of games if all you do is say "McDavid, go score me a goal". I don't think all the moves the coaches and GM's have made have been right. I think there is definitely room to improve both on the coaching and management side. I do not think the Oilers team today is the finished product but I don't think it is a complete pile of crap that you seem to think it is. Nor do I think the sky is falling.

You think the coach and GM suck and basically everything they do is wrong. You think the sky is falling. So I don't see a point in continuing to "debate" with you about these topics because unless I change my opinion to exactly match yours, its not going to go anywhere.


What is your question?



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701620 is a reply to message #701616 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 13:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
PlusOne  is currently offline PlusOne
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Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 12:08

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 11:42

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

Question for you.
I am going to be the bigger person and back out of the argument with you. It's pointless. We obviously have 2 vastly different opinions on the team and different opinions on who run it. I don't think as a coach or GM you have any success in this league by fluke or just sitting back and throwing McDavid over the boards. I don't care how good McDavid is, if you do nothing with that garbage team that Chia took over other than put McDavid on that garbage team, while being slightly better, they aren't much better. If you are a crap coach with crap systems, you aren't winning a ton of games if all you do is say "McDavid, go score me a goal". I don't think all the moves the coaches and GM's have made have been right. I think there is definitely room to improve both on the coaching and management side. I do not think the Oilers team today is the finished product but I don't think it is a complete pile of crap that you seem to think it is. Nor do I think the sky is falling.

You think the coach and GM suck and basically everything they do is wrong. You think the sky is falling. So I don't see a point in continuing to "debate" with you about these topics because unless I change my opinion to exactly match yours, its not going to go anywhere.


What is your question?


Welcome to the RDOF blacklist Adam. Predictably you end up on it by refuting bad facts, presenting your own, being met with an "im not going to argue anymore but here is a long post before I take my ball and go home" post.

The blacklist isnt a bad place. There is a lot of reasonable discussion, fact based realistic opinions and occasionally some humor(as long as you can stand a healthy dose of sarcasm).



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CrusaderPi wrote on Thu, 30 January 2020 12:21

und(i)sputed O.L.F.N Heavybra(i)n Champ(i)on of the Woooooooooooooooooorld. Plus. One.

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701629 is a reply to message #701620 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 14:17 Go to previous messageGo to next message
RDOilerfan  is currently offline RDOilerfan
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PlusOne wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 13:24

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 12:08

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 11:42

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

Question for you.
I am going to be the bigger person and back out of the argument with you. It's pointless. We obviously have 2 vastly different opinions on the team and different opinions on who run it. I don't think as a coach or GM you have any success in this league by fluke or just sitting back and throwing McDavid over the boards. I don't care how good McDavid is, if you do nothing with that garbage team that Chia took over other than put McDavid on that garbage team, while being slightly better, they aren't much better. If you are a crap coach with crap systems, you aren't winning a ton of games if all you do is say "McDavid, go score me a goal". I don't think all the moves the coaches and GM's have made have been right. I think there is definitely room to improve both on the coaching and management side. I do not think the Oilers team today is the finished product but I don't think it is a complete pile of crap that you seem to think it is. Nor do I think the sky is falling.

You think the coach and GM suck and basically everything they do is wrong. You think the sky is falling. So I don't see a point in continuing to "debate" with you about these topics because unless I change my opinion to exactly match yours, its not going to go anywhere.


What is your question?


Welcome to the RDOF blacklist Adam. Predictably you end up on it by refuting bad facts, presenting your own, being met with an "im not going to argue anymore but here is a long post before I take my ball and go home" post.

The blacklist isnt a bad place. There is a lot of reasonable discussion, fact based realistic opinions and occasionally some humor(as long as you can stand a healthy dose of sarcasm).


What reasonable discussion? Hearing for the 500th time why Chia sucks, everything he does is stupid, the team is screwed and how some internet poster knows all the answers. That discussion?

Or the coaching staff is a bunch of morons, they don't know what they are doing and if some internet poster were calling the shots, here is what he would do and the Oilers would be all fixed? That one?

Or my personal fav. Let's all take pot shots at people who dare have a different opinion.

Thank you once again Plusone for correcting me. I now see the errors of my ways and realize now how valuable these discussions are and how it is stupid of me not to want to continue them.

[Updated on: Fri, 03 November 2017 14:20]


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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701630 is a reply to message #701629 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 15:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
g2k  is currently offline g2k
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 14:17

PlusOne wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 13:24

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 12:08

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 11:42

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 10:07

RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 09:50


I am not even going to entertain Pouliot. Since the 2010-2011 and including the 13 games this season with Buffalo, Pouliot is on his 6th team and he's been on 7 teams over his career. That's ridiculous and says to me that he is a player who has a short shelf life on any team. He was drafted 4th overall by Minne and he spent only just over 3 seasons with Minnie before they had enough. When a team drafts a player that high, they usually keep them around longer than 3 seasons before they give up on a player. He played 3 seasons with the Oilers. Other than that, 5 other teams felt 1 season was enough. So sorry man, I am not going to complain about Pouliot being gone. He was dead wait and it was time.

When it comes to Eberle. In my opinion there are 2 ways to look at the team. If you are a short sighted person and all you care about is the absolute here and now meaning this year, then YES on paper Eberle for one more season makes the Oilers stronger because he is a better scorer than Strome which I have said many times he is. While anything is possible and if you make the playoffs you always have a chance, I personally did not see the Oilers winning the cup even if they had Eberle because I don't think their defense is ready yet. I am not looking to get into anther whine fest about Russell. Even if the Oilers mortgaged the future and traded for a mediocre upgrade in Hamonic instead of Russell, their defense would still not be good enough. They need Nurse and Benning to take another step and that won't happen for at least another year.

I am not a short sighted person. I am looking to build a really strong team that lasts, not a one and done if you are lucky. Keeping Eberle for one more season would have been a short sighted, foolish move in my opinion. Even if the Oilers didn't resign Russell and traded for Hamonic or whatever other move on defense that all the arm chair GM's in here think they should have done, there is no way in hell Eberle was an Oiler after this season. There isn't enough money. Even if Leon signed for 1 mill less and Lucic signed for 1 mill less just like all the arm chair GM's complain about, there still isn't enough money. So he would be gone. So if you wait one more season, you go on your "run" and when you fall short of winning the cup because Sekera doesn't come back until after xmas and hasn't played hockey in 3/4 of a year so he's no where near as good. Who ever plays Russell's spot - him or Hamonic is mediocre because that is what they are. Nurse while coming isn't quite there just yet because he's barely got 2 seasons of experience. Benning still isn't quite there yet because he's got even less experience and then Eberle turns in another "the games are hard so I don't do crap". You have nothing. You loaded up, took your shot and now you have to dump Eberle for nothing because you need ALL the money you can find.



So you're saying yes, the team is weaker this year, but it's fine because we probably wouldn't have won the Cup anyhow? That's the argument?

Also, if this is so - then why would Chiarelli then declare that the team was a contender this year at the end of training camp? If he knowingly made the team worse now, because he believed it's in the team's long-term benefit, then why add the pressure of saying we're Cup contenders?

Question for you.
I am going to be the bigger person and back out of the argument with you. It's pointless. We obviously have 2 vastly different opinions on the team and different opinions on who run it. I don't think as a coach or GM you have any success in this league by fluke or just sitting back and throwing McDavid over the boards. I don't care how good McDavid is, if you do nothing with that garbage team that Chia took over other than put McDavid on that garbage team, while being slightly better, they aren't much better. If you are a crap coach with crap systems, you aren't winning a ton of games if all you do is say "McDavid, go score me a goal". I don't think all the moves the coaches and GM's have made have been right. I think there is definitely room to improve both on the coaching and management side. I do not think the Oilers team today is the finished product but I don't think it is a complete pile of crap that you seem to think it is. Nor do I think the sky is falling.

You think the coach and GM suck and basically everything they do is wrong. You think the sky is falling. So I don't see a point in continuing to "debate" with you about these topics because unless I change my opinion to exactly match yours, its not going to go anywhere.


What is your question?


Welcome to the RDOF blacklist Adam. Predictably you end up on it by refuting bad facts, presenting your own, being met with an "im not going to argue anymore but here is a long post before I take my ball and go home" post.

The blacklist isnt a bad place. There is a lot of reasonable discussion, fact based realistic opinions and occasionally some humor(as long as you can stand a healthy dose of sarcasm).


Or my personal fav. Let's all take pot shots at people who dare have a different opinion.



This coming from the guy that's become known for calling other "morons" when he's losing a discussion.

Classic..



#firebob #screwitjustselltheteam

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701631 is a reply to message #701629 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 15:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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RDOilerfan wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 14:17


What reasonable discussion? Hearing for the 500th time why Chia sucks, everything he does is stupid, the team is screwed and how some internet poster knows all the answers. That discussion?

Or the coaching staff is a bunch of morons, they don't know what they are doing and if some internet poster were calling the shots, here is what he would do and the Oilers would be all fixed? That one?

Or my personal fav. Let's all take pot shots at people who dare have a different opinion.

Thank you once again Plusone for correcting me. I now see the errors of my ways and realize now how valuable these discussions are and how it is stupid of me not to want to continue them.


I honestly don't know what you believe the point of a discussion board is, if you're going to get mortally offended every time your opinion is challenged.

I'll point out that I have barely even challenged your opinion in this thread, rather asked questions to tease out the logic behind your arguments.

I am genuinely interested to know the answer to the questions I've posed:

- does it make sense to burn the last year of McDavid's rookie contract by making the team worse in the short-term, in the hopes that down the road it might provide more cap space?

- if the Oilers are worse in the short-term than last year's squad that didn't get out of the second round, and the focus of the Eberle deal is entirely long-term thinking, then why would the GM, who until now has always gone out of his way to temper expectations, anoint the team as a Cup contender?

I think those are fair questions. I suspect that you are struggling to reconcile those two things too, which is one of the reasons you're bowing out of the discussion here.

Just to lob a grenade for Oilfans to ponder - I do think I could have done a better job running this team than our GM (and his entourage of Old Boys) the last three years. I don't think that makes me particularly special. I think half of this board would have known better than to agree to the Hall and Eberle deals as they sat, and would have done a better job negotiating contracts so as not to lock the team in to multiple unmoveable overpay contracts. Chiarelli was dealt a Royal Flush, and somehow he's turned it in to two pairs.

[Updated on: Fri, 03 November 2017 15:44]


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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701632 is a reply to message #701631 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 16:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
ziltoid  is currently offline ziltoid
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Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 15:40



Just to lob a grenade for Oilfans to ponder - I do think I could have done a better job running this team than our GM (and his entourage of Old Boys) the last three years. I don't think that makes me particularly special. I think half of this board would have known better than to agree to the Hall and Eberle deals as they sat, and would have done a better job negotiating contracts so as not to lock the team in to multiple unmoveable overpay contracts. Chiarelli was dealt a Royal Flush, and somehow he's turned it in to two pairs.


PC strikes as the type of Gm who is perfectly capable of devising a strategy, but panics when there is even a slight deviation from said strategy. Sekera gets injured: "Oh no! My defense pairings are shot, better lock down Russell asap just to be safe." Drai's contracts looks like it will be a bigger than expected: "Better trade Ebs and hope a bunch of bubble players and Strome can make unreasonably large jumps in their development to offset the loss." The more moves he makes, the more it seems he lacks flexibility in his worldview. He has made good moves, and I think those good moves came about because nothing knocked his plan off course; but you can't GM in a vacuum, and without flexibility any GM is bound to fail in the long run.



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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701635 is a reply to message #701632 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 17:24 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Adam  is currently offline Adam
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ziltoid wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 16:18

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 15:40



Just to lob a grenade for Oilfans to ponder - I do think I could have done a better job running this team than our GM (and his entourage of Old Boys) the last three years. I don't think that makes me particularly special. I think half of this board would have known better than to agree to the Hall and Eberle deals as they sat, and would have done a better job negotiating contracts so as not to lock the team in to multiple unmoveable overpay contracts. Chiarelli was dealt a Royal Flush, and somehow he's turned it in to two pairs.


PC strikes as the type of Gm who is perfectly capable of devising a strategy, but panics when there is even a slight deviation from said strategy. Sekera gets injured: "Oh no! My defense pairings are shot, better lock down Russell asap just to be safe." Drai's contracts looks like it will be a bigger than expected: "Better trade Ebs and hope a bunch of bubble players and Strome can make unreasonably large jumps in their development to offset the loss." The more moves he makes, the more it seems he lacks flexibility in his worldview. He has made good moves, and I think those good moves came about because nothing knocked his plan off course; but you can't GM in a vacuum, and without flexibility any GM is bound to fail in the long run.


That makes sense. Most of his best moves came in that first year, and his worst move that year came when what he hoped would happen (ie. he'd get Hamilton out of Boston) fell apart.



"Thinking that a bad team's best players are the reason the team is bad is the "Tambellini re-signing Lennart Petrell" of sports opinions." @Woodguy55
#FireLowe #FireChiarelli #FireBobbyNicks #FireKeithGretzky #FireKenHolland #FireTippett

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 Re: Review: Pittsburgh @ Edmonton (Game #11) [message #701636 is a reply to message #701635 ]
Fri, 03 November 2017 17:32 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Goose  is currently offline Goose
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Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 16:24

ziltoid wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 16:18

Adam wrote on Fri, 03 November 2017 15:40



Just to lob a grenade for Oilfans to ponder - I do think I could have done a better job running this team than our GM (and his entourage of Old Boys) the last three years. I don't think that makes me particularly special. I think half of this board would have known better than to agree to the Hall and Eberle deals as they sat, and would have done a better job negotiating contracts so as not to lock the team in to multiple unmoveable overpay contracts. Chiarelli was dealt a Royal Flush, and somehow he's turned it in to two pairs.


PC strikes as the type of Gm who is perfectly capable of devising a strategy, but panics when there is even a slight deviation from said strategy. Sekera gets injured: "Oh no! My defense pairings are shot, better lock down Russell asap just to be safe." Drai's contracts looks like it will be a bigger than expected: "Better trade Ebs and hope a bunch of bubble players and Strome can make unreasonably large jumps in their development to offset the loss." The more moves he makes, the more it seems he lacks flexibility in his worldview. He has made good moves, and I think those good moves came about because nothing knocked his plan off course; but you can't GM in a vacuum, and without flexibility any GM is bound to fail in the long run.


That makes sense. Most of his best moves came in that first year, and his worst move that year came when what he hoped would happen (ie. he'd get Hamilton out of Boston) fell apart.


Ya, the only exception I would take to that would be the Russel contract. I think they genuinely felt that he was a solid Top 4 defenceman based on his time with Sekera. McLellan played him a ton. And they just ignored any evidence that showed he was being massively propped up by Sekera. Now he's down to 12 min a night the past couple games and is a very expensive 3rd pairing defenceman.



Oilers Goal Differential
17/18: 234 GF / 263 GA (-29)
18/19: 232 GF / 274 GA (-42)
19/20 (82 game pace): 257 GF / 254 GA (+3) in 64 games
2021 (82 game pace):269 GF / 235 GA (+34) after 38 games

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