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 Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471945]
Tue, 24 March 2009 07:17 Go to next message
nae17  is currently offline nae17
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Neat article by Dan Barnes in the paper this morning. We all know that Hemsky has been bothered by something lately, and this seems to answer it.

Hemsky touches base upon wanting to feel needed a little more and also states that he is just doing what they want him to right now: "I'm just trying to do exactly what they want. I'm becoming a checker."

I personally applaud him for being so honest and straightforward, and if anyone deserves to be, in my opinion, its Hemsky. The one guy who has really really fought to keep his game amidst an extremely defensive system.

http://www.edmontonjournal.com/Sports/Hemsky+feels+underappr eciated/1421448/story.html



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471947 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 07:36 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay  is currently offline Jay
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I was just about to post a link to the same article.

Pretty interesting, and I actually agree with Barnes take on the comments. Hemsky is being honoust and it really is obvious that he cares and wants to be a big part of this team. I dont have a problem with it at all. He wants to be the guy on this team. Good for him.

Doesnt sound like he is particularly happy with the way he is being coached. MacT can certainly dish it out, I guess now we will see how he responds to what looks to be some critisism from his best player.

A little off topic but seeing as how the entire line was mentioned as being not responsible enough, isnt Horcoff supposed to be the "anchor" on that line? Werent a bunch of people (AY comes to mind) claiming that his defensive responsibility was a big part of why that line could be successfull...or something along those lines. I really want to know, other than win the occasional face-off what he brings. It doesnt seem to be a strong defensive game and it clearly isnt offence or physicality.

My personal opinion is that being left out of the last couple of shootouts probably bothered Hemsky. Cant argue with the results but up until the last few games Hemsky had been in (or on the list) for basically every shootout the Oilers were in and they had a pretty damn good record.

Hopefully MacT plays Hemsky 23/25 minutes tonight and he responds by leading the team to a dominant victory over Detroit Wave Towel




"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471949 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:01 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Superintendent  is currently offline Superintendent
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One of the first things Hitchcock did when he got to Columbus was put Rick Nash on the PK. Talked about how you need your most talented players to play in all areas of the game. Nash averaged 0:08 of SH-TOI/Game before Hitch got there...now he plays 2:12/game...and Colmbus has a respectable 14th ranked PK unit.

Datsyuk (who always seems to be known as "what Hemsky could become") plays 1:38/game..Zetterburg plays 1:53.

Hemsky sits at 0:04.

If everyone, especially both He and MacTavish, want Hemsky to be the man on this team...why has he never killed penalties? Is there a better way to showcase and learn the defensive side of the game? With his one-on-one skills he would have the ability (especially if coming in on a forward playing the point on the PP) to net some shorties.

At 18:39/game, Ales Hemsky plays <2min more than Gagner. Some other names around the league:
OV - 22:55
Malkin - 22:44
Crosby - 22:14
M Koivu - 21:34
Statsny - 21:14
Nash - 21:07
Gaborik (who I thought was playing injured this year) - 20:16.



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471950 is a reply to message #471949 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:07 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay  is currently offline Jay
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Good point Superintendant and I couldnt agree more. I brought this up a while back as a possibility and it still makes sence to me. Its a way to get 83 more ice time, he would be a constant offensive threat and would make the opposition think twice about pinching or making high risk plays.

And perhaps most importantly, can their PK really be worse? I say give Hemsky a shot on the PK. Practice it for a few days and give him a shot. If the defensively impotent Gilbert can be a regular on the PK then so can Hemmer. Killing a penalty can be taught. Its not rocket appliances.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 08:10]


"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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 Yeah, of course that was me... [message #471956 is a reply to message #471947 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AY  is currently offline AY
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but c'mon, Hemsky's coverin' up the fact he's giving way more than he's bein' paid and expected to get these days.

On the PP? What's his excuse there? How is he shuckin' off his vital role and responsibility?

He's only got a half a brain? Souray keeps the other half?

There'd be less complaining if like Kotalik said, he'd be more easy to read. More efficient and perform with greater intensity.

edit note: good point on not bein' part of MacT's brilliant shootoour strategy. I carefully watched the celebration of the last victory and sure enough, Hemsky was one of the last to leave the bench to gather with his teammates. Did Barnsie, in all his ragin' glory push Hemsky on his "feelings"?

Without reading the article yet I doubt it.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 08:48]


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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471957 is a reply to message #471950 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:47 Go to previous messageGo to next message
pikeyoil78  is currently offline pikeyoil78
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ales_freaking_hemsky wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:07

Good point Superintendant and I couldnt agree more. I brought this up a while back as a possibility and it still makes sence to me. Its a way to get 83 more ice time, he would be a constant offensive threat and would make the opposition think twice about pinching or making high risk plays.

And perhaps most importantly, can their PK really be worse? I say give Hemsky a shot on the PK. Practice it for a few days and give him a shot. If the defensively impotent Gilbert can be a regular on the PK then so can Hemmer. Killing a penalty can be taught. Its not rocket appliances.


great TPB reference! i thought it was a good article, but I don't quite know what to think. Part of me thinks "What are you? a grade 10 kid who needs to feel important, after being the big fish in the little pond in grade 9" or is it a case of our best player pleading with the coach to let him be our best player. I'm going to have to side with Hemsky...



With Comrie back on the team, where do I direct my anger now?
GOILERS!

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471958 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:48 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Kr55  is currently offline Kr55
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It was only a matter of time I suppose.

Doesn't help that the team is no damn good either, so he can't really hold onto the idea that it's all worth it in the end to win a cup. If things stay like they are, he's going to spend the rest of his contract going through this exact same crap every year.

Also, he's not saying it, but he knows damn well he's going to have to be the guy busting his hump to help justify Horcoff's salary for the next few years, and at the same time watch Horc make millions more. He's in a pretty tough situation and I think it would eat away at most anyone given enough time. This will probably only get worse. How long until Hemsky is benched? icon_wink

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 09:51]


..talk is cheap
..success is coming
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..limitless potential
..good structural improvement

Eakins: I know EXACTLY what we need to do next year...

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 Bingo! [message #471961 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 08:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
AY  is currently offline AY
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Right here.

MacT communicates the obvious, one Hemsky does admit too:

We need them to give up less in their pursuit of offence in certain situations," he said before speaking to Hemsky.

"They give up a lot of chances. At times, he has played really well, especially early in games. He's going to be fine. It's not as if he is devoid of confidence."

You see that in the whole team though... if they don't capitalize on early chances, y'know it's gonna be a long night.



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 Re: Yeah, of course that was me... [message #471963 is a reply to message #471956 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 09:08 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay  is currently offline Jay
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AY wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:45

but c'mon, Hemsky's coverin' up the fact he's giving way more than he's bein' paid and expected to get these days.

On the PP? What's his excuse there? How is he shuckin' off his vital role and responsibility?

He's only got a half a brain? Souray keeps the other half?

There'd be less complaining if like Kotalik said, he'd be more easy to read. More efficient and perform with greater intensity.

edit note: good point on not bein' part of MacT's brilliant shootoour strategy. I carefully watched the celebration of the last victory and sure enough, Hemsky was one of the last to leave the bench to gather with his teammates. Did Barnsie, in all his ragin' glory push Hemsky on his "feelings"?

Without reading the article yet I doubt it.


Hemsky definately needs to produce more for sure. I cant really comment on his play of late since before the Chicago game I was away and missed all the previous games in March. From what I can gather though that was basically 83s worst stretch of the season.

On the PP I would really like to see him become more of a shooting threat from the half boards. If he can add that threat things will open up for him for sure. Part of the problem though is that for the last number of years the Oilers PP has always revolved around the point shot. Weather it was MAB or Stoll or Souray or Visnovsky. It seems obvious to me that the coaching strategy is to get it back to the point. Hes doing what the coach wants.



"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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 Re: Yeah, of course that was me... [message #471967 is a reply to message #471963 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 09:23 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Beerfish Revisited  is currently offline Beerfish Revisited
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It still positively kills me that Hemsky is under the microscope and the whispers of criticism are floating in. Twice the past couple of weeks had Gregor and Brownlee talked about Hemsky having to do more, is in a slump, has to score.

Not a stinking rotten word about Horcoff. Horcoff is the telfon don. Well he wins faceoffs so..... He doesn't score, he is not a great set up man, he's less physical than Sam Gagner and Hemsky, he is on a pk that is one of the worst in the league, he's on a pp that is lousy.

Media and coaches give him a free pass and yet our best player starts to get the stick. Want Hemsky to produce more? Get the friggin boat anchor off his line.



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471968 is a reply to message #471949 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 09:30 Go to previous messageGo to next message
huynh  is currently offline huynh
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Superintendent wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:01


One of the first things Hitchcock did when he got to Columbus was put Rick Nash on the PK. Talked about how you need your most talented players to play in all areas of the game. Nash averaged 0:08 of SH-TOI/Game before Hitch got there...now he plays 2:12/game...and Colmbus has a respectable 14th ranked PK unit.

Datsyuk (who always seems to be known as "what Hemsky could become") plays 1:38/game..Zetterburg plays 1:53.

Hemsky sits at 0:04.

If everyone, especially both He and MacTavish, want Hemsky to be the man on this team...why has he never killed penalties? Is there a better way to showcase and learn the defensive side of the game? With his one-on-one skills he would have the ability (especially if coming in on a forward playing the point on the PP) to net some shorties.




I've been screaming for Hemsky to be put on the PK for a few seasons now. I don't see it happening until there is a coaching change here... Or worse, when Hemsky is playing on another team... Which ever comes first.. gulp...

Fire MacT at season's end...



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 Re: Yeah, of course that was me... [message #471970 is a reply to message #471967 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 09:46 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay  is currently offline Jay
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Beerfish Revisited wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 09:23

Want Hemsky to produce more? Get the friggin boat anchor off his line.


icon_thumbsup

This is one of the most accurate statements ever made.

The real test for Horcoffs seeming immunity to critisism will be next year. If (and by 'if' I really mean 'when') this is the player we get for 7 million he might start to get a bit of flack....no no what am I thinking. He works hard every shift and blocked a shot with his face 3 years ago. Nevermind. icon_rolleyes



"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471972 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 10:11 Go to previous messageGo to next message
kcsabers77  is currently offline kcsabers77
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K honestly as someone who is old school I want to tell Hemsky where to go and how to get there and to think team first. But after all this guy has had to deal with I dont blame him and I agree and this just adds fuel to the fire that all Mac does is turn our offensive players into Checkers! Look at how the oilers play most of the time when they are behind and have to get a goal they press and usually get a goal but watch this team when they are up a goal and Mac T takes over and makes everyone sit back BRUTAL!!!!!!


"Paying for Parking is like going to a prostitute because if I apply myself I might get it for free"

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 Re: Bingo! [message #471975 is a reply to message #471961 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 10:14 Go to previous messageGo to next message
goalpost  is currently offline goalpost
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AY wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:52

Right here.

MacT communicates the obvious, one Hemsky does admit too:

We need them to give up less in their pursuit of offence in certain situations," he said before speaking to Hemsky.

"They give up a lot of chances. At times, he has played really well, especially early in games. He's going to be fine. It's not as if he is devoid of confidence."

You see that in the whole team though... if they don't capitalize on early chances, y'know it's gonna be a long night.


Except for very recently, our inconsistent / lack of offense has been a problem all year.
As in the Minnesota game, we do not have an abundance of players wit the size / grinding type that takes up the ice space and can muscle players off the puck as is required to play the trap well.
Obviously from MacT's perspective Hemsky is a veteran with the tool set [size and speed] to play the grinding role, as compared to Gagner or Nilsson who don't, and is prepared to forego the offense created by Hemsky for compliance with his defensive system.

I see no fault in Hemsky responding to the "quiet" criticism that he's not fulfilling his role as an offensive producer by communicating the obvious… MacT has changed his role from that of the team's offensive leader to that of grinder.
I also so no fault in Hemsky pointing out the obvious, his offensive skills are being wasted in requiring him to fulfill a grinding role that any less talented player [Reddox / JFJ / Brodziak / Stortini…] can fulfill.

I would have much preferred MacT to handle this with more tact, particularly as Hemsky is a team leader [he's got an "A" -- at least part of the time], and does not make a habit of complaining to the press.
As I see it, MacT should have confirmed Hemsky's comments about a change in his role without the comment/criticism on Hemsky's poor defensive play. Unfortunately, as is his modus operandi, MacT chooses to include criticism of Hemsky's defensive play to the media and point to compliance with his system as the cure.

As an aside, there is more to defense than the MacT's current trapping system and as Calgary and Detroit show an aggressive puck pursuit game can be a very effective defense and lead to offense, but the debate as to whether MacT properly utilizes his players / picks a "system" appropriate to his players skill set has been played out on numerous other threads.



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471977 is a reply to message #471972 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 10:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
swany  is currently offline swany
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Hemmer has asked for it give it to him play him on the 1st line and ever second shift for the 4th line put Hemmer on RW with Penner and Brods, play him 25 min play him out of this, show him this team is his to lead. As well as Roli has done this year for 50 games Hemmer WAS this teams offence, we need him to have any chance. Sather said that if Gretzky got a glow in his face he played him every second shift, Hemmer has come out and demanded to be the guy it's about figgen time, our superstar has finaly demanded this team follow him NOW it's up to Hemmer to grab this team and lead it (MACT give him 22-25 min tonight) lets see if he can do what he says he can. Take it and run


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 Finally! [message #471979 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 10:50 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BTR17  is currently offline BTR17
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....thrilled the guy finally spoke up re: MacT.

'They're turning me into a checker.'

Ahhhh yes, MacT hockey...where the appreciated player is the one who can plug. The appreciated player is the plumber with no hands. Where the key word is 'responsible.' And where mediocrity is the golden, constant, all-encompassing standard.

For years I've been saying Hemsky needs to play more minutes - serious minutes -to be his most effective. And for years, MacT would limit his minutes.

MacT has got. to. go.

Applaud the guy for calling out MacT's 'system' or lack there of. The same system that's led the club to years of mediocrity and little-brained decisions.

In MacT's world where Horcoff gets accolades for being a bag of suck, a ridiculous cap hit at that, this is refreshing - a guy saying 'I need more minutes.' Horcoff is never called out...for anything. MacT's double standard is established, and thick.

If MacT remains, this is the beginning of the end of 83 in Edmonton, sadly.

For the love of god, fire MacT.

I'll say it now - for the health of this hockey club long term, I'd rather the EDM miss the playoffs, fire MacT and KLowe and go in an entirely new direction. Squeaking into 8th and getting run out of the rink will ensure more of the same mediocrity next year and beyond.

If I had a choice, I know what mine is. 9 years is long enough of this comprehensive nonsense.



"The Oilers are playing like they'd rather die than lose."

Mike Emerick, on-air, after the Game 3 win over Anaheim in the 2006 Western Conference Final.

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 No... [message #471980 is a reply to message #471970 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 10:52 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BTR17  is currently offline BTR17
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...Horcoff will never take any criticism under MacT.

A first line C who is producing nothing - that'll never raise MacT's ire.

It has to end. Truly.



"The Oilers are playing like they'd rather die than lose."

Mike Emerick, on-air, after the Game 3 win over Anaheim in the 2006 Western Conference Final.

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 He Was Benched For The CHI OT... [message #471981 is a reply to message #471947 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
BTR17  is currently offline BTR17
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...was he not?

I believe so. He wasn't a part of the PP in OT, nor did he play the final 5 mins.



"The Oilers are playing like they'd rather die than lose."

Mike Emerick, on-air, after the Game 3 win over Anaheim in the 2006 Western Conference Final.

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 Re: Finally! [message #471982 is a reply to message #471979 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Souther  is currently offline Souther
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Whether of not We make the playoffs....Mac T has to go. He has had his time with this team and now its time for him to move on.

I understand where he is coming somewhat from a defensive stand point being that he played the game as a defenseman....But when you have a player like Hemsky comin out saying that they are basically turning him into a checker then there is something wrong there.

Hemsky needs to be able to freewheel and have the reigns taken off of him.



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 Re: Finally! [message #471983 is a reply to message #471982 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:09 Go to previous messageGo to next message
swany  is currently offline swany
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Souther wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 11:02

Whether of not We make the playoffs....Mac T has to go. He has had his time with this team and now its time for him to move on.

I understand where he is coming somewhat from a defensive stand point being that he played the game as a defenseman....But when you have a player like Hemsky comin out saying that they are basically turning him into a checker then there is something wrong there.

Hemsky needs to be able to freewheel and have the reigns taken off of him.

Mact was a centre not a D-man and RB has hinted as much that Mact wont be back no matter what, can you say assistant to the President of Hockey Operations, great title, and I still say that Hemmer feels this way because Mact has not GONE to him in the shootout. He looked absolutly pissed after the Hawks game.



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471985 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:15 Go to previous messageGo to next message
bigEfromGP  is currently offline bigEfromGP
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For years MacT faithful have been saying that MacT doesn't stunt ofeensive player development, and they almost always exclusively go back to "look at Hemsky, look at comparables from that draft, MacT has done great developing him". And now Hemsky comes out and says what many of us have been preaching for years.

I thank you Mr. Hemsky, for some truly, truly, good info.



oilerinvan should never leave Oilfans.

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 It's a Number of Things [message #471986 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:16 Go to previous messageGo to next message
philly boy is currently online philly boy
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1. This has always been my opinion (and suspition), but I think Hemsky's strength and fitness plays a factor in his ability to be consistant, more dominant along the boards, win battles, play harder for longer stretches etc... He seems to always be so hot and cold, have stretches where he's outstanding then burns himself out and disappears for awhile.

I mean he's scrawny, I would say he's 180 sweatin'... he should add muscle, and work on things that'll allow him to go longer and harder, I think it holds him back to an extent. Another thing is he's being underutilized.

2. I've always been an advocate to put Hemsky on the PK, no question. I don't care how soft or how stupid an idea people think it is, it's worth a try. And if MacT's half the coach people think he is, he should be able to do this with #83. Turn him into the star he was meant to be rather than being your prototypical, one dimensional 1st line Euro star.

If he really wants be a team leader, be the go-to guy, he should be playing in all situations, simple as that. People underestimate how valuable he could be on that PK - being how terrible it has been all year - it'd bring a totally new and unfamiliar element that teams will have to constantly be aware of.

3. Shawn Horcoff has for the most part had an awful year (arguments about his overuse in all other situations aside). Yes, he has been an anchor somewhat for Hemsky (offensively), and if he could produce even just a little more than what he's been doing, Horcoff would be a consistent 70+ point player, and put Hemsky at least at a PPG.

4. Other teams are well aware of what he's going to do now. Cut and cross through the ice at the opposition blueline at least once, either do a loop around the opposition's net or try to dangle and look for a quick pass/quick shot in the slot area. He's pretty soft on the boards, and I've noticed several times this year that he's being knocked off the puck - both open ice and on the boards - quite easily. It wouldn't hurt if he tried simplifying his game a bit, as stupid as it may sound. It's weird, it's like he's unpredictable but he's not.

5. Needs to make more happen on that PP and take affirmative action. It doesn't always have to go the point, man. Move around and QB that thing like your life depended on it. Some of that offensive awareness should rub off on your fellow players. Everyone is trapped in a lull on that PP right now and it's killed #83's vibe, clearly. I think he's making a mockery of MacT and almost doing it intentionally.

6. Needs to QUIT GIVING UP IN BATTLES and be tougher.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 11:26]


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 Re: Finally! [message #471988 is a reply to message #471983 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:21 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mike  is currently offline Mike
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If I'm Katz, or even Tambellini, I'm more than a little concerned with this. Defense is all fine and dandy, but you gotta score some goals to win. It also seems like MacT loathes offense - guys are pratically looking for their defensive assignments while they are breakaways FFS.

Fire MacT.



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 Re: Finally! [message #471989 is a reply to message #471982 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:22 Go to previous messageGo to next message
EdinburghOiler  is currently offline EdinburghOiler
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I dont know if this was the right time to bring this up and certainly not in public.

Howver It is very visible that some of the players dont agree with their roles and it has to come to a head sometime .... I really hope its at the seasons end.




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 Re: Finally! [message #471990 is a reply to message #471979 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:24 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Skoobz  is currently offline Skoobz
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BTR17 wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 10:50


If MacT remains, this is the beginning of the end of 83 in Edmonton, sadly.

For the love of god, fire MacT.

I'll say it now - for the health of this hockey club long term, I'd rather the EDM miss the playoffs, fire MacT and KLowe and go in an entirely new direction. Squeaking into 8th and getting run out of the rink will ensure more of the same mediocrity next year and beyond.



I read this article as purely critical of the coaching staff and as Hemmer drawing a line in the sand. Without calling MacTavish the terrible coach he is, Hemsky is putting him, the rest of the "brain trust", and Oiler fans on notice that if the ship doesn't get a new direction soon, he'll be jumping off it. BTR is right. If MacT isn't gone shortly after the Oilers' season ends, we can all expect a trade demand from #83, and frankly, I won't fault him for it.



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 Re: Finally! [message #471991 is a reply to message #471982 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:33 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Ales Cooper  is currently offline Ales Cooper
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On one hand, I'm glad Hemmer came out and expressed his frustration. It shows not everyone on the team is enamored with the coaching staff, and how they utilize their players.

On the other, given Mac's stubbornness, this very likely could cause a rift between coach and player. And perhaps a linemate or two as well. Not good with ten games remaining.

Hemsky has had a few stinkers as of late. As was pointed out, he gets frustrated if things dont go well early. But should it not be on the coaching staff to encourage more of the same from him?

He's always been accountable for his play. Remember that quote a couple years back? "We stink, we dont look like we know how to play hockey. And you can start with me" (something to that effect anyway).

I guess the question is, at the end of the season, are the high-ups going to let the coaching staff chase another skill player out of town?



In fairness to Hall, I've wanted to throw a waterbottle at Eakins all season.
~nullterm 03/22/2014

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 Re: Finally! [message #471992 is a reply to message #471979 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:40 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Jay  is currently offline Jay
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BTR17 wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 10:50



If MacT remains, this is the beginning of the end of 83 in Edmonton, sadly.




This is my worst fear as an Oiler fan. Everyone knows MacT isnt getting fired this year so I have come to accept it. This needs to be his final season though. He is alienating more and more of our players. His Schtick is tired and a change is needed. Short of the Oilers winning the cup he should be replaced in the summer.

Right now I think we can say 100% for sure that the following players would be absolutely thrilled with a coaching change;

Penner
Nilsson
Hemsky
Cogliano
Schremp (not that it matters IMO)

and the players who would be devestated;

Horcoff
Moreau

MacT certainly is fortunate that his good buddy is in charge. Not to many guys can win the battle of player vs coach unless they are consistently winning.



"Initiative comes to thems that wait"

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 Re: Finally! [message #471994 is a reply to message #471990 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 11:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
mightyreasoner  is currently offline mightyreasoner
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skoobz2001 wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 13:24



I read this article as purely critical of the coaching staff and as Hemmer drawing a line in the sand. Without calling MacTavish the terrible coach he is, Hemsky is putting him, the rest of the "brain trust", and Oiler fans on notice that if the ship doesn't get a new direction soon, he'll be jumping off it. BTR is right. If MacT isn't gone shortly after the Oilers' season ends, we can all expect a trade demand from #83, and frankly, I won't fault him for it.


Yeah, I agree. Hemsky has put up with an awful lot of empty promises and disrespect from the Oilers management. Quite honestly, I think its shows a lot of strong character for him to not have said anything until now... In my opinion, this has been building up for a long time.

He is clearly frustrated, and I don't blame him. I just hope that Lowe/Tambellini take notice and remove MacTavish and if they don't, I hope Katz removes them all. As others have said, if they aren't gone soon, Hemmer will be.



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 Re: It's a Number of Things [message #471996 is a reply to message #471986 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:05 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Regulator  is currently offline Regulator
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When our star / franchise player 'calls out' the coaching system of this team and says he is being turned into a 'checker' - I am not sure what more you Mac T lovers need for him to be gone. We cannot continue down this road of mediocrity when our star also feels unhappy and that his 'offensive' role is being diminshed to play defensive style hockey. No wonder this team is so bad when playing from behind or when the chips are down, because the whole mentality of this team is defense, defense, defense. I do not think we have played very exciting hockey this year even though we have the players and the talent to do so. As a post above suggested, I'm willing to miss the playoffs this year if it means progressing as a hockey club the next few years, because we are not going to get the best of Hemsky, Penner (who is here to stay) and the other kids under Mac T.

Don't even get me started on the role Cogliano has had to play. A player that has shown flashes of brilliance, skill, speed, work ethic has been banished to a 3rd line checking role where some games Liam Reddox gets more ice team that him. I guarantee you, any other team, Hemsky would be averaging over 20 mins a game, and Cogliano closer to 15 mins rather than his average 10. It is like Mac T doesn't know what to do with skill players - yet players like Horcoff he overplays based on his contract - shame we have never 'overpaid' anyone who truly deserves it - see Horcoff/Penner/Gilbert/Staios/etc etc

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 12:19]


dkb19 wrote on Mon, 20 July 2009 13:05 (re: Horcoff)

He's like a mastercard comercial, alot of what he does is priceless.

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471997 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:18 Go to previous messageGo to next message
haggis  is currently offline haggis
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I don't think the irony is lost that we have the smallest, softest team in the NHL who barely hit yet they're being asked to play a checking role. The 'passive checker', MacT has found a new role in hockey. rofl rasta


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 Re: Finally! [message #471998 is a reply to message #471979 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:20 Go to previous messageGo to next message
K.McC#24  is currently offline K.McC#24
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BTR17 wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 10:50

....thrilled the guy finally spoke up re: MacT.

'They're turning me into a checker.'

Ahhhh yes, MacT hockey...where the appreciated player is the one who can plug. The appreciated player is the plumber with no hands. Where the key word is 'responsible.' And where mediocrity is the golden, constant, all-encompassing standard.

For years I've been saying Hemsky needs to play more minutes - serious minutes -to be his most effective. And for years, MacT would limit his minutes.

MacT has got. to. go.

Applaud the guy for calling out MacT's 'system' or lack there of. The same system that's led the club to years of mediocrity and little-brained decisions.

In MacT's world where Horcoff gets accolades for being a bag of suck, a ridiculous cap hit at that, this is refreshing - a guy saying 'I need more minutes.' Horcoff is never called out...for anything. MacT's double standard is established, and thick.

If MacT remains, this is the beginning of the end of 83 in Edmonton, sadly.

For the love of god, fire MacT.

I'll say it now - for the health of this hockey club long term, I'd rather the EDM miss the playoffs, fire MacT and KLowe and go in an entirely new direction. Squeaking into 8th and getting run out of the rink will ensure more of the same mediocrity next year and beyond.

If I had a choice, I know what mine is. 9 years is long enough of this comprehensive nonsense.


I don't want this team to miss the playoffs, but I agree with pretty much everything else. I can't see how a playoff appearance buys anything for MacT, but who knows? He HAS to be outta here at season's end IMO.

I'm glad that Hemmer opened up about this rather than sulking. I really hope management read this piece.

You can't make defensive drones out of every player you have. Hemsky is average defensively, and to try to make a drone out of him devolves his considerable offensive skills. A guy like this, if you ask him to make the safe plays ALL THE TIME that your 3rd/4th liners make, will be stifled offensively. MacT then reduces his role, the team suffers, and a player who's been publicly held up as a leader and a guy to be counted on starts to ask questions. It's the vicious circle that's part of MacT hockey.

If MacT has an iota of sense, he'll give Hemsky some rein from here on in. I see this as Hemsky having something to prove, and MacT should let him prove it. Hemsky wants to dominate. Give him the guys on his line and the situations to do it.



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #471999 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:28 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Mullet  is currently offline Mullet
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My take is that hemmer is frustrated that he isn't producing to his standard and everyone can see it. MacT gives him the old if you aren't producing you need to do something such as get shots, hits, reduce turnovers, etc.. Hemsky's ego is bruised - who is this 4th liner to tell me. Hemsky knows the public perception and decides to give the coach some of his own medicine and uses the media to give him one. MacT has now been served notice that this is Hemsky's team not his and he better get on board. Management now has a sticky situtation. These sorts of public disputes help nobody. I expect a big game from Hemsky tonight as he needs to back up his talk and will be getting asked a lot of questions. My expectation is that he and MacT have spoke (as indicated in the article) and the spin tonight will be we had a talk which was productive and we both understand each others position. Ales is critcal to our team, yada yada yada (feed his ego) and this will only help our team over the long run that Ales is so committed. Meanwhile the media and blogs will speculate well into the offseason who is going to go.

Perhaps it is as simple as he is being PO'd that he didn't get a chance on either shootout as see's his role diminishing that coupled with the fact that his line mates are seeing more ice as they are also used on the PK.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 12:36]


WARNING: The consumption of alcohol may create the illusion that you are tougher, smarter, faster and better looking than most people.

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 Re: Finally! [message #472003 is a reply to message #471992 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:51 Go to previous messageGo to next message
derrick  is currently offline derrick
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Quote:



Right now I think we can say 100% for sure that the following players would be absolutely thrilled with a coaching change;

Penner - Justified
Nilsson - who cares? He sucks
Hemsky - Justified - rant probably has more to do with his C and shootouts though
Cogliano - Who cares? He's playing like crap - giveaways and forcing the play
Schremp (not that it matters IMO) - Doesn't one iota. Not NHL ready

and the players who would be devestated;

Horcoff
Moreau
Staios - Don't forget the other half of the Moreau /Staios partnership

.


IMO the Oilers do not have room for Eberle along with the rest of the Smurfs. I'd jettison Cogliano and Nilsson in the offseason if they could be part of a trade bringing a decent return. Cogliano's non-ability to improve in the FO circle is a concern.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 12:53]


With all due respect to Longcat, derrick is quite possibly the dumbest poster on Oilfans.

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #472004 is a reply to message #471999 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 12:53 Go to previous messageGo to next message
nickxero  is currently offline nickxero
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I hope this does flare out of control and management has to choose between the player they're supposed to be building the team around or the inept coach. It's ultimatums like this that make a passive TambeLoweni HAVE to act.

And what scares me the most? I honestly don't know which side the would take. I know what side they SHOULD take. I'm shiverin', lads.



"Put the kids in with a few old pappy guys who still like to win and the combination is unbeatable." -Conn Smythe

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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #472009 is a reply to message #471945 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 13:02 Go to previous messageGo to next message
smyth260  is currently offline smyth260
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Quote:

"For me, it's just carry the puck and don't be scared to turn it over. I'm here to make plays. I should play my game. When I play my game, I'm good. I can't be scared to play my game."


So he knows he turns it over? Turn overs happen, but when you don't go in your own end backchecking to stop it that is unacceptable.

MacT has given him way too much leniency and I believe that is why he is saying those things. He has always let him do what he wants and never disciplines him when he makes mistakes. Now that he's not playing him as much Hemsky is upset.

Very self centered player. Honest or not that is his attitude, and Hemsky went down in my books. It's obvious that he doesn't like the coaching. But that is so ridiculous to say it felt good when I was playing well, yet the team wasn't nearly as good of shape it is now. Now we are finally starting to see some effort, and Hemsky don't like it? He feels unimportant when Gagner takes up some ice-time yet Gagner is going on a hot streak. That is not the attitude of a player who is playing for the logo on the jersey.





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 Re: Finally! [message #472010 is a reply to message #471979 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 13:03 Go to previous messageGo to next message
cosmicheretic  is currently offline cosmicheretic
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Sadly I agree that missing the playoffs this year would be good for the long term. It's the only chance that Mac T would get fired. Asking your #1 offensive player to be a checker is grounds for firing right there! If we make the playoffs Mac T stays and Hemsky leaves...it's that simple.


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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #472016 is a reply to message #472009 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 13:37 Go to previous messageGo to next message
derrick  is currently offline derrick
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Registered: December 2002

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I think you missed the entire gist of the Hemsky/Lowe quotes. MacTavish wasn't commenting on Hemsky's defence at all. He was stressing that he has to be more aggressive with his offensive opportunities. Hemsky is saying he isn't getting enough of those opportunities.


With all due respect to Longcat, derrick is quite possibly the dumbest poster on Oilfans.

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 Re: Finally! [message #472019 is a reply to message #471983 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 13:45 Go to previous messageGo to next message
Souther  is currently offline Souther
Messages: 172
Registered: November 2006

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Hmmm i don't know why i thought MacTavish was a defenseman....wierd...

So Hemsky wasn't even 1 of the 3 chosen? I guess it was Gagner after Kotalik...

I can understand Hemsky kinda being pissed he didn't get picked but to be honest the 3 before him are pretty good in the SO. And tbh...the most important thing is getting the 2 points so that should be #1 in Hemsky's mind not him not getting picked...

But i do believe he has an argument concerning the checking thing.

Also this has been stated for so long....HEMSKY SHOOT THE PUCK!!!

I can't recall how many times i got pissed watching Hemsky circle around and come of the boards into the slot only to see him pass it off or circle back again, so annoying.

[Updated on: Tue, 24 March 2009 13:48]


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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #472020 is a reply to message #471957 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 13:59 Go to previous messageGo to next message
SJPRAJA  is currently offline SJPRAJA
Messages: 134
Registered: November 2008

No Cups

pikeyoil78 wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:47

ales_freaking_hemsky wrote on Tue, 24 March 2009 08:07

Good point Superintendant and I couldnt agree more. I brought this up a while back as a possibility and it still makes sence to me. Its a way to get 83 more ice time, he would be a constant offensive threat and would make the opposition think twice about pinching or making high risk plays.

And perhaps most importantly, can their PK really be worse? I say give Hemsky a shot on the PK. Practice it for a few days and give him a shot. If the defensively impotent Gilbert can be a regular on the PK then so can Hemmer. Killing a penalty can be taught. Its not rocket appliances.


great TPB reference! i thought it was a good article, but I don't quite know what to think. Part of me thinks "What are you? a grade 10 kid who needs to feel important, after being the big fish in the little pond in grade 9" or is it a case of our best player pleading with the coach to let him be our best player. I'm going to have to side with Hemsky...


Im officially siding with Hemmer on this one. The gets hit so much and goes to the dirty areas for the puck. Give me break! This guy does deserve more respect!! If Hemsky leaves, it will be because of management not anyone else. For that they all should be fired!



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 Re: Hemsky feeling underappreciated [message #472022 is a reply to message #472016 ]
Tue, 24 March 2009 14:01 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Regulator  is currently offline Regulator
Messages: 1405
Registered: April 2007

1 Cup

What an attractive place Edmonton is turning our to be to play in. I am sure all the skillful would be free agents (not that we have any cap room anyway to sign them) will be lining up to play for a coach whose most skilled player says he wants him to play as a checker. Fire Mac T !!


dkb19 wrote on Mon, 20 July 2009 13:05 (re: Horcoff)

He's like a mastercard comercial, alot of what he does is priceless.

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